? Wheezly breathing in post DKA post Hypo cat

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I don't know for sure but I would imagine feline lungs sound about the same as human lungs, I mean, lungs are lungs, regardless of the species, and I don't think they should be making noises outside the the usual sounds of breathing. If he's hearing bronchitis-like sounds in the upper part of her lungs, I would definitely pass that information on to the vet.
 
Tanya and Ducia said:
it is too quiet for video
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I keep thinking it's related to the placement of the feeding tube. If their anatomy is anything like ours, the entrance to the esophagus and the trachea for breathing are very close at the top in the neck. We have a flap that closes when we swallow so food doesn't get into the trachea - and it's not fool proof as anyone choking can tell you.
 
I replied on your other thread. If I had to place a bet it would be on the feeding tube somehow irritating or interfering with the air way.
 
if sits on her own it is very quiet, as if someone with cold or a stuffy nose breathes. It is only when I pet h the sounds increase.
 
Kris & Teasel said:
I keep thinking it's related to the placement of the feeding tube
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I called the clinic twice and was told that due to my refusal of he proposed treatment per owner's request I will no longer receive phone explanations. The proposed treatment was to start her on 2U and I refused. I actually wanted to talk to them to go below 1U which but it never came to it.
 
Tanya and Ducia said:
I called the clinic twice and was told that due to my refusal of he proposed treatment per owner's request I will no longer receive phone explanations. The proposed treatment was to start her on 2U and I refused. I actually wanted to talk to them to go below 1U which but it never came to it.
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WOW!!!! I don't have any advice regarding the wheezing (I have no experience with tubes and such), but that is super uncool of the Vet office. Can you bring her to your normal vet, or call them? (Unless this is who declined helping you over phone.)
 
Did Ducia have anesthesia recently? I have heard of kitties who had too large a tube for intubation get a wheezy sound afterwards cause things were irritated.

Let us know what you find out.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
Did Ducia have anesthesia recently? I have heard of kitties who had too large a tube for intubation get a wheezy sound afterwards cause things were irritated.

Let us know what you find out.
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Wendy&Neko,
Yes, she has been under anesthesia for a short time for E-Tube fitting procedure and actually due to her not been able to rid itself quicj enough she groggy for longer than I would expect. The procedure was success.I cannot any longer communicate with the clinic staff. I had ro refuse their propose increase in Ducia's dose from 1U to 2U. Her weight was 6.5 lbs, and I believed it to be too large of a dose. I thought that her high 300s could be better managed than another Hypo that we went thru the day before yesterday, and refused it. Now, because I did not accept their treatment plan, refused their services, the owner forbade her staff to discuss anything with me over the phone. Even when I asked if that's the possible cause I was told you have to bring her in and that their are the techs and would not know. The owner did came to the phone and asked who it was and after I named my self she hanged up without saying other word. I got her stuff finally email me the lab tests from yesterday and it turned out that for managing her Hypo crisis they didn't do any blood work only the glucose test. I expect it now, but the copy has been sent to my vet, the one who original diagnosed DKA. I am going to call him.
But I have 2 questions that maybe you can help me with:
a) Yesterday after the discharge Ducia was in much better condition. Her numbers are in the SS. Not bad.
this morning 6:45 Bg 342 Lantus 1U 20ml watered slurry, meds and at 8:45 BG is 366. It is going up. I am very anxious and do not know what to think. Why is it up ? Will test again 11:30. She is semi letargic I think, sleeps, reacts to me calling her, but lays down sleeping.
b) the coat under the Tube protective colar is wet. It must be leaking. Can I do anything about it?I will discuss it with the wet but your thoughts are much appreciated. Thank you all
 
Tanya, definitely call your vet. I've never dealt with a feeding tube but it seems reasonable to me to think that it might be leaking and maybe needs to be repositioned. It worries me that it may be interfering with her breathing, somehow. I'm sorry you were treated so shabbily by the clinic that put the tube in, they should never have hung up on you! But please DO call your own vet and let him/her know what's going on!
 
Tanya and Ducia said:
Wendy&Neko,
Yes, she has been under anesthesia for a short time for E-Tube fitting procedure and actually due to her not been able to rid itself quicj enough she groggy for longer than I would expect. The procedure was success.I cannot any longer communicate with the clinic staff. I had ro refuse their propose increase in Ducia's dose from 1U to 2U. Her weight was 6.5 lbs, and I believed it to be too large of a dose. I thought that her high 300s could be better managed than another Hypo that we went thru the day before yesterday, and refused it. Now, because I did not accept their treatment plan, refused their services, the owner forbade her staff to discuss anything with me over the phone. Even when I asked if that's the possible cause I was told you have to bring her in and that their are the techs and would not know. The owner did came to the phone and asked who it was and after I named my self she hanged up without saying other word. I got her stuff finally email me the lab tests from yesterday and it turned out that for managing her Hypo crisis they didn't do any blood work only the glucose test. I expect it now, but the copy has been sent to my vet, the one who original diagnosed DKA. I am going to call him.
But I have 2 questions that maybe you can help me with:
a) Yesterday after the discharge Ducia was in much better condition. Her numbers are in the SS. Not bad.
this morning 6:45 Bg 342 Lantus 1U 20ml watered slurry, meds and at 8:45 BG is 366. It is going up. I am very anxious and do not know what to think. Why is it up ? Will test again 11:30. She is semi letargic I think, sleeps, reacts to me calling her, but lays down sleeping.
b) the coat under the Tube protective colar is wet. It must be leaking. Can I do anything about it?I will discuss it with the wet but your thoughts are much appreciated. Thank you all
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The leaking around the tube is a worry. If water or food slurry gets inhaled she could develop pneumonia. This needs attention by your own vet ASAP.
 
The clinic won't discuss anything with me over the phone at the owner's request. I am not even sure I am welcome to brinh her in.
My vet hasn't called yet.
But hold on everybody, cross your fingers. Ducia just got up and eats on her own warmed yammy WhiteOceanFish pate, phosphorus high, very good for her.
 
Ducia woke up and ate about 1/4 of Friskie 5.5 can, not much but is good, visited her box, groomed, reacts when called. No longer lethargic.Alert. She should get some water in to her but I am not sure I should use her etube without talking to the vet. He is swamped, but the office received the paperwork from the clinic. I hope he will soon.
 
Kris & Teasel said:
The leaking around the tube is a worry
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wet coat rather, it was not leaking as in faulty leaking/dripping faucet. No. It is visible wet. And she licks front of her body often, like right now. But the over all demeanor is better than before.

Her number was up, and now that she has eaten when should I test her?
Does it make any sense to test now?
 
Did you give insulin this morning? The units column on the spreadsheet is blank. It helps us help you if the spreadsheet is kept up to date. When was the last test and how long since her shot?
 
No idea what amount can cause it with a cat, but you can overdose on water. Water poisoning. I know this because I accidentally overdosed our foster baby on water. She had a feeding tube. It messes up electrolyte balance. She did survive my stupidity, but the whole ordeal was horrible. So maybe you can check for a safe amount of water for Ducia. I am so sorry things are such a mess for you and Ducia right now.
 
Glennie said:
No idea what amount can cause it with a cat, but you can overdose on water. Water poisoning. I know this because I accidentally overdosed our foster baby on water. She had a feeding tube. It messes up electrolyte balance. She did survive my stupidity, but the whole ordeal was horrible. So maybe you can check for a safe amount of water for Ducia. I am so sorry things are such a mess for you and Ducia right now.
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Can you recall "water overdose" signs and symptoms?
 
Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey said:
I'm a little concerned about a gel - possibly sugar in it? But right now, if her potassium really is low, it's more important that she gets her supplement.
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When Squallie was first dx-ed w/potassium deficiency he was given a gel by Vetoquinol called Renal K and it had no effect on his bg. They also make a powder that you can add to food, which is what we use now; it's a lot cheaper than the gel. You can check with your vet and see if this would be appropriate for Ducia.
 
Tanya and Ducia said:
Can you recall "water overdose" signs and symptoms?
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The following is from Dr. Karen Becker, describing water intoxication in dogs. I would imagine the symptoms would be similar in cats, as well.

"Symptoms of water intoxication include staggering/loss of coordination, lethargy, nausea, bloating, vomiting, dilated pupils, glazed eyes, light gum color, and excessive salivation. In severe cases, there can also be difficulty breathing, collapse, loss of consciousness, seizures, coma, and death."

There is also THIS detailing a cat being given too much water by e-tube.
 
Tanya and Ducia said:
thank you, I certainly will if he calls, ever.
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If you don't hear from him before the end of the business day I would call back before they close and ask again that he call you at his convenience, stressing that it is a matter of importance to the health and well-being of your sick kitty!
 
Glennie said:
No idea what amount can cause it with a cat, but you can overdose on water. Water poisoning. I know this because I accidentally overdosed our foster baby on water. She had a feeding tube. It messes up electrolyte balance. She did survive my stupidity, but the whole ordeal was horrible. So maybe you can check for a safe amount of water for Ducia. I am so sorry things are such a mess for you and Ducia right now.
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Thanks, Squalliesmom. Much better info than I could give, Tanya. Hope the wheezing gets figured out.
 
Squalliesmom said:
at his convenience, stressing that it is a matter of importance to the health and well-being of your sick kitty!
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that has already been done.
He did the same thing when we were expecting his call about Ducia's blood work. Called much much laer than then agreed. And all I could get from his staff was "he is with the patient" or he is in the room. He has very busy practice.
 
Tanya and Ducia said:
this morning 6:45 Bg 342 Lantus 1U 20ml watered slurry, meds and at 8:45 BG is 366. It is going up. I am very anxious and do not know what to think. Why is it up ?
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That's totally normal.....remember, her levels are all out of whack due to the hypo

There's something we call "bouncing" going on too....when they 1. drop too low, 2. drop too quickly or 3. drop lower than their body is used to (or any combination of all 3), the liver releases stored sugars and hormones to bring them back up fast

It can take up to 3 days for those sugars and hormones to clear the body before you start to see "real" numbers again
 
Ducia Bg 305 +7
I expected lower on 1U
she at 10:50 but not much watered food and peed at this time
The vet hasn't called; Ducia didn't drink 7 am but ate watered meal
7 am water was about 6+ml
she seems to avoid over heating, sneaking from under the blanket, lays almost lethargic. There is trouble with tube but should I give some water anyway?
 
I would hold off on giving her more water until somebody more familiar with e-tubes and hydration can weigh in. How long ago (in hours) and how much water have you given her?
 
As a general guide, cats need about 350ml total oral water a day. A 5.5oz can has about 250ml give or take, so free oral water intake should be about 100ml. Too little water and too much water can be a bad thing. Too much can overload the kidneys and heart if there are issues with these organs. It can also cause electrolyte issues. Keep track of how much extra water you are adding to food and giving her otherwise.

I'm not sure if hydration is the current source of breathing issues. I do know that after one of my cat's dental, she grunted and coughed for a few days because the breathing tube irritated her trachea.
 
Dyana said:
I think most vets only think in 1 unit increments for some reason. It's like they have never heard of syringes with 1/2 unit marks on them. It must be part of their training.
I wonder if the person who sent you syringes to work with the Lantus could verify or confirm that the ones you used were the U100 syringes.
I am keeping you in my thoughts and prayers. Please test tonight, especially about 4 to 5 or 6 hours after the shot is given. Post here for any concerns. I hope you have lots of test strips. It is recommended to keep an extra box of 50 with your hypo kit, as you never know when you will go through a bunch and the last thing you need is to run out of strips in the middle of the night or during the day when you have no car.
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Mine didn't know you could get them with 1/2 unit markings. I had to show her.
 
I'm not familiar with problems that an e Tube might cause, but I know that one of our members (no longer active) highly recommended the Yahoo Feline Assisted Feeding Group. https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Feline-Assisted-Feeding/info
The people there are very knowedgeable and helpful. You would have to join the group and then they send you 4 informative files. They would be the best positioned to help you, and I have heard that they are terrific and caring.

Sending vines for Ducia, hugs for you,
 
Meya14 said:
Also, ---Are you testing for ketones??-- Please try to get a test, as lethargy can mean she's sliding back into DKA.
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Squalliesmom said:
I would hold off on giving her more water until somebody more familiar with e-tubes and hydration can weigh in. How long ago (in hours) and how much water have you given her?
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The water up until now is about 21-22 ml, 47 ml slurry and about 1/2 canned 5.5 ounces food. Her nose was dry to the touch and went to litter box twice. Is it too much of water?
 
Squalliesmom said:
How long ago (in hours) and how much water have you given her?
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The water up until now is about 21-22 ml, 47 ml slurry and about 1/2 canned 5.5 ounces food. Her nose was dry to the touch and went to litter box twice. It's too much. The last water she had was 4 ml via tube at 1pm. The last time she ate was about 3:15pm.
 
Tanya and Ducia said:
The water up until now is about 21-22 ml, 47 ml slurry and about 1/2 canned 5.5 ounces food. Her nose was dry to the touch and went to litter box twice. It's too much. The last water she had was 4 ml via tube at 1pm. The last time she ate was about 3:15pm.
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Tanya....please only post in one thread....it's just too confusing for everyone to try to keep track of what's being said in two separate forums

I have asked one of the mods to merge the threads but I don't know how long that might be
 
The water up until now is about 21-22 ml, 47 ml slurry and about 1/2 canned 5.5 ounces food. Her nose was dry to the touch and went to litter box twice. Is it too much of water?
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If she's peeing, I think she's probably getting enough water

Do you know how to check for dehydration?
 
Tanya and Ducia said:
The water up until now is about 21-22 ml, 47 ml slurry and about 1/2 canned 5.5 ounces food. Her nose was dry to the touch and went to litter box twice. It's too much. The last water she had was 4 ml via tube at 1pm. The last time she ate was about 3:15pm.
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26 ml is less than one ounce, so I definitely don't think that is too much water. How much water was in the slurry? Do you mean 47 ml water to 1/2 can food? If so, that's still less than 3 ounces of water, all together. If she's only had 1/2 of a 5.5 oz can of food, she will need more, I'm pretty sure. Did the vet give you any information on how much to feed her, and how much water she would need? If not, make sure to ask your vet tomorrow when you go in. She needs enough food to make sure she doesn't slip back into DKA. I'm really glad you have the appointment with your own vet tomorrow!
 
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