? Laying By Water Bowl Often

[H.M. Victor (GA)]

Victor will go to his water bowl and drink for a little bit, but then he'll just lay there for quite a while. We haven't kept track of how many times he does this or how long he lays there, but it's quite often, and sometimes he'll have his head hanging over or lying on the edge of the bowl. I did a Google search and saw that this can be behavior associated with kidney disease, so I wanted to get some opinions from you guys about this.

He's still eating normally, and other than what I mentioned above and his issues with constipation and neuropathy, the only other thing that stands out as a concern is that he's lethargic a lot of the time, but that has been going on since he started on insulin, and it's also not easy to tell whether it's also due to his neuropathy or whether it could be something else.

I'm hoping we can get him in to the vet just to get him checked out, so are there any particular tests or anything that you would suggest we make a request for?

I'd really appreciate any advice about all of this.

 

[Squeaky and KT (GA)]

I would suggest a senior blood panel and a thyroid test.

When mine start that, it usually does mean there's a kidney issue BUT NOT ALWAYS! Dakota, diabetic, does that often but he does have failing kidneys altho' he did it before too. When Snow (civie) does it, it usually means he's getting constipated. He also has compromised kidneys but he's always done it way before he got 'old man kidney's.

HUGS,

 

[Bama Kitty Mom (GA)]

Do you monitor how much water he drinks daily? One of the things I keep an eye on is how many ounces of water Bama drinks. I use a measuring cup each morning to measure out one cup of water for his first 12 hours. Before adding it to his bowl, I pour his old water into another dish and measure how much he drank overnight. I do the same thing at night. This is easily incorporated into his preshot and feeding routine. Some of his fresh water gets mixed into his wet food to get him to finish it or doused over his Dr. Elsey's dry kibble that he gets at the end of his meals. For his smaller mini meals, I bring extra water and keep track of how much I've added to his wet food. It is a constant pour and stir, sometimes spoon feed or hold his food bowl up to his face or bring it to him wherever he has plopped down. I wonder sometimes if thirst is a factor in his being slow to eat and that's why he tends to lap the moisture out of his food instead of taking bites of it. He sometimes lays down at his water bowl and stares at it or lays down to drink.

While kidney issues could be a factor for Victor, high blood sugar will make a kitty feel lethargic and not interested in eating. Bama tends to eat better when his preshot numbers are below 300. Above that I know meal time will be a hassle and he will take longer to finish.

Hope you get some answers for Victor and that he feels better soon.

 

[Candy&Company]

Fena used to do this, A LOT - it stopped, not when she started insulin but when I started flooding her food, all food, with extra water.

It was so bad, she'd fall asleep with her chin on the edge of the water pot and I used to be scared she'd slip off to sleep and drown.

Breakfast, lunch, dinner - wet food plus 3.5 tablespoons water. Plus Breakfast and Dinner, she'd get 1 tablespoon water mixed with gravy/jelly/etc. from canned food to mix with her Miralax BEFORE the real mail - overnight, any left overs from her would get an extra 1tablespoon. Mao's, I'd mix with an overnight 5.5oz can of food in 2 dishes - 2 tablespoons water each.

If Mao didn't eat all his breakfast or lunch? I'd add 1-1.5tbs. water and leave out for either/both of them.

Water, water, water, water....

If you've been flooding Victor with water, I'd watch a couple things -

1.) his kidneys: how are his pees? How frequent/amount, guestimate, if you know?

2.) liver - if he's vomiting, and if he is, is it dark/thick...?

3.) bowel movements - is is constipated at all, have you checked his stool for soft/firm/etc...? Frequency?

4.) skin tenting - when you pull up his skin for shots, is it firm, harder to find a good spot, or looser...?

5.) thyroid - when he's at the pot, does he gorge on water or drink then sleep, drink then sleep, etc? If it's the latter, thyroid - especially if he does it a lot, seems tired all the time, has litter box accidents - not necessarily outside the box but seems a bit disoriented confused, unsteady when he uses it like he seem like he doesn't know why he's there - watch his behavior - and weight loss.

I'd suggest a full blood panel - special attention on kidneys and thyroid, and liver levels.

God love you and your baby!!!

 

[Phoebes (GA)]

Phoebe does this on the days before her fluids are due. I swear she's having an affair on the toaster oven with her water bowl!

 

[Candy&Company]

LOL

Phoebe does this on the days before her fluids are due. I swear she's having an affair on the toaster oven with her water bowl!

God this made me laugh so hard, that IS what it seems like doesn't it...?

Or how about when they come to you, begging/demanding attention/love/worship and their mouth is ALL WET maybe their paws too... uugh! Especially when you're sleeping, or trying to sleep at least. For joy!

 

[Phoebes (GA)]

LOL


God this made me laugh so hard, that IS what it seems like doesn't it...?

Or how about when they come to you, begging/demanding attention/love/worship and their mouth is ALL WET maybe their paws too... uugh! Especially when you're sleeping, or trying to sleep at least. For joy!

And when they shake their heads!

 

[Candy&Company]

And when they shake their heads!

Oh god yes, LOL. When they just woke up not long ago and they got water, and they have.. dun dun DUN... shoe laces!!!!

People with dogs always think they have it bad, never realizing cats... yeah... *sigh* LOL.

Another good one! They wanna snuggle with momma, or daddy - it's all good.. then they sneeze Hurricane Katrina right in your face.

 

[H.M. Victor (GA)]

@Candy&Company Thanks for all the suggestions

We haven't been able to switch Victor to wet food yet, so he is still eating dry food, but we already add water to it because he has had some teeth pulled in the past and currently has a cracked tooth so he has trouble chewing it.

1.) his kidneys: how are his pees? How frequent/amount, guestimate, if you know?

He doesn't seem to go very frequently, but the amount does tend to be a lot when he does

2.) liver - if he's vomiting, and if he is, is it dark/thick...?

3.) bowel movements - is is constipated at all, have you checked his stool for soft/firm/etc...? Frequency?

He does vomit occasionally but it always looks pretty normal and is usually either a hairball or due to eating his food too fast. He does have constipation issues and sometimes when he tries to have a bowel movement he will vomit afterwards, which I've read can be due to the fact that he's straining. He will sometimes go a day or more without having a bowel movement and usually when he does the stool is either all hard or the first little bit will come out hard but the rest will be softer.

4.) skin tenting - when you pull up his skin for shots, is it firm, harder to find a good spot, or looser...?

Victor gets his shots in the flank area, and sometimes I do have a bit of trouble pulling up his skin, but not always. It seems more like I just have trouble finding the spot where the skin is looser than an overall problem.

5.) thyroid - when he's at the pot, does he gorge on water or drink then sleep, drink then sleep, etc? If it's the latter, thyroid - especially if he does it a lot, seems tired all the time, has litter box accidents - not necessarily outside the box but seems a bit disoriented confused, unsteady when he uses it like he seem like he doesn't know why he's there - watch his behavior - and weight loss.

When he's drinking his water he drinks it slowly but then will usually just lay there for a while and - like your kitty - sometimes start to fall asleep with his head on the edge of the bowl. When he does get up and leave he just goes and lays back down in one of his usual spots and goes to sleep. Sleeping a lot/lethargy has been very common for him in general after he started getting insulin. His behavior in the litter box actually does sound similar to what you described - unsteady, etc; - but until now I just assumed he had trouble maneuvering in it because of his neuropathy.

We will try to get him in as soon as possible to get a blood panel, it's just a bit of a hassle for us because we don't have a car and our vet is 4 miles away, so we either have to have someone give us a ride (which we can't always find) or we have to take a cab, which we don't always have the money for.

 

[Candy&Company]

So far sounds ok! Have you thought about trying something like Miralax, for the constipation? It's done wonders for my Fena, honestly and I've been getting her brother Mao used to canned pumpkin and it's been working great on him too (he needs the bulk) thus far. A bottle goes A LONG way, so it's a good investment! Just need a 1/8 teaspoon. I'd suggest a 1/4 too but the "slot" in the Miralax container is too small for a 1/4 - so when Fena needs that dose, I just do 2 1/8ths.

Lactulose from the vet is another good one, but syringing it can be problematic - some people mix it into the food, I haven't tried that so unsure what the rate of kitty "detecting" it is, but it's another option. At my vet I get 60 mL for $18 (given 2x daily 2cc each time). The Miralax from Walmart, I got 21.5 oz for only $17 and it'll last me FOREVER.

Yes, straining DOES cause vomiting - not always, but it can and usually is a big factor when it happens. My general rule of thumb for Fena, since no one can predict when a cat will try the littler box is if they break off eating to try and they strain/vomit, to with hold their food for 10-15 minutes to let their stomach settle. Fena's lost some food before if I don't pick it up - she'll vomit, then try to eat again when she's not "really" ready and then she'll vomit again. So give that a try maybe.

Another trick is, after vomiting, if your kitty Victor will allow it - lightly finger-tip massage his sides. Find the end of his rib cage on both sides, from there to about 3 inches down are the muscles you want to massage lightly, circular motions with your fingertips working from the spine down and around to his "belly" area. If those relax/he relaxes, the tension of post-vomit goes away and he can be more comfortable. This especially helps after really hard/violent vomiting where their whole body arcs/jerks/seizes.

Yeah neuropathy and thyroid symptoms can overlap, heck diabetes symptoms too really so if you know they have 1, sometimes it can kinda "hide" the other in the beginning. Sounds like your Victor has great hydration, is peeing good (no obstructions/pain), so if you can maybe help the constipation it might clear up some things and make it a bit easier to spot specific behaviors or symptoms of neuropathy/thyroid. Not a lot, but a little - the better your baby feels after good litter box visits the more clear it can be.

I hear yas on the transport issue! My car's been in the shop 1 month+ because she's old, so I've been walking my butt off when I can and using neighbors/taxi's and I agree it's expensive, worrying, and a hassle - you're not alone!

One additional question though - some cats hold their pee longer than others, your Victor might be in this camp - but can you remember if this is his usual habit, less pees but big ones, or if it's something new...? If it's something new, then I'd ask for a "kidney panel". It's what I asked my vet for Fena. I'm unsure of specifics, but they go in depth for urea, creatine, bun, etc. It might be included in a senior panel, I'm not sure.

You're welcome on the suggestions by the way, I just hope you and your Victor are okay and that you get the help you need.

 

[H.M. Victor (GA)]

@Candy&Company We just got some canned pumpkin and are going to try that for his constipation, but I have seen Miralax mentioned before so it's something I'll keep in mind.

One additional question though - some cats hold their pee longer than others

I think Victor has started to do this, before he started having the diabetic symptoms his usual habit with going pee was of a much more normal frequency, now it is definitely less frequent, so we'll be sure to ask for them to check his kidneys when we can get him in to the vet.

Thanks again, and I hope you and Fena are well too