New here. I have a few questions!

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mattm1124

mattm1124

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Hello everyone!

My cat Oreo was just diagnosed with diabetes on 12/16/17 with a reading of 427. She is about 9 years old, not sure on exact age because we took her in as a stray 2 years ago and the vet at that point thought she was around 7. I have been reading through the forums but just wanted to post my specific questions here so they were easy to find. First took her to the vet when she started drinking a lot more and of course urinating more. Since she has been on ProZinc, she has been drinking less and urinating less.

The vet gave us ProZinc and we give Oreo 2.2 units every 12 hours. Once around 5 AM while she's eating and then again around 5 PM while she's eating. The shots have been pretty on time so far. I have a few questions which I'll list below, but please give me any other useful information I may be missing.

1. I want to know if we are feeding Oreo enough and if we should change to more wet food. I've read wet is overall better. The vet gave us the food but wondering if there are better options. Right now we are feeding her 1/4 cup dry food in the morning, at 5PM we feed her wet food (the can is 5.5 oz and we feed her 2 spoonfuls which is 1/5 of the can each night so about 1-1.5 oz), and then we feed her 1/8 cup of dry food over night or she'll bother us. The wet food is PURINA - Pro Plan Veterinary Diets DM and the dry food I believe is the same kind, just dry. I'll have to call the vet and find out. I threw the package away after putting the food into a container not thinking. Also, with the wet food it's stored in the cupboard but after it's open, we keep it in the fridge until it's gone.

2. We are supposed to take Oreo back for an insulin curve but I have been reading about the benefits of home monitoring. Would it be a bad idea to at least have the vet do the initial curve?

3. I saw in another thread most people use the Bayer Elite Glucose Meter. When I clicked the link, that one wasn't listed there but I found it on Ebay. Are their other good meters?

4. What should Oreo's glucose readings be? What is normal?

Thank you all in advance and I have attached a few pics of Oreo, as well as the can of wet food we now use.
 

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Hello, and welcome! Some of your questions, I do not have enough experience/knowledge to address, but I can speak to the meter. Many of the members use the ReliOn meter from Wal-Mart. The strips are reasonable, it’s an accurate meter, and it uses a small sample size.
Regarding the food, prescription diets are often more expensive and much higher in carbs than a diabetic cat should have. The pate versions of both Fancy Feast or Friskies are fed by a pretty large majority of the people here with great success. If you haven’t yet looked at it, Dr Lisa has a link to a food comparison chart on the main health forum. I have it bookmarked, and anytime I am looking for a new food as a treat or just a change, I always reference this.

I will defer to other members to advise on recommended calorie needs of cats, as I do not have the specifics available right now.

Oreo is a cutie!
 
Hi and Welcome! Sounds like you're already doing a great job of getting started! And those pictures are absolutely adorable!!!

Okay, here are some responses to your questions and a whole bunch of other info. I hope I don't overwhelm you....one step at a time...

1. Has Orea lost weight? Is she at a healthy weight? Underweight? Overweight? Calorie needs really depend on the cat. Most cats lose weight prior to diagnosis and need lots of food at the beginning because while they aren't getting/making enough insulin, the can't use the nutrients well. But it really does depend on if she needs to gain or lose right now. In general we say to feed them as much as they want at the beginning - unless she is heavy. The wet DM is 10% carbs which is the max recommended for a diabetic cat - lower is better. The DM dry is 18% carbs - way too high for a diabetic cat. If you can, I would recommend getting her off of the dry as soon as you can - but not before you are monitoring BG at home. Changing food can lead to changing BG rather quickly - so you want to make sure you are testing BG at home to keep her safe. There is a food list in my signature that can help you find foods that are appropriate for Oreo. Most of us stay around 0-6% carbs, but anything below 10% is okay.

2. It doesn't hurt to have the vet do the curve - except to your wallet. The biggest problem is that the results aren't that helpful. Most cats are stressed at the vet which means their blood glucose (BG) numbers are higher than they would be at home. Then the vet uses those higher-than-normal numbers to tell you how much insulin to give - which is then too much insulin once you get home. So while you certainly can have the vet do the curve, you'll need to be very careful about how you decide to use the information the vet gives you.

3. At this point, most folks are using the ReliOn meters from WalMart because the strips are so cheap. I used the store brand meter from my local pharmacy for a long time, and when that died, I went to this one: https://www.adwdiabetes.com/product...ose-test-strips-lancets-and-free-presto-meter because I like online ordering and don't have a WalMart near me.

4. Normal BG for a cat using a human meter is 50-120, with most cats running between 50-80

Now on to a few other things.

5. Get a spreadsheet set up as soon as you can so you can keep track of the BG numbers you get. The spreadsheet color codes automatically and helps with finding patterns in Oreo's responses. http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/fdmb-spreadsheet-instructions.130337/ Let us know if you need any help with that part.

6. Start your signature with all of the key info: cat's name, age, weight, date of diagnosis, food, insulin type, meter type, any other health issues, anything you want us to know so we don't keep asking the same questions over and over (we have terrible memories :))

7. When you start testing, you'll want to test before every shot, and mid-cycle tests whenever you can. The mid-cycle tests are really helpful so you can judge if the dose is working, too much, or too little. Nadir on Prozinc is usually somewhere around +4 to +7 hours after the shot is given, but every cat is different - mine has typically hit nadir around +3, I've seen a kitty here who usually hit around +9. And of course the nadir can move from day to day based on activity, food, stress, etc., although most cats will have a "typical" time at least.

8. Ketones - one more thing to buy while you're at WalMart - ketone test strips are around $15 - you stick it under your kitty's bum when he/she is peeing and catch a drop, then see if it changes colors. Ketones can develop quickly and are deadly if not caught right away. If your kitty won't let you in the room when using the litter box, we have some tricks we can teach you to get these tests done. Usually once/week is enough or if symptoms pop up.


Okay, that's probably more than enough for now. Please let us know what questions you have as this can be a bit overwhelming in the early days. I promise it gets easier. It will be as routine as brushing your teeth in no time, but the first couple of weeks are tough. We've all been there. We are here to help.
 
Hello! Djamila gave great info so I have nothing more to add, but wanted to say hi and your pictures are adorable! Please let us know if you have more questions for us...we'd be happy to help!
 
Thank you so much for the answers and help! I tried to respond to each question within your question Djamila but it wouldn't let me post that way for some reason. When I tried to quote your post it said it contained spam like content or inappropriate elements.

1. Oreo has lost weight overall. At one point she was around 13 lbs about 2 years ago and we realized she had to lose some weight so we changed her diet and made sure she was playing a lot more. She seemed to be losing weight prior to the diabetes diagnoses. She is now 10 lbs and we think that is a healthy weight. 10 lbs is a good weight correct? As for the food, this may be a dumb question, but how do you figure out Protein, fat, carbs based on the food label? For example, the wet DM on the label says crude protein is 12.5%, crude fat is 4%, fiber is 1%. I'm guessing some math is involved but I'm just not sure how to figure that out. Grocery stores don't seem to have a great selection for foods high in protein but low in carbs. Where do most people buy from? At Walmart though, I found the Meow Mix - Tender favorites Tuna and shrimp and based on your chart it appears to be a good one to use. Is that correct? I have a lot of the DM cans left, do you think it's ok to finish them and then switch or would you recommend going to a lower carb wet food right away also? I also heard in the past that fish type foods weren't always good to serve and chicken/turkey was better?

2. This makes a lot of sense. I don't want to stress her out any more than she needs to be but doing all this testing seems overwhelming at first. But I want to do what's in her best interest obviously.

3. At Walmart today, I picked up a ReliOn Prime GC meter, 50 test strips, and lancing device. I am still a little nercous about doing this at home but let me make sure I have this correct. I first use the lancer to prick her ear and then use the meter to test? I don't think she'll sit still and let us lance her ear. She's good with shots because while she's eating we give it to her. Is there not a device that I just stick to her ear and it automatically pricks, instead of a single needle I have to use? Maybe it's really easy but obviously never having done it, it seems hard. Also, I read that I need to call the number and have them send me the control solution to make sure the meter is accurate. Should I wait to test anything until I get the solution. Also, should I wait to start testing when I can be home for the whole day?

5. Once I start testing, I will definitely get this set up!

8. I picked up the ketones testing strips also and she should let me test this without any issues.
 
Vader723 said:
Hello, and welcome! Some of your questions, I do not have enough experience/knowledge to address, but I can speak to the meter. Many of the members use the ReliOn meter from Wal-Mart. The strips are reasonable, it’s an accurate meter, and it uses a small sample size.
Regarding the food, prescription diets are often more expensive and much higher in carbs than a diabetic cat should have. The pate versions of both Fancy Feast or Friskies are fed by a pretty large majority of the people here with great success. If you haven’t yet looked at it, Dr Lisa has a link to a food comparison chart on the main health forum. I have it bookmarked, and anytime I am looking for a new food as a treat or just a change, I always reference this.

I will defer to other members to advise on recommended calorie needs of cats, as I do not have the specifics available right now.

Oreo is a cutie!
Click to expand...

I appreciate that and the help!
 
Hi! Let me see if can get some of your questions answered:

1. Here's a link to the Food Chart we use. It has a ton of different brands of food on there and you can find all the info on nutrition that you should need. If a brand isn't on there, you'd have to contact the company to find out that info. Most of us get our food from either a pet store (PetSmart, PetCo, etc) or from an online source like chewy.com. I used to order from chewy before I started making food.

As for what to feed, I wouldn't switch from the DM until you start home testing and feel comfortable with it. They can drop BG dramatically overnight with new food so you want to be sure you are okay testing first. Then you might want to introduce the new food slowly....mixing it into the old food. That'll help reduce any tummy upset. However, once you've got them on new food I'd just return the DM you have left. Tell them your cat stopped eating it if you want...a lot of cats won't eat it long term.

Fish is okay, but not too often. Many feed it once a week or so. It can have high levels of mercury and some cats will get hooked on fish and refuse to eat anything else. I don't feed any to my cats due to other issues that fish can make worse.

3. Yes! Use the lancet to prick her ear and then put the blood drop on the strip that you inserted into the meter. You might want to try it on yourself once or twice to get the hang of it...and don't worry about the pain. It hurts US in the fingertip but really, it doesn't hurt the cats as much. We have tons of nerve endings in our fingers but they don't have that many in their ears. Might want to youtube a few videos first too...that helps you to really see what to do. You can use the lancet device if you want...where you put it against her ear and press a button and it pricks but most of us find it doesnt work well and the noise can scare the cats. I found it easier to use the lancet myself and freehand it. Whatever works for you is fine!

I never used control solution with my relion. I didn't know they had it. I think it should be fine...anyone else know about that?

I'd start testing right now! Why wait? It'll help you get used to it before trying to do a whole day curve. :)
 
Rachel said:
Hi! Let me see if can get some of your questions answered:

1. Here's a link to the Food Chart we use. It has a ton of different brands of food on there and you can find all the info on nutrition that you should need. If a brand isn't on there, you'd have to contact the company to find out that info. Most of us get our food from either a pet store (PetSmart, PetCo, etc) or from an online source like chewy.com. I used to order from chewy before I started making food.

As for what to feed, I wouldn't switch from the DM until you start home testing and feel comfortable with it. They can drop BG dramatically overnight with new food so you want to be sure you are okay testing first. Then you might want to introduce the new food slowly....mixing it into the old food. That'll help reduce any tummy upset. However, once you've got them on new food I'd just return the DM you have left. Tell them your cat stopped eating it if you want...a lot of cats won't eat it long term.

Fish is okay, but not too often. Many feed it once a week or so. It can have high levels of mercury and some cats will get hooked on fish and refuse to eat anything else. I don't feed any to my cats due to other issues that fish can make worse.

3. Yes! Use the lancet to prick her ear and then put the blood drop on the strip that you inserted into the meter. You might want to try it on yourself once or twice to get the hang of it...and don't worry about the pain. It hurts US in the fingertip but really, it doesn't hurt the cats as much. We have tons of nerve endings in our fingers but they don't have that many in their ears. Might want to youtube a few videos first too...that helps you to really see what to do. You can use the lancet device if you want...where you put it against her ear and press a button and it pricks but most of us find it doesnt work well and the noise can scare the cats. I found it easier to use the lancet myself and freehand it. Whatever works for you is fine!

I never used control solution with my relion. I didn't know they had it. I think it should be fine...anyone else know about that?

I'd start testing right now! Why wait? It'll help you get used to it before trying to do a whole day curve. :)
Click to expand...

Thank you for the information Rachel! Actually, when the vet gave us the new food, we did just switch all at once, not knowing we should do it gradually. Luckily Oreo seemed fine with it.

I'm still not quite understanding where the numbers on that chart are coming from though. On the Chart, the DM Savory Selects has a content of 49 Protein, 40 Fat, and 10 Carbs. I'm assuming those are percentages. When I look at the can though, how do you get the 49,40,10 on the chart from the can that says: Protein (min) 12.5%, Fat (min) 4%, Fiber (max) 1%, Moisture (max) 77%, Taurine (min) 0.05%.

Would you be able to send me a few links to appropriate wet foods from Petco, Petsmart, or even Chewy that would be great for Oreo to be eating? I feel like when I look at the chart and then search for the food, I can't find the specific one.

I'll probably watch a few more videos and then give the meter a try!

Thanks again.
 
mattm1124 said:
Thank you for the information Rachel! Actually, when the vet gave us the new food, we did just switch all at once, not knowing we should do it gradually. Luckily Oreo seemed fine with it.

I'm still not quite understanding where the numbers on that chart are coming from though. On the Chart, the DM Savory Selects has a content of 49 Protein, 40 Fat, and 10 Carbs. I'm assuming those are percentages. When I look at the can though, how do you get the 49,40,10 on the chart from the can that says: Protein (min) 12.5%, Fat (min) 4%, Fiber (max) 1%, Moisture (max) 77%, Taurine (min) 0.05%.

Would you be able to send me a few links to appropriate wet foods from Petco, Petsmart, or even Chewy that would be great for Oreo to be eating? I feel like when I look at the chart and then search for the food, I can't find the specific one.

I'll probably watch a few more videos and then give the meter a try!

Thanks again.
Click to expand...
I can tell you that ProPlan DM Savory Selects is about 10% carbs as fed and the ProPlan DM pate is about 6% carbs as fed. I asked to see the product info sheet when I was at my vet's quite a while ago.
 
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Here is a link for understanding the spreadsheet. You might also find it helpful to click on a few or ours (in our signatures) to see how they look. You don't have to test as often as some of us do, so don't be scared off!

http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/understanding-the-spreadsheet-grid.156606/

And here is a link with some pictures and videos to show you how to test:
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/hometesting-links-and-tips.287/

We have loads and loads of tips and tricks for overcoming the struggles in the beginning, so give it a try and let us know what worked and what didn't for you and we can help you problem solve. It doesn't always go perfectly the first time, so don't let it stress you out. We're here to help! :bighug:
 
Oh, and about the food calculations - you can't figure it out from the labels. The labels have minimum and maximum values for different things, so it might have a max of 48% protein, but it might also only have 20% - the companies won't put the real values on the label - which means you can't know for sure. The numbers in the food chart were gained by writing to the companies and getting the actual values. Many companies will tell you - but only if you ask for it. Some companies won't - and they are not included in the list for that reason.

Most folks around here just feed Fancy Feast Classic pate styles, or Friskies pates. They are low carb, inexpensive, and easy to find in just about any grocery store. As you can see from the list, there are lots of other good choices as well - those are just the most convenient.
 
mattm1124 said:
Thank you for the information Rachel! Actually, when the vet gave us the new food, we did just switch all at once, not knowing we should do it gradually. Luckily Oreo seemed fine with it.

I'm still not quite understanding where the numbers on that chart are coming from though. On the Chart, the DM Savory Selects has a content of 49 Protein, 40 Fat, and 10 Carbs. I'm assuming those are percentages. When I look at the can though, how do you get the 49,40,10 on the chart from the can that says: Protein (min) 12.5%, Fat (min) 4%, Fiber (max) 1%, Moisture (max) 77%, Taurine (min) 0.05%.

Would you be able to send me a few links to appropriate wet foods from Petco, Petsmart, or even Chewy that would be great for Oreo to be eating? I feel like when I look at the chart and then search for the food, I can't find the specific one.

I'll probably watch a few more videos and then give the meter a try!

Thanks again.
Click to expand...
Dr. P painstakingly over the course of months contacted each company to get the "as fed" values. There are apps that claim to do the calculations but none of them are accurate.

I have a video in my signature showing how I test my cat CC. It's not as hard as you would think. The whole thing takes all of 30 seconds each time. Giving your cat a favorite low can treat that she only gets for a test will quickly make her grow to tolerate and even look forward to the tests. As you can see she's purring in the video. The first two weeks she wasn't nearly as happy about it. Lol
 
Agree with @JanetNJ about the food. Dr. Lisa put in a ton of time and research into putting together her chart. There are a few brands that weren’t helpful or that she feels are outright unhealthy for cats, and if you look at her pdf version she will note these by the name of the brand. The carbs column is indeed percentages, and you want to stay at less than 10%. Most of the time pate versions of food are within this range, but not always, so you may want to reference the chart until you become familiar with the brands and flavors that meet not just the carb threshold but also the approval of your feline overlord :) You can pick up cans of Fancy Feast or Friskies pate at Walmart, Target, or pretty much any grocery store.
 
Thank you so much for the information! We tried to test Oreo today but her ear wouldn't bleed. We used the lancet device after rubbing her ear for a bit.

We are going to try again later. We currently don't have rice to put in a sock which I've seen suggested. Can we try a microwavable heating pad to warm her ear up? Also, if the lancet device doesn't work, I guess we'll try freehand with the needle.

Rachel said:
Hi! Let me see if can get some of your questions answered:

1. Here's a link to the Food Chart we use. It has a ton of different brands of food on there and you can find all the info on nutrition that you should need. If a brand isn't on there, you'd have to contact the company to find out that info. Most of us get our food from either a pet store (PetSmart, PetCo, etc) or from an online source like chewy.com. I used to order from chewy before I started making food.

As for what to feed, I wouldn't switch from the DM until you start home testing and feel comfortable with it. They can drop BG dramatically overnight with new food so you want to be sure you are okay testing first. Then you might want to introduce the new food slowly....mixing it into the old food. That'll help reduce any tummy upset. However, once you've got them on new food I'd just return the DM you have left. Tell them your cat stopped eating it if you want...a lot of cats won't eat it long term.

Fish is okay, but not too often. Many feed it once a week or so. It can have high levels of mercury and some cats will get hooked on fish and refuse to eat anything else. I don't feed any to my cats due to other issues that fish can make worse.

3. Yes! Use the lancet to prick her ear and then put the blood drop on the strip that you inserted into the meter. You might want to try it on yourself once or twice to get the hang of it...and don't worry about the pain. It hurts US in the fingertip but really, it doesn't hurt the cats as much. We have tons of nerve endings in our fingers but they don't have that many in their ears. Might want to youtube a few videos first too...that helps you to really see what to do. You can use the lancet device if you want...where you put it against her ear and press a button and it pricks but most of us find it doesnt work well and the noise can scare the cats. I found it easier to use the lancet myself and freehand it. Whatever works for you is fine!

I never used control solution with my relion. I didn't know they had it. I think it should be fine...anyone else know about that?

I'd start testing right now! Why wait? It'll help you get used to it before trying to do a whole day curve. :)
Click to expand...
 
mattm1124 said:
Thank you so much for the information! We tried to test Oreo today but her ear wouldn't bleed. We used the lancet device after rubbing her ear for a bit.

We are going to try again later. We currently don't have rice to put in a sock which I've seen suggested. Can we try a microwavable heating pad to warm her ear up? Also, if the lancet device doesn't work, I guess we'll try freehand with the needle.
Click to expand...
I'd you are using a 31 gauge lancet that might be the problem. Get some 26-28 gauge lancets. Don't be afraid to poke all the way through.
 
You mentioned not having rice -- you can also use uncooked popcorn or flaxseed if you happen to have either of those. You only heat it for somewhere around 20 seconds for most microwaves, so the popcorn won't start popping ;)
 
Another option is an empty pill bottle...you can fill it with warm water from the sink.

Djamila said:
You mentioned not having rice -- you can also use uncooked popcorn or flaxseed if you happen to have either of those. You only heat it for somewhere around 20 seconds for most microwaves, so the popcorn won't start popping ;)
Click to expand...

And if the popcorn DOES start popping...just means you have a nice snack for after, right????
 
Ok, We just tested Oreo for the first time with the ReliON Prime meter from Walmart. We had struggles to get blood in the past couple days as you know, but today we warmed up a sock of rice and it worked.

We fed her at 5 PM and also gave her 2.2 units of ProZinc Insulin. We then tested her BG at 6:45 PM and her reading was 103.

With this being a "human" meter is the 103 a good test? What are the ranges I should be looking for again? Oreo has not had an insulin curve yet since she was just recently diagnosed but now that we had a successful test, we hope to do the curve this weekend when we can be home all day.

I know we'll have to get a spreadsheet started also.

Thanks for any advice and if the 103 is a good start.

Djamila said:
You mentioned not having rice -- you can also use uncooked popcorn or flaxseed if you happen to have either of those. You only heat it for somewhere around 20 seconds for most microwaves, so the popcorn won't start popping ;)
Click to expand...
 
Thank you for this. We were using 30 gauge and didn't realize so we bought the 28 gauges this past weekend!

JanetNJ said:
I'd you are using a 31 gauge lancet that might be the problem. Get some 26-28 gauge lancets. Don't be afraid to poke all the way through.
Click to expand...
 
Whew! That 103 is a nice number but it's a bit low for only 1.75 hours after her shot. ProZinc usually reaches its peak action (where BG will be lowest) around 5 to 7 hours after the injection. I think you'll have to practice some more testing this evening. I suggest testing again at the 3 hour mark and posting the result here. It's possible that the 2.2 u dose is a bit too high.
 
First of all, congratulations on getting the test!!! So glad to hear that warming and using the 28's helped.

Now for the bad news - I agree with Kris - that is a bit low for so early in the cycle and it makes me a little nervous about where Oreo might be heading tonight. If she gets below 50, you'll want to take some action to keep her safe as that is getting into hypo territory.

So 103 is a great number, but with 2.2u, there is some risk with that number at less than two hours into a 12 hour cycle. Hopefully she'll float along and stay above 50, but please do try to get in another test tonight.
 
mattm1124 said:
With this being a "human" meter is the 103 a good test? What are the ranges I should be looking for again?
Click to expand...
Normal reference range for cat BG as measured on a human meter is 50-120mg/dL.

Good catch on that 103 so early in the cycle! :)


Mogs
.
 
Ok, we just tested her again 3 hours past her insulin shot (2.2 units) and she is at 48. We have been giving her 2.2 U since December 19th at 5 AM after she eats and 5 PM after she eats. From the symptoms we've look up of Hypoglycemia she has not shown any of them since we have been giving her the 2.2 U. This is obviously the first time we've been able to test though. She will also play if we take out the laser pointer. What do you all suggest with the numbers given tonight and her not showing any signs of HYPO since December 19th? Do we lower the units given, snack, etc?

Thanks!

Kris & Teasel said:
Whew! That 103 is a nice number but it's a bit low for only 1.75 hours after her shot. ProZinc usually reaches its peak action (where BG will be lowest) around 5 to 7 hours after the injection. I think you'll have to practice some more testing this evening. I suggest testing again at the 3 hour mark and posting the result here. It's possible that the 2.2 u dose is a bit too high.
Click to expand...
 
Yes, lower the units, and yes, give a snack.:) Since she's only at +3, she is quite likely to go lower still, which means you'll need to be careful with the snack - yuou don't want her to fill up and refuse to eat later. What foods do you have at home? Let's see what carb levels you have to work with and we can try to help figure out the best way to manage the next little bit. Also, how long until your bedtime?
 
PS - most cats are still fine at 48, so no need to panic - we just want to intervene at this point so she doesn't drop much lower. The lowest point on Prozinc is usually around +5-+7, so the insulin might still be pushing her down for a couple of more hours.
 
Thank you so much for the information and help! We actually give her an 1/8 cup of dry food (Purina DM) at 9 PM (4 hours post shot) every night or else she will bother us all night. I'm guessing that's what helps with the BG going up some each night and allow her not to go into hypo. So instead of 2.2 units tomorrow morning do you think we give only 2? We will also try and test her BG before the shot tomorrow morning. What's a good number to aim for tomorrow morning pre-shot?

Oreo usually heads off to bed after she eats her snack but I'm up for awhile after that. I can try and test her again tonight but how long after she eats at 9 PM would be good to test?

PS. I'm setting up my chart on Google sheets now but when I put in the +1, +2, etc the + disappears unless I put it like .+1. How did you get yours to only show the + and number?

Djamila said:
Yes, lower the units, and yes, give a snack.:) Since she's only at +3, she is quite likely to go lower still, which means you'll need to be careful with the snack - yuou don't want her to fill up and refuse to eat later. What foods do you have at home? Let's see what carb levels you have to work with and we can try to help figure out the best way to manage the next little bit. Also, how long until your bedtime?
Click to expand...
 
Okay, so you have DM dry and wet? Go ahead and give her a tablespoon of the dry. I'll respond to the rest in a minute, but want her to get some carbs and not wait for me to finish typing :)
 
mattm1124 said:
Thank you so much for the information and help! We actually give her an 1/8 cup of dry food (Purina DM) at 9 PM (4 hours post shot) every night or else she will bother us all night. I'm guessing that's what helps with the BG going up some each night and allow her not to go into hypo. So instead of 2.2 units tomorrow morning do you think we give only 2? We will also try and test her BG before the shot tomorrow morning. What's a good number to aim for tomorrow morning pre-shot?

Oreo usually heads off to bed after she eats her snack but I'm up for awhile after that. I can try and test her again tonight but how long after she eats at 9 PM would be good to test?

PS. I'm setting up my chart on Google sheets now but when I put in the +1, +2, etc the + disappears unless I put it like .+1. How did you get yours to only show the + and number?
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you aren't using the template we have?
 
So let's see if I have this right....(my memory gets fuzzy sometimes ;))

You have been giving her 2.2u for a couple of weeks now, but tonight is the first home test? I would recommend dropping the next shot down to 1u and start testing before each shot. There are two possible reasons for the low number tonight. The most likely reason is that she's getting too much insulin. The other possibility is that she is still eating high carb food, and that can cause erratic numbers.

However, based on what you said about needing to feed her at night or she drives you crazy, that can be an indication of low numbers, so my guess is that she's on too high of a dose.

Oh geez! And I meant to say to give her some wet food. Ah typing! Please go ahead and give her a tablespoon of wet food too. It absorbs a bit faster.
 
In regards to the spreadsheet? I am, and it looks the same as the one's I've seen on here. I'm just trying to get the +1, +2 on the sheet. Every time the plus before the number disappears though. I know that's not a big thing but it bothers me!

JanetNJ said:
you aren't using the template we have?
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After you've given her the snack, wait about a half hour and test again. Hopefully she'll be holding steady or rising a bit by then.

Also, do you happen to have any of those soft treats? Like Temptations or similar? Those are super high carb.
 
You are correct. Honestly though, before she had diabetes, she would bother us at night if she didn't eat so that's pretty normal for her. Once she eats the 9 PM snack, she's fine until morning. This didn't just start when she was diagnosed. Also, we've tried to feed her only wet food, but she doesn't like it. The times we have tried, she seems out of it and it takes her a long time to eat. She only seems ok when we feed her dry food but then wet for dinner. I know from reading wet is a lot better, but she won't seem to only eat wet food.

UPDATE: She just finished her snack which was dry and she's now playing with her ball as usual and seems fine like always. Obviously I want her to feel the best she can.

Djamila said:
So let's see if I have this right....(my memory gets fuzzy sometimes ;))

You have been giving her 2.2u for a couple of weeks now, but tonight is the first home test? I would recommend dropping the next shot down to 1u and start testing before each shot. There are two possible reasons for the low number tonight. The most likely reason is that she's getting too much insulin. The other possibility is that she is still eating high carb food, and that can cause erratic numbers.

However, based on what you said about needing to feed her at night or she drives you crazy, that can be an indication of low numbers, so my guess is that she's on too high of a dose.

Oh geez! And I meant to say to give her some wet food. Ah typing! Please go ahead and give her a tablespoon of wet food too. It absorbs a bit faster.
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Most kitties don't show symptoms until they get really low. All of this testing and snacking is just in service of keeping her away from the dangerous lows.

That makes sense that the nighttime snack is just her habit. I like a bedtime snack too :D.

Have you tried Young Again Zero Carb? It can be ordered online and lots of folks around here use it if they can't get their cats off of kibble. It's lower in digestible carbs than any other kibble, so for most cats it doesn't mess with their BG as much. It's expensive, but most cats only eat about 1/4c per day (and less if it's just fed as a snack) so apparently a bag lasts a long time.
 
Thanks, I'll definitely look into that food. She ate at 9 so I'm planning on testing her in about 8 minutes or so.

I doubt this will happen but I want to be prepared. Say we test her tomorrow morning at 5 AM and her BG is within normal range 50-120. What should we do then?

Djamila said:
Most kitties don't show symptoms until they get really low. All of this testing and snacking is just in service of keeping her away from the dangerous lows.

That makes sense that the nighttime snack is just her habit. I like a bedtime snack too :D.

Have you tried Young Again Zero Carb? It can be ordered online and lots of folks around here use it if they can't get their cats off of kibble. It's lower in digestible carbs than any other kibble, so for most cats it doesn't mess with their BG as much. It's expensive, but most cats only eat about 1/4c per day (and less if it's just fed as a snack) so apparently a bag lasts a long time.
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If she is under 200, don't give her any insulin. As you collect more data you can give her insulin at lower numbers, but at this point I would error on the side of caution. Her liver is going to need a little time to recover from this.

More likely though, she'll be high tomorrow. Usually after a low number they'll bounce a bit (go up higher). Even if she's high tomorrow though, I would still recommend reducing the dose. She went low early in the cycle, so she needs a big reduction.
 
Once again, thank you for the help. We just tested her again, 30 mins after her snack and her BG was 53. She climbed a little from the 48.

We will test in the morning and sounds good on reducing her insulin down from 2.2. Did you say how many units you recommend giving her tomorrow? I know that would overall depend on her BG but probably won't have time to post her number and then get a response that early and before heading to work.

Thanks.

Djamila said:
If she is under 200, don't give her any insulin. As you collect more data you can give her insulin at lower numbers, but at this point I would error on the side of caution. Her liver is going to need a little time to recover from this.

More likely though, she'll be high tomorrow. Usually after a low number they'll bounce a bit (go up higher). Even if she's high tomorrow though, I would still recommend reducing the dose. She went low early in the cycle, so she needs a big reduction.
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Oops. we cross posted. Before you sign off....how many hours post-injection are you now? She is still really too low to leave her alone yet.

She is going to need you to keep giving her more snacks and another test to make sure she doesn't drop still.
 
mattm1124 said:
Once again, thank you for the help. We just tested her again, 30 mins after her snack and her BG was 53. She climbed a little from the 48.

We will test in the morning and sounds good on reducing her insulin down from 2.2. Did you say how many units you recommend giving her tomorrow? I know that would overall depend on her BG but probably won't have time to post her number and then get a response that early and before heading to work.

Thanks.
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Djamila recommended a dose of 1 unit in post #33 above. I agree with that.
 
Are you at +5 right now? Do you have any other cats? If you leave out food will she graze or inhale it all? If I'm right that it's +5 and you need to go to sleep, I think at this point you could just leave her a good helping of the DM Savory and go to bed. That's high enough in carbs that she could steer herself if she needs to. Although if she tries to wake you up, pay attention - cats are known to wake up their human when they get too low. Clever little critters. :cat:
 
We are at +5 right now. Oreo is the only cat we have and typically if we leave any food out she inhales it.

She's actually really good after she eats her 9 PM snack. She does start to wake us up around 4:45 - 5AM which is when we feed her anyways. We will keep an eye on her though for sure and if she trys to get us up earlier this in the morning, we'll know why.

Thanks again for all the help tonight everyone!

Djamila said:
Are you at +5 right now? Do you have any other cats? If you leave out food will she graze or inhale it all? If I'm right that it's +5 and you need to go to sleep, I think at this point you could just leave her a good helping of the DM Savory and go to bed. That's high enough in carbs that she could steer herself if she needs to. Although if she tries to wake you up, pay attention - cats are known to wake up their human when they get too low. Clever little critters. :cat:
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Good morning! So we just tested Oreo and she was at 95 BG AMPS. We obviously didn't give her a shot. We're going to test her again in a couple hours before we leave for work.

I'm hoping that number is correct and we don't have a faulty meter or something.

Djamila said:
Are you at +5 right now? Do you have any other cats? If you leave out food will she graze or inhale it all? If I'm right that it's +5 and you need to go to sleep, I think at this point you could just leave her a good helping of the DM Savory and go to bed. That's high enough in carbs that she could steer herself if she needs to. Although if she tries to wake you up, pay attention - cats are known to wake up their human when they get too low. Clever little critters. :cat:
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