08/11 Butters AMBG N/A - e-tube surgery today

Butters & Lyla

Butters & Lyla

Member Since 2020
Yesterday Thank you so much for stopping by butters's condo yesterday. I never had a chance to come back on the board last night.

Not much to report yet today.

I dropped off Butters this morning and just called the clinic (4.5 hours later) for an update. The vet tech says she is next in line for the surgeon but resting in her cage for now. I totally forgot to check her BG but since I didn't give her insulin and she hasn't had any in days, it doesn't matter:joyful:!

The nutritionist vet called and communicated a plan for Butters to the clinic's Practice Manager. Her vet, who is not performing the surgery, will get the info from the Practice Manager and call me with the plan sometime later today.

Surf safely, Kitties:cat:

PerfumedCatMom said:
Hope the e-tube works well for Butters. I had often thought that we would have to resort to it with Ruby but never did. Which kind of hydrolyzed food would you be able to give her that won't push her BGs higher? Curious to know, as I've been advised by Olive's vet to feed her hydrolyzed for her probable IBD but I've been resistant to go back to a full on canned food diet after feeding her raw all this time.
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It has been well over a month of Butters going off her food and me trying to find something else she will eat. The e-tube is long overdue, just to buy some time.

Butters's nutritionist prescribes homemade and hydrolyzed diets depending on the specific patient's issues.
At this point, we are prioritizing GI inflammation and hypersensitivities over diabetes and CKD. Where there are both hypersensitivities and inflammation as in Butters's case, she goes with hydrolyzed for food elimination diets because the current studies are showing it is more successful in helping resolve both problems. She knows Butters is diabetic and yet she would rather I give Butters more insulin and the hydrolyzed diet because of how much more successful it tends to be.
 
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Tomlin said:
Many thoughts and prayers to you & Butters today :bighug:

Given that so many cats are misdiagnosed or given incomplete diagnosis when it comes to the GI enteropathies, often due to a lack of complete and thorough diagnostics necessary to get it right, & the fact that they know that food is oftentimes a primary cause &/or at a minimum, a contributing or aggravating factor across the various diagnosis, it makes sense that they want this to be part of the diagnostic & treatment process. As you know, if an issue with protein(s) or ingredients is never identified, it will continue to cause inflammation and problems for the body—even if there is an additional need to target the immune system with a drug at some point. Even for cases where a steroid is needed, you don’t want to be using a steroid to reduce an inflammatory &/or immune response (depending on the dose of the steroid) & then feeding a cat a protein(s) &/or ingredient(s) that increase that same response:banghead:…. if that makes sense?

As far as hydrolyzed protein & diabetes, you have insulin to manage glucose. If the hydrolyzed protein is the food that is found to be required to keep inflammation at bay and to prevent it from damaging the intestines & potentially the surrounding organs like the stomach, pancreas & liver as well as being able to put a stop to the ear scratching and infections (possibly also being able to avoid the need for a steroid or minimize the dose of a steroid if it is ever needed)…..I say grab that food and your insulin & rock on :rolleyes:!!
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This is also what I've heard from her nutritionist and primary vet! I still have to continue getting diagnostics for Butters. Her vet was actually not on board with the e-tube right away. He kept saying, we don't know why she isn't eating and we need to figure out why. But when I walked him through how little she has been eating, he got very on board with it. But he said we still need to do more diagnostics, the e-tube buys us some time, and he'd recommend another ultrasound as the next step:facepalm:.

It totally makes sense. The nutritionist and her vet also brought that up as well. You need to get to the cause of the inflammation and it is most often caused by a protein source if it is food related. Food elimination diet is the first step. The nutritionist will also address gut biome as the second step.

And exactly regarding the insulin. It is all about prioritizing. Her vet reminds me all of the time that we will be prioritizing things and will not get a perfect solution to address everything, so when I heard the nutritionist say "hydrolyzed diet and adjust insulin", I wasn't taken by surprise. I am grateful that Butters has had such beautiful flat cycles but I also have been doing my best to prepare myself for the likelihood that it won't always be this way, unfortunately.
 
((Lyla))

I’m keeping Butters very close in thought and sending more vines for your girl. I’m sure the etube will help and I’m glad Paula suggested the kittykollar. Those are invaluable.

Don’t know what you think about it but Nutriscan by Dr. Jean Dodds can help identify food sensitivities (not allergies). I’ve done it for both my kitties, at the suggestion of my vet, as a preventive to them developing any issues. I can’t remember if I’ve mentioned it to you before. I did mention it to someone and they did it but those brain cells are gone from my head!

:bighug:
 
Marje and Gracie said:
Don’t know what you think about it but Nutriscan by Dr. Jean Dodds can help identify food sensitivities (not allergies). I’ve done it for both my kitties, at the suggestion of my vet, as a preventive to them developing any issues. I can’t remember if I’ve mentioned it to you before. I did mention it to someone and they did it but those brain cells are gone from my head!
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It was me :) Unfortunately, we couldn’t gather enough saliva from our non drooler Cosmo :cat:

Wishing you and Butters all the best :bighug: There are many here that have competing priorities as well. I do hope the new diet plan goes well :bighug:

Thinking of you.
 
Marje and Gracie said:
((Lyla))

I’m keeping Butters very close in thought and sending more vines for your girl. I’m sure the etube will help and I’m glad Paula suggested the kittykollar. Those are invaluable.

Don’t know what you think about it but Nutriscan by Dr. Jean Dodds can help identify food sensitivities (not allergies). I’ve done it for both my kitties, at the suggestion of my vet, as a preventive to them developing any issues. I can’t remember if I’ve mentioned it to you before. I did mention it to someone and they did it but those brain cells are gone from my head!

:bighug:
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Marje, may I please ask how this Nutriscan test works. I have a cat here who constantly licks himself bald or semi-bald (currently he has a mowhawk). He has had Depo shots for a temporary fix (last year) and was on a low dose of Dexamethasone every other day that at least kept him from licking through his skin! I don’t like Marcus (who is an otherwise healthy boy with FIV) being on a steroid even every other day. I recently stopped it, and am waiting to see if he gets worse again. If this is a food related intolerance then the Nutriscan could identify that? Thank you.
 
Butters & Lyla said:
Thank you for all of the positive thoughts and prayers and suggestions! I am working, but just wanted to update that the surgeon called to say surgery went well. She is out of surgery and has woken up. I'm waiting for her vet to call with a plan.
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So happy to hear that she’s out and awake! May I ask a question…. Did I miss something or did you say the vet wants to do another ultrasound? She just had two conflicting ultrasounds, I thought… and they want to do another? Maybe there was a nuance in there that I did not read (from your previous condo about the differing ultrasound interpretations.)
 
So glad to hear things went well!

And just wanted to share a success story about hydrolyzed diets. Last summer, my parents' cat, who is quite the little miss, was constantly vomiting, scratching, and not eating. She was miserable, poor thing. My mother was so upset every day, but they couldn't get to the bottom of it. Fast forward...she finally ended up getting an ultrasound that showed some mild inflammation, and her vet prescribed a hydrolyzed Rx diet. I was all like, "Mom, there's NO way she's going to eat that stuff..cats hate it", etc. etc. WELL, lo and behold..she loved it! And long story short, she is now just about 100% better. No more vomiting, no more scratching. She occasionally needs a bit of appy stim to keep on track, but other than that, it's been an amazing turnaround.

All paws crossed for Butters today and with the e-tube!
 
So happy to hear she is out of surgery and awake. Sending loving prayers to Butters. Hope they will soon have answers to what’s going on with her and solutions to make her feel better. Hugs to both of you.
 
Thank you all :bighug::bighug::bighug: she is home. When I picked her up they allowed me inside to get a demo on how to use the tube and clean it from my vet's amazing vet techs. I did the first feed as soon as we got home because Butters was demanding food. I put some on a plate but she didn't want it. She was very quiet while I fed her through the tube, flushing with water before and after. It's pretty straightforward when the cat is quiet and not moving. We'll see what happens tomorrow after the good drugs wear off.

I spoke with her vet earlier in the afternoon and the nutritionist also sent over some info to him. He also took time to walk me through how to feed Butters and care for the e-tube. We have a plan to try to transition her to the new diet and he also went through her list of meds/supplements and tried to pare it down a little because it was getting a little out of control, at least for me.

I'll try to post a picture of her with her e-tube tomorrow.

@Purrberry thank you for that story:bighug: . I'm really glad to know your parents' cat was helped by it.
@thebigfuzz thank you. Yes, there are many with competing priorities, Cosmo included:bighug:. Butters is joining the ranks!
@Suzanne & Darcy yes she had two done and they were very conflicting. Her vet was saying he's not pushing this immediately, but it may be worthwhile down the road to get another ultrasound done. He says we need to figure out why she is not eating and I agree. In the meantime, the e-tube buys some time. I can start her over on the new food and feed her so she regains some weight, and then hopefully she starts wanting to eat at some point.
@Marje and Gracie thank you for all of the vines and for the suggestion to look into Nutriscan. I'll also talk to the nutritionist about it. I'm glad it was helpful to you with your kitties:bighug:.

Thank you @Bandit's Mom , @Our Dolly Girl , @carfurby , @Diane Tyler's Mom and @Pamela & Amethyst as well for stopping by as well with your well wishes, good thoughts and love for Butters. She and I both appreciate it so much.:bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug:
 
So glad Butters did well, both with the surgery and first feed! I hope this relieves some stress for you.

(Sorry Lyla not to hijack) @Suzanne & Darcy - is it possibly fleas? Mr Kitty did that to himself, at the time there was a newer study out where that sort of pattern indicated a flea allergy. I never saw a single flea anywhere not had any bites, but once I started treating Pippi and blitzed the apartment he stopped all the licking and eventually grew back. I don't treat indoor cats, and I really only treat Pippi as needed. Don't like all the chemicals.
 
Glad she is home and feeding went well. I had allergy test on Tripper. Hers came back sensitive to pork, soybean and milk as well as all the outside pollen stuff. But she was eating, though very little. Fast forward to May, with all her vomiting and not eating. Third opinion vet suggested among other things to try the rx food z/d because of the pancreatitis, the possible gi upset from thyroid meds her stomach needed to calm down. I am very skeptical on rx foods, but willing to try. Surprisingly Tripper gobbled it down for weeks. During this time also learned ANY dry food made her vomit.

I know Butters issues are different, but maybe some food that is easier on the stomach might be worth asking about.
 
Lyla, I really hope Butters continues to allow you to feed her through the tube and that she has a positive reaction to the hydrolyzed food. Best of luck, and keep us posted when you can. :bighug:
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
Marje, may I please ask how this Nutriscan test works. I have a cat here who constantly licks himself bald or semi-bald (currently he has a mowhawk). He has had Depo shots for a temporary fix (last year) and was on a low dose of Dexamethasone every other day that at least kept him from licking through his skin! I don’t like Marcus (who is an otherwise healthy boy with FIV) being on a steroid even every other day. I recently stopped it, and am waiting to see if he gets worse again. If this is a food related intolerance then the Nutriscan could identify that? Thank you.
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Sorry to just get to to you, Suzanne.

They send you a small piece of rope for the kitty to chew on so the saliva and DNA are deposited. Then they are able to look at it and determine potential food sensitivities. I feel it has been accurate for our cats. Tobey was always picky about eating chicken and it came back that he had a sensitivity to it. I did not have any trouble getting my cats to salivate enough for the test. If you do this and have any issues, call them. They are very helpful. And I want to stress it’s sensitivities, not allergies.

Good luck!
 
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