Blue AMPS High 8/28/2020

Discussion in 'Feline Health - (Welcome & Main Forum)' started by Patty and Blue GA & Brat, Aug 28, 2020.

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  1. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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  2. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    I bet he’s coming down!
     
  3. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    I'm thinking so too since he is out and about like his normal sweet self. I'm going to try again to get a reading. Will post it when I do.
     
  4. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Morning again! (Gonna have to start calling you Patty Schwarzenegger. ;) :p )

    Greetings, Elise. Hope you had a good sleep too. :)


    Mogs
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  5. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    Okay, finally got a reading and it's down to 109 +5...crazy huh?
     
  6. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    @Patty and Blue Please add today’s date to your subject bar. Thanks.
     
  7. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    He’s clearing the bounces quickly. What did you feed him? I’d feed a little mc.
     
  8. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    Now add your +# for your last test. Thanks.
     
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  9. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    He ate just wet food this morning. FF and American Journey. He and Brat trade foods. LOL
    I'll give him some food now.
     
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  10. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    Just a teaspoon or two since he’s dropped s much. We dint want another reduction earned this fast.
     
  11. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    I think i have high carb or low carb...gave him FF...I have gravy lovers but that's high carb right?
     
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  12. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    Stick with lc then. Gravy lovers is high. Test in an hour please.
     
  13. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    I gave him about a teaspoon of gravy from a Meow Mix. I couldn't find the carb count on it even on their site.
     
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  14. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    Just gave him the little bit of gravy. I will retest in an hour.
     
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  15. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    Ok. Will be interesting to see his next move.
     
  16. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    From one of your threads earlier in the week:

    Patty - make a note of these values for future reference:

    * Meow Mix Tender Favorites - Turkey & Giblets in Sauce: 13% Carbs

    * Meow Mix Savory Morsels in Gravy - Salmon & Ocean Fish: 20% Carbs

    (Carb values from Dr. Pierson's 2017 list)


    Mogs
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  17. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    IIRC the contraband treats were 24%.


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  18. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    Thanks. I looked all over for it. I copied and pasted into my notes so will have it handy for next time.
     
  19. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    :banghead:
    Won't do that again
     
  20. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    No big deal. It’s all useful info.
     
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  21. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    He's at 237 +6 so increased a good bit. It doesn't take much to raise his BG. Is this what other cats do?
     
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  22. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    I only posted it so you'd have the reference handy when you're labelling stuff in your hypo kit, Patty. :)

    As Elise says above, you now have an idea of what happens to Blue's BG levels in response to the treats. It's all good.


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  23. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    OKay, yes I forgot to label but it's done now!

    Blue wants to eat again. I gave him a bit of dry food. The Dr. Elsey's PureProtein. I didn't give him dry this morning.
     
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  24. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Depends on the cat. Some are more carb sensitive than others. That's why it's important to keep a little note in the Remarks column of what you feed and when during a cycle.

    As a kitty spends more time in lower, healthier numbers it may be necessary sometimes to 'steer the curve' by feeding the right type and amount of food at the appropriate point in the cycle. To do so safely and successfully, one needs to know how a cat responds to its insulin and its food.

    Keeping the food notes alongside the BG data will help you build up a record of how Blue responds to different carb loads. Should you need to steer his numbers in the future, a glance back at what worked best during previous cycles can help you to choose the right carb load to feed, when to feed, and how much to feed depending on how low Blue's numbers are running and how far along he is in the current cycle. For example you might want to feed a small amount of MC early in the cycle to slow a steep-ish drop in BG (as Elise suggested today). Another example might be where Blue is a tad on the low side but in safe numbers later in the cycle. In such a case, you might feed a small amount of low carb food just to give his numbers a little nudge upwards.


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    Last edited: Aug 28, 2020
  25. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    So you know it was too high in carbs and next time try lower. Good info.
     
  26. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    PS:

    Knowing how much, how quickly, and how long a particular quantity/type/carb level of food is likely to raise a cat's BG level - and keep it raised - is extremely important if ever one needs to manage the cat safely out of a hypo. While there are general principles of how to feed a cat out of a hypo, any cat-specific knowledge is hugely helpful.


    Mogs
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    Last edited: Aug 28, 2020
  27. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Example of 'Remarks' Food Log:

    AMPS: Fed XXg wet 4% carbs.
    AM+3: Fed YYg wet 13% carbs to slow drop.
    AM+6: Fed 2 tsp dry 5% carbs.

    Tip: To move to a new line when adding or editing text in a spreadsheet cell, type CTRL-RETURN (on a PC, don't know the equivalent on a Mac or a tablet.)


    Mogs
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    Last edited: Aug 28, 2020
  28. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    I'm hopeful I'll learn all this eventually. Thanks for all the good info and I will start taking more notice of food and what it does to him. I was surprised a teaspoon of gravy and lc FF would make it rise that much but as you say, it's good to know. Looks like he's very carb sensitive.
     
  29. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    You will, Patty, and much sooner than you may think now. One thing about managing feline diabetes: there's a lot of repetition and it helps to cement the knowledge. :)


    Mogs
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  30. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    Max was carb sensitive as well. The good part of that is I could get him to safe numbers quickly.
     
  31. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Saoirse only had two hypos, one biochemical and one symptomatic (while still in the normal range - 4.4 Alphatrak - after a drop that would give the Angel Falls a run for their money), and one biochemical.

    The symptomatic hypo occurred after the very last time I took any dosing recommendations from our vets. I gave her a liberal amount of honey and tested her shortly afterwards to make sure she was in safe numbers. I subsequently posted here for help, but not before sticking the contents of an entire can of Purina DM in front of her. She absolutely mullered it. Didn't sleep that night. Nor the next night. Nor most of the night after...

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  32. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    Oh no, that's terrible. I wouldn't have slept either.
    I hope I'm prepared for that with honey and high carb food. That would be scary.
     
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  33. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    Good point.
     
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  34. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    Max never got more than hc and a drop if honey to raise his BG. At 12 to 3 a.m. It’s even more scary. That’s why I stuck with 6:00 shots. I found myself up several hours updating my ss and talking to myself as nobody was online.
     
  35. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    In addition to being terrifying it was also a real eye-opener about the gaps in the FD knowledge of some vets. For example, many vets advocate against home testing. When challenged by a more 'hands-on' caregiver about (correctly) wanting to test to protect their cats from hypoglycaemia, some vets tell their clients that there's never really any need to worry about hypos because the cat will automatically seek out food as soon as their numbers get low. This is completely untrue. There is no guarantee a cat will help itself.

    When Saoirse was on Caninsulin it made her feel really unwell for most of each cycle. She would get lethargic and withdraw behind a floor-length curtain not long after her dose was administered. I went to call her for her before-bed sugar check. Her eyes were open but she was otherwise unresponsive. When I went to pick her up she was quite floppy in my arms. I didn't wait to use any fancy ear-warming techniques. I was so panicked I her ear a few rubs between my fingers and went straight for the MEV with the lancet to make sure I got a blood sample on the first go. (Sorry, Saoirse... :( ) :oops:


    Mogs
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  36. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    :bighug:

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  37. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    Poor kitties but you guys learned so much from the experience and your cats survived your learning curve. I hope I don't have an emergency situation but I know it could happen. Sometimes I get up to check Blue to make sure he's breathing. I know, crazy.
    How long ago did you each lose your babies?
    I remember Elise said Max lived to 19? Is that right? I'm happy you both are here to help the newly diagnosed to help their human through the learning curve. :bighug:
     
  38. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    @tiffmaxee -

    Elise, are you OK here? I need to do a hypo watch with new arrival Olive and her mom (underweight kitty with yoyo-ing BGs). Thread.

    Also, she has NOTHING carby apart from raw ultra-low-carb. Can she dip it in honey till I can see if she has someone who can do a dash to the shops for some carby cat food? Also can you remember where the recipe is to make emergency 'gravy'. Also, I can't remember whether or not it's safe to give a cat plain ice cream, in case her mom might have any of that. (I am SO rusty! :oops: :rolleyes:)

    Sorry for the brief threadjack, Patty. :oops:

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  39. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    No Problem Mogs.

    Retested Blue and he's up a little 269 but still not too bad. He's eating again. FF
    He seems fine. Almost normal. Crazy!!!
     
  40. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    That's not bad at +9, Patty. :)

    I'll keep popping in to make sure you're OK but I might not have time to post, but if you need help just stick it on here and I'll pick it up when I next stick my nose in the door.

    :bighug:
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  41. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    I'm good. Probably not test again until PMPS at 7:00...although I'm going to move it slowly so I can shoot at 8 eventually.
     
  42. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    Move it up 15 minutes each cycle. Blue won’t notice.
     
  43. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    Sorry. I was off on some phone calls. All looks good here.
     
  44. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers Gourmet Beef Feast in Gravy 20% High Carbs


    Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers Gourmet Chicken Feast in Gravy. 15% Med Carbs


    Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers Turkey Feast in Gravy. 15% Med Carbs


    Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers Chicken and Beef Feast in Gravy 15% Med Carbs

    Good to have these on hand, it's really only the Gravy you would need to feed him, or just a teaspoon of the food.
    Always good to have honey in hand
     
  45. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    Thanks. I will copy and keep in my notes.
     
  46. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    Back up to 566 PMPS will shoot at 7:15
     
  47. jt and trouble (GA)

    jt and trouble (GA) Well-Known Member

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    I think Blue lives in a bounce house! :confused:
     
  48. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    I'm thinking of buying him a couple of pairs of velcro bootees. :rolleyes:

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  49. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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  50. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    Is this unusual? Seems like big shifts. Maybe he'll adjust to the new dose in a few days. I hope so.
     
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  51. Red & Rover (GA)

    Red & Rover (GA) Well-Known Member

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    If Patty is shooting late to change her shot time, why does it have to be in 15 minute intervals?
    I thought it was only when moving a shot time back.
     
  52. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    Oh, that's a good question... Inquiring minds.
     
  53. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    It doesn’t actually have to be in 15 minutes or even 30 minute intervals but it can act like a decrease if done all at once. Excellent question. I meant to write that when I got back from my walk. I think it’s more necessary when shooting early. Feel free to shot at your desired time in the morning.
    @Red & Rover (GA) Thanks for reminding me to answer.
     
  54. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    Not unusual at all, Patty.

    It takes a little while for the depot to adjust, plus you needed to skip a dose when Blue had that 81 AMPS.

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  55. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    Yes...don’t have to get up in the dark. Reminds me of going to work so 8 will be better. I should test him tonight though. You think once is enough?

    I was going to ask you all with black-eared cats if you tested on the inside? I have a hard time seeing the blood on the outside with his dark ears.
     
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  56. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    It sure looks like once will be enough unless you see a big drop. If you have any questions, you know where to find me.

    Yes,I always tested on the inside with Max for that very reason.
     
  57. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Elise and all. Probably test 10 or 10:30 and update SS. Hopefully he'll move slowly this time.
     
  58. Critter Mom

    Critter Mom Well-Known Member

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    I tested Saoirse's ear on the furry side. Are you using a thin film of Vaseline or Neosporin ointment to help the blood droplet bead up? Also, it helps for the testing spot to be well illuminated (or maybe use one of those headband torchy thingummy wossnames?).


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  59. Red & Rover (GA)

    Red & Rover (GA) Well-Known Member

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    The headband works well.

    I tested on the inside. Rover had lighter, albeit very long hair on the inside.
     
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  60. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    Blue's BG is down 294 +3 tonight. Is that too big of a drop that fast or ok?
     
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  61. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    It’s a pretty big drop. Can you stay up for one more test? If not, feed a little and get a test should you wake up during the night. Since you want to test later it won’t matter if you need to stall in the morning.
     
  62. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    That's a great idea to use a headlamp. I turn on every light in the room and still have trouble seeing. My phone flashlight would be perfect if I had more hands. Yes, a friend on FB had a video showing her testing and she put vaseline on her cats ear. She's the person that directed me to the FB Feline Diabetes group and they suggested I join here as well. I using the Neosporin. It works great. Blue's ears don't bleed much. What did you all use to heat the ear? I've been rubbing them and still have problems. Thinking about maybe making a small rice sock. Just don't want to burn him.
     
  63. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    I can probably stay up. I'll retest then and if he's dropped again I can give him some PureBites. He's been begging for a treat but I've been scared to give him anything.
     
  64. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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    I see many use a small rice sock, put it on the inside of your wrist to make sure it's not to hot, just like you would test a baby's bottle
     
  65. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    I'll do that. Thanks. I tried to use my coffee mug this morning....:coffee:
     
  66. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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    You are welcome :cat:
     
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  67. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    Your spreadsheet looks incredible. How do you measure .10 Lantus? It already looks like a drop and I'm giving .50....
     
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  68. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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    For 0.10 you would bring the syringe right under the zero line on the syringe, it would be the first line you see
     
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  69. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Pictorial guide using a U-100 syringe marked with half units:
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
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  70. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    My syringes don't have those markings. I ordered some today so hopefully it will help. It looks like nothing is in the syringe using what I have.
     
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  71. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Are you using syringes with half unit markings?
     
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  72. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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  73. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    I just ordered today from Chewy. I haven't been able to find any locally.
     
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  74. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Good it will make it so much easier for you :cat:
     
  75. Red & Rover (GA)

    Red & Rover (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Make up a syringe with coloured water to use as a guide.

    A pair of dollar store magnifying reading glasses helps.
     
  76. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    Great idea! Thanks.
     
  77. Patty and Blue GA & Brat

    Patty and Blue GA & Brat Well-Known Member

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    Just tested again and he's up just a little to 301 +4. I'm heading to bed but will check back in shortly to see if I need to do anything more. I'm going to skip the treats since it's a little higher.
    Changed my mind. He looked so cute and they all got a few treats. PureBites for Blue and the others got Instinct 24% carbs...lol won't make that mistake again.
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2020
  78. tiffmaxee

    tiffmaxee Well-Known Member

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    Good night a Patty! The treats were fine.
     
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