Nadir within 2 hours and glucose dropping to lower values, help?

Bob's Staff

Bob's Staff

Member Since 2024
I’m in a bit of a panic… I don’t have spreadsheets yet, I’m new to this. Our boy’s values are quickly going down today, with his Libre already showing 90 mg/dl and the nadir is still 2 hours away so he will keep dropping I think? He doesn’t eat properly because of acute kidney failure. I already fed him liquid snacks but it does not seem to rise. He is on 1.5 unit Prozinc, with nadir around 149 yesterday en PMPS of 253 mg/dl on his Libre today. What should I do? Will the numbers keep dropping dangerously low until nadir has been reached? And when should I give him honey and how much?
He is lethargic anyway in his current situation so I cannot really tell when he would be in a hypo …
Help? 🫣
 
Ok! breath in breath out, we are here for you,! what insulin are you using? also, the Libre always reads the lower numbers much lower and 90 is not hypo, di you have a human monitor and strips, is always recommend when using the Libre to use a hand monitor, most member use the ReliON Premier monitor, and strips is very inexpensive, Walmart has them for $19.00 the monitor and the strips are $ 9.00 for 50 and $17.88 for 100, in the meantime can you please send us todays BG numbers for every two hours, let me know the insulin so we can tag the correct member to assist you with dosing 🤗
 
Oh dear god, thanks a lot! He is on Prozinc, his preshot value was 255 on the Libre and he got is 1.5 unit dose almost 4 hours ago. Nadir is at 6-7 hours after shot. He is now at 70 on the Libre. We also have a Contour Next human meter but with him being ill, I want to chose the right moment to annoy him in his ears because it upsets him very much.
I know 90 or in the meantime 70 is not a hypo yet, but I’m afraid he will go down there within the next two hours 😳
 
Ok! I could probably help you since you already gave the shot, 70 is not bad, that number is probably in reality 79 or higher, do not give Karo or Honey, he will have a quick fix, if he goes lower than 60, we'll stick to the Libre, just feed 1tbsp of low carb, check hi BG again in 1/2 hour, if it keep dropping , repeat, the same, do you have any high carb food, like gravies or even dry, just in case, we do not want to give carbs unless is necessary of his BG get to 50, he is safe, again Breath in breath out cats are very sensitive to stress you stress they stress, I am right here, we will communicating until you are comfortable with the numbers, let me know in 1/2 hour his BG, it would be great if you can get a B G number with the Counter, it will be a much realistic number
 
The reason why I said I could help you is because I do not give dosing advice, but you are in good hands I’ve been right were you are right now
 
Ok, do you have any high carb foods, if you do give him 1tsp of the food wait1/2 hour and test again. and when we are done here se his spreadsheet and his numbers so you can see is ok. if you do not have high carbs, feed him 1tbsp of any low carb, and test in 1/2 hour, let me know his BG at 5:30
 
Is liquid snack high enough in carbs? We only have renal food, a 1000 calories per kg, is that a good reference? We are new to this and totally not prepared for these low numbers. He wouldn’t go there with his acromegaly, the vet said… Oh boy 🫣
Thanks for your precious support!!!
 
He already ate 3 Vitakraft liquid snacks with about half an hour in between them, is it normal his numbers don’t react to that or only react shortly and then start dropping again? He got his next one now, anything else we can do?

In the meantime I try to stay alive myself …:eek:
 
CORKY said:
Ok! breath in breath out, we are here for you,! what insulin are you using? also, the Libre always reads the lower numbers much lower and 90 is not hypo, di you have a human monitor and strips, is always recommend when using the Libre to use a hand monitor, most member use the ReliON Premier monitor, and strips is very inexpensive, Walmart has them for $19.00 the monitor and the strips are $ 9.00 for 50 and $17.88 for 100, in the meantime can you please send us todays BG numbers for every two hours, let me know the insulin so we can tag the correct member to assist you with dosing 🤗
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To answer your question about his numbers: this morning his insulin dose partly ended up in his fur and he stayed between 220 and 260 until his evening dose. Yesterday he went from 300 preshot to 146 at nadir, to end up again around 250 before the partly missed shot this morning.
This evening he was around 260 preshot and started going down after one hour already.
 
it does not work right away, it takes about 1/2 hour, but do not give him any more of the liquid snack, other wise his BG will be way high, what we are doing is stabilizing him, he is safe, 50 under then we worry, do you have a market close by that you or someone can go and get a can of any cast food that has gravy, what's his BG now with the Libre?
 
when you give a shot the best way to do it, is picking up the scruff above the shoulder, not the bone, but that are is fatty stick the needle straight thru, not sideways, that's why you are getting a fur shot, but never shoot again, some insulin always goes in and you do not want to risk a hypo episode, you just wait for the next shot in 12 hours, ProZinc kicks in 2 hours after shot, so to keep the inulin in check is good to give a small snack two hours after shot, and several meals during the day
 
CORKY said:
it does not work right away, it takes about 1/2 hour, but do not give him any more of the liquid snack, other wise his BG will be way high, what we are doing is stabilizing him, he is safe, 50 under then we worry, do you have a market close by that you or someone can go and get a can of any cast food that has gravy, what's his BG now with the Libre?
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You mean cat food with meat? We have that, bit he does not really want to eat that much and especially no wet cat food 🫣
We also have a can of royal canin recovery food left, if that might be better?
 
ok take some honey and rub it on his gums, if you have a syringe give 1/2ml thru the corner of his mouth, if it has gravy yes give him 1 tsp of that, but first please do the honey now
 
CORKY said:
when you give a shot the best way to do it, is picking up the scruff above the shoulder, not the bone, but that are is fatty stick the needle straight thru, not sideways, that's why you are getting a fur shot, but never shoot again, some insulin always goes in and you do not want to risk a hypo episode, you just wait for the next shot in 12 hours, ProZinc kicks in 2 hours after shot, so to keep the inulin in check is good to give a small snack two hours after shot, and several meals during the day
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I think I missed it because he is so skinny I can barely grab some skin, and I have to do it quickly before he grabs my skin … 🫣 But I indeed already learned on this forum that I should not give an extra dose after a fur shot so luckily I didn’t 😉
 
you can shoot while he's eating, you do not have to wait till he's finished eating the protocol for ProZinc is Test, feed shoot
 
let me now in 15 minutes, feed him 1/2 tsp of any food not the liquid that's high carbs, try another test with the Contour if you can
 
He starts to show some signs, went off the couch to drink, but slipped off with his back leg when he tried to jump back on. Gosh how nerve wrecking is this!!! I’m glad you’re with me to assist me!!
 
I can tell you that I am in your shoes right now, Corky had several Hypo episodes, he had the Libre and in the middle of the night the alarm would go off with 40 BG , and the alarm was set for 90, it IS nerve racking, I had many sleepless nights, the sensor would fall off, it would stop working before the 14 days, I am here for you! This Forum saved my Corky's life, one night, a member stayed with me till 4:30 AM until Corky was stabilized, today thank goodness, Corky is extremely stabilized, it will take you a bit to understand how ProZinc is working on your cat, and you will begin to get comfortable with low numbers, the way I have coached you is the safest way without high carbs first not to shock the BG to a down spiral, that;'s why I bought the ReliOn human Premier monitor and strips, we actually base our numbers on human meters.
What's his BG now?
 
he did he has the Contour is still reading low 53, I coached him with food and testing, I did tell him to rub a bit of honey on the gums, he has no high carbs
 
Bob, Suzanne just plugged in, She is the member that coached me and saved Corky's life, she can assist you with dosing
 
53 on the Contour is safe, but you are early in the cycle, correct? Did you give high carb or medium carb food and retest in 15 minutes?
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
53 on the Contour is safe, but you are early in the cycle, correct? Did you give high carb or medium carb food and retest in 15 minutes?
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You mean early users of insulin, or early in the downward day curve? ☺️
I gave liquid snack but I just heard here that’s not enough so I put a teaspoon of renal wet food into his mouth after I gave 1/2 ml of honey as recommended above.
 
Bob's Staff said:
You mean early users of insulin, or early in the downward day curve? ☺️
I gave liquid snack but I just heard here that’s not enough so I put a teaspoon of renal wet food into his mouth after I gave 1/2 ml of honey as recommended above.
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I mean how many hours after his shot are you right now?
 
Bob's Staff said:
You mean early users of insulin, or early in the downward day curve? ☺️
I gave liquid snack but I just heard here that’s not enough so I put a teaspoon of renal wet food into his mouth after I gave 1/2 ml of honey as recommended above.
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I don’t know how many carbs (percentage of carbs) are in the liquid snack so not too sure about that. Most renal foods are mid to higher carbs in my personal experience. We normally do not recommend honey to be given until the cat drops below 50, but in your situation with him not being willing to eat and us not knowing the carbohydrate percentages of the food, it’s all right.
 
He’s very grumpy and agressive because I forced him to eat the honey and food, so testing in his ears would be a struggle, is it ok to keep relying on the Libre which measured the same as the Contour when he was at 60?
 
Bob's Staff said:
He’s very grumpy and agressive because I forced him to eat the honey and food, so testing in his ears would be a struggle, is it ok to keep relying on the Libre which measured the same as the Contour when he was at 60?
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Just feed him another teaspoon of the renal foods and watch your Libre for the trend.
 
Bob's Staff said:
5, so one more hour to go before he stops dropping and stabilizes
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Got it. Thank you.

In general, I do not trust Libres in the lower numbers at all i have never seen one be accurate in the 50s, 60s or even 70s. Yours would be a first for me.

But let’s try to work with it for now because he’s upset.
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
I don’t know how many carbs (percentage of carbs) are in the liquid snack so not too sure about that. Most renal foods are mid to higher carbs in my personal experience. We normally do not recommend honey to be given until the cat drops below 50, but in your situation with him not being willing to eat and us not knowing the carbohydrate percentages of the food, it’s all right.
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The renal wet food is Purina advanced kidney care in cans, I thought it had 4.2 percent carbohydrates
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
Got it. Thank you.

In general, I do not trust Libres in the lower numbers at all i have never seen one be accurate in the 50s, 60s or even 70s. Yours would be a first for me.

But let’s try to work with it for now because he’s upset.
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I heard that’s indeed often the case, maybe it was a lucky shot this time for us, but he won’t allow me to touch him for long. I want to use his tolerance to feed him 🫣
 
Libre shows 60 again. I’m taking a deep breath first, because I think I forgot to breath for the last hour or so :eek::eek:
 
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