How much insulin to give

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Poopers and Catia

Poopers and Catia

Member Since 2021
Hello everyone!

Poopers is regularly on 5 units of Caninsulin (we are changing to Lantus). Since i joined, everyne keeps telling me that 5 units is way too much. Yesterday Poopers dropped to 1.1mmol/L (20md/dl) at 1PM. I tested him multiple times during the day and by night his results went up to 9.4mmol/L (169md/dl) i was suggested not to give his insulin for the night.
Now his numbers are at 12.1mmol/L (218md/dl)
I was just wondering if i should give him any insulin at all or what units i should.

This is the other thread incase you want background to the other conversation. https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/new-member.246860/#post-2784964
 
Poopers and Catia said:
Hello everyone!

Poopers is regularly on 5 units of Caninsulin (we are changing to Lantus). Since i joined, everyne keeps telling me that 5 units is way too much. Yesterday Poopers dropped to 1.1mmol/L (20md/dl) at 1PM. I tested him multiple times during the day and by night his results went up to 9.4mmol/L (169md/dl) i was suggested not to give his insulin for the night.
Now his numbers are at 12.1mmol/L (218md/dl)
I was just wondering if i should give him any insulin at all or what units i should.

This is the other thread incase you want background to the other conversation. https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/new-member.246860/#post-2784964
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I have updated my spreadsheet incase you want to see all the numbers
 
Yesterday @JanetNJ, who uses caninsulin, suggested you drop the dose to 2 units if the BG is over 200.
So I think we should try 2 units and see how Poopers goes with that.
Make sure he eats well before he has the shot (wait the 30 mins before the dose is given) and I would give him a small snack at +1 and +2.
I would also get a +1 and a+2 test to see how he’s going so we can catch any drops early. Then decide when to test next.
Are you happy with that?
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
Yesterday @JanetNJ, who uses caninsulin, suggested you drop the dose to 2 units if the BG is over 200.
So I think we should try 2 units and see how Poopers goes with that.
Make sure he eats well before he has the shot (wait the 30 mins before the dose is given) and I would give him a small snack at +1 and +2.
I would also get a +1 and a+2 test to see how he’s going so we can catch any drops early. Then decide when to test next.
Are you happy with that?
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I just checked his levels! i gave him 2 units of insulin like you suggested at it is at 8.9mmol/L (160md/dl). Later on i will do another one to see where its at. Would you help me on the amount of units i should give him at night if you dont mind please.
 
Poopers and Catia said:
I just checked his levels! i gave him 2 units of insulin like you suggested at it is at 8.9mmol/L (160md/dl). Later on i will do another one to see where its at. Would you help me on the amount of units i should give him at night if you dont mind please.
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Hi Catia, Bron is in Australia and has gone to bed.

I will tag @JanetNJ for dosing advice. If you do not hear from Janet or Bron, I would stick to the 2U. A few cycles on 2U should give you a good idea of whether Poopers needs more or less insulin.

I shall watch out for your next test/post :-)
 
Bandit's Mom said:
Hi Catia, Bron is in Australia and has gone to bed.

I will tag @JanetNJ for dosing advice. If you do not hear from Janet or Bron, I would stick to the 2U. A few cycles on 2U should give you a good idea of whether Poopers needs more or less insulin.

I shall watch out for your next test/post :)
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Th specialist called me to check up on Poopers and i told him how i want to change insulins and he asked why... i told him how i am on this group and that you all suggested Lantus because Caninsulin is mainly for dogs... He told me thats incorrect and that if we want to change to Lantus thats fine but hes not going to promise that Poopers will get better. He said when i change insulin to start at 1unit and to keep him updates. I dont think he was too glad that i mentioned the group. He told me to book an appointment next time... thats $150 just for him to see him. I am going to contact my vet hopefully i get a better response.
 
Poopers and Catia said:
Th specialist called me to check up on Poopers and i told him how i want to change insulins and he asked why... i told him how i am on this group and that you all suggested Lantus because Caninsulin is mainly for dogs... He told me thats incorrect and that if we want to change to Lantus thats fine but hes not going to promise that Poopers will get better. He said when i change insulin to start at 1unit and to keep him updates. I dont think he was too glad that i mentioned the group. He told me to book an appointment next time... thats $150 just for him to see him. I am going to contact my vet hopefully i get a better response.
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If this is the "specialist" who recommended 5U of caninsulin, you are better off without him! I don't think you need an Rx in Canada for Lantus. I could be wrong.
Tagging @Butters & Lyla and @thebigfuzz for confirmation.
 
No, you don't need a script for Lantus in Canada. Insulin is OTC there. Just call around to find the cheapest price for a 5 pack of Lantus Solostar Pens (they are a better buy than the vial) Just tell them it's for a cat so it doesn't go through your health insurance.

A 5 pack of pens will be 1500 units. Each pen holds 300 units and you don't need the special pen needles either (so don't buy them!). We use regular U100 insulin syringes to pull the insulin out of the pen....using it like a "mini-vial".

With the vial, you get 1000 units but most cats can't use that much before the vial starts to lose efficacy and you end up throwing a lot of it away. With the pens, you can use every drop in all 5 pens.

Price for 5 pens should be around $100-125

As for dose, once you get the Lantus we can help you determine a starting dose. When switching from one insulin to another, we take the dose of the old insulin into account when suggesting a starting dose for the Lantus.
 
Chris & China (GA) said:
No, you don't need a script for Lantus in Canada. Insulin is OTC there. Just call around to find the cheapest price for a 5 pack of Lantus Solostar Pens (they are a better buy than the vial) Just tell them it's for a cat so it doesn't go through your health insurance.

A 5 pack of pens will be 1500 units. Each pen holds 300 units and you don't need the special pen needles either (so don't buy them!). We use regular U100 insulin syringes to pull the insulin out of the pen....using it like a "mini-vial".

With the vial, you get 1000 units but most cats can't use that much before the vial starts to lose efficacy and you end up throwing a lot of it away. With the pens, you can use every drop in all 5 pens.

Price for 5 pens should be around $100-125

As for dose, once you get the Lantus we can help you determine a starting dose. When switching from one insulin to another, we take the dose of the old insulin into account when suggesting a starting dose for the Lantus.
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Thats perfect to hear i definitely will call around. His attitude was for sure not what i expected and he did mention the special pen and for me to get it at his clinic lol. Thank you so much for your help i trust you much more than him. You all know exactly what i and Poopers are going through because you have been there, he has never been there so for him to say that i should be listening to him because he is the specialist is just arrogant. Once again thank you i will do more research on the products to get. Hopefully ill get them ASAP
 
These are the syringes you should get. They have half unit markings so it is easier to measure. With Lantus, increases are usually 0.25 units.
BD Insulin Syringes 3/10ml 31G 1/2 unit.
You may have to call around to see who has them in stock.
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His number was good this morning considering you skipped. And was coming down nicely into the blues but not crashing fast. I look forward to seeing your next readings.
 
JanetNJ said:
His number was good this morning considering you skipped. And was coming down nicely into the blues but not crashing fast. I look forward to seeing your next readings.
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Hey! i just updated my spreadsheet! I just tested Poopers and his level is at 8.3mmol/L (149md/dl). Just wondering how much insulin should i give him tonight? I am going to feed him in about 20 minutes and then insulin. This morning i gave him 2 Units
 
Thanks, Catia. Since his numbers are still coming down, I would suggest that you skip again tonight. Had he stayed flat or started rising, you might have considered giving insulin, if you could continue to monitor his cycle tonight.
 
Christie & Maverick said:
Thanks, Catia. Since his numbers are still coming down, I would suggest that you skip again tonight. Had he stayed flat or started rising, you might have considered giving insulin, if you could continue to monitor his cycle tonight.
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Christie & Maverick said:
I haven't seen @JanetNJ on again yet, but will try a couple other ladies who can perhaps offer their opinion

@Deb & Wink @Chris & China (GA)

If it were me, I'd skip.
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I have no idea why it dropped that much :(. Would skipping insulin often do any harm to him?
 
Poopers and Catia said:
I have no idea why it dropped that much :(. Would skipping insulin often do any harm to him?
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Nope, not if he’s in low numbers. Remember that insulin is not medication. It’s a hormone. It could be that your cats pancreas is waking up a bit and starting to work. While it can be tricky figuring out what to give, it’s a good thing.
 
Christie & Maverick said:
Catia, please make sure you don't feed when you stall, you don't want the next BG test to possibly be influenced by food. When you mentioned hopefully he eats again..it caught my eye.
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I updated his spreadsheet. He did eat a little bit because in the morning he hadn't eaten that much and only had a small snack but he didnt eat that much.
 
Poopers and Catia said:
I updated his spreadsheet. He did eat a little bit because in the morning he hadn't eaten that much and only had a small snack but he didnt eat that much.
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Since that number is after eating we done know what the fasting number is. I would only give 1 u
 
If it were me, I'd still try and get one more test tonight, just to see what he's up to. If you can't, I'd make sure he has access to food when you go to bed, just to be on the safe side.
 
Christie & Maverick said:
If it were me, I'd still try and get one more test tonight, just to see what he's up to. If you can't, I'd make sure he has access to food when you go to bed, just to be on the safe side.
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Hi everyone!
Last night his levels were at 11.3mmol/L (203md/dl) and i was suggested to give him 1 unit so i did.
This morning for some reason i'm not able to get any blood out, well blood comes out but the monitor says its not enough and i think his paw is getting sore(i do it on his paw because i cant get anything from the ear).
Would you suggest i just give him 1unit for now and monitor him closely? And i could check his results in a couple of hours to see how they are. Thank you!
 
Hi Catia,

Were there any tests last night after that 203 to see how low he went on the 1U?
Given his history with hypoglycemic seizures and dropping so low, I am reluctant to suggest you shoot blind!
 
Bandit's Mom said:
Hi Catia,

Were there any tests last night after that 203 to see how low he went on the 1U?
Given his history with hypoglycemic seizures and dropping so low, I am reluctant to suggest you shoot blind!
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No i had a long day and went to bed, i can try one more time and hopefully i can get his results... hes going to hate me:facepalm:
 
Bandit's Mom said:
Hi Catia,

Were there any tests last night after that 203 to see how low he went on the 1U?
Given his history with hypoglycemic seizures and dropping so low, I am reluctant to suggest you shoot blind!
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Hey i just checked and was able to get a result. His level is at 9.4mmol/L (169md/dl). How much do you think i should give him of insulin. His spreadsheet has been updated!
 
Poopers and Catia said:
Hey i just checked and was able to get a result. His level is at 9.4mmol/L (169md/dl). How much do you think i should give him of insulin. His spreadsheet has been updated!
Click to expand...
If you can monitor closely today, I would give 1 unit. If you feed him a little at +1 and +2 as well, that would help keep him surfing.
 
Bandit's Mom said:
If you can monitor closely today, I would give 1 unit. If you feed him a little at +1 and +2 as well, that would help keep him surfing.
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Hey I just checked Poopers levels for PMPS and it’s at 13.5mmol/L (243md/dl). How much insulin do you guys suggest I give him? His levels have been pretty good today (in my opinion) last night and this morning I gave him 1U should I stay at that?
 
Poopers and Catia said:
Hey I just checked Poopers levels for PMPS and it’s at 13.5mmol/L (243md/dl). How much insulin do you guys suggest I give him? His levels have been pretty good today (in my opinion) last night and this morning I gave him 1U should I stay at that?
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Sorry no one got back earlier. Did you shoot 1U? I would stay at 1U for a couple of days and get some mid-cycle tests to see how low he's going on the dose and then decide whether to increase or not.
@JanetNJ
@Christie & Maverick
 
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