9/17 Muffin pmps 384 +2 82 +3 42..,+4.5 55 +5 47

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Anne&Muffin (GA)

Anne&Muffin (GA)

Member Since 2010
Yesterday: viewtopic.php?f=9&t=79210

Recap:

9/16
amps 71
+2 54 fed
+3 52 fed
+4.5 47
+6 51
+9 47
+12 62 skipped shot

Ouch on poor Muffin's amps this morning! :cry: But I'm still glad I skipped last night. I was beginning to wonder whether she really need insulin still or if maybe she just needed a jump start. So I gained valuable information. I did reduce this morning to .1, so we'll have to see what this cycle brings. I'm waiting for lab results today, so that will be good information as well.

Muffin is acting a little hand shy with me today, even tho I gave her the whole night off. I'm going to try to catch her going potty so I can do a ketone test - I've not actually seen her go potty at all since this started, and her potty pad has remained dry. It's Monday and the DGD's are back to school, so paws crossed she'll be more cooperative with testing today.
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin amps 369

Holy moly - all that beautiful green and then such a big bounce! Muffin is obviously not used to getting the juice again. Hopefully that AMPS is just that, a big fat ugly bounce, and that it will clear soon!

Fingers and paws crossed for Muffin with the microdosing!! She better hop right back on that wagon!!!!!
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin amps 369

Hi Anne, sorry about the bounc! This does give you more information with skipping the shot and seeing what happens. Come on down, Muffin. Hope she clears the bounce soon. Congrats on the dosecrease.
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin amps 369

Hi Anne:) Hoping Muffin clears this bounce and gets back on track with her great numbers.
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin amps 369 +2 324

+2 324 I haven't gotten lab results yet, but she definitely has a UTI. She peed on DGD's bed this morning and there are 2 pee spots on the rug in the front room. I wish he'd hurry up and call so we can start the AB's.
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin amps 369 +2 324

Hi guys .. bummer on the amps and bummer on the UTI .. I hope you can start the meds soon so muffin starts feeling much better .. have a great day guys!
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin amps 369 +2 324

Hi !! Hope that Muffin comes down & goes back OTJ! Anne, you know all the variables and maybe Muffin is experiencing some of them now--Hope this is temporary as I know how diligent you are with Muffin--
Thank sfor all your sweet thoughts for Moonie--We wish good things fro you & Muffin too--Many Hugs & Love from us!!!
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin amps 369 +2 324 P'titis again Dose help!

+4.5 is 277. Vet called finally - there is no UTI, but spec fpl came back at 8! So major pancreatitis flare, worse than she's ever had. Dr wants to put her on sam-e for at least a year, possibly a lifetime. I'm not looking forward to that, as those pills are huge and were very difficult to give her last time she was on it. He wanted to hold off on the prednisone until I had her BG under control, as it's so high again today, but I disagreed. I want to get treatment started, and assured him I can counteract the effect with more insulin. So I've given bupe with the +4.5 test and will go pick up the other meds shortly.

After updating him on our insulin ride so far, he's suggesting a dose of .25, which I originally thought might be too much. However, this .1 doesn't seem to be doing enough for her today, and with adding prednisone into the mix, maybe .25 is the way to go? I know I'm jumping doses a lot, and that's a no-no with lantus, but I've just been trying to figure out where to start. So I need the wise ones! Thank you! :YMHUG:
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin amps 369 +2 324 P'titis again Dose help!

Hi Anne, I'm so sorry to see you and Muffin back here! but glad to hear from you, I hope she is back OTJ as soon as whatever has been bothering her is cleared up. I've been out of town and need to catch up. :YMHUG: :YMHUG:
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin amps 369 +2 324 P'titis again Dose help!

Well drat on the P-itis, and as Sienne writes "knowledge is power", so now you can make a plan! I'm no help with the dosing but will bump you up.
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin amps 369 +2 324 P'titis again Dose help!

Anne --

Is there a way to break the SamE into smaller doses? You can always purchase blank gel caps. Denosyl is the active ingredient in SamE and also comes in denamarin. This is the brand that Jill uses with Alex. Milk thistle is also a substitute.

As for dose, I think you're forgetting that you need to give Muffin's depot a chance to form. Muffin's numbers have dropped 100 points by +4. I'd pick a dose and stick with it.
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin amps 369 +2 324 P'titis again Dose help!

Thanks for the link on the denamarin Sienne. I had done some research last time she was on it, and everything said not to break or crush the pills. So it's interesting that there are chewables for dogs. Maybe breaking just makes it less effective? I'll have to do some research. And you're right about the shed. I'll stick with one dose, and maybe I'll pick that dose based on whether or not I start prednisone tonight? Now I'm second-guessing myself on everything. :lol: I'm thinking about getting an ultrasound done just to see what's really going on - going to talk to the vet about it this evening when I go pick up Muffin's meds. I see a lot more reasearch in my near future. @-) Decisions, decisions, decisions....I hate 'em ;-)
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin amps 369 +2 324 P'titis again Dose help!

Hi Anne, sorry about the P-titis Dx, but at least you have an explanation for the BG numbers and can hopefully get it under control again. I had done some research on Sam-E for a friend's dog, and apparently the pills are coated because whatever is inside is foul tasting. Hence the recommendation not to split the pills because you'll taste the ingredient. They must have done something special for the chewables.
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin amps 369 +2 324 P'titis again Dose help!

I sent a note to Jill. Here's her reply:
you mentioned denamarin in her condo. she should talk to the vet to see if denamarin (sam-e and milk thistle combo) is ok. it's a small pill. easy to pill a cat. the pill is to be given whole... should not be cut or crushed. administer on an empty stomach at least one hour before feeding.
Click to expand...
Hopefully, your vet won't have any objections and it sounds like this would make things much easier on you and Muffin.
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin amps 369 +2 324 P'titis again Dose help!

(((Anne))), so sorry to hear Muffin's dx. But I gather that you know what to do, having been through this before. Rusty had a mild case of pancreatitis last spring, and I had to raise his dose to compensate for the higher carb food I was feeding him in order to make sure that he ate enough. It all worked.
Good luck with Muffin's dose, with building her shed, and with the supplements you are considering giving her. We are sending healing vines--good ones!

Hugs,

Ella & Rusty
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin amps 369 +2 324 P'titis again Dose help!

Hi Anne,
I'm so sorry about poor Muffin's pancreatitis! I hope the other form of SamE works for her so it's easier for the two of youl I hope she feels better soon and can get back off the juice.

Melanie & Racci
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin pmps 384 P'titis again

Pmps 384 I settled on a dose of .25. I went up and had a discussion with the vet after having a nice conversation with Marje. I took Muffin's SS with me, at his request, and after going over that, he thought .25u would be best. I asked questions about the spec fpl possibly being affected by something else going on other than with the pancreas. Apparently they didn't run any bloodwork this time other than the spec fpl, but in the past, including her July BW she's never had elevated liver values or anything else abnormal, so he feel pretty certain it's her pancreas. I asked about an ultrasound, and he did that was a good idea, so he'll schedule that tomorrow for sometime this week most likely. He also agreed to Denamarin as opposed to Denosyl, but I won't get that until Wednesday. So in light of all this, we are holding off on prednisone, and starting with denamarin on Wed. I'll just give bupe for now and work on getting her shed full and her BG under control. He would really like to see if we can control this naturally, with just denamarin, but if that doesn't seem to work, we'll add the pred. I'm happy with the plan.

Muffin, however, does not seem to be doing as well today. She is definitely "off". She is not interested in eating atm, so I'm digging out the pepcid.
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin pmps 384 P'titis again

Anne

I'm sorry for the dx of p'titis. I give Gracie the same denamarin that Jill uses. Do you think Muffin would eat a pill pocket? That's how I give Gracie her denamarin. I usually get up about 1.5 hours before AMPS and give it to her. It's ok to give it in a pill pocket. I usually give her a little bit of water from a syringe so her throat isn't dry and then she eats her pill pocket and I give her a bit more water. There used to be FD friendly pill pockets for cats but they discontinued them. Many people now use the ADW Duck and Pea Pill Pockets for dogs and haven't seen a rise in BG.

You might find this article on Treatment of Feline Pancreatitis informative. It does discuss use of pred or dexamethosone for kitties with triaditis or chronic p'titis.

Here is a great Roundtable Discussion of Feline Pancreatitis.

I would check with my vet on the specfPL. When Gracie just had hers, Texas A&M said the reference ranges for the test was based on a 6-hour fast for a FD and 12 hour fast for non-FD. Also, the IM veterinary specialist at IDEXX said kitties have to be fasted 12 hours.

Did you ask him about fluid supportive therapy? That can often be helpful. And liver values can rise quickly. Each blood test is just a snapshot for that moment. So just because her liver enzymes were not elevated in July doesn't mean they aren't elevated now. They may not be but I wouldn't rely on bloodwork that is two months old .....IMHO.
Sending Muffin healing vines. Good luck with this dose.
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin pmps 384 P'titis again

sorry to hear muffin is feeling yucky and has p'titis! way to go being on top of all of it - you sound very educated and prepared to tackle the issues!

sending muffin feel better wishes. :YMHUG:
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin pmps 384 P'titis again

So sorry about the p'titis dx!!! Poor Muffin!!! No wonder why she needed some juice.

You made a good decision with the ultrasound. I've heard from a couple vets and an IM specialist that the spec fpl is not always that reliable. Also kudos on your holding off on the pred. Hopefully you can control the pancreatitis with other avenues rather than risk messing with possible insulin resistance.

Has your vet ever mentioned a lower fat diet for p'titis? That is what I was advised from the IM specialist. Wellness Salmon & Trout has a hefty amount of fat. Just a thought.

Sending healing and comfort vines to Muffin!!
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin pmps 384 +2 82 P'titis Again

+2 82...Really Muffin? Another PJ party? 300 pts in 2 hrs? ohmygod_smile :o The good news is she's feeling better now. Not sure if it's due to the BG, the pepcid, or both, but I'm happy she's out and about.

Marje - Thanks for the links. I did mention the fasting for the specfPL, but he didn't really say anything. No, I forgot about asking for fluids - I will call him tomorrow about that. And I agree with you about the BW and liver values, but I'm hoping these remaining questions can be answered by the U/S. He said he should be able to get it done this week. Muffin won't eat pill pockets, but she does like hot dogs. Are hot dogs FD friendly? ;-) And would a small piece of hot dog count as food? I don't think she's too crazy about cheese, either. I got the pepcid in her with no trouble (at least the first time)...so one way or another I'll get it into her.

Julie - Just when I start to feel somewhat educated, I learn there is so much more I don't know. :lol:

Deb - Marje was telling me that it is a somewhat unreliable test. Vet has mentioned (but not in relation to p'titis) that maybe she had too much fat in her diet. She's only eating Wellness Chicken now, which is also high in fat, but...it's the only canned food she'll eat.
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin pmps 384 +2 82 P'titis Again

muffin!! :shock: :shock: you let mama get one nights sleep and then do this? Naughty kitten.

Doing ok, Anne? Thats quite a drama queen drop!

Hmmmm...not sure if hot dogs are FD friendly...maybe you could get the as feds :lol: :lol: :lol:

The recommendation to feed low fat foods is dated. Both links I gave you state there is no evidence that fat affects cats as it does dogs and humans with regard to p'titis. If you were feeding a super high fat diet, it might be something to consider to get a diet that is more in line with most good feline diets. But a low fat diet is not necessary.
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin pmps 384 +2 82 +3 42 +3.5 40

Fed the 42 with 1 tsp WN Chicken with a drop of Karo. I figured since I'm going to up all night anyway, I may as well (1) see if she'll eat food with karo - she did; and (2) find out what it does for her and how she responds to it.
+3.5 is 40. Fed another tsp with drop karo - she basically just ate the karo off the top before I could mix it in.
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin pmps 384 +2 82 +3 42 +3.5 40

Wooh! Muffin surf higher!
That's a big splashing dive girl!
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin pmps 384 +2 82 +3 42 +3.5 40

Good grief.
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scuba-cat-6.jpg


Good idea on checking her every 30 mins. I think you better take the dose back down ;-) :roll: :roll:
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin pmps 384 +2 82 +3 42 +3.5 40

Whoa! Now that's a fast dose reduction! :lol: I've got to test again before I can go to bed too.I have a diver that might do itt again tonight. I might need a cup of that ~O)

Melanie & Racci
 
Re: 9/17 Muffin pmps 384 +2 82 +3 42... +4 42 +4.5 55

+4.5 55 So the karo is kicking in. Not feeding this. Let's see what happens....
 
+5 47 So apparently karo doesn't do much... :roll: Unless it just hasn't kicked in yet...we shall see. Although I prefer not to stay up all night, performing experiments makes it much more exciting :lol: Fed this 1.5 tsp plain food. I'm done giving karo unless something bad happens. I don't want to overdo it, in case I haven't seen the results yet.
 
+5.5 52 Fed 2 tsps because she wanted it and because I want to give her a little break from pokies. She seems to be in surf mode and I feel bad for her sore little ear. I've been putting neosporin with pain relief on it, but she still deserves a break.
ETA: She didn't eat.
 
Looks like .25 was too much.

The karo could have worked and wore off already, maybe?
 
It could have Dyana, but it sure doesn't seem it did much. Well, maybe it did if she was going to continue to drop. And yes, I agree .25 is too much. Even tho I promised to stick with a dose this morning, I'm going back to .1 in the am. Maybe a f.1, if I can figure out what that is :lol:
 
Looks like you were up taking care of Muffin all night long. I hope you can find a dose that will be safe and less dramatic for the both of you. Surf safely sweet Muffin.
 
Thanks Tamara!
Gave her time for a nap. +7 52. So she seems to be in the same "surf the high 40's low 50's" mode again. It's been 3.5 hrs since she's had karo, so that should be well worn off by now. I may get wet noodled for this, but I'm going to try to get some sleep, although with all the ~O) I'm not sure that will happen :roll: I've left 2 tsps food out for her. I need to be up in less than 3 hrs (it's my day to take the grandkids to school) so I'll try to test her then, if the girls haven't scared her off.
 
Hi Anne.... oh my! What a day and night for you. I am sorry about the DX - poor Muffin. Not too much I can add to what has already been said - just wishing you much luck. It sounds like you have a great plan in place.
 
I think I got about an hour of sleep. The food is gone, but Kibby was in here this morning asking for breffis, so could very easily have been him who ate it. Either way, she's 63 at +10.5. Off to get the DGD's ready for school.
 
I've found it takes at least 30 min. for honey to kick in. With Gabby, Karo gives a bigger bang for the buck but it can take a little while to work.

I would expect that as long as hot dogs don't have fillers in them, for the amount you'd need to hide a pill, it would be OK.
 
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