Cat recently diagnosed with diabetes. First Post

Status
Not open for further replies.
p.s. method used to put Binky's page into this spreadsheet
1) downloaded the html page as an mht (single file)
2) start Excel and open the mht file (there's a drop down which says what kinds of files to display for Excel to open)
3) un-merge any and all cells that are merged, because they can't be sorted
4) put all info for 1 product on 1 line
5) clear out unneeded blank lines
6) set headers to the table
7) sort by any order you want
8) add in any other math you want - like calories per ounce (I didn't find calories per container helpful with the container sizes varying, plus some were stated as grams
 
BJM said:
Being something of a geek, I put some of Binky's pages, plus some other info on separate pages, into an Excel spread sheet. I did try to keep the source indicated, so that credit goes where it is due!

So, as requested, see if you find this helpful.

Geeks rule!!
Thank you. This will help me a lot in sorting out the foods.
I currently have stacks of paper I am shuffling though.

Sev<--Semi geek himself.
 
BJM said:
p.s. method used to put Binky's page into this spreadsheet
1) downloaded the html page as an mht (single file)
2) start Excel and open the mht file (there's a drop down which says what kinds of files to display for Excel to open)
3) un-merge any and all cells that are merged, because they can't be sorted
4) put all info for 1 product on 1 line
5) clear out unneeded blank lines
6) set headers to the table
7) sort by any order you want
8) add in any other math you want - like calories per ounce (I didn't find calories per container helpful with the container sizes varying, plus some were stated as grams

I am using Open Office.
Now I just need to figure out how I can change which is ascending and descending.
I would like to get the protein in descending order. Of course I have only looked at the file in read only at the moment.
 
Sev,

We can debate food choices until we are all blue in the face, everyone has their personal preferences, and what their own personal budgets and their cat's particular likes and dislikes. So it really comes down to finding something that A) Your cat will eat, B) That fits into you budget and C) that is under 10% calories from Carbs for your diabetic.

But there is WAY more to dancing with a sugarcat than just diet.

You have already been started on a good insulin and at a good starting dose.

The third key to this whole process is test blood sugar levels at home to know if Kitty is receiving enough or not enough insulin. This is purely my own point of view but I would stop over analyizing your cat's menu and pick something he likes, that is under 10% carbs, and fits within your budget to feed both cats. And start considering getting a meter and start testing him at home so you can start heading him in the right direction towards hopefully remission. Especially while you are doing a diet change and eliminating the dry out of his diet and finding that perfect food. Since food can and does have a major role in the way their bodies respond to insulin therapy I would want to be watching for trends in his readings as well as collecting data on how he is responding. It is also the single best way of making sure he is safe while on insulin. I would also want to be testing his urine for ketones, as these can lead to a potential fatal condition known as DKA.

If you are hoping for remission in Kitty then you need to have all three elements in place, diet, insulin and home testing. Also we can't help guide you on adjusting and tweaking Kitty's numbers to give him the best possible shot at remission until you start gathering data on his blood sugar reading to share with us. I know first hand since I adopted both of my sugarcats as diabetics that had I know been testing at home I could have very well seriously injured or even killed my Maxwell, because he so quickly went off insulin and we had no history together for me to be able to pick up the subtle personality changes that would have told me hypo was coming on. The same can be said for my Musette, I have on a couple of ocassion only been able to intervene it was could have become a serious hypo situation because I was monitoring her at home, because a couple of times she has taken a seriously low dip into the low 40s and even 30s with no outward signs of hypo.

Diet can always be tweaked as you go along, because every cat is different, what may work for one will not always work for another. I have a very delicate balancing act that I play here with feeding 13 cats, which include one diabetic in remission, one currently insulin dependent diabetic, one non-diabetic that is highly sensitive to anything with grains, 2 that are allergic to chicken, 1 allergic to eggs, and yet another one that is allergic to beef. Even among my two diabetic, one can easily eat things as high as 7-9% carbs and not spike in BGs, while the other one if she gets over 6% carbs will dramatically rise in readings. I am also feeding cats ranging in age from 18 months to 15 years old. I'm also a full time college student, wife, mother and grandmother, and thus we are working on my husband's single income at present so for us it came down to what they would eat that was within our budget that would work for all the various health concerns.

As far as quality of ingredients since many of my cats are former ferals and ex-barn cats...I'm pretty sure they never asked the mouse or sparrow they had in the wild to produce a USDA certification before comsuming it for dinner, and they certainly didn't mind eating said mouse or sparrow's "by products" in fact I have seen them on several ocassions leave nothing but the tail behind when having a rodent appetizer. :-D At least for myself, I try to remember that these are cats, and in being so the only real difference between them and their distant cousins the lion and tiger is size. They are still very much one of the ultimate predators and obligated carnivors as well as skilled hunters and killers. Humans are about the only mammal on the planet that worries about the makeup of their diet, we as humans tend to over think everything.

Mel, Maxwell, Musette & The Fur Gang
 
MommaOfMuse said:
Sev,

We can debate food choices until we are all blue in the face, everyone has their personal preferences, and what their own personal budgets and their cat's particular likes and dislikes. So it really comes down to finding something that A) Your cat will eat, B) That fits into you budget and C) that is under 10% calories from Carbs for your diabetic.

But there is WAY more to dancing with a sugarcat than just diet.

You have already been started on a good insulin and at a good starting dose.

The third key to this whole process is test blood sugar levels at home to know if Kitty is receiving enough or not enough insulin. This is purely my own point of view but I would stop over analyizing your cat's menu and pick something he likes, that is under 10% carbs, and fits within your budget to feed both cats. And start considering getting a meter and start testing him at home so you can start heading him in the right direction towards hopefully remission. Especially while you are doing a diet change and eliminating the dry out of his diet and finding that perfect food. Since food can and does have a major role in the way their bodies respond to insulin therapy I would want to be watching for trends in his readings as well as collecting data on how he is responding. It is also the single best way of making sure he is safe while on insulin. I would also want to be testing his urine for ketones, as these can lead to a potential fatal condition known as DKA.

If you are hoping for remission in Kitty then you need to have all three elements in place, diet, insulin and home testing. Also we can't help guide you on adjusting and tweaking Kitty's numbers to give him the best possible shot at remission until you start gathering data on his blood sugar reading to share with us. I know first hand since I adopted both of my sugarcats as diabetics that had I know been testing at home I could have very well seriously injured or even killed my Maxwell, because he so quickly went off insulin and we had no history together for me to be able to pick up the subtle personality changes that would have told me hypo was coming on. The same can be said for my Musette, I have on a couple of ocassion only been able to intervene it was could have become a serious hypo situation because I was monitoring her at home, because a couple of times she has taken a seriously low dip into the low 40s and even 30s with no outward signs of hypo.

Diet can always be tweaked as you go along, because every cat is different, what may work for one will not always work for another. I have a very delicate balancing act that I play here with feeding 13 cats, which include one diabetic in remission, one currently insulin dependent diabetic, one non-diabetic that is highly sensitive to anything with grains, 2 that are allergic to chicken, 1 allergic to eggs, and yet another one that is allergic to beef. Even among my two diabetic, one can easily eat things as high as 7-9% carbs and not spike in BGs, while the other one if she gets over 6% carbs will dramatically rise in readings. I am also feeding cats ranging in age from 18 months to 15 years old. I'm also a full time college student, wife, mother and grandmother, and thus we are working on my husband's single income at present so for us it came down to what they would eat that was within our budget that would work for all the various health concerns.

As far as quality of ingredients since many of my cats are former ferals and ex-barn cats...I'm pretty sure they never asked the mouse or sparrow they had in the wild to produce a USDA certification before comsuming it for dinner, and they certainly didn't mind eating said mouse or sparrow's "by products" in fact I have seen them on several ocassions leave nothing but the tail behind when having a rodent appetizer. :-D At least for myself, I try to remember that these are cats, and in being so the only real difference between them and their distant cousins the lion and tiger is size. They are still very much one of the ultimate predators and obligated carnivors as well as skilled hunters and killers. Humans are about the only mammal on the planet that worries about the makeup of their diet, we as humans tend to over think everything.

Mel, Maxwell, Musette & The Fur Gang

Nothing to disagree with here at all.

I am going to see if I can get a copy of the original blood work on Kitty. I think that would also help with the over all data collection.
As I said earlier this is uncharted territory for me. I have been known to be a bit anal when it comes to details. Its been commented that I am the only contractor that treats building a deck or addition as if I am building a grandfather clock.
Have no fear I will over analyze. However that will not interfere with me from weeding out foods rapidly once I get familiar with their ingredients and nutritional value. Expensive dose not necessarily mean good and the opposite is true as well.

Now just wait till I start selecting a testing kit. :-D
I am a tool guy and I believe in investing in good equipment.

However as the discussion moves forward I am formulating more questions. :smile:
 
Sev said:
I am using Open Office.
Now I just need to figure out how I can change which is ascending and descending.
I would like to get the protein in descending order. Of course I have only looked at the file in read only at the moment.

Go to the Data menu, select Sort, then you have the option to sort each column in ascending or descending.
 
Mystery said:
Sev said:
I am using Open Office.
Now I just need to figure out how I can change which is ascending and descending.
I would like to get the protein in descending order. Of course I have only looked at the file in read only at the moment.

Go to the Data menu, select Sort, then you have the option to sort each column in ascending or descending.

AH ha!
Excellent!!
 
Lol
Ok, sev. Going forwrd, when we think you are over analyzing, we will say "Sev, it's a deck, not a grandfather clock!"
Carl
 
carlinsc said:
Lol
Ok, sev. Going forwrd, when we think you are over analyzing, we will say "Sev, it's a deck, not a grandfather clock!"
Carl

Yah yah. :-D
Its not stopped me yet. My attention to detail has gotten me a lot jobs over the years.

So I believe I have some good news.
Today I noticed a marked difference in the amount of water Kitty is drinking. It appeared to have changed a noticeably yesterday. I was not sure though.

Also on the FreshPet I am only giving 1oz at a time so that should be the equivalent 4.6 carb.
I am also only giving about 1/3 of a can of Cowboy Cookout at a time. Which should be 1.6 carb.
I am leaving an additional 1/2 oz of Freshpet out for snacking during the day. which should be 2.3 carb.
For a total 8.5 carbs through out the day.
Night time feeding is 1 oz of FreshPet and 1/3 can Cowboy which is another 5.9 carbs.
Total for the day 14.4 carbs.
Is this an acceptable total?

Mind you kitty has never been a big eater. Between refills there is a little FreshPet left in the bowl. So I know he is not starving.
He is ignoring the dry.
 
We haven't been totalling the number of carbohydrate grams in a day - we just feed them enough ounces (or grams) that should sustain the cat. More is given when unregulated because the cat can't use it and feels hungry. More may be given for an underweight cat.
 
BJM said:
We haven't been totalling the number of carbohydrate grams in a day - we just feed them enough ounces (or grams) that should sustain the cat. More is given when unregulated because the cat can't use it and feels hungry. More may be given for an underweight cat.

I would have thought carb counting combined with the proper amount of food per feeding would be a priority.
 
Nope - its hard enough to get owners to change food, much less do home testing. If they had to keep track of kitty's carbs, more would just euthanize.

That being said, it is probably better to do that ... if you are on an insulin that can be flexibly dosed (and you are). It isn't useful for Lantus and Levemir, as doses are adjusted based on the nadir, not on food spikes.
 
BJM said:
Nope - its hard enough to get owners to change food, much less do home testing. If they had to keep track of kitty's carbs, more would just euthanize.

That being said, it is probably better to do that ... if you are on an insulin that can be flexibly dosed (and you are). It isn't useful for Lantus and Levemir, as doses are adjusted based on the nadir, not on food spikes.

Well I am approaching this as an Atkins diet for Kitty. Know your foods. Know your carbs. Adjust your foods and quantity based on the total carb intake.
 
Also on the FreshPet I am only giving 1oz at a time so that should be the equivalent 4.6 carb.
I am also only giving about 1/3 of a can of Cowboy Cookout at a time. Which should be 1.6 carb.
I am leaving an additional 1/2 oz of Freshpet out for snacking during the day. which should be 2.3 carb.
For a total 8.5 carbs through out the day.
Night time feeding is 1 oz of FreshPet and 1/3 can Cowboy which is another 5.9 carbs.
Total for the day 14.4 carbs.
Is this an acceptable total?

Where/how are you getting these numbers? Are they based on "as fed" values?

He is ignoring the dry.
Just a word of caution. As long as the dry food is available, it's a bad idea. One day, he'll decide he's hungry enough to eat it, and BAM, just like that, his BG will skyrocket. We have seen kitties that are in remission somehow find the secret stash of dry food in the panty (inside of tupperware containers), and the next day, they end up needing insulin again. We've had a kitty who was so addicted to carbs that he started eating corn-based cat litter. Took the poor lady forever to figure out why his numbers were all of a sudden off the charts. "World's Best Cat Litter" was the culprit. There is a really good reason why we refer to dry cat food here as "Kitty Krack". Cats will do ANYTHING to get a fix of dry food when you least expect it. It takes quite a while for them to come out of "rehab" once they do too.

Carl


Carl
 
my FD Tilly unregulated but we woke up one morning to find bread bags opened and eaten she would get into to anything she just 'thought' were carbs so i would be careful with ignoring the dry i end somedays they are ok and then one day they go carb nuts
 
carlinsc said:
Also on the FreshPet I am only giving 1oz at a time so that should be the equivalent 4.6 carb.
I am also only giving about 1/3 of a can of Cowboy Cookout at a time. Which should be 1.6 carb.
I am leaving an additional 1/2 oz of Freshpet out for snacking during the day. which should be 2.3 carb.
For a total 8.5 carbs through out the day.
Night time feeding is 1 oz of FreshPet and 1/3 can Cowboy which is another 5.9 carbs.
Total for the day 14.4 carbs.
Is this an acceptable total?

Where/how are you getting these numbers? Are they based on "as fed" values?

He is ignoring the dry.
Just a word of caution. As long as the dry food is available, it's a bad idea. One day, he'll decide he's hungry enough to eat it, and BAM, just like that, his BG will skyrocket. We have seen kitties that are in remission somehow find the secret stash of dry food in the panty (inside of tupperware containers), and the next day, they end up needing insulin again. We've had a kitty who was so addicted to carbs that he started eating corn-based cat litter. Took the poor lady forever to figure out why his numbers were all of a sudden off the charts. "World's Best Cat Litter" was the culprit. There is a really good reason why we refer to dry cat food here as "Kitty Krack". Cats will do ANYTHING to get a fix of dry food when you least expect it. It takes quite a while for them to come out of "rehab" once they do too.

Carl


Carl

This was posted on page one by Jullia&Bandit.
https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B8Uu8g ... ist&num=50

Actually I am off by 2.12 carbs. The Freshpet that is listed is 17 carbs not 14. I am using 1/3 of the amount recommended for feeding.
Let me know if my assumptions are correct.

As fed says 3%
 
A question on the "As Fed".
What % should be used as a good/bad threshold?
Merrick for instance has most of there's well below 2% with many being below 1%.
 
sorry, late to this discussion. for %, are you asking % of calories from carbs? if so, 5-7% is considered optimal but .....
 
Jen & Squeak said:
sorry, late to this discussion. for %, are you asking % of calories from carbs? if so, 5-7% is considered optimal but .....

On the FreshPet Select, which I am trying to decide to keep or trash,
the %Kcal from carbs is 17% and the %Carbs as fed is 3.00%.

I have reduced the recommended feeding amount by 2/3's. So the reduction in percentage should be linear.

Darn just noticed the Freshpet that is on the chart is for their canned not the pouches of meat.

However the guaranteed analysis looks a lot better.

Now where was that carb calculator I saw????
 
wow, you really ARE analytical aren't you? @-)

Just a caution....you may see some benefits from all your hard work...but these are cats, and I've found that a person can drive themselves crazy analyzing things and meanwhile the cat isn't really interested in behaving as predicted... there are many factors that cannot be managed or accounted for in this process.
 
Jen & Squeak said:
wow, you really ARE analytical aren't you? @-)

Just a caution....you may see some benefits from all your hard work...but these are cats, and I've found that a person can drive themselves crazy analyzing things and meanwhile the cat isn't really interested in behaving as predicted... there are many factors that cannot be managed or accounted for in this process.

Oh I know.
My main concern is switching both cats to a healthy diet that stays within what is considered good nutritional boundaries.
I dont mind having to buy multiple brands of food to achieve this. Or having both cats on completely different brands.
I may need to call fresh pet and get the nutritional break down. The kitten wont touch that and if it is carb safe that works in my favor.
I would like to find a food for the kitten that Kitty turns his nose up at as well.
That may be a pipe dream though. :smile:
 
Sev,
On the index page there's a sticky thread titled "calculating food carb %" that might help you out.
Carl
 
carlinsc said:
Sev,
On the index page there's a sticky thread titled "calculating food carb %" that might help you out.
Carl

I saw that.
I believe Dr. Piersons site has a calculator as well.
 
Sev said:
Sev said:
carlinsc said:
Sev,
On the index page there's a sticky thread titled "calculating food carb %" that might help you out.
Carl

I saw that.
I believe Dr. Piersons site has a calculator as well.

I found this as well.

http://www.scheyderweb.com/cats/catfood.html
It says 6.95%
Not sure if its accurate though.

I ran the numbers off the label on Cowboy Cookout and it came within .67 of what is on the charts.

Blue Buffalo Wilderness Kitten came in at .9% carbs. Thats interesting.
 
Sev,
time for this.
"It's not a grandfather clock".

The research you are doing is terrific, really. But there's an underlying possible flaw to your theory. All this work assumes that you will be able to precisely control his food intake. I know you said you have scales and portion sizes. But the only way you can get "in" what you want is to either limit his food to only "so much" per day, or, force him to eat what you put out. Neither of those options is really an option with a diabetic cat, at least not this early in the game.

He's going to need more food than you think he is daily. As long as his blood glucose is not "normal", he can't metabolize food "normally". You give him 100 calories, he doesn't get "100 calories" worth of nutrition. His body is all wonky inside right now. He's going to have to eat more than 100 calories to get the nutritional benefit of 100 calories. How much more? Absolutely no way of telling. Some days, he's going to look at the food bowl, then look at you like you've grown horns, and say "you actually want me to eat this? I feel like crap today, I ain't eating it. Where's the dry?" You'll put "x" grams of protein in, and he won't get "x" amount of protein from it. He just needs food. As long as you keep to some canned food that is low in carbs, he'll be better off. He's not going to be 50% better on 2% carbs than he would be on 4% carbs. He'll just be 100% better on low carbs.

This isn't like weight watchers or jenny craig. You might be able to put "numbers and values" to every menu choice, but he's a cat. He's going to do what he wants, eat what he feels like eating, and really couldn't care less how many "points" he's used up that day. Your work is not a total waste of time. I just think it's costing you more than it's worth at this point. This could be a "Think Tank" thread.

There are a couple of really important things we'd like to know, beyond food questions:

How is Kitty doing? Nobody is really talking about him?
Have you given more thought to home testing? Are you "in" with that yet?
It's been three days since you first posted, but none of really know how Kitty is doing.
Any better, worse, or about the same?
You should probably start a new thread if you post information on Kitty, because once threads get 80 posts long, people tend to skip over them if they haven't been reading all along since it takes way too long to catch up. We can continue this one just relating to "food", but how about another one just about Kitty and his current outlook on life?

Carl
 
carlinsc said:
Sev,
time for this.
"It's not a grandfather clock".

The research you are doing is terrific, really. But there's an underlying possible flaw to your theory. All this work assumes that you will be able to precisely control his food intake. I know you said you have scales and portion sizes. But the only way you can get "in" what you want is to either limit his food to only "so much" per day, or, force him to eat what you put out. Neither of those options is really an option with a diabetic cat, at least not this early in the game.

He's going to need more food than you think he is daily. As long as his blood glucose is not "normal", he can't metabolize food "normally". You give him 100 calories, he doesn't get "100 calories" worth of nutrition. His body is all wonky inside right now. He's going to have to eat more than 100 calories to get the nutritional benefit of 100 calories. How much more? Absolutely no way of telling. Some days, he's going to look at the food bowl, then look at you like you've grown horns, and say "you actually want me to eat this? I feel like crap today, I ain't eating it. Where's the dry?" You'll put "x" grams of protein in, and he won't get "x" amount of protein from it. He just needs food. As long as you keep to some canned food that is low in carbs, he'll be better off. He's not going to be 50% better on 2% carbs than he would be on 4% carbs. He'll just be 100% better on low carbs.

This isn't like weight watchers or jenny craig. You might be able to put "numbers and values" to every menu choice, but he's a cat. He's going to do what he wants, eat what he feels like eating, and really couldn't care less how many "points" he's used up that day. Your work is not a total waste of time. I just think it's costing you more than it's worth at this point. This could be a "Think Tank" thread.

There are a couple of really important things we'd like to know, beyond food questions:

How is Kitty doing? Nobody is really talking about him?
Have you given more thought to home testing? Are you "in" with that yet?
It's been three days since you first posted, but none of really know how Kitty is doing.
Any better, worse, or about the same?
You should probably start a new thread if you post information on Kitty, because once threads get 80 posts long, people tend to skip over them if they haven't been reading all along since it takes way too long to catch up. We can continue this one just relating to "food", but how about another one just about Kitty and his current outlook on life?

Carl

Oh I here ya.
I am not going to regiment to food to much. The best I can do is 3 feedings a day if I am out as my better half come home from work. So she could give a small portion to get both cats by till the evening feeding. If I am out on a job site I could be there into the evening.
Or and most likely I will figure out the total amount of carbs on the foods I settle on and then put 2/3's of the daily amount out. Kitty is a snacker and has never had a voracious appetite.
I understand what your saying on him feeling 100% better on a low carb diet. However If I can determine the lowest carb combination that still maintains a quality diet then I can put out more food without fear of him being over carb'd or under fed during the course of a day.
Now I do have a timer bowl and could pick up another. So that is an option if strict regimentation is required.
I just want to make sure what I do is effective.

Which reminds me.
If a mouse is about 5 carbs. How many mice would your average feline require on a daily basis to meet its nutritional needs??
Knowing this would give a good indication of where I should draw the line on carbs per day. This will also allow me to fine tune which foods will be on the menu. Within budgetary constrains of course.

Home testing is on the burner. I have not started a thread on that or done a search on the site as of yet.

Kitting seems to be doing well. He is bright eyed and bushy tailed and drinking far less water. Wrestling and running with the kitten.
He goes to the vet tomorrow for another blood test. I'll give an update in the morning on what is found.
 
i sympathise with you as what works with one may not work with another! All i do know is how hungry they are at the beginning so maybe you could get the automatic feeder to activate every hour or two. My Tilly is not regulated yet mostly due to bad insulin but she is hungry every hour. So maybe that will help there are loads of wet foods though good for low carb but a lot of diabetic cats until regulated just can't deal with high carb it send the BG through the roof.

I have got mine on Purina MD which works well its pate and she actually likes it such a bonus also botiza is good
 
Raggie Doll said:
i sympathise with you as what works with one may not work with another! All i do know is how hungry they are at the beginning so maybe you could get the automatic feeder to activate every hour or two. My Tilly is not regulated yet mostly due to bad insulin but she is hungry every hour. So maybe that will help there are loads of wet foods though good for low carb but a lot of diabetic cats until regulated just can't deal with high carb it send the BG through the roof.

I have got mine on Purina MD which works well its pate and she actually likes it such a bonus also botiza is good

I just tried Blue Buffalo Kitten. It appears to be a no go. However the Kitten has no objections. :smile:

Opened a can of Cowboy Cookout. No problem.
 
thats good! its funny isn't it they are so picky we tried Hills that was a big NO go for her so luckily I'm glad she has settled on the purina but she is constantly needing it especially as before she came to me as a foster cat she had been on high carb food and had lost nearly all her weight poor thing so I'm hoping once the insulin starts working she will gain weight. I do find though as i have other cats too if they have biscuits she will charge at them and push over anyone in her way :lol: so i have a routine of separation :lol:

Is your little one underweight or over
 
Raggie Doll said:
thats good! its funny isn't it they are so picky we tried Hills that was a big NO go for her so luckily I'm glad she has settled on the purina but she is constantly needing it especially as before she came to me as a foster cat she had been on high carb food and had lost nearly all her weight poor thing so I'm hoping once the insulin starts working she will gain weight. I do find though as i have other cats too if they have biscuits she will charge at them and push over anyone in her way :lol: so i have a routine of separation :lol:

Is your little one underweight or over

The little one is very sleek.
Giving that one antibiotics and steroids at the moment for suture problems from being fixed.
 
Which reminds me.
If a mouse is about 5 carbs. How many mice would your average feline require on a daily basis to meet its nutritional needs??

That depends on two things:
1 - how much does Kitty weigh, or better yet, what would his ideal body weight be?
2 - how many calories are in the average mouse, assuming the entire mouse is eaten?

Carl
 
carlinsc said:
Which reminds me.
If a mouse is about 5 carbs. How many mice would your average feline require on a daily basis to meet its nutritional needs??

That depends on two things:
1 - how much does Kitty weigh, or better yet, what would his ideal body weight be?
2 - how many calories are in the average mouse, assuming the entire mouse is eaten?

Carl

Kitty's Ideal weight is probably 10lbs.
He still has a little extra on him but he looks really good.
He is actually doing more leaping.

One thing I also noticed and I cant say when, is that he lost interest in his toys. I am watching to see if and when his behavior includes playing with them again.
 
Today so far.

Coffee perked. Check.
Fed cats. Check
Insulin shot Check.

Looks good doesnt it?
But wait.

Couldnt find carrier box.
Blue escapes to deck.
Run laps around deck in an attempt to capture The Flash in cat form.
Find carrier box.
Stuff Kitty in box.
Run out to van. Side door is open. Batteries dead.
Run back in house cat carrier in hand.
Step on Blues tail. Received unhappy vocal response.
Let cat out of carrier.
Reschedule trip to vets.

Trapped at home.

And people wonder why I drink. :shock: :smile:
 
:lol: drink and smoke wow its stressful isn't it
I have had to feed tilly 4 times already that girl can eat if only she could put the weight on
 
Raggie Doll said:
:lol: drink and smoke wow its stressful isn't it
I have had to feed tilly 4 times already that girl can eat if only she could put the weight on

Hopefully things are smoother tomorrow. :roll:
 
On the canned cat food.
Both cats appear to enjoy the Wellness Chicken and Herring. Going to try them on the chicken formula and turkey formula next.
If they stay with it the 12.5 oz cans will run me about 18 cents an oz if I buy by 2 cases at a time. That works out to about 54 cents for a 3 oz. That's pretty economical.
 
Sev said:
On the canned cat food.
Both cats appear to enjoy the Wellness Chicken and Herring. Going to try them on the chicken formula and turkey formula next.
If they stay with it the 12.5 oz cans will run me about 18 cents an oz if I buy by 2 cases at a time. That works out to about 54 cents for a 3 oz. That's pretty economical.

Sounds good! Keep in mind that the Wellness is higher in calories than something like Fancy Feast, so you will want to feed less of it. To give an example, Bandit maintained the same weight on 6oz of EVO (about the same caloric content as Wellness) as he did on 7.5oz of Fancy Feast.
 
Julia & Bandit said:
Sev said:
On the canned cat food.
Both cats appear to enjoy the Wellness Chicken and Herring. Going to try them on the chicken formula and turkey formula next.
If they stay with it the 12.5 oz cans will run me about 18 cents an oz if I buy by 2 cases at a time. That works out to about 54 cents for a 3 oz. That's pretty economical.

Sounds good! Keep in mind that the Wellness is higher in calories than something like Fancy Feast, so you will want to feed less of it. To give an example, Bandit maintained the same weight on 6oz of EVO (about the same caloric content as Wellness) as he did on 7.5oz of Fancy Feast.

Managing the proper amounts of food is something I am working on. I am trying to set out an amount that runs out late in the day.
Kitty does not gorge himself. Never has. He prefers the initial meal and then lightly snacks several times a day.
On a 5 oz can calories are running from between 135-220.
What is the caloric intake I should be looking at per day for an 11lb cat that is about 13 years old?

I posted a Kitty update thread today.
 
normally you try to hit between 15-20 calories per pound of the cat's ideal weight.

Mel, Maxwell, Musette and The Fur Gang
 
MommaOfMuse said:
normally you try to hit between 15-20 calories per pound of the cat's ideal weight.

Mel, Maxwell, Musette and The Fur Gang

So 150-200 cal for a 10lb cat?
 
Yes. Depending on level of activity, the more active, the higher towards the 200 you'd go. Bob weighs 14.5 today. He's been between 14 and 14.8 the past 3 months. I try for about 280 cal per day to keep him there.

Carl
 
carlinsc said:
Yes. Depending on level of activity, the more active, the higher towards the 200 you'd go. Bob weighs 14.5 today. He's been between 14 and 14.8 the past 3 months. I try for about 280 cal per day to keep him there.

Carl

Ok. Sounds good.

Both cats are destroying the Wellness food. I have one more variety to try. If they like it I'll start getting the 12.5 oz cans.
 
Raggie Doll said:
sounds like the food change is going well, hope they keep it up, do you have any pics of the little ones

This is kitty.
100_0416.jpg
 
Your cat looks like my Shadoe.

The first thing to be started is home testing, especially before you go mucking with better food.
I would be terrified to shoot blind. You may find cat's OK on a dose, then you muck with low carb foods, and all of a sudden, cat's sick and rushed to vet due to numbers low because insulin not needed as food was changed.

Until cat is closer to regulated, and you won't know until you are home testing, the food amount will matter little as cats can't get all they need from the foods, so seem hungrier and eat more, just to get the nutrients they need.
My Shadoe once ate close to 24oz/day but is down to maybe 8oz now. My Oliver was eating at least 30oz/day and is close to maybe 12oz now. They are regulated now.

I feed them friskies and fancy feast pate flavors which are under 10%; good enough for me. Shadoe is very carb sensitive and if she gets 3 pieces of dry food in her mouth, her BG will hit the 400s. Remove all the dry as it's just not good food.

Get yourself a Relion meter as the test strips are the cheapest, and you test cat like crazy and save some cash.
You will never know how cat is doing, or if your food choices are good or lousy, if you are not home testing.
Be sure you are testing for ketones as well.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top