8-27-20 New member and feeling overwhelmed

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@tiffmaxee -

Story so far:

PMPS: - 403 // Fed 1/4 cup raw // DOSE: 0.25IU Lantus (1st cycle)
+1.00 - 418
+2.00 - 552 // Fed 1/8 cup raw
+3.00 - 645
+6.00 - 555

AMPS: - 514 // Fed ??? raw // DOSE: Skinny 0.5IU Lantus
+4.00 - 95
+5.00 - 69 // Fed cpl tsps raw
+5.25 - 109
+6.00 - 82
+7.00 - 70 // (asked caregiver to feed again)

Foods currently available:

* Raw low carb (very)
* Honey

(More supplies on the way)

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Waiting to hear back from Robyn. I asked her to feed and then test after 15 mins. I didn't ask her to give karo, based on the food rise from the earlier 'snack' of raw. I know it won't keep the numbers up long but Robyn's husband has gone to Walmart for carbier supplies. (It's about 15 minutes away from where they live.)

I've been trying to hold the fort thus far. Do you want to take over, Elise?

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Could you cover for about 15 minutes? I have a furchild that requires pilling and I could really do with a comfort break (so I guess I do need a little 'relief'... :oops:). Other than that, I'm A-OK to carry on.

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https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/fdmb-spreadsheet-instructions.130337/

After things calm you it would be helpful to set up a spreadsheet for Olive, it would be easier for members to take a look at that rather than go through the posts. There is also a remarks column there to add what you have fed Olive in case you have to see what you have feed to bring her BG up. She is adorable
Praying for Olive to come up and stay there :bighug::cat:
 
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@OlivesMom -

Robyn, please can you let us know how things are at your end?

- Did Olive eat OK?

- What was her BG 15 minutes after the food?

- Has Steve managed to get back yet with the additional foods?

- Is there anything else wrong?

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Sorry to worry everyone. I've been testing Olive, on phone with hubby as he's been trying to get the right stuff for Olive, he swung by another store to get her some more raw food, and I've been on the phone with the vet tech playing the relay info game again. Vet's supposed to call me tonight with her plan of action as I told the tech that a half unit is simply too much for Olive. The tech said the vet wasn't going to allow me to go under that half unit, so we'll see what she says. But yes, Olives numbers are okay at the moment. I started to tell you guys 15minutes after I tested but then I kept being dragged away. Again, sorry if I worried you. Let me get those numbers written out.
 
@OlivesMom -

If you get stuck like that again, Robyn, just post the number for the test result - no need for any accompanying text. That way, if there's anything we need to advise you in response to the result, we can post it up for you to read as soon as possible so you can take any action necessary without any delay. :)

Next requests:

- Please can you test Olive again ASAP. She may be heading downwards again and if so you need to catch it.

- Please can you post the result here as soon as you get it. (Also the test result from +7.25, please.)


(We'll be able to respond to it faster - you can add it to your spreadsheet after).


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OK, great, it's nice to see her up some, but she's not exactly starting her bounce yet, now is she???

Just so you know, numbers like the ones she's been in today are great for her pancreas-- healing numbers!
 
Story so far:

PMPS: - 403 // Fed 1/4 cup raw // DOSE: 0.25IU Lantus (1st cycle)
+1.00 - 418
+2.00 - 552 // Fed 1/8 cup raw
+3.00 - 645
+6.00 - 555

AMPS: - 514 // Fed ??? raw // DOSE: Skinny 0.5IU Lantus
+4.00 - 95
+5.00 - 69 // Fed cpl tsps raw
+5.25 - 109
+6.00 - 82
+7.00 - 70 // Fed small amount of raw @ +7.25 (16:10)
+7.75 - 100
+8.25 - 104
+9.25 - 94



Foods currently available:

* Raw low carb (very)
* Honey

(More supplies on the way)

.
 
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@Nan & Amber (GA) -

I think that Olive is now within the 2 hours before next preshot test is due. I had hoped we would have been able to ask Robyn to give her a little bit of food beforehand.

Fs & Ps crossed that this far along in the cycle the numbers will hold (anti-jinx).

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Once again pulled away. The vet called as I had just told you I'd send Olive's numbers.
Nan & Amber (GA) said:
OK, great, it's nice to see her up some, but she's not exactly starting her bounce yet, now is she???

Just so you know, numbers like the ones she's been in today are great for her pancreas-- healing numbers!
Click to expand...
That's great to know. I've got so much to share with you guys now after speaking to the vet. Want to run it all by you guys and get your thoughts. But first let me get the numbers to you from earlier and again I want to thank Chris for the help creating the spread sheet. I had such hopes of having that done for you guys today but there's been no time. Hubby is back with all the supplies and so I'm all set now. Hooray!
Critter Mom said:
PMPS: - 403 // Fed 1/4 cup raw // DOSE: 0.25IU Lantus (1st cycle)
+1.00 - 418
+2.00 - 552 // Fed 1/8 cup raw
+3.00 - 645
+6.00 - 555

AMPS: - 514 // Fed ??? raw // DOSE: Skinny 0.5IU Lantus
+4.00 - 95
+5.00 - 69 // Fed cpl tsps raw
+5.25 - 109
+6.00 - 82
+7.00 - 70 // (asked caregiver to feed again)
Click to expand...

Sorry, still having trouble turning the actual time into +
4:50pm Olive was at 100 after having eaten some at 4:10.
104 +8.25
94 +9.25
 
@OlivesMom -

Thanks for keeping the info coming. It helps us to help you better. :)

Next:

- Please can you test again in 30 minutes, Robyn.

- Please can you familiarise yourself with the new glucometer ASAP and let us know how many test strips you have for it. You may need to use it tonight.

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Critter Mom said:
@Nan & Amber (GA) -

I think that Olive is now within the 2 hours before next preshot test is due. I had hoped we would have been able to ask Robyn to give her a little bit of food beforehand.

Fs & Ps crossed that this far along in the cycle the numbers will hold (anti-jinx).

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Click to expand...

Pretty sure there's still time for a snack (I think she's in CST, it's 6:30 there now), but with those numbers I wonder if Olive will be high enough to shoot tonight anyway...
 
Critter Mom said:
@OlivesMom -

Thanks for keeping the info coming. It helps us to help you better. :)

Next:

- Please can you test again in 30 minutes, Robyn.

- Please can you familiarise yourself with the new glucometer ASAP and let us know how many test strips you have for it. You may need to use it tonight.

.
Click to expand...
Yes, I'll be retesting in about 20 minutes. I'll try and get the new human meter up and running tonight but I do have some test strips left for the AT2 for tonight. I may work on the other meter tomorrow as I'd really like to work on that spread sheet some.
 
I think that makes sense, to start fresh with the new meter on a new day. Assuming Olive will let you do that, that is ;).

Tomorrow it'll also be a good idea to start a new thread, as this one is getting kind of long (hard for new people to jump in). Stick with this thread tonight, though, to keep the story together :).
 
OlivesMom said:
I'll try and get the new human meter up and running tonight but I do have some test strips left for the AT2 for tonight. I may work on the other meter tomorrow as I'd really like to work on that spread sheet some.
Click to expand...
If Olive goes low again tonight it's very likely you'll run out of test strips for the Alphatrak. I wouldn't suggest the rush otherwise. I'd not like to see you have the additional stress of trying to learn how to use a new meter on top of the stress of a low run.

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You've done great today!
Critter Mom said:
- What was her BG 15 minutes after the food?
Click to expand...
Just an FYI - it takes 20-30 minutes for carbs to go from the plate to the blood sugar. Testing after 15 isn't going to tell you what you need to know.
OlivesMom said:
the vet wasn't going to allow me to go under that half unit, so we'll see what she says.
Click to expand...
The most important thing to remember is that you hold the syringe - you are the one there with Olive. Looking forward to hearing what the vet suggested.
 
The vet said in her 30 years of practice she's never seen a cat like Olive who bottoms out to hypo on just a half unit of insulin. After reviewing her lab work and all the numbers I had in my log book, she believes that Olive isn't getting ENOUGH carbs in a day. Makes some sense since since we had her on kibble that was 25% carbs for the 8 years and we suddenly took her off that and switched to raw that has 0.04% carbs. She definitely pushed that we put her on the Purina DM just for a trial period of 2-4 weeks as she said all her diabetic clients have excelled on it and many have been able to go off insulin in the end just by that diet. I told her I wanted to stay raw as I've heard it's the best for diabetic cats and she said that in Olive's case it's not offering her enough carbs. She said if I could find another raw equivalent that offered 50-60% protein instead of the 97% that is Primal Raw, that she'd be willing to allow Olive to go to that. Otherwise, she begged me to give the DM food a trial try just to see how that diet balances Olive out. I'm curious if there's anything I can add to the raw diet to make it higher in carbs and if any of you have any ideas on alternative holistic foods that will satisfy the 50-60% protein content the vet wants. She said not to worry about the actual carb content because as long as the protein amount matches that, then the carb content would be just the right amount. I was HAPPY that I convinced her that we should try Olive at the quarter unit of insulin by explaining to her the positive results this group has had using that amount. She said if Olive goes up to a BG of 350 by 9pm tonight then to give her that quarter unit of insulin and if not then to give her nothing until morning at which time to give her the quarter unit of insulin. One thing she told me is that treating a diabetic cat shouldn't be this hard and that she feels awful for Olive that she's having to be stuck so frequently all because her BG is so erratic. She again stated that if she just had higher carbs that the insulin wouldn't be making her drop like this. Any thoughts? We'd like to keep her on raw food, but if she needs more carbs and I can't find another alternative holistic diet that offers more, then I really don't know what to do next as far as diet goes.

104 +10 It may just be that Olive is starting to stay steady now. She hasn't taken a dive in a while.

Ok, I see what you mean. I've got enough stress right now so I'll get the new meter going just in case it's needed through the night.
 
Story so far:

PMPS: - 403 // Fed 1/4 cup raw // DOSE: 0.25IU Lantus (1st cycle)
+1.00 - 418
+2.00 - 552 // Fed 1/8 cup raw
+3.00 - 645
+6.00 - 555

AMPS: - 514 // Fed ??? raw // DOSE: Skinny 0.5IU Lantus
+4.00 - 95
+5.00 - 69 // Fed cpl tsps raw
+5.25 - 109
+6.00 - 82
+7.00 - 70 // Fed small amount of raw @ +7.25 (16:10)
+7.75 - 100
+8.25 - 104
+9.25 - 94
+10.00 - 100


Foods currently available:

* Raw low carb (very)
* Honey

(More supplies on the way)

.
 
Hmmm... initial first thoughts: I like that your vet is taking such a thoughtful approach! Whether or not I end up agreeing with her :woot:, it's a good sign.

I do think it's a sensible hypothesis, that Olive may not be ready for a super-low-carb diet. Some diabetic cats generally seem to do well with just slightly higher carbs; Olive may be one of them, or that may change once she gets back to her fighting weight.

I disagree that the higher carbs are going to stop all of her wild BG swings, though. Maybe she won't dive quite as low with a few more carbs buffering her, but I suspect that she'd still be a pretty bouncy girl and keep zooming up regularly. She's still very very early in her diabetes story, this just takes time.

I'll be interested to hear what other think, especially about ways to modify a raw diet to add a few more carbs. Maybe you could add a little cooked rice or similar? I have no experience with raw food though, so let's see what those who do have to say.
 
I'm going to go feed Olive and knowing her numbers aren't going down anymore think I'll test an hour from now while I go sit and relax for the first time all day. Then I'll work on the new meter. I'll pop on later and see if anyone has any thoughts on anything.
 
Nan & Amber (GA) said:
So... no shot tonight, with that 120, correct? (just checking!)

Am I reading your spreadsheet correctly, that she only got a handful of shots in the beginning, then one at 3am on 8/21, then the last couple? Hmmmm.....
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Yes, at the beginning when her numbers dropped the old vet told me to stop all insulin and test her without it for a week and do a week long curve, but I got so nervous at her high number that night during it that I gave her the shot. But the vet said to continue on without the insulin and sort of "reset" the week long test. So she's not been consistent on the Lantus at all. No, I won't be giving her any insulin tonight but as long as her numbers are at 350 or above by morning I'm supposed to give a quarter unit.
 
OlivesMom said:
Yes, at the beginning when her numbers dropped the old vet told me to stop all insulin and test her without it for a week and do a week long curve, but I got so nervous at her high number that night during it that I gave her the shot. But the vet said to continue on without the insulin and sort of "reset" the week long test. So she's not been consistent on the Lantus at all. No, I won't be giving her any insulin tonight but as long as her numbers are at 350 or above by morning I'm supposed to give a quarter unit.
Click to expand...
On the spreadsheet you should put in the unit column NS for No Shot and you can note why in the remarks column
 
Also in the remarks column whets you put the times you fed her you should put @+3 for example not the time, only because we have members here with all different time zones
Where you have a skinny half , instead of that put 0.5 Skinny
With quarters you can put 0.25 Skinny
Same thing with half's example 0.5 FAT if you ever give a dose like this
 
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OlivesMom said:
Yes, at the beginning when her numbers dropped the old vet told me to stop all insulin and test her without it for a week and do a week long curve, but I got so nervous at her high number that night during it that I gave her the shot. But the vet said to continue on without the insulin and sort of "reset" the week long test. So she's not been consistent on the Lantus at all. No, I won't be giving her any insulin tonight but as long as her numbers are at 350 or above by morning I'm supposed to give a quarter unit.
Click to expand...

You know, I don't think I appreciated just how many days she'd gone without insulin until I saw it on the spreadsheet. Hmmm...

Guess we'll see where she is in the morning! If you are still up, I'd probably try to get one more test in tonight, just to make sure she's behaving herself. Wonderful run of numbers today, though!
 
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