Trembling/Shivering at normal levels?

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AVD

Member Since 2017
Hello.

My cat Jack is 12 years old and until 2-3 months ago was acting normal. In March, he started acting lethargic and a blood test revealed very high glucose numbers - 600. A fructosamine test confirmed he had diabetes.

I started giving him his 1 IU injections of ProZinc twice a day and started doing a lot of research (including this forum - thank you). After a few weeks his numbers were not improving so I purchased an AlphaTrak monitor to test his blood twice a day before injections and found a "natural" higher meat protein diet for him.

Fast forward to last night. We are up to 3 IU twice per day and his numbers are doing better keeping it under 300 most of the time.

Last night his numbers were, what I thought, a respectable 152 (which in theory is in the normal range).

But, before I gave him his shot I noticed he was trembling/shivering which potentially indicates the initial stages of hypoglycemia. So, I did not give him his shot, just his food and he stopped trembling about 10 minutes later. At 3 hours later his numbers were at 400. His normal dip in numbers is about the 5 hour mark so I did not give him a shot last night.

This morning (12 hours later) he was at 639.

My thought is since his body has been used to such high numbers for at least the past 2+ months, it thought it was way too low and could have actually been heading towards hypoglycemia.

I would appreciate any thoughts you might have.

Thanks.
 
Well, that is a possibility.

At 6:00 a.m. yesterday morning he was at 228 before eating. Knowing that his numbers would rise I still gave him his 3 IU shot of ProZinc. Based on his previous curves he most likely would have risen to about 400 but could have dropped to 100 or so during his low point and then come up to 152 at the 12 hour mark.

I did not notice any shivering or other issue but I didn't watch him all day.

From 639 this morning I think he will drop to 300 at the low point and back to 400+ this evening.

Thanks. :)
 
Welcome AVD and Jack :bighug:
Glad to hear you are home testing. Most important tests are the AMPS and PMPS (morning / evening pre-shot) which it sounds like you are doing. One thing to add is make sure he has not eaten 2 hours prior to the pre-shot test so the BG number is not food influenced. If you are open to setting up a spreadsheet and sharing Jack's numbers with us, we could help understand what his doses are doing. Just need a google account, if you need help setting it up just ask: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/fdmb-spreadsheet-instructions.130337/

Setting up your Signature with some information is helpful to those of us with bad memories and gives a quick "snapshot" if you make other threads/posts. http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/editing-your-signature-profile-and-preferences.130340/

And I like to give this to new members, better to be prepared: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/how-to-treat-hypos-they-can-kill-print-this-out.15887/

Last few things here,
  1. What brand and flavour food is his "natural" higher protein? Want to make sure they are low carb as well.
  2. What was his starting dose?
  3. When was each increase to get you to 3.0U?
  4. How much was each increase? (Did you start at 1.0U, then go to 2.0U, and now 3.0U?)
 
Thank you for your detailed response. :) Soooo many questions. :)

1. Testing - yes, I test at least twice a day (morning/night) and he has not eaten before the tests.

2. Signature - I modified my signature to include Jack's basics, let me know if you need more

3. Food - I recently found a "holistic" type vet who believes in western and eastern philosophies (a certified DVM of 25 years) and he has a brand of food (possible private label) that is meat protein based. You can see the details here: https://store.pettao.com/Feline-Diets/feline-harmony-turkey-formula-organic.html

4. Dosage - I started Jack at 1 U twice a day for 4 weeks with no change, moved him to 2.0 U for a couple weeks, 2.5 for the next couple and finally 3 U for the past 2 weeks. I prefer a much slower approach than my "usual" vet's agressive request. I only trust doc's so far and definitely do not have blind faith. Other doc's in the past have given me very bad information that have put some of my cat's on the edge of death due to their ignorance; I have been through a few docs. If they have an attitude when I ask questions (and I ask a lot) then they are out. :)

I live in the country and currently have 8 cats, 3 dogs and 2 chickens. :) Unfortunately all but one of my cats are 12+ years old with one at about 20 years old. He is getting a bit frail, some renal failure and is on k/d but still moving and eating on his own. My youngest cat (8 years old) is just crazy. She thinks her tail is out to get her and attempts to run away from it all over the house. Never seems to work though.... :)

5. Numbers - I do not prefer to use the "cloud" or the google services, however; I have included an image of Jack's numbers.

Thank you for your help and insight.
 

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Yes, I can ask a lot of questions :). Just might want to add that you are using Prozinc insulin and his current dose.

Ok so first increase was aggressive, 100% increase from 1.0U - 2.0U. I tend to bombard doctor's and Vets more so, with questions so my boy does not have one to manage his diabetes. I consult with some fellow Prozinc members because they live and breathe feline diabetes 24/7 ;).

Sounds like a fun household with so many fur and feather kids :woot:. Wondering if your youngest has some form of hyperesthesia for her tail issue.

I understand the preference for not using "cloud" or google services. I am usually the same way but don't mind sharing my cat's BG numbers :cat:

For the food you are feeding, I've calculated the range at: 15.9 - 25% dry matter carbs.:eek: We like to stay under 10% for diabetic kitties. Here is the Food Chart many of us use here, if you have another brand not listed like Feline Harmony was not listed, I can calculate the estimated carb content for you. :)
 
Most of my animals are laid back. An occasional "tiff" every now and again. They haven't learned about personal space....especially with two blind cats (20 year old and another one who is about 16 I think (would have to look it up) - dual subluxations). But overall they wander about, eat, sleep, don't contribute anything to the rent... :) :P

As for Coco (or her current name: Coco Loco :)) Hyperesthesia sounds like a fit for her symptoms. According to the vet this is a typical thing they have seen in calico cats...some neurilogical problem. I have some "valium" and the new doc gave me some "liver happy" (eastern methodology) pills. She gets it only as needed, and she doesn't need it all the time.

Before we knew about the problem (all my animals have either shown up on my door or are rescue), during roll call :) she wouldn't be present and I would find her up a tree not willing to come down. Why you ask? Because cats come down tail first and you know that tail would never let her come down..... so I have climbed 60 foot trees to get this crazy child.... (hmmm....maybe I'm the crazy one). :) After 7 or so times of that, she isn't allowed out anymore. :)

As for Jack's food - how did you calculate the dry matter carbs in a wet food? :P And why do you want to stay under 10%?

Thanks.
 
Can respond more later, have to get to a job site. There's a formula to calculate carbs in food, I have one setup in my signature. Staying under 10% carbs, quick answer is related to the hidden sugar effect in humans. :)
 
I am new here but I've had other cats with serious chronic illness you may want to get iron and potassium levels checked just in case if your cat has not had bloodwork recently. Low potasium especially caused some unusual trembling and twitching in one of my cats.
 
My cat had some hind-end weakness that I thought was diabetic neuropathy, turned out to be a potassium deficiency. Apparently it is not uncommon in diabetic kitties, so always good to get it checked! :):cat:
 
When one of my cats was anemic she shivered and she was always trying to get near us to stay warm. Weakness, shivering, trembling and twitching are what I've seen with both of these deficiencies. I am planning to keep my cat on a multivitamin once I find one that has good RDA values for a cat.
 
Thanks for all of your input. I am having second thoughts about the shivering. He didn't shiver/tremble all day and his PMPS was 154 which is good. When he was eating the shiver/tremble returned, but not before. So, it makes me wonder if it is just some strange by-product of him chewing. I don't recall ever seeing that before, but he is acting normal.

I waited about 30 minutes while he ate then gave him 2 U (instead of 3 U) this time. +5 later his numbers were 132 and based on the curves I have done in the past, his low point is usually about 4-5 hours.

It is possible I misinterpreted what is an obvious shaking for something non-relevant or non-important.

His last blood work (2 months ago) only showed the BG being a problem with some other minor items being near the high range (I don't have the report with me).

So, as usual, I will keep a close eye and continue to test and shoot. Maybe we are finally into normal numbers now. :)

Thanks.
 
Is his dish raised? Maybe arthritis and you know when you get weak and shaky when you squat or hold something for awhile. Maybe he gets weak. Just reaching in a hat here.
 
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