8-27-20 New member and feeling overwhelmed

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Quite a wall of text but i do understand why you are panicking,..I've been there. About food, you want to drop all the dry and start giving pate wet food but read the labels.
 
Good morning. What a night. I must have tweaked the insulin too much and ended up not giving her even the quarter unit. Either that, or I didn't inject it properly, which I don't think happened. Plus I think giving her the added food a few hours after her main meal (as the vet suggested) at shot time jacked her numbers up even more. Her numbers rose to 645 by midnight and were at 555 by 3am and 514 by 9am pre shot. The vet had me give her another insulin shot at 9. She wanted half a unit. Fearful I'm not giving her even the quarter dose properly, I figured a sure thing was better at this point, so I gave her just slightly under the half unit mark. Being daytime I feel much more secure in the fact I can watch her like a hawk if she hypos. At least sticking to just under the half unit mark I KNOW she's getting a set amount of insulin. It's just too difficult with my Walgreens needles to find the quarter mark. I'll be working on the spread sheet today. Thank you to everyone who has been helping and I really appreciate your help through the night.
Wendy&Neko said:
If it helps, in the early days, my cat's numbers sometimes were so high the meter just said "Hi", meaning out of high range. I hated it when the meter greeted me "Hi". All I could do was wait it out. She did eventually become regulated.
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That's what I was afraid I was going to see. I'm relieved to know your cat went through that and did eventually become regulated. Gives me hope.
 
OlivesMom said:
Good morning. What a night. I must have tweaked the insulin too much and ended up not giving her even the quarter unit. Either that, or I didn't inject it properly, which I don't think happened.
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I wouldn't jump to that conclusion... The numbers today aren't always a result of the shot today, remember bounces can last a looooooong time. It's more likely that Olive was still bouncing from a low sometime than that you did anything 'wrong' last night. Patience is key!

If you're shooting a skinny 0.5U, that's your new dose for a while (unless she goes low again). We want to stick to a consistent dose so that the depot can settle down and we can properly evaluate what the dose is doing. Unless, again, she goes low-- then we know immediately that the dose is too high and have to reduce.
 
jt and trouble (GA) said:
Awwwwww hugs to you! I think maybe you should add CHOCOLATE to your hypo kit. Not for Olive of course but for YOU!
Dont worry its going to be ok!
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LOL. You may be right.:D
Nan & Amber (GA) said:
I wouldn't jump to that conclusion... The numbers today aren't always a result of the shot today, remember bounces can last a looooooong time. It's more likely that Olive was still bouncing from a low sometime than that you did anything 'wrong' last night. Patience is key!
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Oh okay, I didn't realize. I'm just so confused as to what the right thing is at this time. Now I wish I hadn't given her the half unit 4 hours ago and tried for the quarter again. I say this because Olive's BG numbers have dropped significantly since the shot. She's at 95 now and if the past is any indication, she will continue to drop for the next few hours and instead of worrying about her being too high, I'm now worried about her going hypo. I have the Karo ready and some food. I'm watching her like a hawk now. As long as I don't see any noticeable signs of hypo should I keep testing on the hour or do I need to go more frequent?
 
Ive always said "You cant test too much" I now there are circumstances where of course that wont do but testing is information. Information brings knowledge.
You have all the tools you need.(in case) ;)
 
Hi Olive's Mom! (It would be nice to know your name too, but if you'd prefer not to share it that's A-OK. :) )

Glad all went safely overnight and I'm glad that @Chris & China (GA) was here with you. (Thank you, Chris! :bighug: )

Can you let us know what foods you have at home (brand and variety, please). If you know them, the carb values would be great too.

e.g.

Brand X - Variety A - Wet/Dry - ??% carbs
Brand Y - Variety B - Wet/Dry - ??% carbs

Also whatever treats you have (e.g. Temptations, Dreamies, Purebites)


Mogs
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My name is Robyn and there's a really fast answer to your food question. She only gets Primal frozen Raw Turkey nuggets. The raw food is 97% protein and 0.04% carbs. I don't offer treats because now I'm afraid to give her anything with carbs. I was just planning to offer her more of the raw if she hypos. Is there something else you would suggest in the case of hypo?
 
Okay, Olive is now dropped to 69 and we are +5 since the half unit of insulin was given. I know it's going to continue to drop as she kept dropping last time and didn't start to go up until 7 hours after shot. Should I keep monitoring and see how much lower it goes or intervene now with some food?
 
Hi Robyn! :)


Ok, you're on an Alphatrak meter and that's right at the bottom of the normal range. You need to intervene with food now. Give a small amount of the low carb food straight away - ONLY A COUPLE OF TSPS FOR NOW. It's important for Olive not to get filled up because it is likely we will need her to eat frequent small amountsuntil we know she's going to stay in safe numbers). Keep the honey to hand (but don't give any for now).

Then come back and tell me:

* If you are in the US.

* If there is anyone else at home with you right now who could get to a shop quickly to get some different cat foods (will give you more info what to get when I know where you are geographically).


Mogs
.
 
Hi @OlivesMom - Just here for support and to say WELCOME - hats off to you for finding this group so fast - Olives is so LUCKY to have YOU. I can totally relate to feeling alone and overwhelmed - everyone here is SO SO supportive and will do everything they can to help. I've only been in this group a week and it's immensely helpful. Just keep on keeping on - reading and learning (and chocolate really does help :)).
 
IMPORTANT:

Note the time you gave the food and test again 15 minutes later and post the result here ASAP.

You may need to add test strips to the shopping list.

.
 
Ok, I'm back. I had decided to go ahead and feed her a little so I was happy when I returned to this forum to see I'd made the right decision. It's the pages I printed out and kept in my hypo toolbox that came in handy. I wanted to cut off the hypo at the pass. I will continue to monitor her closely. I also called the vet's office to tell them her numbers and that I knew they would continue to drop. I only got relayed messages from the vet, but I did tell the tech I want to try her on a quarter unit and she said they could write out a script for those syringes. Yes! I have no clue where we'll find them though. I live in Wisconsin, USA. Yes, my husband is home early from work. He can get whatever food you suggest for when her numbers go low.
 
A lot of us use Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers for quick carb (all the carbs are in the gravy, so we just feed a tsp or so of that when we need to bump them up). Not sure if that's something you want to use along with the raw feeding, though (not for any reason other than if you're trying to keep to a raw diet-- FF definitely does not qualify). Another thing you can do to make a medium-carb food is to add a couple drops of honey to her regular food. We use straight honey for emergencies when we need them to come up fast; the honey+low carb food is kind of an intermediate action.


Good catch on the 69!
 
Sorry if my replies are a little brief at the moment. This is to speed up exchange of important information between us. (Please don't think I'm being abrupt, just need to keep everything focused on Olive's safety at the moment. :) )

Firstly:

Please test Olive's BG again as soon as 15 minutes have elapsed since you gave her food. If it is more than 15 minutes ago, test her straight away and post the result.

Also, please post how many test strips you have left for the Alphatrak meter.

.
 
OlivesMom said:
I want to try her on a quarter unit and she said they could write out a script for those syringes. Yes! I have no clue where we'll find them though.
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Unfortunately, there are no syringes that I'm aware of with quarter-unit markings. We just use the half-unit marked syringes and eyeball it ;).

Just to confirm the syringes you are currently using: they are U-100 (with an orange cap) and 3/10 cc in size, correct?
 
Critter Mom said:
Sorry if my replies are a little brief at the moment. This is to speed up exchange of important information between us. (Please don't think I'm being abrupt, just need to keep everything focused on Olive's safety at the moment. :) )

Firstly:

Please test Olive's BG again as soon as 15 minutes have elapsed since you gave her food. If it is more than 15 minutes ago, test her straight away and post the result.

Also, please post how many test strips you have left for the Alphatrak meter.

.
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BG is 109 now. I only have 25 test strips left. I ordered more and they won't be here until Monday. Ugh!
 
Hmmm... maybe you can put a cheap human meter (Relion brand at Walmart is a favorite around here for convenience/budget reasons) on hubby's shopping list! Always good to have a backup, even if you want to stick with the AT2.
 
Nan & Amber (GA) said:
Not sure exactly-- I think it's a little more durable than honey alone, and maybe less likely to cause tummy upset, because of the added food.
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Thanks for reply, Nan.

I don't know much about raw but from seeing posts by Chris I think it's ultra-low-carb and also very calorie dense so I'm worried about a tiny amount filling Olive up too quickly and her not wanting to eat later in the cycle should she need to. She has been down into the 50s before per Robyn's OP and we've no idea yet how Olive responds to carbs (sensitivity, speed of metabolism).

Can you recommend another brand of gravy food in case there might be no FF Gravy Lovers?

.
 
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OlivesMom said:
BG is 109 now. I only have 25 test strips left. I ordered more and they won't be here until Monday. Ugh!
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Thank you.

109 is fine for now, but you'll need to check again soon to check if Olive's BG is staying up. You're still only mid-way through the cycle. I'd normally suggest testing in 15 minutes but I'm conscious of the strip situation, so ...

Next question: Do you have a Walmart nearby?

.
 
Nan & Amber (GA) said:
Hmmm... maybe you can put a cheap human meter (Relion brand at Walmart is a favorite around here for convenience/budget reasons) on hubby's shopping list!
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That's a good idea. Are the BG numbers very different from the AT2? I only know the AlphaTrak2. Olive's syringes are the orange capped ones from Walgreens. U-100 0.3ML 31 Gauge. We're sticking with the Raw food because it's so high in protein and only has 0.04% carbs, plus it ties in well with their carnivore diet. They also love it, which is a bonus. I have two cats. We just lost our 19 year old baby end of April. It crushed us. Now we're battling this with Olive.
 
Quick summary of last night/today's action (please add/correct anything I get wrong):

PM+3 645
PM+6 555
AMPS: 514, 0.5U given
+4: 95
+5: 69, food (low-carb?) given
+5.25: 109

Critter Mom said:
I think it's ultra-low-carb and also very calorie dense so I'm worried about a tiny amount filling Olive up and not wanting to eat too quickly.
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I think you're right about this, definitely something to be very cautious about.

Critter Mom said:
Can you recommend another brand of gravy food in case there might be no FF Gravy Lovers?
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Ahhh.... nothing with which I have specific experience. FF is probably the most mass-market and readily available option in the US-- you can find it at corner stores, so it should be easily located, it's just that it's pretty much the opposite of a raw, "natural" diet.

On meters, if you don't have a Walmart near you, check your local Walgreens or CVS or other big chain pharmacy. They likely have a store brand meter with cheap strips (I used a CVS meter as a backup, mostly because that's what I have in walking distance so it won out on convenience)
 
Critter Mom said:
@Nan & Amber (GA) - Is there another brand of gravy food you can recommend in addition to the FF GLs?

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Sorry I don't really have a specific rec, but I should say, probably anything advertised as "with gravy" probably means carbs. I also used Temptations treats as BG boosters, of course they're also pretty far from a raw aesthetic, they're basically the cat version of gummi bears.
 
Critter Mom said:
Thank you.

109 is fine for now, but you'll need to check again soon to check if Olive's BG is staying up. You're still only mid-way through the cycle. I'd normally suggest testing in 15 minutes but I'm conscious of the strip situation, so ...

Next question: Do you have a Walmart nearby?

.
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Yes, we're only about 15 minutes from one. I think we'll pick up a human Relion meter. Plus get some FF. Going to go test her again.
 
OlivesMom said:
That's a good idea. Are the BG numbers very different from the AT2? I only know the AlphaTrak2. Olive's syringes are the orange capped ones from Walgreens. U-100 0.3ML 31 Gauge.
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OK, good. Just double-checking the syringe, we sometimes get mistakes by the pharmacy (or even sometimes the vet).

The numbers will be lower on a human meter than what you're used to. There's no real conversion between the two, the only hard-and-fast rule is that while the "take action" number on the AT2 is 68, it's 50 on a human meter. After that, you'll always be working with relative numbers-- what matters is whether the cat is going up or down.
 
OlivesMom said:
Yes, we're only about 15 minutes from one. I think we'll pick up a human Relion meter. Plus get some FF. Going to go test her again.
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Brilliant!

Suggested Shopping List
----------------------------------

For your toolkit:

* Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers - Beef Variety (couple of cans)
* Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers - Any other varieties (couple of cans)
* Fancy Feast Classic Patés - Chicken Feast preferably (NOT Ocean Whitefish and Tuna)
* Temptations Cat Treats

If you can't get FF Gravy Lovers, get some other cat food in gravy. try for these:

* Weruva Grandma's Chicken Soup
* Weruva Cats in the Kitchen: Chick Magnet Pouches
* Weruva Cats in the Kitchen: Love Me Tender Pouches


Testing Supplies:

* Relion Prime Meter and test strips (strips are <$20 per 100) - see Nan's recommendations above if you can't get the Prime.
* Lancets
* Ketone Test Strips (if you don't already have any)

Plus:

* CHOCOLATE!

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Nan & Amber (GA) - can you think of anything I've missed?

.
 
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For higher carb foods, Weruva makes a couple canned/pouch options. I fed them instead of Fancy Feast gravy because FF has wheat that my girl was allergic to. Weruva Grandma's Chicken Soup is a 21% carb canned food. In their Cats in the Kitchen line, Chick Magnet, Love Me Tender pouches were my go-to's at 16-17% carbs, so the lower end of high carb. Not all gravy canned foods are high carb - I used to keep the catinfo list on my tablet or phone and look at it when in the store.

Treats are fine - but Temptations are very high carb. Any pure meat treat (dehydrated) is a perfect low carb treat and in line with feeding raw. I buy dehydrated raw treats.
 
Ok, I'll give Hubby (Steve) the list for the toolkit. Wow, the test strips are so much cheaper for the Relion verses the AT2. No, I don't have any ketone test strips. The vet gave me some glucose strips for her urine which I've been so preoccupied just trying to get her to stay ALIVE today that I haven't even thought about using as of yet. Got those today. Will have hubby look for the ketone strips. I know nothing about them. This vet said she doesn't test using those, just the glucose in the urine.
Olive's BG went down to 82 a half hour ago so I'm going to test again here soon.
 
Critter Mom said:
Hi Steve! (Great name. My dad was a Steve. :) )

,
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Hubby says thanks to you all for being there for for us...and for helping me not to lose my mind through this. ;) He's worried about me since I'm not sleeping and not getting around to eating...hmm, can't imagine why. lol. Hopefully things will start to calm soon. For now, I'm just battling a ton of anxiety as I want to get this right, for Olive. It's stressful too when the vet is not telling us to feed her 2 large meals at 9 and 9 and a small snack between, when I've already told her that Olive won't eat large meals at a crack. Olive likes smaller meals portioned throughout the day. Plus I already know she's going to say I can't give her a quarter unit of insulin, which is what I really think needs to happen.
 
Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers Gourmet Beef Feast in Gravy 20% High Carbs

Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers Gourmet Chicken Feast in Gravy. 15% Med Carbs


Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers Turkey Feast in Gravy. 15% Med Carbs


Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers Chicken and Beef Feast in Gravy 15% Med Carbs

Good to have these on hand, it's really only the Gravy you would need to feed him, or just a teaspoon of the food.
It's good to write the carbs on the cans also
 
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