Needle size for sub q's

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Carol & Yoshi

Carol & Yoshi

Member Since 2009
If you are giving sub q's to your kitty, what size needle are you using? My vet sells the complete set up
and the needles are 18 gauge Nipro. In doing some research online it seems 20 or 22 gauge are what
most folks using forhome use. Those needle gauges are smaller and my kitty flinches when I stick
the needle in which I'd prefer to take a little longer and not have him feel it like that. I will check with
the vet tomorrow to see if I can at least try a 20 or 22 gauge. Kitty get 100 ml 1-2x per week for
his bowel issues.
 
19 gauge is the largest I will ever use, and that’s only with the Terumo needles that are very sharp and more comfortable and they have the ultra thin wall. I use 20 gauge most of the time. With the Terumo needles you get a pretty good flow rate because of the ultra thin wall. But there’s no doubt that the larger needles make everything go faster. If your kitty is cooperative about things then you should be able to use the smaller needles.
 
Deborah & Muffy(GA) & Wendall said:
I also use Terumo 20 gauge and the cats don't seem to mind them very much. Warming the fluids can help make the experience a little more comfortable and I usually offer a snack as a distraction.

https://thrivingpets.com/products/terumo-needles-thin-wall-21-gauge-1-inch-box-of-100

IV administration lines: https://thrivingpets.com/products/iv-admin-set-bbraun-v1402
Click to expand...
I also warm the fluids in warm water. And some of my cats have eaten during fluid administration.
 
You do not need your vet's permission to use the needles you want to use.

I've used Terumo (brand) 20 gauge x 1" ultra thin all, which flow just as fast as Monoject 18 gauge.
When inserting the needle, be sure the bevel is facing up.

Chewy has Terumo 18 ga x 1" (but no 20 ga). Also another brand I have never tried: Dynarex 20ga x 1".

Check with thrivingpets.com....they have 21 ga needles.
 
Another Terumo fan here. I used 20 and 22 gauge.
The "vet kit" contained BD 18g. Boy, did they take a chunk of skin out.
Order the Terumo if your vet doesn't carry them.
 
Woah. I’ve been using 29g, both for U-40 previously and U-100 now. Wondering now if that’s an issue?
 
Kris & Loki said:
Woah. I’ve been using 29g, both for U-40 previously and U-100 now. Wondering now if that’s an issue?
Click to expand...

What kind of issue? This is about needles for administering subcutaneous fluids, not insulin.

The higher the gauge number, the smaller the needle. So a 29 gauge needle is larger than a 31 g, which is what I use for insulin. The length of the needle can also be an issue for many cats. One of our cats came with 29 g that are an inch long (yikes!) whereas the 31 g needles are just 5/8", much more comfortable for my cats.
 
Thanks for all your input. Thriving pets looks like a good place to order from but California is not on their list and they don't indicate why.
Do you have to have an RX to order your needles?

Yesterday when getting fluids, my kitty tried to depart a couple of times. If he continues to do that, do you think the smaller needles might
lessen that despite taking longer to get the fluids in?
 
Deborah & Muffy(GA) & Wendall said:
What kind of issue? This is about needles for administering subcutaneous fluids, not insulin.

The higher the gauge number, the smaller the needle. So a 29 gauge needle is larger than a 31 g, which is what I use for insulin. The length of the needle can also be an issue for many cats. One of our cats came with 29 g that are an inch long (yikes!) whereas the 31 g needles are just 5/8", much more comfortable for my cats.
Click to expand...
Nah that’s just me misunderstanding that this isn’t about insulin. All good lol
 
Kris & Loki said:
Woah. I’ve been using 29g, both for U-40 previously and U-100 now. Wondering now if that’s an issue?
Click to expand...
That's for insulin and is fine....better than fine because they can barely be felt.
Original Poster was asking about needles for giving subcutaneous fluids. Larger gauge needle required or else.you'd be at it all day.

The larger the number the smaller the needle. 29ga is smaller than 20ga
 
Carol & Yoshi said:
Yesterday when getting fluids, my kitty tried to depart a couple of times. If he continues to do that, do you think the smaller needles might
Click to expand...

from: https://felinecrf.org/cheap_supplies_usa.htm

Most people use Terumo needles — you can read here why they are so popular. Unfortunately it seems that the favoured UTW (ultra thin wall) needles have been discontinued in the USA, so they are increasingly hard to find and many of the stockists below are running out or may have run out by the time you read this. I would recommend stocking up on them if you can find them. Some suppliers, such as Thriving Pets, apparently import Terumo needles from Canada so they can obtain the ultra thin wall.

Why are Terumo needles so good?

  1. They are extremely fine but still very sharp. Terumo states that its Sur-Vet veterinary needles have been shown to be the sharpest on average among brands tested (10% sharper than BD needles and 16% sharper than Covidien needles). Other needles are referred to as "kitty harpoons" on Tanya's CKD Support Group, but Terumos slide in like a sharp knife through soft butter.
  1. The diameter of the inside bore of some Terumo needles (see below for information on needle sizes) is larger than another manufacturer's needle of equivalent size, allowing greater flow rate. Terumo Europe has a photo of how this works. This feature means it takes less time to give your cat sub-Qs
 
Carol & Yoshi said:
Thanks for all your input. Thriving pets looks like a good place to order from but California is not on their list and they don't indicate why.
Do you have to have an RX to order your needles?

Yesterday when getting fluids, my kitty tried to depart a couple of times. If he continues to do that, do you think the smaller needles might
lessen that despite taking longer to get the fluids in?
Click to expand...

Not sure where you read that but Thriving Pets ships everywhere in the continental US. You do not need a script to order needles or IV administration lines. You do need a script to order fluids. My vet sells me a case at her cost so if you'll be doing this long term, it's worth asking.

Well, no cat loves getting fluids but just like getting their sugar tested, they do get used to it. You want to make it as pleasant as possible by warming the fluids in a bowl of hot water and using as little restraint as possible. I do my cats on the kitchen counter in a little bed and hang the bag from the top of the cupboard with a big S hook. Smaller needles are definitely more comfortable. The flow time (100 ml) for Terumo 20 gauge is 1:59 and Monoject 18 gauge is 1:17. Not a whole lot of difference in time, big difference in comfort. Cats, especially older ones, have very thin skin that tears easily so it's better to make the smallest hole possible. Under sedation for a dental, my vet nicked my 20 yr. semi-feral's tissue paper skin while shaving off some mats and had to use a decent amount of surgical glue to put him back together.
 
Kris & Loki said:
Woah. I’ve been using 29g, both for U-40 previously and U-100 now. Wondering now if that’s an issue?
Click to expand...
You are talking about insulin syringes with those types and sizes of syringes and needle gauge sizes. We are talking about needles that are attached to the tubing for administering subcutaneous fluids to a cat (you know, using a bag of fluids.). It sounds like you are okay to me. U-40s are for ProZinc and Vetsulin and U-100s are for Lantus, Levemir and biosimilar insulins.
 
I spoke with a gentleman at Thriving Pets and he was very informative and helpful. Thanks for pointing me in his direction.


Thanks for mentioning warming the fluids. I have been doing that after the initial
go.
 
Can someone give me an idea of the shipping cost of a case of lactated ringers, dozen strip sets and Terumo needles?
Just want to compare with what the vet is charging.

Does anyone use lactated ringer for two months? We're to do it 1-2 times weekly and are still getting used to doing it once a week.
 
I order from Thriving Pets and I live in California. No prescription needed here.

I use the 20G 1 inch Terumo needles for fluids. I tried all sizes bigger and smaller and that was the perfect combination of speed and comfort for my kitty.
 
Carol & Yoshi said:
Can someone give me an idea of the shipping cost of a case of lactated ringers, dozen strip sets and Terumo needles?
Click to expand...
I can't give you a cost for the US but I'll tell you what my vet in Canada charged me during an emergency a number of years back: $40 CDN for a kit which consisted of 1 bag fluids, 1 admin line, 10 needles all thrown together in a grocery bag and called a "kit."
I started ordering my own. 100 needles, a couple of admin kits, a case of fluids. Worked out to under $10 Canadian + shipping.
 
Well, Thriving Pets no longer ships to California. Anyone else had this problem? The fellow I spoke to suggested contacting local pharmacies to see
if they can get the lactated ringers for me with Braun recommended. I don't want to have to buy a case at this point so hope that's not the option
with CVS or Walgreens. Ugh, wish Thriving Pets would send here.
 
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