1/27 Silver AMPS 171 +2=299 +4=283 +6=234 +9 193 PMPS 196

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I hope Silver comes back down for you today and shows you what he is doing on this dose.
Thanks. He has been on this dose for two weeks though so not doing too much. I think he will be due an increase. There is no real change in his numbers in the last two weeks
 
Come on Silver, show your bean what's going on. Hope you see some blue today, Juliet. :cat:
How do I make an effective dosing decision today? I know I am now on the new meter.....but I am looking at trends and from the secondary testing I have got, on the new meter - the yellows are pinks, the blues are yellows and the greens are blues....so really - the only change is a couple of blues that is new. He's been on the dose two weeks, he isn't in regular good numbers....but if I look only at the new meter readings, then he's gone into green twice on this dose but does his usual and bounces. Personally I think he could benefit from going up to 3u as I know the FS measures on the low side. My vet readings - I compared the results from his last blood test - they are most closely correlated to the Accu-check.
 
Good luck with your curve. Hope you get the clarity you need.

The food bump...Silver gets all his food at once and eats it all at once I am assuming (otherwise his sister gets it!) That can be a big food bump compared to CG that give the same amount of food divided out over 6-9 hours. Just an idea.
 
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Good luck with your curve. Hope you get the clarity you need.

The food bump...Silver gets all his food at once and eats it all at once I am assuming (otherwise his sister gets it!) That can be a big food bump compared to CG that give the same amount of good divided out over 6-9 hours. Just and idea.
Yes he gets a can of FF at amps and a can at pmps. You're correct, I can't split it over several meals because his sister will get it and she can't get more overweight than she is. Also he would scarf it all at once if I left out more. He does seem to be fine without the midday snack. I haven't run into issues. One can of FF isn't like I am giving him a huge amount of food but he always does have that food bump at +2. I am not sure how you would divide a can of FF over 6 hrs unless you gave a quarter can three times. Not possible on work days and I didn't want to interrupt his usual routine at weekends.

I am going to need help with a dosing decision today and I am hoping to get advice I can weigh. Even on the FSL his numbers do seem too high still.

Thoughts on me increasing to 3u?
 
Thoughts on me increasing to 3u?
Looking at the SS I am getting the feeling he might be going under 150 at night. You've also had a few low PS (95, 139, 99) that could let us suppose he is dipping under that 150.

So now on interpretation of SLGS. We know not all cycles are equal. When SLGS says "do a curve, and if the nadirs are above 150, increase", is that based on the one arbitrary curve we do, or is that also to take into account our guesstimates of what has been going on during the week?

Because if it's the second case, it might be that the reality of his numbers over the last week is more like (quoting the sticky):
  • If nadirs are between 90 (5 mmol/L) and 149 mg/dl (8.2 mmol/L), maintain the same dose
And we also have:

"As your cat's blood glucose begins to fall mostly in the desired range [lowest point of the curve approaching 100 mg/dl (5.5 mmol/L) and pre-shot value around or below 300 mg/dl (16.6 mmol/L)], do lengthen the waiting time between dose increases."

-- which could be the situation Silver is in now.

So, if this comes down to an interpretation of the method, I interpret the plural "nadirs" as inviting the CG to look at the whole week, filling in the blanks with the curve being done and the spot checks, and therefore I would lean towards sticking with the current dose, which looks quite good.

But maybe there is a provision for being more agressive here? More experienced advice welcome.
 
Looking at the SS I am getting the feeling he might be going under 150 at night. You've also had a few low PS (95, 139, 99) that could let us suppose he is dipping under that 150.

So now on interpretation of SLGS. We know not all cycles are equal. When SLGS says "do a curve, and if the nadirs are above 150, increase", is that based on the one arbitrary curve we do, or is that also to take into account our guesstimates of what has been going on during the week?

Because if it's the second case, it might be that the reality of his numbers over the last week is more like (quoting the sticky):
  • If nadirs are between 90 (5 mmol/L) and 149 mg/dl (8.2 mmol/L), maintain the same dose
And we also have:

"As your cat's blood glucose begins to fall mostly in the desired range [lowest point of the curve approaching 100 mg/dl (5.5 mmol/L) and pre-shot value around or below 300 mg/dl (16.6 mmol/L)], do lengthen the waiting time between dose increases."

-- which could be the situation Silver is in now.

So, if this comes down to an interpretation of the method, I interpret the plural "nadirs" as inviting the CG to look at the whole week, filling in the blanks with the curve being done and the spot checks, and therefore I would lean towards sticking with the current dose, which looks quite good.

But maybe there is a provision for being more agressive here? More experienced advice welcome.
I'm trying to translate your numbers - I am in Canada so we use mmoL....and I do know and understand the SLGL protocol - BUT I am looking at trends and the ONLY reason he is out of pinks and yellows is the change of meter. The two times you have seen him in greens have been blues on the regular meter. So I have to take into account the trend. The trend is the same. He hasnt suddenly dropped into good numbers.

I have followed the SLGS where it says hold the dose longer - he has been on this dose two weeks now instead of the usual one - I am leaning towards the 3u - which is in fact just one drop more than he is currently getting (I fill the syringe to 3u and squeeze out a drop).
 
BUT I am looking at trends and the ONLY reason he is out of pinks and yellows is the change of meter.
Oh, what was the meter before that? I've been through meter strip change just recently and it's really messed with my head (even though, no insulin for lucky Quintus).

So yeah, given that, if you're comfy with him going a bit lower than what he's doing, and your 2.75 is actually 3ui-1drop...

Did you do some meter comparison when you switched to get a sense of how much lower it read?
 
Oh, what was the meter before that? I've been through meter strip change just recently and it's really messed with my head (even though, no insulin for lucky Quintus).

So yeah, given that, if you're comfy with him going a bit lower than what he's doing, and your 2.75 is actually 3ui-1drop...

Did you do some meter comparison when you switched to get a sense of how much lower it read?
I used to be on accucheck until last week and yes it’s really messing with my head because I see the drastic diffeeence in the two. The red line in the ss shows where I switched and you immediately see greens and blues as I expected. I kept back a few accucheck strips to compare in the transition and have about ten left as when he was at green preshot I snagged a second accucheck test and it was in double digits 10.4 and 9.7 so I felt safe to shoot the “green”. That’s why I am struggling with the dose decision this week but I also know if he goes lower - even below 5 on the freestyle he is really higher than that on the accucheck. I tested my civvie and got 4.6 on the accucheck and that is the same as the last vet reading but I am thinking they use pet specific meters?

Anyhow yes it’s messing with my head.
 
Oh and yes that first day I did a curve with both strips. The yellows were pinks. Eg 11 on the freestyle was 20.4 on the accucheck. 5.5 on freestyle was 10.4 accucheck. 9.3 on freestyle was 16.3 on accucheck. So yellows are pinks; blues are yellows and greens are blues. Hence me seeing no real change in the last couple weeks.
 
Hold the dose, you are seeing numbers under 150 (6.2). You don't look at just the data from curve day, but from the previous week too. Don't try to compare meters. Pick one and stick with it. If you have no more Accucheck strips, Freestyle is how you'll be deciding dose going forward.
 
Hold the dose, you are seeing numbers under 150 (6.2). You don't look at just the data from curve day, but from the previous week too. Don't try to compare meters. Pick one and stick with it. If you have no more Accucheck strips, Freestyle is how you'll be deciding dose going forward.
Isn’t 150 8.3? Yes I do understand I need to keep to one meter but are we not supposed to look at the trend? He has not come out of yellows on this dose. I will bear all comments in mind and make decision tonight. He has been on this dose a long time and I’m worried he’ll get too used to it like he did before.
 
Yup, sorry, a typo. Keyboard is getting sticky. 150 is under 8.3.

He's probably got some bounce going today from however low he went yesterday or the night before.
 
My 2 cents...is that there is lots of 150 or less this week with the new meter. And you had a 121 just a week ago on the old one.

Using your analogy (which I hope I remember correctly) New Pink would be like old red. New yellow is old pink. New blue is old yellow. New green is old blue. I know that maybe over simplified but may be the best way to help you convert to the new meter and get comfy with it and then again may be not! I thought I read on a previous thread of yours that the meters are closer together the lower the numbers.

How big of a drop are you taking out? A drop that once big enough rolls down the needle?

I might hold for another couple of days on this dose, just wondering how big that drop is?
 
My 2 cents...is that there is lots of 150 or less this week with the new meter. And you had a 121 just a week ago on the old one.

Using your analogy (which I hope I remember correctly) New Pink would be like old red. New yellow is old pink. New blue is old yellow. New green is old blue. I know that maybe over simplified but may be the best way to help you convert to the new meter and get comfy with it and then again may be not! I thought I read on a previous thread of yours that the meters are closer together the lower the numbers.

How big of a drop are you taking out? A drop that once big enough rolls down the needle?

I might hold for another couple of days on this dose, just wondering how big that drop is?
Not that it really makes a huge difference. A drop is a drop. It’s a good drop that rolls down syringe. Yes. That analogy IS the pattern. Therefore numbers have NOT changed at all. If I kept same meter which I wish I had now it would still be consistently yellows and pinks and run for the hills when seeing a blue. New meter - yellows and blues and run for the hills when see green. No different at all.

I think I have decided to increase. Whatever you guys say - I must look at the trends and they have not yet trended down far enough to be in regular good numbers. He saw two suspicious greens. Anyone else would be encouraged to increase at this point. A couple days when already been here on this dose for two weeks is not going to change anything.
 
Not that it really makes a huge difference.
It can, trust me when I was taking multiple drops out of 0.1U for Jones at one point.

And see me with my hands up? I was giving my 2 cents..if it was Jones, I would hold for a couple more days and just see what he does as he clears this possible bounce. If no improvement I would do a solid 3 units.

You do what you think you feel you need to
 
It can, trust me when I was taking multiple drops out of 0.1U for Jones at one point.

And see me with my hands up? I was giving my 2 cents..if it was Jones, I would hold for a couple more days and just see what he does as he clears this possible bounce. If no improvement I would do a solid 3 units.

You do what you think you feel you need to
I’ll give it some thought tonight. Thanks. It’s good to get input so I can make an informed decision.
 
Coming from an incredibly impatient diabetic cat mom, I know this would be difficult for me to embrace, so you do what you feel you should. However, I would be curious to know how Silver is feeling. Drinking/urinating more than he should? Feeling happy or lethargic?

If Silver’s symptoms are in a good place, I would advise myself to hold the dose. It’s very difficult because we want them to be in the normal range, but chasing numbers can create a lot of stress for us. What’s the harm in giving Silver a bit of time and you some time with the new meter if symptoms are ok? (I’m actually asking, it’s not rhetorical.)
 
Coming from an incredibly impatient diabetic cat mom, I know this would be difficult for me to embrace, so you do what you feel you should. However, I would be curious to know how Silver is feeling. Drinking/urinating more than he should? Feeling happy or lethargic?

If Silver’s symptoms are in a good place, I would advise myself to hold the dose. It’s very difficult because we want them to be in the normal range, but chasing numbers can create a lot of stress for us. What’s the harm in giving Silver a bit of time and you some time with the new meter if symptoms are ok? (I’m actually asking, it’s not rhetorical.)
Silver is fine in every way. No symptoms at all of diabetes. There is a reason I need him OTJ so chasing the good numbers. I am needing to go to the UK for two weeks and can’t go until he is low enough dose to be able to leave him with a sitter who can’t test but can only shoot the insulin. I managed five days but he was only on .25u. Can’t leave her to dose without testing for two weeks. I have no other options for pet sitter. No vet techs locally. No one else I can trust.
 
It can, trust me when I was taking multiple drops out of 0.1U for Jones at one point.

And see me with my hands up? I was giving my 2 cents..if it was Jones, I would hold for a couple more days and just see what he does as he clears this possible bounce. If no improvement I would do a solid 3 units.

You do what you think you feel you need to
I’ll hold a couple more days. I’m comfortable doing that.
 
Silver is fine in every way. No symptoms at all of diabetes. There is a reason I need him OTJ so chasing the good numbers. Not explaining those here.

Well, I’m happy to hear all is well with symptoms. It’s clear you’re a well-educated, prepared cat mom. Here’s to Silver having a great week!
 
Silver is fine in every way. No symptoms at all of diabetes. There is a reason I need him OTJ so chasing the good numbers. I am needing to go to the UK for two weeks and can’t go until he is low enough dose to be able to leave him with a sitter who can’t test but can only shoot the insulin. I managed five days but he was only on .25u. Can’t leave her to dose without testing for two weeks. I have no other options for pet sitter. No vet techs locally. No one else I can trust.

I haven’t traveled for this exact reason and left for 5 days over the holiday. Now, Hamilton flinches when he gets an injection (which he never did before). I share your pain. Actually cancelled a trip to Spain to be here for him. I wish I was closer and could help!
 
I also can’t afford to keep going with treatment long term. I have managed to get some sysringes thanks to @Ann & Liz but its getting too expensive for me to manage.
 
I haven’t traveled for this exact reason and left for 5 days over the holiday. Now, Hamilton flinches when he gets an injection (which he never did before). I share your pain. Actually cancelled a trip to Spain to be here for him. I wish I was closer and could help!
My mum has just had a major stroke and I thought I’d lost her. Thankfully she has made a recovery but I need to see her every year now not once every other year. I won’t have her for too much longer. I’m caught between not wanting to leave my sick cat and needing to see my sick Mum.
 
My heart breaks for you. We’ll be sending all positive vibes your way. (I just complained to a friend, after Hamilton wanted to destroy me for making him exercise, that I feel like I’m the only one trying here!). Come on, Silver! You can do this!
 
It'll b good to get some more data this weekend before deciding what to do. One green is questionable, two not so much. And who knows, maybe the Freestyle is the more accurate of the two meters.
 
It'll b good to get some more data this weekend before deciding what to do. One green is questionable, two not so much. And who knows, maybe the Freestyle is the more accurate of the two meters.
Thanks. I’ll give it another couple days. How would I know which is more accurate? The vast difference even at small numbers does worry me.
 
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Caught napping...
 
It's not the routine, Juliet. It's how the carbs at a given time effect a given number. His cycles are always changing.
That makes no sense. You’re just saying what I said in a different way. “How carbs at a given time affect his number” = routine. He gets fed exactly the same food exactly the same amount at exactly the same time every single day. So I don’t see any need to be writing any comments down. I barely have the time to post every day. I wonder why there is even a need to post daily when people can click on an ss at any time to see the progress.
 
There is no requirement to post every day. It's a personal choice. But if someone doesn't post, it's unlikely I will randomly think to open their spreadsheet. And then I miss the cute cat pics too.
 
That makes no sense. You’re just saying what I said in a different way. “How carbs at a given time affect his number” = routine. He gets fed exactly the same food exactly the same amount at exactly the same time every single day. So I don’t see any need to be writing any comments down. I barely have the time to post every day. I wonder why there is even a need to post daily when people can click on an ss at any time to see the progress.
We are saying two different things. For instance, if Silver gives you a 75 and you feed him some 6 % food, what did that 6% do to that number? Did it bump him up ten points, 20 points or higher when you retest in 30 minutes. That is useful information to help understand patterns and what food does what to the numbers. Do see what I am saying?
 
We are saying two different things. For instance, if Silver gives you a 75 and you feed him some 6 % food, what did that 6% do to that number? Did it bump him up ten points, 20 points or higher when you retest in 30 minutes. That is useful information to help understand patterns and what food does what to the numbers. Do see what I am saying?
My apologies. I’m having a really stressed out day today. I’m just tired and Silver being sick adds to my stress. I know you guys are here to help.
 
We are saying two different things. For instance, if Silver gives you a 75 and you feed him some 6 % food, what did that 6% do to that number? Did it bump him up ten points, 20 points or higher when you retest in 30 minutes. That is useful information to help understand patterns and what food does what to the numbers. Do see what I am saying?
Yes in a way. But I have no clue of % of food. I feed a can of FF at amps and again at pmps and half a can at bedtime. He slways spikes. I never test in 30 mins. My budget is so tight I can test only 4 times a day unless doing a curve.
 
My apologies. I’m having a really stressed out day today. I’m just tired and Silver being sick adds to my stress. I know you guys are here to help.

Apology accepted. I know it's stressful enough with a sick cat and then to have your mom have a stroke, I am sure your stress level is over the moon. If you will post the Fancy Feast that you feed I can look it up for you tomorrow but, for now I am signing off. Is it a Classic Fancy Feast and what flavor.
 
Apology accepted. I know it's stressful enough with a sick cat and then to have your mom have a stroke, I am sure your stress level is over the moon. If you will post the Fancy Feast that you feed I can look it up for you tomorrow but, for now I am signing off. Is it a Classic Fancy Feast and what flavor.
It’s in my signature but I give him the seafood pate ones. They come in a multi pack. It’s all he will eat. I know it’s low carb as FF pate (Classics) in US is low carb and he’s been off all dry for ever.
 
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