Tigger hypo this morninf

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kate&tigger

Member Since 2012
As if to prove the vet right Tigger dropped to 44 this morning after being 200 last night. I gave 2.25 units last night in spite of feeling a little nervous about it. He ate well. Yes, I'm afraid it WAS Convenia he got yesterday. I wonder if any connection between that and hypo today? Who knows? He was asymptomatic however and ate his brekky with gusto. I held his AMPS and left his a tablespoon of dry food and will check on him at noon. Any thoughts? I think I ought to back down from 2.25 units to 2 units again. Darn! BTW I will reply to last post in detail later. Am on my way out the door to a funeral of a good friend... K&T
 
Hi Kate,
My condolences on the loss of your friend. We have had so much loss on the board lately, we know how difficult losing either human or pet is.

For Tigger, here's the thing about Levemir. You can give too much for a considerable amount of time and not see evidence that the dose is too high. This happens on Lantus too, so the vet is still not right about Levemir being so much more potent, but I do call it the Gentle Giant. Instead of dropping them to the basement on the first too large dose like a faster acting insulin might do, Levemir can produce BGs which look for all the world like the dose is not high enough. Then Bam! Out of the blue you have a drop-out like this morning. There's your proof that 2.25U is too much, and honestly from what we've experienced, even 2U is too much.

Levemir works best using a step up approach, that's why the Tilly Protocol works well with it and Lantus, as Lantus is similar in this regard. It is so much easier to start with a dose below their optimum (which you don't know) and work up if needed. That is what you thought you were doing. Unfortunately, 2U is not far enough below the optimum.

Because we have seen cats do so well on doses of less than 2U of Levemir, I highly recommend dialing all the way back to 1U and essentially starting over. If there is no sign of infection and he's eating well, that would be fine. Yes you will get BGs that look all the world like not enough insulin, but they should level out and not do this bottom dropping anymore and you can increase dose after 5 days, if needed. You can't continue with a dose that produces a 44 at +12.

And I have no idea if the Convenia is related. That would be a variable in this case, so I would definitely watch his behavior over the next 24-36 hours. If you think he received it previously, he's probably OK, but best to be aware.
 
Looks like you have been dripping the dose over the past two weeks and the numbers are settling each time. Probably going to 2.25u was premature as Tigger was still adjusting to the 2u dose. And, although there aren't a lot of numbers to look at the 500s and 400s on 3 and 4 units are probably rebound. Most likely, you are now low enough that his rebound response is relaxing a bit and allowing the breakthrough lows.

I think going to 1u might be a good idea and give it a good 5 days before thinking about changing it - unless he drops low again. And can you get more spot checks in? As a precaution, be sure to test for ketones with the lower dose.
 
Thanks for the responses. I think you all are correct. Will dial him back to 1 unit tonight and stay there for at least 5 days. Just going out to the cattery to check his BG. Will post it is SS as soon as I get back in. I really value the sensible input from you experienced lev users. K&T
 
So, he is already at 250 - might go higher because of the skipped shot - as well as the low this monring.

FYI - I would not consider 44 a hypo, or even a dangerous low, or even a "worry about it low" - it will, however, cause rebound bounces. Both of my boys got down into the 30s with no problems, just hunger and the rebound from it. ECID (every cat is different), of course, so you may/may not see any symptoms. At that number I would expect hunger and not much else. So, you feed reg food, and retest in a bit.

Also, for future reference, you should wait and retest until they are rising and then give a token dose - assuming you are comfortable doing that. Maybe try it for the first time when you will be home to monitor. Even something like .25 would help stop the climb after a low, but we can get into the "next" time....
 
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