Young Again pet food

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FurBabiesMama said:
I use their Zero Mature as a food topper/treat. Of all the dry foods, their zero formulas have the lest carbs. As a treat, it is a good option, but of course, you want low-carb wet food to be the primary food.

http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/...r-more-than-just-carbohydrate-content.175004/
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She's getting Tiki, Weruva and Purely Fancy Feast. They're all close to zero carbs. I finally got my testing kit (AlphaTrak 2) and about an hour after a small meal (1/4 tray of Purely Tuna) she came in at 260. She was diagnosed a few weeks ago and I thought a diet change before I give her the insulin would be the safest route. She's been on low carb for about 8 days.
Any idea how long it takes before you can be sure she's normalized on the low carb? Or does that just take testing for a few weeks. I don't know if 260 is dangerously high.
 
Marylou and Malika said:
She's getting Tiki, Weruva and Purely Fancy Feast. They're all close to zero carbs. I finally got my testing kit (AlphaTrak 2) and about an hour after a small meal (1/4 tray of Purely Tuna) she came in at 260. She was diagnosed a few weeks ago and I thought a diet change before I give her the insulin would be the safest route. She's been on low carb for about 8 days.
Any idea how long it takes before you can be sure she's normalized on the low carb? Or does that just take testing for a few weeks. I don't know if 260 is dangerously high.
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I think the switch to low-carb has an almost immediate impact. That is why if a cat is already on insulin when someone switches to low-carb, they are supposed to monitor very carefully and possibly even proactively lower the dose just in case.

260 is high but not horribly so. It sounds like your baby may need a very small dose of insulin.
 
FurBabiesMama said:
I think the switch to low-carb has an almost immediate impact. That is why if a cat is already on insulin when someone switches to low-carb, they are supposed to monitor very carefully and possibly even proactively lower the dose just in case.

260 is high but not horribly so. It sounds like your baby may need a very small dose of insulin.
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She was at 255 this morning before food. I have an appointment next Wednesday to test her urine and blood, and a blood fructose test for a more accurate picture. I think you're probably right though. She probably needs insulin.
The first vet put her on 1U twice a day of Vetsulin, but I didn't want to lower her carbs AND insulin at the same time, especially without monitoring.
Thanks for the support.
 
Marylou and Malika said:
This company claims to have low carb/starch food. Here's the web site. Does anyone have input on this? I'm looking for some crunchy treats for my cat, and some fiber and thought this might work if it's safe.
https://www.youngagainpetfood.com/which-food.html
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The Young Again Zero food is definitely low carb enough to safely give to your extra sweet kitty (and your non-diabetics as well!). I mostly feed my kids Fancy Feast pates, but I like to have the Young Again out for grazing as well. Lou seems to like the crunch and will frequently eat both wet and dry during a meal. Ultimately I wanted something out at all times to ease my mind if Lou goes too low during the day. Just keep in mind that it's a calorie-rich food, so watch how much your kitty eats if you're worried about her gaining too much weight.
 
Just keep in mind that some diabetics will have trouble with even the lower carb dry foods--while they may be low carb, they aren't low glycemic. Bandit's BG shoots up 100 points or more if he even has just a few pieces of the low-carb kibble, and I've seen cats that have trouble regulating on dry foods even if they're lower carb, where canned foods with the same or higher carb values don't present a problem. All dry food must use a starch as a binding agent during manufacture.

If there isn't a very good reason to introduce the dry (e.g. your cat refuses to eat wet), then I wouldn't recommend it.
 
Malika loves here treats, and the freeze dried makes me think it's really really rich. She has always been on the lean side and I don't see her gaining any weight on the wet food. She can overeat and then toss it up if I'm not careful, so not too much at once either. I was really hoping to give her 10 to 12 'treats' using the cat kibbles. That doesn't seem like over doing it, but indeed here BG level will tell all. I'm not making any dramatic moves without that.
I am proud to say, I performed her second test all on my own! Insulin is easy compared to preparing that ear!!
 
Marylou and Malika said:
Malika loves here treats, and the freeze dried makes me think it's really really rich. She has always been on the lean side and I don't see her gaining any weight on the wet food. She can overeat and then toss it up if I'm not careful, so not too much at once either. I was really hoping to give her 10 to 12 'treats' using the cat kibbles. That doesn't seem like over doing it, but indeed here BG level will tell all. I'm not making any dramatic moves without that.
I am proud to say, I performed her second test all on my own! Insulin is easy compared to preparing that ear!!
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You can give freeze-dried treats throughout the day for treats. Not sure what you mean by them being "rich"? Do you mean they are too expensive? I could give you links for some lower cost ones...

Is she underweight? What canned foods are you giving her and how many times a day are you feeding her? If she needs to gain weight, a higher calorie canned food would be more effective for weight gain then giving her kibble. I could give you a few suggestions Or, you could increase the number of calories she's getting with the canned food she's currently eating by increasing the number of meals.

Congrats on getting your second test!!!!:cat: Testing starts out hard, but you'll become a pro at it in no time. Bandit had me in tears when we first started testing, he was so difficult. 9 years later, he sits and purrs through the whole test like nothing's even happening.
 
Thanks for your reply Julia!
I've feeding her (at the moment) 3 meals a day of low to 0 carb wet food: Tiki, Purely Fancy Feast, and Weruva are her favorites. Her treats are Orijen freeze dried. I tend to put human traits to the food and reaction, and the Orijen just smells rich (stinky) like straight fat on a chuck roast. So I may need to simply over come my associations. According to all of the foods, she should be getting about 3 'cans' a day at 45 calories each. She's 9.15 lbs as of last Wednesday. I have an appt. next Wednesday and will know if she's maintaining it.
She hasn't pooped in 3 days, and my thought was a little higher fiber in a dry food as a treat might help. I used .25 of a 1/4 tsp of Miralax this afternoon and hope that gets her rolling. She generally doesn't communicate issues until the last minute, so I'm trying to mitigate that. I had a cat that ended up requiring several enemas (he hurt his hind quarter and couldn't use his muscles correctly) and that is no fun at all!
Any and all advice is appreciated. We're all rookies once, as they say!
 
I tried Young Again once for my cats (4 total, one diabetic). The three non-diabetics loved it. But Lestat, the diabetic, wanted no part of it. He is quite happy with his Purina DM. If you are still curious, give them a call, explain the situation, and ask if they can send you a sample before you commit to a purchase. That is what I did, and I'm glad (as the cat that needed it didn't want the Young Again). Best of luck with it if you try it!
 
LestatsDad said:
I tried Young Again once for my cats (4 total, one diabetic). The three non-diabetics loved it. But Lestat, the diabetic, wanted no part of it. He is quite happy with his Purina DM. If you are still curious, give them a call, explain the situation, and ask if they can send you a sample before you commit to a purchase. That is what I did, and I'm glad (as the cat that needed it didn't want the Young Again). Best of luck with it if you try it!
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That's a great idea - thank you!
 
Marylou and Malika said:
Thanks for your reply Julia!
I've feeding her (at the moment) 3 meals a day of low to 0 carb wet food: Tiki, Purely Fancy Feast, and Weruva are her favorites. Her treats are Orijen freeze dried. I tend to put human traits to the food and reaction, and the Orijen just smells rich (stinky) like straight fat on a chuck roast. So I may need to simply over come my associations. According to all of the foods, she should be getting about 3 'cans' a day at 45 calories each. She's 9.15 lbs as of last Wednesday. I have an appt. next Wednesday and will know if she's maintaining it.
She hasn't pooped in 3 days, and my thought was a little higher fiber in a dry food as a treat might help. I used .25 of a 1/4 tsp of Miralax this afternoon and hope that gets her rolling. She generally doesn't communicate issues until the last minute, so I'm trying to mitigate that. I had a cat that ended up requiring several enemas (he hurt his hind quarter and couldn't use his muscles correctly) and that is no fun at all!
Any and all advice is appreciated. We're all rookies once, as they say!
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Those foods are all good for diabetics, but pretty low in calories so you need to feed a lot (about twice as much) as something like Wellness pates. Will she eat pates? If not, I can suggest some higher calorie shredded foods.

Young again isn't going to solve your constipation problem, and it might make it worse. Constipation in diabetics is often caused by dehydration, and dry food is dehydrating. Try mixing some extra water into her food each meal. Also, I don't know who told you to give .25 of a 1/4 tsp of miralax (that's only 1/16 tsp), but that's not a big enough dose to do anything. A normal dose for cats is 1/8-1/4 tsp, twice a day.

As for fiber, you need a soluble fiber to help with constipation. If increasing the water content in her food and miralax dose doesn't solve the problem, you can pick up some psyllium husk powder for fiber and mix it in with her canned food. That's what they add to Young Again for it's fiber content.

There was a good article in Cornell's Feline Health Center's Cat Watch called "Get ahead of chronic constipation" this month. I hung on to the issue for some reason...I can scan and share the article with you tomorrow.
 
Young Again Zero doesn't use starch as its binder, it uses guar gum as its binder. This is an soluble fiber that's also sold for humans as a laxative or stool softener. It has the same effect on my cat -- he gets projectile stools with it, very loose. If your cat has constipation, YAZ will certainly solve that problem. (Note that while guar gum is being investigated for its effect upon blood sugar in humans -- i.e., it reduces blood sugar in humans and is being investigated as a possible treatment for borderline Type 2 diabetes in humans -- there is no evidence that it has any effect on blood sugar in cats).

Young Again Zero *is* low glycemic, unlike the "diabetic" kibbles that your vet may push. It has pretty close to zero effect on my cat's blood sugar, the IAMS salmon wet food that is the only wet food that my cat will eat has more effect on my cat's blood sugar than the Young Again does. The problem with YAZ isn't its glycemic index, it's the laxative effect of the guar gum binder. My cat can't have more than a tablespoon of YAZ per day without dire effects, I've found, so it's at best useful as an occasional treat or supplement or as a treatment for constipation, at least for my cat. Of course, your cat may be different. Cats are weird.

I keep hearing this "dry food is dehydrating" thing, and all I have to say is that it depends on the cat. My cat didn't gain any water weight when I switched him from dry kibble to wet food to get him onto the Catkins diet after he was diagnosed. Remember, water weighs 8 pounds per gallon, and your cat is over 50% water. What that means is that if my 16 pound cat had been only 10% dehydrated, then he should have weighed 1 pound more after I switched him to wet food. But in real life, his weight didn't change at all. HOWEVER: Diarrhea can cause your cat to become dehydrated. Insofar as Young Again causes diarrhea, it can cause your cat to become dehydrated. So I would definitely *not* recommend switching your cat to Young Again as her primary food if it has the same effect on her as it has on my cat.

As far as the treats, I found some freeze dried chicken breast on Amazon, "PureBites", and that's what I'm using for my treats. My cat loves it. He patiently lets me molest his ears for blood because he knows he's going to get a treat afterwards. It doesn't have any stinky smell as far as I can tell.

Basically: I can't really recommend or not-recommend YA Zero. If your cat will eat wet food, that is by far the best thing for her, because YA contains guar gum and pork proteins that can cause stomach upset in cats. On the other hand, it *is* low glycemic, and *will not* increase your cat's blood sugar more than wet food. If your cat refuses to eat wet food and can tolerate YA, it's an acceptable product for a diabetic cat. Not preferable, but acceptable - it won't make your cat's blood sugar harder to regulate. What I will suggest is that if you are thinking about YA Zero for any reason, get a sample from them and see how your cat tolerates it. If your cat is like my cat and can't tolerate it, spending $30 on a bag of kibble that your cat can't eat is the last thing you want to do. And if your cat will tolerate wet food that's preferable both on an availability basis and on a digestive basis -- even in cats that tolerate YAZ well, the large amount of soluble guar gum fiber that your cat gets with YAZ may cause some degree of digestive upset.
 
Badtux said:
Young Again Zero *is* low glycemic, unlike the "diabetic" kibbles that your vet may push. It has pretty close to zero effect on my cat's blood sugar, the IAMS salmon wet food that is the only wet food that my cat will eat has more effect on my cat's blood sugar than the Young Again does. The problem with YAZ isn't its glycemic index, it's the laxative effect of the guar gum binder. My cat can't have more than a tablespoon of YAZ per day without dire effects, I've found, so it's at best useful as an occasional treat or supplement or as a treatment for constipation, at least for my cat. Of course, your cat may be different. Cats are weird.
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I admit, I didn't take a close look at the ingredients for the YA, and you're right, it is does seem to be lower glycemic than some of the other "low carb" dry foods. However, I have had experience with some cats where even this food does spike their blood sugar. Just last year I was helping out with a cat that ended up needing insulin again when their owner started them on the YA, and went right back off it when they changed them back to canned food. Of course, one anecdote is just that, but there wasn't concurrent GI upset or infection going on so I don't know what else the problem could have been. I've definitely seen this issue more so with EVO and Epigen dry, which are both also low carb. I've never given YA Zero to Bandit, but he has tried the EVO dry at 8% carbs in the past (not much higher than YA's 5%), and just a small amount pushed him up into the high 200s. I just don't see any reason to risk this sort of effect on a diabetic if it's not necessary. But honestly, this isn't the big concern with the food, as most diabetic cats do handle the food fine. It's the other issues with it.

Badtux said:
I keep hearing this "dry food is dehydrating" thing, and all I have to say is that it depends on the cat. My cat didn't gain any water weight when I switched him from dry kibble to wet food to get him onto the Catkins diet after he was diagnosed. Remember, water weighs 8 pounds per gallon, and your cat is over 50% water. What that means is that if my 16 pound cat had been only 10% dehydrated, then he should have weighed 1 pound more after I switched him to wet food. But in real life, his weight didn't change at all. HOWEVER: Diarrhea can cause your cat to become dehydrated. Insofar as Young Again causes diarrhea, it can cause your cat to become dehydrated. So I would definitely *not* recommend switching your cat to Young Again as her primary food if it has the same effect on her as it has on my cat.
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"Dry food is dehydrating" does not depend on the cat, it's a fact. There are studies that have shown cats on dry diets only take in about half the water content that cats on canned diets do. Cats do not have thirst drives like dogs or people--they never fully make up for the loss of moisture at the water dish. This causes all sorts of problems--constipation, urinary tract disease, and kidney disease. Now, in this case the it would be fed as supplement to canned diet so the negative effects would be lessened but...why even bother at all if your cat will eat canned food? The problem at hand--constipation--would be better solved with supplementing the canned food with some psyllium, which has been proven to be better in helping constipation than guar gaum and even been shown to improve glycemic control in type 2 diabetic humans.
 
Julia & Bandit said:
I admit, I didn't take a close look at the ingredients for the YA, and you're right, it is does seem to be lower glycemic than some of the other "low carb" dry foods. However, I have had experience with some cats where even this food does spike their blood sugar. Just last year I was helping out with a cat that ended up needing insulin again when their owner started them on the YA, and went right back off it when they changed them back to canned food.
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Young Again Zero has less digestible carbs and a lower glycemic index than Young Again. As in, under 1% carbs. You're comparing apples and oranges. Again, I'm *not* recommending Young Again Zero as a cat's primary food because of its digestive effects, amongst other things (guar gum is common in wet cat foods as a gelling agent for pates and such, but the amount in YAZ is pretty much unprecedented in a cat food) but let's be honest here.

"Dry food is dehydrating" does not depend on the cat, it's a fact. There are studies that have shown cats on dry diets only take in about half the water content that cats on canned diets do.
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This shows a complete misunderstanding of science and the meaning of studies. Studies are averages. There is no such thing as an average cat, these are contrary little beasties. I performed the only study that counts on *my* cat -- the scale study. If he was dehydrated on a dry diet he should have gained weight when I switched him to a canned diet because he was a 16 pound cat and water weighs 8 pounds per gallon and cats are around 50% water. So even a 10% dehydration should have caused him to gain 1 pound of water weight after I switched him to wet food. He did not. Ergo, he was not dehydrated. (And given that the way I found out that he was diabetic was because he was drinking water like crazy and urinating like crazy, I call BS on the notion that cats have no thirst drive!).

The problem at hand--constipation--would be better solved with supplementing the canned food with some psyllium, which has been proven to be better in helping constipation than guar gaum and even been shown to improve glycemic control in type 2 diabetic humans.
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Guar gum has also been shown to improve glycemic control in type 2 diabetic humans. There is no evidence that either psyllium or guar gum has any effect on glycemic control in diabetic cats though. Given the difference in diet and digestive system between humans and cats, likely there isn't any effect. In any event, there are a significant number of wet cat foods that use guar gum as their geller, so there's no need to feed YAZ as a source of guar gum either.

Again, I'm not recommending Young Again Zero for our diabetic cats for anything other than as a dry kibble for use as a small-quantity substitute for wet food when neither you nor anybody else is around to feed your cat wet food, or for use when your cat simply won't eat wet food. For our diabetic cats the best food is wet food because it's what works best with their digestive systems compared with the low-glycemic dry foods that I've thus far tested, amongst other things (the stuff used for binders in low-glycemic kibbles tend to have dire digestive effects at least on my own cat). That said, the "dry kibble is evil and will kill your cat" religious extremism becomes annoying after a while. I've had dozens of cats over the years who subsisted just fine on dry food with nary a kidney problem, UTI, constipation problem, etc. amongst them and ended up dying of things completely unrelated to their cat food (cancer, a stroke caused by hyperthyroid disease, etc.), which pretty much contraindicates the entire "dry food is poison!" notion. That said, typical dry kibbles aren't suitable for a diabetic cat for oh so many reasons (their high starch content due to their starch-based binders in particular), and even the low glycemic ones aren't ideal because their alternative binders have dire effects on digestion. Wet food is the best diet for a diabetic cat. I'm willing to admit that reality that's in front of my own two eyes. Some folks, alas, prefer religious arguments instead.
 
Badtux said:
This shows a complete misunderstanding of science and the meaning of studies. Studies are averages. There is no such thing as an average cat, these are contrary little beasties. I performed the only study that counts on *my* cat -- the scale study. If he was dehydrated on a dry diet he should have gained weight when I switched him to a canned diet because he was a 16 pound cat and water weighs 8 pounds per gallon and cats are around 50% water. So even a 10% dehydration should have caused him to gain 1 pound of water weight after I switched him to wet food. He did not. Ergo, he was not dehydrated. (And given that the way I found out that he was diabetic was because he was drinking water like crazy and urinating like crazy, I call BS on the notion that cats have no thirst drive!).
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I just so happen to have a fine grasp on science and the meaning of studies. But thank you, random person on a internet message board whom I've never met before, for your opinion on my ability to evaluate information.

You can't measure dehydration by body weight. Many things, such as muscle mass, body fat percentage, and chronic dehydration can effect a cat's weight and body composition, and water weight can vary daily based on the body's ability to retain and lose water. If you had measured his urine output and concentration over a period of time before and after he was on canned food, then you'd have something to compare to the existing studies, but even so, it doesn't make any sense to make general decisions based on anecdotal evidence or statistical outliers. It's like saying, well, this study shows that smoking is really harmful and causes cancer, but my Great Aunt Matilda smoked until she was 90 and never had any issues, so have at it!

And OF COURSE a diabetic cat is going to drink a lot, polydipsia is a major symptom of the disease. Bandit also drinks like a fish and floods the litter box right now, because he's on a high dose of diuretics. But before the diuretics, he never drank from the dish once he was in remission and on a canned diet. My other younger cat does not drink from the dish at all. But telling my cat versus your cat stories proves nothing; I'd rather look at the studies. Science!

Badtux said:
That said, the "dry kibble is evil and will kill your cat" religious extremism becomes annoying after a while. I've had dozens of cats over the years who subsisted just fine on dry food with nary a kidney problem, UTI, constipation problem, etc. amongst them and ended up dying of things completely unrelated to their cat food (cancer, a stroke caused by hyperthyroid disease, etc.), which pretty much contraindicates the entire "dry food is poison!" notion. That said, typical dry kibbles aren't suitable for a diabetic cat for oh so many reasons (their high starch content due to their starch-based binders in particular), and even the low glycemic ones aren't ideal because their alternative binders have dire effects on digestion. Wet food is the best diet for a diabetic cat. I'm willing to admit that reality that's in front of my own two eyes. Some folks, alas, prefer religious arguments instead.
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I never said dry food is evil and will kill your cat. I said that dry food isn't the healthiest choice, and if your cat will readily eat a diet of canned food, why bother feeding it? I have this opinion because of the studies I've read on the subject, not because I simply "believe" it to be true. I am sharing my opinion with the poster, who I don't think needs dry food in this instance because a laxative/psyllium supplement is a more effective choice. There are better remedies for constipation out there, and a dry diet can contribute to constipation. I don't even think you disagree, so I'm confused on why you're arguing with me?
 
Julia & Bandit said:
You can give freeze-dried treats throughout the day for treats. Not sure what you mean by them being "rich"? Do you mean they are too expensive? I could give you links for some lower cost ones...

Is she underweight? What canned foods are you giving her and how many times a day are you feeding her? If she needs to gain weight, a higher calorie canned food would be more effective for weight gain then giving her kibble. I could give you a few suggestions Or, you could increase the number of calories she's getting with the canned food she's currently eating by increasing the number of meals.

Congrats on getting your second test!!!!:cat: Testing starts out hard, but you'll become a pro at it in no time. Bandit had me in tears when we first started testing, he was so difficult. 9 years later, he sits and purrs through the whole test like nothing's even happening.
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If you have suggestions on a high calorie wet food (non-pate) I'd be interested. She's never been a food hound and I'm still not happy with her food intake.
 
Marylou and Malika said:
If you have suggestions on a high calorie wet food (non-pate) I'd be interested. She's never been a food hound and I'm still not happy with her food intake.
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My go to for is usually wellness core turkey, chicken and liver, and wellness core turkey and duck. They're both about 115 calories per 3 oz can. The regular wellness pates are a little lower since they changed the formulas in July, but they're still around 90 calories per 3 oz. If Bandit's being picky with it because he's not feeling well for whatever reason, I sometimes mix it with a little fancy feast (like a quarter of a can) to get him to eat it all, but most of the time he is good with the wellness core.

Edit: I just saw you need non pate... that's a bit trickier because they are usually lower, but let me take a look tomorrow and see what I can find.
 
@Marylou and Malika, I'm sorry it took me so long to get back to you--it's been a crazy couple weeks for me.

So, the only foods I can think of that are not pates that might be a bit higher in calories than what you're doing is some of the Weruva "Cats in the Kitchen" varieties. Chicken Frick A Zee, Fowl Bowl, and La Isla Bonita are all around 80-90 calories per 3 oz. Lamb Burgini is also up there but it's more pate-like than the others. The Weruva Truluxe Glam N Punk is also higher in calories but the lamb part is similar to a pate, but it has duck chunks in it so maybe she'll eat it still?

Hope that helps.
 
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