? Tiffany has an issue...call into the vet

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Jadi & Tiffany

Jadi & Tiffany

Member Since 2017
Hi there,

We have a call into the vet, but thought I would post for any help. We have been managing Tiffany's care and trying our best to keep her comfortable. She received a good report from the vet this week, although we did not run labs this time.

During the night and morning, it looks like a fluid with some blood is coming from her. It does not look or smell like Urine. She also pooped (not normal) on a bed in a guestroom. She did have poop and this fluid on the outside of her litter box. She seems to be thirstier than normal, but also has been purring and wanting to be on my lap. (which is normal.)

I am afraid that her kidneys are failing. I do have Bupa to give her, but am waiting for the vet to call. (She is sleeping comfortably out on my deck.)

Any suggestions??? ( I do not want to go to the emergency room...we want to keep her comfortable.)

Jadi
 
No experience so sorry no suggestions from me, just lots of prayers for Tiffany and for it to be something treatable.
 
Oh that sounds scary. I'll share my experience...I'm not a vet, but can you see if one of her anal glands has ruptured? I had that happen to my long haired Calico, I didn't realize something was wrong until my dog kept wanting to smell her. Saw the red fluid on her fur, rushed her over to emergency vet. They had to flush it out, and she was fine, just needed antibiotics afterward.

Edit to add, might be just an impacted anal gland? If you don't see a rupture, that's good, but the anal gland might still need to be expressed. Sounds like it's associated with bowel movement? but in any case, I hope you hear back from your vet soon, and that it's nothing serious. :bighug:
 
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Usually, if the blood is not actually in the stool, it's something near the anus that is causing the issue. A simple irritation is possible, but I agree with Christie that it could be the anal glands.

Has she been pooping okay up to this point? Is her poop normal looking, not dry? Sometimes if they get a bit constipated, the dry poop can irritate the tissue as it exits and cause blood. That happened to my civvie Sasha.

I'm glad you have a call in to the vet. If she is "sleeping comfortably", she probably doesn't need pain meds.

Since she is not in distress, and you have eyes on you now, could you please take down the 911? Thanks.

Please keep us posted!!!
 
Christie & Maverick said:
Oh that sounds scary. I'll share my experience...I'm not a vet, but can you see if one of her anal glands has ruptured? I had that happen to my long haired Calico, I didn't realize something was wrong until my dog kept wanting to smell her. Saw the red fluid on her fur, rushed her over to emergency vet. They had to flush it out, and she was fine, just needed antibiotics afterward.

Edit to add, might be just an impacted anal gland? If you don't see a rupture, that's good, but the anal gland might still need to be expressed. Sounds like it's associated with bowel movement? but in any case, I hope you hear back from your vet soon, and that it's nothing serious. :bighug:
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I do not think it is an anal gland. I can see a little blood in the area that urine comes from. Thanks for sharing your experience.
 
Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey said:
Then that could be a UTI - Urinary tract infection. Is she having any trouble peeing? Is she going to the lb more often?
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Yes Tricia, but she has been doing that since her diabetes. I will mention that to the vet when she calls. She had an ultra sound on her kidneys awhile back and they are not in good shape. As you know...sadly her Acro condition is not a good diagnosis. Thank you!
 
I don't have experience with Acro, but with kidney issues, my experience was I never saw blood, so IMHO, the two are not connected. The blood is because of something else going on. Do keep us posted, we all know what it's like to worry, glad Tiffany seems to be enjoying the day :cat:.
 
Christie & Maverick said:
I don't have experience with Acro, but with kidney issues, my experience was I never saw blood, so IMHO, the two are not connected. The blood is because of something else going on. Do keep us posted, we all know what it's like to worry, glad Tiffany seems to be enjoying the day :cat:.
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True. A UTI doesn't necessarily involve the kidneys. A urine culture might be a good idea.
 
Hi Jadi, I really hope Tiffany is ok. I know the Acro dx isn't easy, I took a chance with Marvin with something experimental and it has worked wonders. Others have also chosen to simply treat with what ever amount of insulin their acro or IAA kitty needs and have had they fur babies in healing numbers. Don't give up, Tiffany may surprise you as my baby did.

I am hoping that what ever is happening with her at the moment is not serious and sending you lots and lots of healing vines :bighug:, if you want to discuss Acro options and how people have handled the dx, @Wendy&Neko and @Bronx's dad really helped me with Marvin and also help me get through it, it was a lot to take in emotionally in such a short time between the diabetes dx and then the Acro dx.
 
Marvin's Mom - Nat said:
Hi Jadi, I really hope Tiffany is ok. I know the Acro dx isn't easy, I took a chance with Marvin with something experimental and it has worked wonders. Others have also chosen to simply treat with what ever amount of insulin their acro or IAA kitty needs and have had they fur babies in healing numbers. Don't give up, Tiffany may surprise you as my baby did.

I am hoping that what ever is happening with her at the moment is not serious and sending you lots and lots of healing vines :bighug:, if you want to discuss Acro options and how people have handled the dx, @Wendy&Neko and @Bronx's dad really helped me with Marvin and also help me get through it, it was a lot to take in emotionally in such a short time between the diabetes dx and then the Acro dx.
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I would love to hear what you did with Marvin. Thank you.
 
Hi Everyone,

Thank you all for your concern and words of advice and encouragement. My vet just happened to be in the office today and was able to see Tiffany. It looks like a UTI and she gave her an antibiotic for now. They did blood and urine analysis and will have results for us in 3 days. Tiffany is not feeling well and has been vomiting tonight. (So, I do not think she is getting antibiotic in her.) I am still concerned it is her kidneys, but we will know more soon.

Thank you for your prayers. So sad to see her sick.

Jadi
 
Jadi & Tiffany said:
I would love to hear what you did with Marvin. Thank you.
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Hi Nat,

Wow, I actually just looked at Marvin's spreadsheet. So, maybe if we can get Tiff through this, we should try Cargobaline and fish oil? Bronx's dad told me that it did not work for Bronx, so I did not consider it. We are not doing the radiation, although we did consider it, but your chart is giving me new hope. I would love to hear more. Thank you!
 
Jadi & Tiffany said:
Hi Nat,

Wow, I actually just looked at Marvin's spreadsheet. So, maybe if we can get Tiff through this, we should try Cargobaline and fish oil? Bronx's dad told me that it did not work for Bronx, so I did not consider it. We are not doing the radiation, although we did consider it, but your chart is giving me new hope. I would love to hear more. Thank you!
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Hello Jadi,

I couldn't afford other options, and was concerned that at one point even the insulin may get too pricey. Marvin has sever neuropathy and when I took him to the internist before his diagnosis they sort of recommended I let him go cause I couldn't afford all the tests (and I mean all think there were almost 10 for 2K) they wanted to do. Lucky for me I checked in here first. My Vet was great, she didn't hesitate and coordinated the IAA and 1GF-1 testing for me as we both had a feeling that is why Marvin wasn't reacting to insulin (he had some of the physical symptoms). I couldn't afford those two tests. So when we got the diagnosis I decided to contact RVC. I had notice Bronx Dad had mentioned that one kitty on the trial was doing well (low side of high dose kitty), so I didn't have anything to lose. I texted with Bronx Dad and of course Wendy was there to hold my hand. My Vet was on board to try anything we needed to.

I got dosing information from RVC and provided to my vet
Found a compound Pharmacy who could make the medication in liquid format (don't have vet do it, too expensive, go directly to compound pharmacy with script)

As you will see on his SS took a few weeks to kick into gear, but once it did holy cow what a ride. He become OTJ this week :) First kitty to do so on cabergoline. RVC researcher running the trial said he is doing better than the others on the trial. Study results are scheduled to come out next month. So I am not sure is Marvin is completely unique. I think the only side affect he may have is his appetite, mind you as soon as he was dx and switched to wet food his appetite wasn't great. He eats a lot better now, thinking being regulated is helping.

well this is sort of Marvin's story.
 
Hi Jadi, Been away and just ran across your thread. Hopefully Tiffany is feeling better today. Blood by the LB is always scary, hopefully the UTI clears up soon. I am still unsure if Cabergoline was working for Bronx towards the end, it may have. His insulin needs were going down but I scheduled the radiation about a month ahead of that so stopped the Cabergoline since cats need to be weened off slowly and the hospital was not going to administer the Cabergoline while Bronx was going under for 5 days straight. It will be interesting to see the results from the official trial next month. There are other stories of the success of Cabergoline in other kitties not part of the trial and not on this board. One kitty's insulin needs went from 110u to 70u after going on Cabergoline. Marvin's SS is amazing and gives hope for all acro kitties.
 
LizzieInTexas said:
Any update?
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I will try the Cabergoline if we can get her through this!

We had a horrible night. She vomited up everything in her stomach...even some clear fluid with speckles of blood. I know that we can not do insulin on an empty stomach and we still need to get the antibiotic pills down her as well. (I usually wrap it in a small ball of food and she will take it. This is the first time ever that she has turned her nose up at food.) I am afraid she is in kidney failure. (She had an ultra sound of her kidneys in Feb when she was in the emergency room and they did not look great.

I do not want to do the emergency room route today...they are traumatizing for her and we have already spent thousands there on three occasions. Any suggestions on how to keep her going for the next 24 hours until I can rush her into her vet?
 
@Wendy&Neko & @Judy and Boomer may have some ideas to help with getting her to keep food down. I think you can get d-mannose at pharmacy, which helps with UTI and I think kidney too (not sure). It may not do alot till tomorrow, but it apparently helps alot with UTI in general and preventing them.

:bighug: healing vines for Tiffany .....
 
Bronx's dad said:
There are other stories of the success of Cabergoline in other kitties not part of the trial and not on this board. One kitty's insulin needs went from 110u to 70u after going on Cabergoline.
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I didn't know that, that is great news, would love to hear about those too, which boards?
 
Jadi, any chance you have some Cerenia around, or could get some from the vet ? As long as there is no obstruction, Cerenia is good for vomiting. Have you tried feeding all meat babyfood? You may need to assist feed her a bit, if she will keep food around. Do you think she might be nauseous? Is she lip smacking or showing interest in food then turning around?

@Marvin's Mom - Nat Paul is talking about a closed, non peer reviewed Facebook group that has some high dose cats on it. It's a pity it's closed, cause I believe information like this should be shared with everyone who has an acro.

Unless Tiff ate something bad, she shouldn't have acute kidney failure. There are signs if a kitty is in chronic kidney failure. Or there should have been something off with her kidney values on her bloodwork.

Sending healing vines for Tiff and these for you. :bighug::bighug:
 
The antibiotics can cause tummy upset, and throwing up and not wanting to eat. What kind of antibiotics did you get? I don't know which are better but I know that some caused inappetence, nausea, and vomiting with my cat and some not so much. Maybe someone can chime in on which antibiotic would be better. Did they do a culture and sensitivity where they send the sample out to see which antibiotic would work best for her particular UTI?
I always tried to give probiotics a few hours after giving antibiotics.

I agree with trying the all meat baby food (without onions or garlic) as it might be easy on her upset tummy. She needs to eat.
Sending healing vines to Tiffany. :cat:
 
Wendy&Neko said:
Jadi, any chance you have some Cerenia around, or could get some from the vet ? As long as there is no obstruction, Cerenia is good for vomiting. Have you tried feeding all meat babyfood? You may need to assist feed her a bit, if she will keep food around. Do you think she might be nauseous? Is she lip smacking or showing interest in food then turning around?

@Marvin's Mom - Nat Paul is talking about a closed, non peer reviewed Facebook group that has some high dose cats on it. It's a pity it's closed, cause I believe information like this should be shared with everyone who has an acro.

Unless Tiff ate something bad, she shouldn't have acute kidney failure. There are signs if a kitty is in chronic kidney failure. Or there should have been something off with her kidney values on her bloodwork.

Sending healing vines for Tiff and these for you. :bighug::bighug:
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Yes!!!! I do have Cerenia from her past hospital visit! I totally forgot. Giving it to her now. She is totally turning her nose up at food, but I have some chicken Tiki cat mouse that I will try in a while. We did not give her insulin this morning...I have never had to miss a dose...is that really bad???

Thank you, Wendy!
 
The one advantage to higher doses is a larger depot which will help her somewhat get through the skip. For future, typically vet's say you can give half a dose if your kitty is undergoing anesthesia and can't eat. Not all the insulin goes to combat the carbs in the food. A partial dose may be OK. I usually gave Neko full dose when she was off her food. It usually meant her numbers were higher. And I could assist feed some, higher carb if needed. Vomiting is a different story.
 
I would check her for ketones and hopefully the cerenia will get her eating. Did you test her this morning?
 
Dyana said:
The antibiotics can cause tummy upset, and throwing up and not wanting to eat. What kind of antibiotics did you get? I don't know which are better but I know that some caused inappetence, nausea, and vomiting with my cat and some not so much. Maybe someone can chime in on which antibiotic would be better. Did they do a culture and sensitivity where they send the sample out to see which antibiotic would work best for her particular UTI?
I always tried to give probiotics a few hours after giving antibiotics.

I agree with trying the all meat baby food (without onions or garlic) as it might be easy on her upset tummy. She needs to eat.
Sending healing vines to Tiffany. :cat:
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Hi Dyana,

Yes, the antibiotic that they gave her does upset the stomach, but the vomiting started before we gave it to her. I think she has been vomiting it up...only one dose and we have just been trying to calm her stomach this morning. We did give her the Cerenia, but she vomited most of that with what little water she has had. We are going to crush a little in baby food in a bit and see if we can keep that down.

They did do a culture and I am going to see if they can give me a different antibiotic tomorrow morning...in the meantime, healing vines are appreciated.

Thank you!
 
Wendy&Neko said:
The one advantage to higher doses is a larger depot which will help her somewhat get through the skip. For future, typically vet's say you can give half a dose if your kitty is undergoing anesthesia and can't eat. Not all the insulin goes to combat the carbs in the food. A partial dose may be OK. I usually gave Neko full dose when she was off her food. It usually meant her numbers were higher. And I could assist feed some, higher carb if needed. Vomiting is a different story.
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What about low sodium chicken or beef broth?
 
Jadi & Tiffany said:
What about low sodium chicken or beef broth?
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You can boil your own chicken or beef, that way you know for sure it's pure. I used to use that for Neko to wash down some of her less pleasant tasting meds. Then I started using gelcaps which completely hid the taste. If you aren't giving probiotics, that can help with the tummy upset too. Just make sure they are given separately from the AB.
Marvin's Mom - Nat said:
With Marvin I preferred the antibiotic shot instead of pill. Lasts the full two weeks.
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Convenia is a double edged sword. It's an antibiotic originally created for skin infections and used a lot by vets because of the convenience. However, I wouldn't go there if Tiffany has never haad it before. The down side of it lasting two weeks is if she has a reaction to it. Here is Dr. Lisa's take on it.
 
Dyana said:
The antibiotics can cause tummy upset, and throwing up and not wanting to eat. What kind of antibiotics did you get? I don't know which are better but I know that some caused inappetence, nausea, and vomiting with my cat and some not so much. Maybe someone can chime in on which antibiotic would be better. Did they do a culture and sensitivity where they send the sample out to see which antibiotic would work best for her particular UTI?
I always tried to give probiotics a few hours after giving antibiotics.

I agree with trying the all meat baby food (without onions or garlic) as it might be easy on her upset tummy. She needs to eat.
Sending healing vines to Tiffany. :cat:
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Wendy&Neko said:
You can boil your own chicken or beef, that way you know for sure it's pure. I used to use that for Neko to wash down some of her less pleasant tasting meds. Then I started using gelcaps which completely hid the taste. If you aren't giving probiotics, that can help with the tummy upset too. Just make sure they are given separately from the AB.

Convenia is a double edged sword. It's an antibiotic originally created for skin infections and used a lot by vets because of the convenience. However, I wouldn't go there if Tiffany has never haad it before. The down side of it lasting two weeks is if she has a reaction to it. Here is Dr. Lisa's take on it.
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Hi Wendy,
The vet prescribed Clavamox, which Tiff has had before and did make her nauseous. (My husband was the one who took her to the vet and he did not know, although I may not have remembered.) I will take her back in the morning and am hoping that they can give her a shot. They did do a culture to see what the exact antibiotic should be. Thank you for all your advice. Beef baby food is working and I did get her to take some Clavamox...cautiously waiting to see if she can keep it down.
 
*not Clavamox but the Cerenia (anti nauseous medicine) She had a small amount of Tiki cat chicken mouuse and has been drinking small amounts of water here and there. No vomiting for the past 5 hours. Should I give a normal dose of insulin tonight? ( Even if her appetite is small?)
 
Jadi & Tiffany said:
Should I give a normal dose of insulin tonight? ( Even if her appetite is small?)
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I would give the full dose if she is eating at all, and maybe a reduced dose if she is not. See What Wendy said about it in post #28 above.

Sending tummy calming and healing vines. Clavamox can be tough on the tummy. Once she's eating, be sure to give it after food. That helps.
 
Marvin's Mom - Nat said:
Hello Jadi,

I couldn't afford other options, and was concerned that at one point even the insulin may get too pricey. Marvin has sever neuropathy and when I took him to the internist before his diagnosis they sort of recommended I let him go cause I couldn't afford all the tests (and I mean all think there were almost 10 for 2K) they wanted to do. Lucky for me I checked in here first. My Vet was great, she didn't hesitate and coordinated the IAA and 1GF-1 testing for me as we both had a feeling that is why Marvin wasn't reacting to insulin (he had some of the physical symptoms). I couldn't afford those two tests. So when we got the diagnosis I decided to contact RVC. I had notice Bronx Dad had mentioned that one kitty on the trial was doing well (low side of high dose kitty), so I didn't have anything to lose. I texted with Bronx Dad and of course Wendy was there to hold my hand. My Vet was on board to try anything we needed to.

I got dosing information from RVC and provided to my vet
Found a compound Pharmacy who could make the medication in liquid format (don't have vet do it, too expensive, go directly to compound pharmacy with script)

As you will see on his SS took a few weeks to kick into gear, but once it did holy cow what a ride. He become OTJ this week :) First kitty to do so on cabergoline. RVC researcher running the trial said he is doing better than the others on the trial. Study results are scheduled to come out next month. So I am not sure is Marvin is completely unique. I think the only side affect he may have is his appetite, mind you as soon as he was dx and switched to wet food his appetite wasn't great. He eats a lot better now, thinking being regulated is helping.

Hi Nat,

I am going to contact RVC also. What are the next steps that you took? Pharmacy name? Did you need a prescription from your vet? My vet is totally open to this, but we dismissed the idea awhile back, thinking it was not working for other cats. She will be very excited when I tell her about Marvin tomorrow.

Praying that I can get Tiff through the night with no more vomiting. She has gone about 7 hours now and has had some food, water and a normal dose of insulin...holding my breath!

Thank you for your help and encouragement!
Jadi


well this is sort of Marvin's story.
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I just sent RVC an email, they sent me the recommended dosing. I gave to my vet she gave me a prescription. I had to find a compound pharmacy to make the drug in liquid format, cause it's normally pill form and kitty only needed 1/8 of the pill, which would have been impossible to cut. Bronx dad recommended I look into a compound pharmacy. I just did a web search for the area I am in, and found one. Compound Pharmacy, is a specialized pharmacy that make medication you could say the old fashion way. So they if they have the right equipment, they can make it in different formats, in our case we want liquid. I sent them an email, and then spoke to the pharmacist. They made the med for me, I simply renew monthly. 7 weeks later here we are :)... I will send you copy of the dosing.
 
Jadi, there is no guarantee it is still experimental, for me it was a risk I was willing to take. I figured it was worth a try, that I didn't have anything to lose as he really was not doing well. He is doing much better with the exception of his neuropathy, which I am hoping his legs will start to heal now.
 
Marvin's Mom - Nat said:
I just sent RVC an email, they sent me the recommended dosing. I gave to my vet she gave me a prescription. I had to find a compound pharmacy to make the drug in liquid format, cause it's normally pill form and kitty only needed 1/8 of the pill, which would have been impossible to cut. Bronx dad recommended I look into a compound pharmacy. I just did a web search for the area I am in, and found one. Compound Pharmacy, is a specialized pharmacy that make medication you could say the old fashion way. So they if they have the right equipment, they can make it in different formats, in our case we want liquid. I sent them an email, and then spoke to the pharmacist. They made the med for me, I simply renew monthly. 7 weeks later here we are :)... I will send you copy of the dosing.
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Can the compound pharmacy make the smaller dose in a pill form? I'm just wondering because Gizmo is terrible with liquids, but takes pills without a problem.
 
Marvin's Mom - Nat said:
Jadi, there is no guarantee it is still experimental, for me it was a risk I was willing to take. I figured it was worth a try, that I didn't have anything to lose as he really was not doing well. He is doing much better with the exception of his neuropathy, which I am hoping his legs will start to heal now.
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Thank you Nat. My husband and I are thinking we want to try as well. Nothing to lose at this point. Did you notice any side affects?
 
Not really. His appetite was already down before starting. So not sure if contributed to his lower appetite or not. He has been eating better for about 2 wks
 
Wendy&Neko said:
Convenia is a double edged sword. It's an antibiotic originally created for skin infections and used a lot by vets because of the convenience. However, I wouldn't go there if Tiffany has never haad it before. The down side of it lasting two weeks is if she has a reaction to it. Here is Dr. Lisa's take on it.
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I could not agree more! It was originally meant for skin infections in dogs, and is frequently given to cats for UTIs. It is ineffective for UTIs as it is not the proper type of AB to treat these. It stays in the system much longer than two weeks, sometimes longer than two months, so if your cat has a bad reaction there is no way to flush it out of their system. I personally know at least three people whose cats have had severe reactions, two of which were fatal. I will not allow any of my cats to be given Convenia, for any reason. No amount of convenience is worth the risk, to me.
 
Another pharmacy option is Diamondback. They are a pet pharmacy and do compounding also. I ordered two rx's from them a couple of weeks ago. Very easy to deal with and quick. The shipped the two prescription together and only charged for one shipping fee ($8). I emailed them scanned copies of the prescrptions and they emailed when the were ready to fill (same day) asking me to call with payment.
http://www.diamondbackdrugs.com/

I know there is another pharmacy that others here use but I can't remember the name.
 
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Marvin's Mom - Nat said:
How is Tiffany today, did you go see your vet? Healing vines for Tiffany :)
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Thank you!!! Yes, we saw the vet first thing this morning. Never prescribing clavamox to us again...she gave her an anti biotic shot that will last 14 days. Still waiting on the culture, but Tiffany is eating and feeling much better tonight. Posted a blue number!!! We talked about the Cabergoline and I forwarded the email from RVC (already emailed me this morning!!!) We are going to chat again this week about it. (I am hopeful!!)

Thanks again, Nat!! (and Marvin!!!)
 
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