Switching from vetsulin to prozinc

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I just saw the thread that Sweet Angel posted on Health forum about reading alpha Trak numbers. She brings up a really good question.
 
Lisa and Smoky said:
I just saw the thread that Sweet Angel posted on Health forum about reading alpha Trak numbers. She brings up a really good question.
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Here's what I put on that thread:
I use an AlphaTrak meter. All I can tell you is that my vet told me that for a diabetic getting insulin, the ideal range is 5 - 9 mmol/L but up to 12 is acceptable. If BG is 3 - 5 that's trending too low and below 3 is a hypo.

So - in mg/dL:
  • Ideal is 90 to 160-ish
  • Up to 220-ish is acceptable
  • Trending too low is 54-ish to 90
  • Below 54-ish is hypo.
 
What would the numbers be if his BG's we're too high. He has been running higher numbers on the relion meter lately, anywhere from 400 to over 600, am and pm numbers
 
Lisa and Smoky said:
What would the numbers be if his BG's we're too high. He has been running higher numbers on the relion meter lately, anywhere from 400 to over 600, am and pm numbers
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It's not that much different, Lisa. When Teasel is in the 300s and up on the AT, he's high. When he's 70 and below on the AT, he's too low. As many have said here, don't try to convert from one meter to the other, just learn proper ranges for each type of meter. You'll get used to it. You might want to keep a separate SS for your AT entries.
 
Are you thinking 2.75 u or 3.0 u for this AM, Lisa? You stayed at 2.5 u only two cycles and you've given 2.75 u twice now. You could go up. I could be wrong but it seems that you'll be up over 3 u before you see numbers start to shift. Slow and steady increases ...
 
Smokys PMPS was 427, still high but better than being in the high 500's and up.
I think I will give him the 3 units tonight.
 
Smoky has been staying in his carrier almost all of the time lately. He is hiding in there and only coming out for food, water, and bathroom breaks. He was laying on the bed with me before. I'm not sure if it's the prozinc or just because he has been feeling sick for a few months now.
 
Lisa and Smoky said:
I can probably do a + 3 before bed test with him. I've noticed with the prozinc he doesn't drop as fast as with the vetsulin.
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Lisa and Smoky said:
Smoky has been staying in his carrier almost all of the time lately. He is hiding in there and only coming out for food, water, and bathroom breaks. He was laying on the bed with me before. I'm not sure if it's the prozinc or just because he has been feeling sick for a few months now.
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Is he a little more interactive at the end of a cycle when the ProZinc is wearing off? If he is that might be a clue. It's more likely that he's just "sick of feeling sick".
 
He did do the same thing while on vetsulin. I think maybe he is just tired of feeling sick all the time. I believe that affects our pets just like us and it wears them down. My poor little guy is feeling blue.:confused: plus he was just at the vet yesterday.
 
Smokys AMPS was 241. That's a pretty big drop from last night. PM was 427, gave 3 units of prozinc. Should I give same dose for am?
 
Lisa and Smoky said:
Smokys AMPS was 241. That's a pretty big drop from last night. PM was 427, gave 3 units of prozinc. Should I give same dose for am?
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That's a lovely AMPS! If you're at work all day you'll probably feel more comfortable giving 2.75 u again. If you're at home to monitor you could try 3 u again.

You might have some significant bouncing ahead because of that big drop ...
 
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Lisa and Smoky said:
He did do the same thing while on vetsulin. I think maybe he is just tired of feeling sick all the time. I believe that affects our pets just like us and it wears them down. My poor little guy is feeling blue.:confused: plus he was just at the vet yesterday.
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I agree. Better numbers for a prolonged period of time should help him feel more like his normal self.
 
Sorry, I didn't get your posts until after I left for work. I gave him 3 units in am but am going home for lunch so can get a +4 test in. I can leave work a little early to get in a +8 as well.
 
Lisa and Smoky said:
Sorry, I didn't get your posts until after I left for work. I gave him 3 units in am but am going home for lunch so can get a +4 test in. I can leave work a little early to get in a +8 as well.
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He'll probably be fine, Lisa. If he's lower than you'd like at +4 you can add a bit of higher carb food to his lunch. My experience with Teasel on ProZinc is that it takes him until about +5 to really show the effect of a dose so keep that in mind. By +8 I can usually tell if he's going to surf lower until PMPS or rise.
 
I would think the 400+ could have been a bounce. I am glad you are going to check him out midcycle. It is so hard to know what to give in the beginning, especially if you can't get midcycle numbers.
 
I'm thinking Smoky bounced a little bit.
AMPS 241, +5 was 271, PMPS was 374.
I'm trying to decide on whether to keep him at the 3 units or lower dose back down to 2.75 units.
If I keep him on the 3 units for a few more cycles will he continue to bounce? I'm trying to remember to give him slow steady increases for a few cycles each time.
 
Yes, this looks like a bounce. I'd stay with 3 u again tonight. There's no guarantee that dropping it back to 2.75 u will prevent bouncing but it probably would cause his BG to be higher than you want. If you go this way, tonight's 3 u will be your third cycle at that dose. Tomorrow's AMPS will be interesting to see.
 
Thanks Kris,
My gut is telling me to give him 3 units for his pm shoot. thank you for the advice. I was just getting his insulin ready for his shot now. :bighug:
 
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Lisa and Smoky said:
Thanks Sue for the good advice, never heard of a fat dose. I decided to give him the three units again tonight.:D
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I usually forget to mention fat and skinny doses because I rarely use them. They are a good option once you see how sensitive Smoky is to ProZinc. Some cats react significantly to that sort of miniscule change.
 
Do you think I should give 3 units for a fourth time this morning? I can't really monitor during the day until I can do a curve on Sunday.
 
Lisa and Smoky said:
Do you think I should give 3 units for a fourth time this morning? I can't really monitor during the day until I can do a curve on Sunday.
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I think you could give 3 u again. You're still learning about Smoky's responses to ProZinc. Once you have more data over time you'll be able to decide on a dose more easily. If his numbers are similar through today you could think about giving him a fat 3 u tomorrow AM.
 
My roommate called me at work, Smoky is hanging his head over his water bowl.
I told her that he might be nauseous, any thoughts? I'm still waiting to hear back about smokys test results.
 
Smoky seems to be feeling better now. His PMPS was 456 and am wondering if I shld try a "fat" 3 units as suggested or a 3.25 units ?
 
My boy was hanging out on the bed with me again. I gave him lots of extra scritches and ear rubs. He was singing up a storm. :D
 
Smoky at 348 in am. I'll try one more dose of the fat three units and see how he does tonight. I think I'll try 3.25 tomorrow am
 
I like the lower preshots. It would be really nice to have some midcycle numbers to see if, or how much of the higher levels are a bounce. The danger, as I am sure you know, is that increasing, if there are some lows hiding in there - say, at night, can mean higher bounces and higher preshots. We can presume that isn't the case as the nadir you got was a yellow, and you were at 3 units with Vetsulin, but it'd be nice to be sure.

I might wait till the weekend, assuming you can get some mid cycle levels, before increasing to 3?
 
He has already had 3 units for a few cycles now. I have a friend who bought me an AT2 starter kit and some FS lite test strips. I plan on doing a curve on Sunday but need some help figuring out how to read the numbers. I work during the day so it's very hard to get mid cycle tests in. I can't do them after pm dose as I wld have to wait until 1 am to get one in.
I have to wait until my days off for that most of the time.
 
Lisa and Smoky said:
He has already had 3 units for a few cycles now. I have a friend who bought me an AT2 starter kit and some FS lite test strips. I plan on doing a curve on Sunday but need some help figuring out how to read the numbers.
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You must have received a vial of 25 AT strips with your meter kit. I recommend using AT strips at first to get a feel for the readings they give you. After you have a handle on those, I can help you get up and running with the FS strips. Does this sound like a plan?
 
Sue and Oliver (GA) said:
I like the lower preshots. It would be really nice to have some midcycle numbers to see if, or how much of the higher levels are a bounce. The danger, as I am sure you know, is that increasing, if there are some lows hiding in there - say, at night, can mean higher bounces and higher preshots. We can presume that isn't the case as the nadir you got was a yellow, and you were at 3 units with Vetsulin, but it'd be nice to be sure
I might wait till the weekend, assuming you can get some mid cycle levels, before increasing to 3?
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Sorry. Meant 3.25
 
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