6/8/18 New Question/Answered- Dose (jaxa)

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How is this for crazy... her +4 is @65mg/dl with no shot. I have watched her eat from her dish at least five times since her PMPS, and she even had some friskies treats when the dog had a few. We are pretty much at nadir in the +4/5 range for night so I am not too worried about her getting much lower, but holy crap am I glad I didn't try to do a teeny tiny shot with the new needles.
 
That’s great! Barring some other medical condition, a cat without insulin won’t hypo. Some kitties in remission even run in the 40’s from time to time, but they’re quite safe. Good choice on skipping the shot! That’s what we call “mama-sense”!
 
Good number this AMPS too, and I debated for a while but decided to give .2u with the new needle on 120mg/dl. She has a little more carb in the morning with the bisque and we will see where she goes; it had to be at that line, lol, if it was under 120 I would have skipped. I'll probably still second guess myself during the day though.
 
Holy crap... PMPS tonight is 68mg/dl. I heard reports that she was outside a lot, playing with dog and seemed to be running her usual inside/outside scheme all day so it doesn't seem like she went too low (or at least no symptoms of that). Her food is appropriately low for what she ate too, and she just gobbled up her PM snack. She seems to be feeling pretty good.
 
+4 is a bit higher, 110, but I wouldn't have shot at that number either with the way she goes low these days. I think she got some of the dogs treats tonight; the treat ball was down for a while.
 
Only 108 this AMPS, not going to give a shot at that, especially when I'll be gone all day. Was almost expecting her to go to the 140s again. Will see what her PMPS is though.

I'm trying to be patient and take each test as they come, but my mother is pushing for remission right now, lol. I think she is hoping she won't have to give shots when I am at training in August. I hope she doesn't too, but don't want to take anything for granted.
 
She did get a tiny shot tonight; I went out to the kitchen and the dog had left her food out there (usually she eats it all immediately) and the cat was licking it! So I grabbed her and tested her right then in the hope that the dog food wouldn't affect her bg yet; she had just come out of the bedroom with me moments before- only 134, so I gave .2 and will watch. I might open a can of wet food tonight for Jaxa too- she never eats more than one spoon but with the heat maybe she would like something wet and I have a bunch of good low carb stuff on hand (from Whole Earth Farms to Fancy Feast).

Oy, every day there is something, lol.
 
This is gonna be the hard part- when she is just high enough for a shot but even the tiny .2 gets her down to 50mg/dl by her +4 (close to nadir at least it seems); she seems alert and fine, gave her some treats and got the spoon of wet food into a dish but she hasn't shown any interest in it at all. She just doesn't seem to like wet food except that bisque. Don't know why. Gonna put some toys down for her and test again after a bit.

*And she is holding steady; +5 is 51 mg/dl. She has eaten some more regular food, had more of her usual treats, but I had her sniff the wet food and that made her gag (like actually gag) so I am probably going to let the dog eat it instead.
 
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I think we are bouncing a little this morning; slightly higher than the last few days. She didn't eat as much of her regular food in the middle of the night as she usually does, and didn't eat right before I pulled it this morning; no dog stuff on the floor though - I checked last night.

I think I ordered the wrong u100 needles too; she seemed to get the shot when I've given it but the needles are not as long as what I am used to. All these numbers and abbreviations; not sure what any of them refer to I guess.
 
Back to 64 tonight for PMPS, no shot, obviously. We had a big thunderstorm today and I was told she was nervy about being in different rooms and wanting to come in and outside a lot. I think she ate a little less too, though was told she ate about 30 minutes before food was taken up (~+9.5). This is what makes me nervous though- she was 174 this AM, so got .2u, and now I have to wonder if she went really low, or if she had a good green and is going up and down from not eating as much right now. She does seem to stay low in the afternoons instead of curving up a lot lately.

*+4 is @89, pretty good still. It is funny how these low numbers (under 200) start seeming high, like our AMPS seems so high after all these greens and low blues.
 
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Sorry I've been MIA the past couple of days. It's so good to see her doing this well! I agree that 174 might have been a little rebound. If you get another number that you feel like shooting, you could try even less than 0.2u. It gets really hard to be precise smaller than that, so be careful and do your best. One trick is to push the plunger of the syringe in quite firmly, then while you hold that, insert the needle into the vial, invert, and let go of the plunger. It will suck in a dose that we call "drop". It will feel like you're injecting nothing, but it can sometimes help get them over that last hurdle.

And yes, we quickly adjust to lower numbers, and get very greedy for those greens! They go from being something we're so scared of at the beginning, to something we hunt for towards the end.
 
Huge thunderstorm this morning and we lost power for over an hour, so I have to wait to update spreadsheet until I can use my computer later. 75mg/dl this AMPS, no shot. Got it done right before all the lights went out. When is eating better today the yesterday already, did not seem scared of the thunder.
 
This is exciting and scary; we are in our first full 24 hours of no shots. She had a nice PMPS of 80 tonight; will test again at +4 or so to see how she is doing. Right now she is eating her food with a bit of dehydrated duck liver sprinkled on top. Might have to go for treats this weekend when I get some of the pet birthday stuff out of the way.

Super humid with more storms expected, but that means she gets extra combing tonight, her favorite thing.
 
I think it is funny how when she is low at PMPS she goes higher for the +3/4, but when a little higher at PMPS she goes lower at the +3/4; higher and lower being completely relative at this point.

Not a bad +4 (62) considering her last shot was yesterday morning.
 
We are at 67mg/dl this morning and she is feeling fine and frisky; sitting in my window after having her breakfast and b12. I keep telling myself not to be disappointed if we stutter and she needs a shot at her next PS test, but it is hard not to hope that this might be it. No matter what happens we are well stocked.

I think I will ask the vet to look at her spreadsheet again this next week so he can see her progress. I still don't want to bring her in any time soon; however, at her age I need to start thinking about some possible dental and that might affect her bg too if we have work done on her teeth (from what I've read?), and we are still "dieting" to get down to 13/14#. She is probably closer to that and I just haven't had her weighed since the beginning of May.
 
You'll definitely want to stay on top of any dental issues and get regular cleanings if the rest of her health indicates it's safe.

And you're right that sometimes there is some sputtering and you need to give another dose or two before the "end".

Those numbers are really good. Conventional wisdom is that they need to stay under 120, with most numbers between 50-80 (although that part can vary a little by cat). Jaxa is abiding by that nicely right now.
 
I almost feel guilty for posting good news lately. We are continuing, with a PMPS at 76, and she had a good +7 @52 earlier.

It is so hot and muggy here from all of our recent thunderstorms (and we expect more tonight or tomorrow). Jaxa wants to go outside as much as she can so, as long as it isn't raining or dark, I let her; I keep water on the deck in two big dog bowls that get switched regularly, and we have bird baths (water for everyone that way). I added ice to her inside dish today though. Every day I just marvel at how much better she is than a few months ago; I know nothing is ever certain and I could lose her tomorrow to some unforeseen thing, but her quality of life right now is so great and she seems so happy.
 
NEVER feel bad posting good news! We go through this journey with you...we want to join in the celebration when it works!
 
I'm with Rachel on that! Never feel bad about posting good news! It reminds everyone why this is all worth it! When I first joined here, I spent hours reading through old threads to figure out how all of this works. You've done a great job of documenting Jaxa's journey which will someday be helpful to someone else. Plus, you now have so much experience to share with others here!
 
Another good morning @85mg/dl. I wonder if we are edging up a little at each PS test. She was a little fussy about her ear being poked this morning but it seemed to be because she was too hungry.

*Not a lot of movement today; but got in a +4 and +6. She has been a little clingy today too, but is eating plenty. I think she misses me when I'm at work so she has to follow me when I'm home and she can't go out (today is rainy).
 
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A few minutes early so I can get to my father's house, but PMPS is @82, no shot for the third full day (fourth night in a row). I am sorta expecting that we will be over 100 again in the next day or two, just a feeling, but so far so good. I sent the Vet office a note about looking at her spreadsheet, so hopefully they will look it over again- they actually mentioned remission and careful testing the last time we spoke over a week ago.
 
One more morning (@65). Last night when she had 89 for a +4 I wondered, but she had been scarfing down food about 30 minutes before the test, eating more just before the test and then she ate a little more right after the test. It was like she waited for me to get home to eat.
 
Our streak is continuing, though a little higher at 88 for PMPS. I'm not entirely sure when her food was put up today, but was told she was out of the room most of the day. Thursday is going to be a difficult day; we are getting garage doors installed and both bedrooms are right above the tuck-under garage, so she won't have an easy time escaping from the noise and strange people outside.

*+5 added (73); she is so stubborn; she skipped eating her regular food for over an hour in the hopes of getting four little treats, and after she got them acted like she was dying of starvation until she could get to her food dish.

*AMPS @69, we got in a ketone test the other day too so we are trying to do random tests and double check everything.
 
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Glassgoblin said:
she skipped eating her regular food for over an hour in the hopes of getting four little treats, and after she got them acted like she was dying of starvation until she could get to her food dish.
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Sam does this too! Craziest thing! I've finally figured out that if I just give him a piece of salmon he'll stop screaming and go eat his food. Cats are funny sometimes...
 
She is keeping on track, had a nice low 52 at +5 last night too, but that makes 6 nights and now 6 mornings with no shot. This is the first time in about seven months that she hasn't been on medication for more than a day at a time, it almost feels weird.
 
Still on track. I almost expected her to be high this PMPS, but instead she had the exact same number as this AM. We had people working on the tuck-under garage all day so she was scared, had no good hiding spots and wasn't sure if she wanted to be inside or outside; then it took a good ten minutes to test just now because she kept jerking her head around and not wanting to settle anywhere. Poor kitty. The work-people are gone now though so she can hopefully relax.
 
Poor Jaxa! I'm glad the stress didn't mess with her numbers too much. She's looking great! It would probably be okay at this point to drop the before-bed tests if you feel comfortable with it. Of course if you feel better checking, go right ahead!
 
Djamila said:
Poor Jaxa! I'm glad the stress didn't mess with her numbers too much. She's looking great! It would probably be okay at this point to drop the before-bed tests if you feel comfortable with it. Of course if you feel better checking, go right ahead!
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I actually did skip the late test last night but mostly because she was still kinda nervy so I wanted her to relax and chill with me instead. A little higher this AM, but probably because I usually wake up between 2-3:30am and get the food up and this morning didn't wake until almost 4:30 and grabbed the dish right before she was going to eat; not sure if we had two hours before the test but tested at the usual time to see what we would be at anyway (85).
 
It’s good at this point to see how she’s doing regardless of the timing of the food. A cat in a strong remission won’t have large food spikes. You should be able to test at any time during the cycle and see her holding steady in the greens. 85 is still a good number!
 
And we got our lowest PS ever just now- PMPS (PMNS?) is at 46mg/dl. She is gobbling up some food; her dish looked like she had been eating though, so she didn't fast too long during the day.
 
Yup, cats can run in the 40’s all on their own and be perfectly safe. I believe you call it AMBG/PMBG when you aren’t giving shots.

This is so fun to watch!
 
I'm never sure what will happen each time we test, but she was a good 71 this AM, and feeling frisky- she even was playing with the dog's tennis balls. That is nine nights/mornings without a shot so far; I need to start thinking about the next stage of protocol. How often do I test, what to watch for (like excessive thirst/peeing again, etc). She will be ten yrs old this month, and as much as I want her to never have this again I am trying to be realistic since in the next ten years (or more if we're lucky) there is a lot that can happen, and maybe in just two or three months I'll be giving shots again, or in five years. Trying to be optimistic too, but my pessimism has driven me to plan for things in the past and that usually serves me well.
 
The two biggest things are food and health care. For the rest of Jaxa's life, you'll want to be super duper careful about food choices. I got a little lax with Sam and trusted the packaging on a food without confirming the actual values with the company. Turned out that despite being a dehydrated raw food, it was high carb and he came out of remission.

Health care: stay on top of dental issues in particular and get regular cleanings. Any health concern that pops up you'll want to take care of quickly, as inflammation and infection of any kind can pull them out of remission. And of course, avoid steroids. The rub on that one is that there are times when a steroid is a necessary treatment, even if diabetes is an unfortunate side effect. In a case like that, you just have to weigh the pros and cons and do what is best for her overall health.

Conventional wisdom around here has been that you test 2/day for 14 days (you're on day 9ish now, I believe). Then once/week for a couple months, then once/month for life. Honestly, I wish I had stayed at once/week as I might have caught the problem with Sam sooner and maybe avoided him becoming a lifer. Since it sounds like you'd rather err on the side of caution, i would say once/week or once every two weeks, and not let it go longer than that. And if you get a number that concerns you, increase the testing until you're convinced things are okay again.

Oh, and keep her weight under control. Just like in humans, being overweight is connected to diabetes, so you want to keep her svelte and active.

Another thing I wish I had done was stay active on the board. Sam went into remission quickly the first time, and I disappeared. Then normal life pushed diabetes right out of mind. If I had stayed active and helped other folks, I think it would have kept the urgency of care more in the front of my mind. I thought I was being mindful, but not in the way I would have been if I'd stuck around.
 
I am hoping tonight continues; a little concerned about a +10 we just did (92), but hoping that it was just that the pets were home alone (usually someone is home all day) and though the food was up from where the dog couldn't reach it should have been accessible to the kitty. So made sure she ate, grabbed food up and will test in 2 hrs.

*PMBG is at 76 though so maybe just a little stressed from the dog barking and freaking out when we got home and stayed outside for a few minutes. Eating again; not sure if she wants to go outside though- super hot today.
 
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Djamila said:
The two biggest things are food and health care. For the rest of Jaxa's life, you'll want to be super duper careful about food choices. I got a little lax with Sam and trusted the packaging on a food without confirming the actual values with the company. Turned out that despite being a dehydrated raw food, it was high carb and he came out of remission.

Health care: stay on top of dental issues in particular and get regular cleanings. Any health concern that pops up you'll want to take care of quickly, as inflammation and infection of any kind can pull them out of remission. And of course, avoid steroids. The rub on that one is that there are times when a steroid is a necessary treatment, even if diabetes is an unfortunate side effect. In a case like that, you just have to weigh the pros and cons and do what is best for her overall health.

Conventional wisdom around here has been that you test 2/day for 14 days (you're on day 9ish now, I believe). Then once/week for a couple months, then once/month for life. Honestly, I wish I had stayed at once/week as I might have caught the problem with Sam sooner and maybe avoided him becoming a lifer. Since it sounds like you'd rather err on the side of caution, i would say once/week or once every two weeks, and not let it go longer than that. And if you get a number that concerns you, increase the testing until you're convinced things are okay again.

Oh, and keep her weight under control. Just like in humans, being overweight is connected to diabetes, so you want to keep her svelte and active.

Another thing I wish I had done was stay active on the board. Sam went into remission quickly the first time, and I disappeared. Then normal life pushed diabetes right out of mind. If I had stayed active and helped other folks, I think it would have kept the urgency of care more in the front of my mind. I thought I was being mindful, but not in the way I would have been if I'd stuck around.
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Makes sense; I just ordered another bag of her YAZM and more immune/enzyme supplement. I plan on keeping a low carb diet for her; if she decides she hates this food one day we will just switch to another. I do want to get some low carb canned food- she licked the dog's blue buffalo beef and veggie food the other night. Maybe if I can get a liver or beef flavor (her favorite Orijen treat flavors) she might try some. We are sticking with the b12 too, that has helped so much so it is staying in her daily schedule.

Dental is on the list; they suggested brushing her teeth and I found some little finger things that I might try. And absolutely on the diet. I think she has lost weight since her last weigh-in a the vet over two months ago now, but we don't have any scales at home to check. Definitely looks more slender though.

And I do have to stick around; I don't know how much I have to offer except moral support but I do want to jump in sometimes and let people know that it does get better/easier and there is some hope after diagnosis. It is so overwhelming at first, and then anytime something gets a little scary, it is nice to know others have been there and know what you are facing. I might be able to sleep longer on the weekends though, lol.
 
Still good, AMBG @70. I looked through the spreadsheet and it seems like it was just a short time ago that we had a pink for AM, but it was over a month ago. Having the spreadsheet sure helps see the progress and put it all in perspective from above as it were.

In this heat Jaxa is just appreciating that her bisque is in the refrigerator every morning so she gets nice cool meal to start the hot humid day. I've been putting ice in her bowls of water too.
 
I bet she likes that! My cats always seem happy when I add ice to their water dish.

Isn't it nice to scroll through your SS now and see how it went down?
 
Still good; my sister and her foster kid came for a visit about an hour before the test- Jaxa is scared of strangers and freaks out when anyone knocks on the door. When getting her to the bedroom (to hide) she scratched the hell outta my arm, and ripped a hole in my shirt ; she may have peed on me a little too but I had been carrying wet things so hard to tell. However, she was still only at 76 about 90 later (30 minutes after they left). Poor kitty.
 
Getting really close; tonight is our 12th PM no shot, (11th morning was this AM). Hot! But she is in and out and likes the cool wet dirt under the deck where she can watch the chipmunks and birds. Still eating well. I wish there was cat ice cream; I found a Purina ice cream for dogs, but I suspect it would be too high carb for Jaxa to try. I will have to chill some wet food for her later instead.
 
You can definitely freeze their food and make a meatsicle. Although to be honest, my cats always wait until it's thawed and warmed up anyway. :rolleyes:
 
12th AM with no shot, @59 this morning. My mother was telling me that Jaxa is communicating with her more and more; yesterday she went directly to my mother, mewed at her and then clearly indicated that she wanted to be let into the bedroom (where the food is); a first for them. She has always been a one-person cat, but now that she is feeling better is getting a little more social with people who already knows (and the dog). Still scared of strangers, but I don't mind if it keeps her in the yard.

We still hadn't finished our second bottle of ProZinc and I bought the next bottle as back-up and we haven't touched it yet, will have to think about what to do on that later.
 
You could try selling it on the Supply Closet thread if you don't mind figuring out cold shipping. Or if you can find someone in your area that needs some - maybe connect through your vet's office?

It's great to hear that she's "talking" more with your mom. I found that Sam has become a much friendlier cat through this whole process, and I know other people have had that experience with their diabetic cats as well. Maybe all the love and treats they get?
 
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