HELP! Monkey has bloated belly

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PH&MonkeyPenPenFaFaTiger

Member Since 2020
Sorry that I open a new threat again. I would like to concentrate my issues in on one thread for your convenience, however this time is somewhat urgent. And I will give feedback to the previous comments you wonderful people made.

Please see the attachment: Monkey has bloated round shaped belly. I am not sure what does this happen. Also, there is some tumor of his skin surface. Please help me! IS there danger? Monkey has ok mood today, not too energetic, not completely sluggish. Also, his body temperature feels quite high, he has been high for at least a week. (By saying high, is it feels high compare to other cats. In addition he lost a lot of fur, such may make me feel his temperature is higher)

The reason I can think of:
1. He drinks too much water without peeing.
2. He eats too much dry, high carbohydrate food, because he eats a lot dry food for breakfast and diner, compare to my another cat PenPen, maybe double amount, I am not sure. But he eats a lot, maybe more than usual, that's my impression. I let him eat without limit because I afraid this blood sugar can get too low.
3. He eats wet good can and homemade food such as chicken breast. He is ALWAYS hungry therefore I give him a lot of extra meat in the hope that he can gain weight. Also, I feed him freeze dried chicken heart as a treat for blood checking, in the hope that it can replace dry, high carb snack. I am thinking maybe he is not used to digest these. Since he eats dry food all of his life.

Another issue:
1. Please see PenPen's spreadsheet, he fell to 63 ml/DL!!!! I am sure it is not the error of the device because I measure twice, with different testing paper. Luckily PenPen is completely fine today. One thing I did was feed some small amount of high carb snack. What should I do now? Do I need to reduce to dose?

To update previous post:
1. I have brought Lantus solostar 100ml pen*5 today, I am learning how to use. Please confirm the appropriate dose: Currently Monkey's dose is 3.25 U in U40, PenPen is 3.00 U. Do I want to convert it to the same amount of Lantus? and TWICE shot per day, 12 hours per one shot.
2. Please see my spreadsheet, I see Monkey has a high BG all day > 300, does it mean I feed too much dry food, or too few insulin?
3. I have brought wet can food for a complete nutrition (beef, lamb, chicken), plus homemade cooked chicken breast, chicken liver and heart.
4. In the following few days I want to weigh how much dry food they eat at breakfast and dinner. After I get the value, I restrict dry food by reducing 5% of the amount per day while free feeding can food. I may mix the can food to their dry food. Then I closely monitor their BG like 5 to 7 times per day, and reduce their insulin when necessary. Does this make sense?

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Tumor on side belly:
upload_2020-4-14_21-17-56.png

Tumor on near the pelvis bone:
upload_2020-4-14_21-20-42.png
 

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Oh Dear poor Monkey. :( I dont know Peter this to me sounds like an emergency. You say he hasnt been peeing? He could be blocked in which case he NEEDS to see the Vet. Hang on for more replies . I am so sorry this is happening and I send my prayers ans healing vines for Monkey.:bighug:

Your prayer will help:bighug:. I am not sure if it is an emergency, as maybe he is bloated for days or weeks. As my family member report it is not the first day he is like that. (he looks bloated only if his sitting posture is like in the picture, that's why I did not notice it previously). I am sure he pees in recent days and poop this morning. I am not sure if he pees today.
 
Your prayer will help:bighug:. I am not sure if it is an emergency, as maybe he is bloated for days or weeks. As my family member report it is not the first day he is like that. (he looks bloated only if his sitting posture is like in the picture, that's why I did not notice it previously). I am sure he pees in recent days and poop this morning. I am not sure if he pees today.

Amentment, my family report that he pees or poop maybe three times for today. Luckily he is unlikely to be blocked.
 
Peeing is good so you can rule that out. I'm wondering if the Vet gave Monkey a steroid shot for his skin condition. THAT could drive his BG numbers up.
Do me a favor. Type @Deb&Wink or @MarjiandGracie in your next post. My tags arent working. Maybe one of them is available to help.
 
Peter has the vet said why Monkey is so thin?
Has the swelling if the tummy area happened before?
How much food are you feeding a day?
@Deb & Wink @Marje and Gracie . Monkey does not have steroid shot.

Btw, should I reduce the Caninsulin dose for PenPen as his BG fell to 63 mg/DL today
Yes you should reduce the dose of caninsulin because the BG dropped under 68.

just looked at the SS again and I see you are using a human meter now. However I would still reduce the dose of insulin.
 
Peter has the vet said why Monkey is so thin?
Has the swelling if the tummy area happened before?
How much food are you feeding a day?

Yes you should reduce the dose of caninsulin because the BG dropped under 68.

For food, I think about 63 gram of dry food, plus some chicken heart dried snack, plus some chicken breast and chick liver occasionally during the day. He eats whenever there is food.
I do not think it had happened in his life before few weeks ago... as reported by my family member.
Vet just said he is losing weight and increase the Caninsulin dose from 3 U to 4 U. He does not comment on why. He lost weight rapidly and losing a lot of fur and have skin problem in last 30 days. But since last Monday, I has started to take care of him, and he seems to be gradually gaining weight, growing new fur, have better skin, and have better mood. I suspect the reason that he was losing weight in last 23 days, was my family was very ignorant that they do not even know 1 insulin cycle takes 12 hours, and inject insulin in a very unprecise manner.

Should I reduce from 3 to 2.5 U?
 
Peter do you have the correct syringes for Lantus. They are not the U40 syringes.
You need U-100 0.3ml 30 or 31 gauge, 6mm or 8mm syringes with 1/2 unit markings. Brands are Uticare, Sure Comfort, B/D, Carepoint and Monojet.

I find that what I can do it use my U40 syringe to draw the Lantus glargine from the Pen, do you think it is a good idea? Btw I think the concentration of Caninsulin and Lantus is different? Again my question if I give 3 U of Caninsulin, how can I convert to Lantus.

Below is the Lantus I bought:
 

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Yes the doses are 12 hours apart. Lantus is a depot insulin and you will need to hold the dose for 5 to 7 days to let the depot stabilise unless they BG drops low.you will need to choose whether you are going to do SLGS or tight regulation. You can find the yellow stickies about them at the top of the page

Peter DO NOT START THE LANTUS until you have the CORRECT syringes. They are completely different syringes to the U 40 and you will risk giving the incorrect dose.

I have to leave now as it is almost 1am and I need to get to bed. I’ll look in tomorrow.
 
I'm also wondering if Monkey could have gotten into something he shouldnt. If hes hungry can he get into things like the trash? My cat will try that. She knows better but if theres something in the trash that smells good she'll get into it.
 
For food, I think about 63 gram of dry food, plus some chicken heart dried snack, plus some chicken breast and chick liver occasionally during the day. He eats whenever there is food.
I do not think it had happened in his life before few weeks ago... as reported by my family member.
Vet just said he is losing weight and increase the Caninsulin dose from 3 U to 4 U. He does not comment on why. He lost weight rapidly and losing a lot of fur and have skin problem in last 30 days. But since last Monday, I has started to take care of him, and he seems to be gradually gaining weight, growing new fur, have better skin, and have better mood. I suspect the reason that he was losing weight in last 23 days, was my family was very ignorant that they do not even know 1 insulin cycle takes 12 hours, and inject insulin in a very unprecise manner.

Should I reduce from 3 to 2.5 U?
Peter as Bron said reduce Pen Pen's insulin , I guess 2.5 units would be ok
 
I do not think he gets into trash, also he does not eat any human food now.
Ahhh ok but remember thinking and knowing are two different things. My kitty will not eat human food but she just cant resist that trash. I've never caught her eating it but havent seen her turn away from it either. Its just all over the floor where she rummaged. lol
I'm just trying to think of all the reasons belly bloat happens to my knowledge

AND YES! YOU NEED THE U-100 syringes. Trying to utilize the ones you have WONT work.
 
Cats usually develop several symptoms that will tip the pet owner off to a major problem. Until the vet knows just what has caused the bloated stomach, knowing the cat’s symptoms helps the pet owner fill the vet in more accurately: Repeated attempts to vomit or belch Swollen abdomen and stomach Drooling Lethargy Pale gums Lowered body temperature Shortness of breath Rapid heartbeat Sudden weakness or collapse

Read more at: https://wagwalking.com/cat/condition/bloating

Peter this is the best I can do for bloating. I am still praying Monkey will be ok.
 
These are from Amazon if you can't find them at a pharmacy

  • 61H%2Bd%2BGkftL._AC_SX425_.jpg
Roll over image to zoom in

BD Ultra-Fine BD Ultrafine U-100 Insulin Syringe 31 Gauge 3/10cc 5/16 inch Short Needle-1/2 Unit Markings 100/box (328440)
by BD Ultra-Fine
198 ratings
| 16 answered questions



Was: $31.70
Price: $27.68 ($0.28 / Count) &FREE Shipping
You Save: $4.02 (13%)














Eligible for return till 2020-05-31 and restocking fee may apply










  • 31-gauge, 8mm (5/16") BD Ultra-Fine Short Needle is 37 percent shorter than a 12.7mm needle
 
These are from Amazon if you can't find them at a pharmacy

  • 61H%2Bd%2BGkftL._AC_SX425_.jpg
Roll over image to zoom in

BD Ultra-Fine BD Ultrafine U-100 Insulin Syringe 31 Gauge 3/10cc 5/16 inch Short Needle-1/2 Unit Markings 100/box (328440)
by BD Ultra-Fine
198 ratings
| 16 answered questions



Was: $31.70
Price: $27.68 ($0.28 / Count) &FREE Shipping
You Save: $4.02 (13%)














Eligible for return till 2020-05-31 and restocking fee may apply










  • 31-gauge, 8mm (5/16") BD Ultra-Fine Short Needle is 37 percent shorter than a 12.7mm needle
Thanks! It is a pity that Amazon dont ship these kind of stuff to HK :(
 
Thanks! It is a pity that Amazon dont ship these kind of stuff to HK :(
I looked it says they do ship to HK maybe I'm wrong take a look

AmazonGlobal Export Countries and Regions
Amazon.com ships products internationally with AmazonGlobal. Available product lines, shipping rates and fees vary depending on the delivery address for your order.

Search for Items Eligible for International Shipping.

Here is a full list of Amazon Global eligible countries and regions:


Australia, Asia and Pacific


Australia India Marshall Islands South Korea
Bangladesh Indonesia New Caledonia Sri Lanka
Cambodia Japan New Zealand Taiwan
China Kazakhstan Palau Thailand
Fiji Macao Philippines Vietnam
Hong Kong Malaysia

Peter call them and find out,, can you find these at any of your pharmacy's
 
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Peter, a U100 insulin like Lantus is 2.5 times as concentrated as a U40 insulin like the Caninsulin you are currently using.
You can not use U40 syringes with a U100 insulin or you will overdose your cat.
You do not want to risk hypoglycemia with Monkey.

Please wait until you have the proper syringes, U100 syringes, to use with the U100 concentration lantus insulin.
 
Peter, a U100 insulin like Lantus is 2.5 times as concentrated as a U40 insulin like the Caninsulin you are currently using.
You can not use U40 syringes with a U100 insulin or you will overdose your cat.
You do not want to risk hypoglycemia with Monkey.

Please wait until you have the proper syringes, U100 syringes, to use with the U100 concentration lantus insulin.
Any thoughts on the belly bloat Deb?
 
@Deb & Wink @Marje and Gracie . Monkey does not have steroid shot.

Btw, should I reduce the Caninsulin dose for PenPen as his BG fell to 63 mg/DL today
I would reduce PenPen’s dose to 2.75u.

Monkey: has he ever been tested for parasites as they, particularly worms, can also cause stomach bloating. I would more likely think it is something along the line of ascites as @Larry and Kitties suggested due to some underlying cause (not diabetes). There is a condition associated with diabetes that can cause a potbelly but there is no other indication, yet, that we are there or need to worry about that.

I hope you can find U100 syringes. While it is possible to convert the dose to use U40 syringes with Lantus, the dosing itself becomes a nightmare because the Lantus dose would be much, much smaller and it’s virtually impossible to fine dose on a U40 syringe much less consistently dose. It would be an absolute last-ditch option and, personally, if that was the only option, I’d stick with Caninsulin.

When you find the U100 syringes, you’ll want to start his dose at 3.25u of Lantus provided you can be there to closely monitor. He’s getting nowhere on 3.25u Caninsulin but we don’t want to jump him up too much on the Lantus dose. We can fast track him if we need to.
 
Sorry that I open a new threat again. I would like to concentrate my issues in on one thread for your convenience, however this time is somewhat urgent. And I will give feedback to the previous comments you wonderful people made.

Please see the attachment: Monkey has bloated round shaped belly. I am not sure what does this happen. Also, there is some tumor of his skin surface. Please help me! IS there danger? Monkey has ok mood today, not too energetic, not completely sluggish. Also, his body temperature feels quite high, he has been high for at least a week. (By saying high, is it feels high compare to other cats. In addition he lost a lot of fur, such may make me feel his temperature is higher)

The reason I can think of:
1. He drinks too much water without peeing.
2. He eats too much dry, high carbohydrate food, because he eats a lot dry food for breakfast and diner, compare to my another cat PenPen, maybe double amount, I am not sure. But he eats a lot, maybe more than usual, that's my impression. I let him eat without limit because I afraid this blood sugar can get too low.
3. He eats wet good can and homemade food such as chicken breast. He is ALWAYS hungry therefore I give him a lot of extra meat in the hope that he can gain weight. Also, I feed him freeze dried chicken heart as a treat for blood checking, in the hope that it can replace dry, high carb snack. I am thinking maybe he is not used to digest these. Since he eats dry food all of his life.

Another issue:
1. Please see PenPen's spreadsheet, he fell to 63 ml/DL!!!! I am sure it is not the error of the device because I measure twice, with different testing paper. Luckily PenPen is completely fine today. One thing I did was feed some small amount of high carb snack. What should I do now? Do I need to reduce to dose?

To update previous post:
1. I have brought Lantus solostar 100ml pen*5 today, I am learning how to use. Please confirm the appropriate dose: Currently Monkey's dose is 3.25 U in U40, PenPen is 3.00 U. Do I want to convert it to the same amount of Lantus? and TWICE shot per day, 12 hours per one shot.
2. Please see my spreadsheet, I see Monkey has a high BG all day > 300, does it mean I feed too much dry food, or too few insulin?
3. I have brought wet can food for a complete nutrition (beef, lamb, chicken), plus homemade cooked chicken breast, chicken liver and heart.
4. In the following few days I want to weigh how much dry food they eat at breakfast and dinner. After I get the value, I restrict dry food by reducing 5% of the amount per day while free feeding can food. I may mix the can food to their dry food. Then I closely monitor their BG like 5 to 7 times per day, and reduce their insulin when necessary. Does this make sense?

View attachment 52708
View attachment 52709
View attachment 52710
View attachment 52714

Tumor on side belly:
View attachment 52712
Tumor on near the pelvis bone:
View attachment 52713
Poor Monkey, I would take him to see a vet, does it look infected, any thing oozing out of it, if you touch it
 
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Thank you all of your love to Monkey and PenPen. Here is the update:

1. This morning, I found that Monkey's belly was a lot smaller than yesterday. After he had finished his breakfast, he went to poop and pee. My family report the feces look "healthy" and the volume of pee is "a lot". After that I checked Monkey's belly, it looks normal, maybe very slightly bloated, I am not sure. My guess is he consume木 too much water and food yesterday. In addition, there maybe gas inside him since he occasionally bulped. I think he will only need to see a vet if this happen again, what do you think?

2. I bought U100 0.3ml syringe easily in pharmacy in Hong Kong. Yes, it is easy to buy. 0.25 USD per one. I will post a photo later to discuss about the dosing. I want to be extremely careful. The upper one is U40, that I draw 3 units for Monkey. The below one is U40 0.3 ml

3. See my spreadsheet. PenPen went to 43.2 at +4!!! He looked fine and I gave him some high carb snack. Fyi, I fed 14 gram of dry food (I reduce 3 grams of food compare to yerterday) and a lot of can food. I am thinking, maybe the dose of 2.5 Caninsulin is still too much. Should feed the same amount of dry food and I reduce the dose to 2.0 Caninsulin?

4. Monkey still have very high BG during the cycle. Same as PenPen I fed 14 gram of dry food today, 3 grams less than yesterday. Given that his nadir is far from danger level, can I reduce his dry food to 11 gram and give a lot of can wet food?

upload_2020-4-15_17-50-15.png
 

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Hi Peter, While I know its inconvenient these days to take a kitty to the Vet, I think you should get to the bottom of this bloating issue.
Watch him like a hawk. If that bloating gets ANY worse I would rush him to the Vet. (I'm sure others will have more advice)
Monkeys diabetes is out of control right now. If I remember correctly, he NEEDS to eat. I know this is complicated so PLEASE watch for more replies ok? You can use the dry food in case he goes low but I would give him canned food as his primary source of food. I'm all for the slow transitioning but it doesnt seem to be working. I'm keeping Monkey and Pen Pen in my prayers, and you too!

AGAIN please wait for more responses.
jeanne
 
Thank you all of your love to Monkey and PenPen. Here is the update:

1. This morning, I found that Monkey's belly was a lot smaller than yesterday. After he had finished his breakfast, he went to poop and pee. My family report the feces look "healthy" and the volume of pee is "a lot". After that I checked Monkey's belly, it looks normal, maybe very slightly bloated, I am not sure. My guess is he consume木 too much water and food yesterday. In addition, there maybe gas inside him since he occasionally bulped. I think he will only need to see a vet if this happen again, what do you think?

2. I bought U100 0.3ml syringe easily in pharmacy in Hong Kong. Yes, it is easy to buy. 0.25 USD per one. I will post a photo later to discuss about the dosing. I want to be extremely careful. The upper one is U40, that I draw 3 units for Monkey. The below one is U40 0.3 ml

3. See my spreadsheet. PenPen went to 43.2 at +4!!! He looked fine and I gave him some high carb snack. Fyi, I fed 14 gram of dry food (I reduce 3 grams of food compare to yerterday) and a lot of can food. I am thinking, maybe the dose of 2.5 Caninsulin is still too much. Should feed the same amount of dry food and I reduce the dose to 2.0 Caninsulin?

4. Monkey still have very high BG during the cycle. Same as PenPen I fed 14 gram of dry food today, 3 grams less than yesterday. Given that his nadir is far from danger level, can I reduce his dry food to 11 gram and give a lot of can wet food?

View attachment 52745
Did the pharmacy happen to have the syringes with half unit marking on it
It would be much easier when you have to increase or decrease with half unit markings such as 0.25 or 0.5:units
 
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