5/27 Copernicus (*dose advice for AMPS) PMPS 328 +6 240 +8 579

Krista & Copernicus

Krista & Copernicus

Member Since 2026
PP

Remind me please do I give a dose or half a dose if he doesn't eat?

In the bigger picture, the solution is more than just another dose increase imo. Something else is wrong/happening with his GI. Pancreas agin? Because this is a pattern (with food). Before I went to bed, Copernicus' BG mid-cycle was 240 after a couple of days of good eating and activity. And some BGs in the yellow. I just woke up to him puking with BG 579 within a couple of hours. When his stomach is good and his BG is good, I use plain cooked chicken and plain baby food as a filler/topper with his Koha rabbit. He can't live off plain chicken alone but his stomach seems to tolerate it very well. So I gave him a bit more Koha rabbit last night because I was out baby food. Last time he shot up this high was after a can of tiki cat after dark rabbbit. And I could never get his number back down without an ER stay. And then a third time he got this high was after the hospital gave him a high carb wet food instead of his own food. Ketones are .7 the pancreatitis group suggests it's all the bone, liver, gums, agars, misrepresented DM matter in these canned foods.
 

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Last edited:
Krista & Copernicus said:
PP

Remind me please do I give a dose or half a dose if he doesn't eat?

In the bigger picture, the solution is more than just another dose increase imo. Something else is wrong/happening with his GI. Pancreas agin? Because this is a pattern (with food). Before I went to bed, Copernicus' BG mid-cycle was 240 after a couple of days of good eating and activity. And some BGs in the yellow. I just woke up to him puking with BG 579 within a couple of hours. When his stomach is good and his BG is good, I use plain cooked chicken and plain baby food as a filler/topper with his Koha rabbit. He can't live off plain chicken alone but his stomach seems to tolerate it very well. So I gave him a bit more Koha rabbit last night because I was out baby food. Last time he shot up this high was after a can of tiki cat after dark rabbbit. And I could never get his number back down without an ER stay. And then a third time he got this high was after the hospital gave him a high carb wet food instead of his own food. Ketones are .7 the pancreatitis group suggests it's all the bone, liver, gums, agars, misrepresented DM matter in these canned foods.
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I’m sorry he had a puke this morning 😢
The Koha may have caused the higher BG but I believe puking can elevate BG.

You can see if he’s down at amps this morning.

Maybe it matters at what point in the cycle he rays the Koha if it spikes his BG (maybe later in cycle spikes more than earlier).

Try feeding him at amps to see if it looks like he is willing to eat and base your dose decision on that, if you need to.
If you think you can get him to eat within the first two hours, you could give the full dose. If it looks like it’s gonna be a struggle you may have to give a lower dose.
You could put that in your title this morning to see if anyone is up and around to give dose suggestions
such as:
“Dose advice for Amps”

I know you’re close to amps at 8am on east coast.

I hope he feels better and will eat 😻💞
 
So do you mean mean give insulin if I think I can get him to eat the 2 hours following? Or
Can Lantus be up to 2 hours late ( I don't believe this is the case) but just clarifying. And how late can Lantus be without a problem?
 
Staci & Ivy said:
I’m sorry he had a puke this morning 😢
The Koha may have caused the higher BG but I believe puking can elevate BG.

You can see if he’s down at amps this morning.

Maybe it matters at what point in the cycle he rays the Koha if it spikes his BG (maybe later in cycle spikes more than earlier).

Try feeding him at amps to see if it looks like he is willing to eat and base your dose decision on that, if you need to.
If you think you can get him to eat within the first two hours, you could give the full dose. If it looks like it’s gonna be a struggle you may have to give a lower dose.
You could put that in your title this morning to see if anyone is up and around to give dose suggestions
such as:
“Dose advice for Amps”

I know you’re close to amps at 8am on east coast.

I hope he feels better and will eat 😻💞
Click to expand...
I also don't fully understand bouncing yet, but interesting how he doubled his BG in just a couple hours.
 
Krista & Copernicus said:
So do you mean mean give insulin if I think I can get him to eat the 2 hours following? Or
Can Lantus be up to 2 hours late ( I don't believe this is the case) but just clarifying. And how late can Lantus be without a problem?
Click to expand...
Yes, the insulin “onsets” or kicks in within around 2 hours. So if he seems like he will eat, you can give his dose (as long as he’s hungry and showing interest in food).
If he’s not eating or hungry, always safety first.

But with a DKA and ketone kitty, we want to try to give insulin.

It’s best to give insulin as soon as you can or your schedule will be off.
Yes you can give a dose up to to hours late, but you will need to walk the time back to where you want your shoot times by 1/2 hour each day.

Is he eating breakfast yet? I know you’re due to feed and shoot.
 
Staci is correct and with a depot the size he has, even if you skipped a shot which I do NOT recommend, his cycle would play out the same.

It’s best to shoot his full dose on time, make sure he has ondansetron and cerenia on board and then offer small amounts of food even baby food.

His dose needs to go up to 8u. He’s been at 7.5 quite a while if you can raise the dose tonight.

Just as a note, it’s better for us to have you keep his SS up-to-date then to attach photos of his BG. Thank you.
 
Marje and Gracie said:
Staci is correct and with a depot the size he has, even if you skipped a shot which I do NOT recommend, his cycle would play out the same.

It’s best to shoot his full dose on time, make sure he has ondansetron and cerenia on board and then offer small amounts of food even baby food.

His dose needs to go up to 8u. He’s been at 7.5 quite a while if you can raise the dose tonight.

Just as a note, it’s better for us to have you keep his SS up-to-date then to attach photos of his BG. Thank you.
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I give him the meds and then he drinks so much water he vomits them up. He puked after zofran. So far the cerenia is staying down. What if he pukes after both?
 
Staci & Ivy said:
Is he not eating his food?
Is he nauseous?
Do you have Zofran (ondansetron for nausea if needed?)

Seems he needs an increase.
Has anyone suggested that?
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No he's not. I would say he's nauseous along with the puking. He puked after I gave him zofran. So he maybe got some but not all. I think the pain puking and nauseous are contributing to high numbers. I will in increase him to 8 but we are in a viscous cycle if he can't eat enough food.
 
Krista & Copernicus said:
No he's not. I would say he's nauseous along with the puking. He puked after I gave him zofran. So he maybe got some but not all. I think the pain puking and nauseous are contributing to high numbers. I will in increase him to 8 but we are in a viscous cycle if he can't eat enough food.
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Try to feed very small amounts of food at a time.

Maybe limit the water all at once since that’s a trend.

Try Zofran again later, so it’s dosed every 6-8 hours. It wears off and you need to dose again.
🙏
 
I suspect it's not the Koha raising his numbers, but rather his bodies reaction to the 240. Cats can bounce and go up quickly when they see numbers they aren't used to. Can you imagine how it must feel to go from 200's to 500's? That alone might make him feel ill. Neko had some pretty extreme jumps in numbers too from bounces. It took her a year to stop bouncing to blacks and reds.

Copernicus has high enough nadirs that I wouldn't worry about reducing his dose if he's not eating everything. Insulin does more than combat the carbs in his food. Insulin helps get food for cells, including the brain. When Neko was seeing green nadirs, I was fine giving full dose if I knew I could get 2/3 of her food into her over time. In 5 years I never skipped a dose, unless it was a fur shot :banghead:, hardly ever did a reduced dose. And that was after radiation therapy to treat her acromegaly and she was coming down the dosing ladder very quickly. The reduced dose was to drain the larger depot.

I'm with Marje on him needing a dose increase. With yellow nadirs, you should be increasing every six cycles.
 
I don't think the Koha is directly raising his numbers. I think it's flaring his pancreatitis and then indirectly raising his numbers from nausea and pain. A lot of these commercial foods contains gums and agars and those are known to cause GI upset. Or maybe the phosphorus is too high for his possible early CKD. I won't skip his dose. Thank you.
 
Krista & Copernicus said:
I don't think the Koha is directly raising his numbers. I think it's flaring his pancreatitis and then indirectly raising his numbers from nausea and pain. A lot of these commercial foods contains gums and agars and those are known to cause GI upset. Or maybe the phosphorus is too high for his possible early CKD. I won't skip his dose. Thank you.
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The Evangers Low Phosphorus Beef has no gums or agar and is 7% calories from carbs. I fed it to my CKD/IBD cat.
 
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