? Saoirse - PRAYERS PLEASE: *HUGE* Anti-jinx - UPDATE MON 06:00: Eating, Pooped, UTI, BG Crazy on i/d

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The doc prescribed me some tranquilisers and more beta blockers today. I was shaking like a leaf all morning. I'll pay for it later but thankfully the meds are helping right now. My hands are raw from all the OCD handwashing and the number rituals have been almost non-stop for the last number of weeks (which made the exhaustion worse by several orders of magnitude). It would freak me out if I were around Saoirse in the state of distress I was in this morning. The last thing she needs is to be picking up on her mama being panic-stricken.


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Mogs, it sounds like she has turned the corner, no giving up. :cat: Now, remember on the human ketone meter, cat ketones do not even start to show up until 2.4. She is home where she will clam down and start to eat. Here is what Jill sent me when I first started using the human ketone meter (same as yours the Precision Xtra)

Continued prayers and healing vines. :bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug:

Ketones
The latest published research/studies in cats indicate ketones will begin to show up at readings of 2.4 and 2.55 on a blood ketone meter:
Measurement of ketones - Weingart_J VET Diagn Invest-2012(1).pdfMeasuring ketones - JSAP_Zeugswetter - 2012.pdf
 
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I knew I had seen something about the feeding tube but totally missed it scanning.

Critter Mom said:
Saoirse did eat a little bit at the vets.
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The fact that Saoirse ate at the vet is encouraging. She's a fighter Mogs and she's in her own environment now and should help make her feel better too. Sending anti-nausea thoughts and hunger pangs for Saoirse! :bighug:
 
Carol & Murphy said:
Oh Mogs All my prayers and hugs I'm keeping hope alive here in Chicago for you two
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Thank you so much, Carol. :bighug:

I have a question for you. From your signature I know that Murphy has a lot of the same issues as Saoirse. Saoirse hasn't had her Hepatosyl (similar to Denamarin) since before she had her op and another member posted recently that cyproheptadine needs to be used with caution in cats with liver issues. Did your vet ever give you any advice about the cypro? If Saoirse makes it the cypro might help her if I can get her nausea under control. (It did when she had the bad pancreatitis flare not long after her FD Dx.) After all that has happened, I'm afraid of giving her something that might make matters worse. :(

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MrWorfMen's Mom said:
Sending anti-nausea thoughts and hunger pangs for Saoirse!
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PMPS - 14.1 (Alphatrak) / BBK 0.8 - Ate tiny bit of Hill's i/d + some of the gravy / Dose: Skinny 0.25 IU Lantus.
PM+1.75 - 12.5 (Lantus onset at +1.5).

Just after insulin onset at +1.5 Saoirse got up to her dish and ate 1-2 tsp Hill's i/d. She's snoozing now in her playpen. She really likes it; it's so much better than the resting cage; more kitty hotel than penitentiary. I got her some nice thick, fleecy bedding for it. It's big enough for me to climb into so I didn't have to disturb her to check her BG. I ordered a scratching mat to go into it today. It's due to arrive tomorrow. I also ordered one of those squirty yokey-bobs you posted a picture of to see if that might help me to get her to drink a little.

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Smokey, Tux, Tripper and I are sending plane load of scritches and hugs to you. With the cone off and being home with you, she will start to come around. It might be slowly but I believe she will. Have you tried the ham baby food?

Here's a thought, do you have a pet water fountain? A lot of cats like the sound of the trickling water.

BTW I just loooove the new accommodations she has. Is it totally enclosed?
 
Critter Mom said:
A very perky Saoirse in her new digs last night ...


25239163006_23c967d60a_z.jpg


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She looks fabulous!!!!
 
Critter Mom said:
squirty yokey-bobs
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Oh is that what they're called? :woot: It's worked a charm for me with my furkids! :D

I am beyond delighted to hear Saorise has taken more food. With all the shuffling she's done lately between home and vet's, it probably takes her awhile to calm down and relax. That can play havoc on a tummy too! I am confident that little trooper is going to surprise the heck out of you and rally very soon! In the meantime, she can luxuriate in the best little kitty condo on the planet. You are such a good Momma Bean! :bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug:

@Woodsywife here's the pic! I think it's a baby nasal suction syringe but I like Mogs' term better!!thHFXNP5KQ.jpg
 
Woodsywife said:
Smokey, Tux, Tripper and I are sending plane load of scritches and hugs to you. With the cone off and being home with you, she will start to come around. It might be slowly but I believe she will. Have you tried the ham baby food?

BTW I just loooove the new accommodations she has. Is it totally enclosed?
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Thank you for the hugs, and I've just given Saoirse the scritches. :bighug:

The playpen is completely enclosed but it's got two zippered side panels, and the 'roof' is zippered, too. The playpen's great because she has much better visibility of the room, she can walk around in it, and she has plenty of sprawl space to get really comfy. I'll post some pics.

It was sooooooo wonderful to get the collar off her when we got home today and know that she was safe from bumping into anything because she has a nice, airy, protective space to be in where there isn't the feeling of incarceration that the cage has. I have found it so tough over the past fortnight seeing her wanting to groom after eating and not being able to. She ate a little bit for me when she first got home and then gave herself a bit of a bath. I was so happy and relieved for her! (She doesn't like mummy tending to her important little places.)

On the baby food, I've never been able to find a plain baby food in the UK. :(


EDITED TO ADD:

It's quite easy to move the kitty hotel around without unloading it. I slid it over beside the sofa earlier this evening so that Saoirse and I can be close together and I can give her plenty of fusses and scritches.


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Critter Mom said:
Thank you for the hugs, and I've just given Saoirse the scritches. :bighug:

The playpen is completely enclosed but it's got two zippered side panels, and the 'roof' is zippered, too. The playpen's great because she has much better visibility of the room, she can walk around in it, and she has plenty of sprawl space to get really comfy. I'll post some pics.

It was sooooooo wonderful to get the collar off her when we got home today and know that she was safe from bumping into anything because she has a nice, airy, protective space to be in where there isn't the feeling of incarceration that the cage has. I have found it so tough over the past fortnight seeing her wanting to groom after eating and not being able to. She ate a little bit for me when she first got home and then gave herself a bit of a bath. I was so happy and relieved for her! (She doesn't like mummy tending to her important little places.)

On the baby food, I've never been able to find a plain baby food in the UK. :(


EDITED TO ADD:

It's quite easy to move the kitty hotel around without unloading it. I slid it over beside the sofa earlier this evening so that Saoirse and I can be close together and I can give her plenty of fusses and scritches.


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So it could be used outside? I would love to let my kitties out in it over the summer.
 
Mogs Magellan and I are sending lots of healing vines and loving thoughts. Keep the faith and your hart will let you know what needs to be done and how to do it, we have faith in both of you.

Many luvs and hugs
Julia and Magellan
 
MrWorfMen's Mom said:
With all the shuffling she's done lately between home and vet's, it probably takes her awhile to calm down and relax. That can play havoc on a tummy too!
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That makes sense. My own tum's been in ribbons. I was in that awful wanna-throw-up state earlier today. The meds have helped a bit with that.

My little Munchkin has woken up from her snooze. She's sitting in sphynx position and purring. I don't think she got a comfortable sleep all the time she had to wear the collar. :(

And she has just eaten a little bit more of the i/d - took it off my fingers (warming didn't work great) - mostly gravy but it's something.


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I know there have been times when I've been so tired I felt nauseated and nothing I could think of food wise really appealed to me even though I was hungry. I'm sure it's the same with our kitties. After all, look how much time they usually spend cat napping! Imagine having to catch up on THAT much sleep! I think Saoirse will be just fine with some good snoozes and her favourite person's loving care! :bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug:
 
(((Mogs and Saoirse)))

Mogs, I hate to hear that you're feeling it may be her time. But you know your girl best...whatever decision you make WILL be the right one, I know.

Please give Saoirse scritches from me as well. Just snuggle with her and cuddle her and love her. I know you're doing that already. Please know that we're all pulling for you and hoping Saoirse makes a grand comeback! Healing vines for you both!
 
PMPS - 14.1 (Alphatrak) / BBK 0.8 - Ate tiny bit of Hill's i/d + some of the gravy / Dose: Skinny 0.25 IU Lantus.
PM+1.75 - 12.5 (Lantus onset at +1.5).
PM+4.75 - 10.5

Saoirse's sitting up and purring, and doing her little 'speak'. If only I could get some food and water into her. :( :banghead:

Bit nerve-wracking with the insulin, too. I've never ever had to give Saoirse insulin when she was eating so little.


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Mogs,

With blood sugars in the 200's, you should be ok giving insulin. Because she has a very low level of ketones, what I would do personally is give very small amounts of honey every 2 hours or so, and adjust the insulin a little higher. This might perk up the appetite as well. Don't let the BS go much above 250ish though, because it will slow down healing increase dehydration.

Also, has she pooped? If not, this is probably the biggest contributor to the poor appetite and nausea. No amount of anti-nausea or anti-acid medications will help with nausea from constipation. You need to get things moving, and moving fast. The anesthesia, dehydration, and bupe can be very constipating. I would start miralax ASAP if you haven't already (per vet recommended doses), and would inquire about metoclopromide as it is really the magic bullet for this sort of situation however terrible of a med it can be (did she have a bad reaction once? I can't remember).
The vet may be able to give an enema as well, but this only treats the "low side" you also need meds to treat the upper bowels. If she goes back to the vet, a abdominal x-ray would show if she's constipated.

Hang in there.
 
"Mogs"
You are doing everything perfect.... she does love you. She has overcome so much I am sure she will continue to overcome it just may be in baby steps...
I agree to take her lead ... sending you much love light and healing for you and your sweet girl. :bighug::bighug::bighug:
 
Meya14 said:
With blood sugars in the 200's, you should be ok giving insulin. Because she has a very low level of ketones, what I would do personally is give very small amounts of honey every 2 hours or so, and adjust the insulin a little higher. This might perk up the appetite as well. Don't let the BS go much above 250ish though, because it will slow down healing increase dehydration.
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Hi Meya,

I'm very glad to hear from you.

Are those human or veterinary meter reference numbers? (I use an Alphatrak.) Also, what sort of nadir should I be targeting?

Realistically I can't do the honey every two hours + increased insulin because I have no-one to cover for me (or even wake me) and I'm afraid of passing out with exhaustion which would leave Saoirse at risk of hypo. At the moment all I can get down her is the gravy from Hill's i/d. :(

Also, has she pooped? If not, this is probably the biggest contributor to the poor appetite and nausea. No amount of anti-nausea or anti-acid medications will help with nausea from constipation. You need to get things moving, and moving fast. The anesthesia, dehydration, and bupe can be very constipating.
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She had got over the post-anaesthesia constipation and was producing fairly normal poops at home before she was hospitalised last Sunday. Since then she's been pooping once every two days. (Monday, Wednesday, Friday). The Monday stools were very hard but Friday morning's were "OK" (what that means exactly I don't know). I did ask the vets to add a pinch of psyllium to her meals while she was there. Now that her face has healed more I discussed bupe with the vet and to stop a withdrawal high blood pressure reaction the plan is to only give a daily token dose of 0.1ml.

I would start miralax ASAP if you haven't already (per vet recommended doses), and would inquire about metoclopromide as it is really the magic bullet for this sort of situation however terrible of a med it can be (did she have a bad reaction once? I can't remember).
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How do I get the Miralax into her? Mixed in the gravy? Can it be co-administered with metoclopramide?

Saoirse did have metoclopramide before. She was on it for a few weeks IIRC and she started to twitch a little. I stopped it within 2 days of seeing the twitch (had to wait that long for ondansetron Rx to come in).

What about her current meds (Famotidine, ondansetron)? Does she have to stop them if she takes metoclopramide?



Mogs
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Critter Mom said:
Hi Meya,

I'm very glad to hear from you.

Are those human or veterinary meter reference numbers? (I use an Alphatrak.) Also, what sort of nadir should I be targeting?

Realistically I can't do the honey every two hours + increased insulin because I have no-one to cover for me (or even wake me) and I'm afraid of passing out with exhaustion which would leave Saoirse at risk of hypo. At the moment all I can get down her is the gravy from Hill's i/d. :(



She had got over the post-anaesthesia constipation and was producing fairly normal poops at home before she was hospitalised last Sunday. Since then she's been pooping once every two days. (Monday, Wednesday, Friday). The Monday stools were very hard but Friday morning's were "OK" (what that means exactly I don't know). I did ask the vets to add a pinch of psyllium to her meals while she was there. Now that her face has healed more I discussed bupe with the vet and to stop a withdrawal high blood pressure reaction the plan is to only give a daily token dose of 0.1ml.



How do I get the Miralax into her? Mixed in the gravy? Can it be co-administered with metoclopramide?

Saoirse did have metoclopramide before. She was on it for a few weeks IIRC and she started to twitch a little. I stopped it within 2 days of seeing the twitch (had to wait that long for ondansetron Rx to come in).

What about her current meds (Famotidine, ondansetron)? Does she have to stop them if she takes metoclopramide?



Mogs
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You mix miralax in her food.
 
Critter Mom said:
How do I get the Miralax into her? Mixed in the gravy?
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Yes, that will work. I mix it with baby food for Rosa, but it's fine to be mixed into regular food or gravy as well. :)

I'm sorry, I can't help with any of the other drug interaction questions - most of them I haven't used before, but that one I do know the answer to.
 
I'm not sure about the metoclopromide with the ondansetron together, but personally, to minimize reactions to drugs in general, I would just do one or the other. They work differently. The metoclopromide works on the receptors in the GI tract and cause things to move much faster along the GI tract. This can help nausea, reflux, and constipation all in one. The ondansetron works on the vomiting center in the brain, but not at all on the GI system. It prevents nausea/vomiting by making your brain less sensitive to triggers.

Metoclopromide is not a good long term medication, but rather a better medication for acute situations where you only might need a few doses to get back on track.

The gravy is probably better for keeping the BS up because it's digested even slower and lasts longer than pure sugar.
 
The slippery elm is probably more of a maintenance way to manage GI issues. I don't think it is strong enough to resolve opiate and illness-related constipation which can be fairly significant.
 
I've been reading through all of this and I really hope she pulls through for you. Thinking about your sweet baby, and hoping you get some much needed rest soon
 
@Meya14 -

Thanks for getting back to me.

When Saoirse was on metoclopramide during the pancreatitis flare she needed cyproheptadine co-administered or else she wouldn't eat at all. That said, she did have diarrhoea at the time, not constipation. I'm going to ask the vet about it in the morning. I have cypro if it's needed (both tablet and liquid suspension).

My question about slippery elm was more in terms of its soothing effects - the vets didn't put Saoirse's phosphorus binder into her food and I'm worried about stomach acid. I did manage to give her a dose of famotidine on Friday afternoon. I asked the vets to give her a dose the previous afternoon. I'm assuming they did so.

I feel so out of my depth. :(

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ja9390 said:
I've been reading through all of this and I really hope she pulls through for you. Thinking about your sweet baby, and hoping you get some much needed rest soon
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Thank you, JC. :bighug:

Now you know why I was so thrilled to hear Diego started eating again for you. :)

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