The weekend messed up Jasper's numbers?

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Hine87

Hine87

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I'll be honest that I cannot help myself on the weekends when my alarm goes off to take care of Jasper that I just turn it off and role over. It never fails that I'm always an hour late to give him his food and insulin, shame on me I know. =/ Since switching the vet about two weeks ago his numbers have but all been staying out of the red, woohoo! Until yesterday, I took two separate readings back to back to see what the difference would be. I'm a little bit bummed today seeing 370 at noon. I guess my question is that, are these higher numbers possibly from being an hour late than normal each morning? (for saturday and sunday) (compensating for night of course). But I look back to the weekend prior where I had done the same thing, probably most weekends I do....and his numbers were fine.

Thank you!
 
Hi Sarah,
It's tough watching the numbers especially when they run higher . I was unable to open the SS.
I too struggle with higher numbers.
Hopefully some one with more experience will come along soon.
:cat:
 
I'm no expert myself but I find myself having the same trouble (getting out of bed, haha) in the weekends and find Baco's numbers higher then normal.
Since this weekend I have no problems with it anymore because her numbers are low, so that's a good thing.

I think what you are saying isn't a strange thing to think, and I asume it could be a possibility, but like I said i'm no expert.
Maybe Sue or Rachel can help you with that question. I will tag them for you, they will come around pretty soon I think!

@Sue and Oliver (GA) @Rachel
 
His numbers are unusual in that they are higher midcycle than at preshot. Anything else going on? Same food/ no infections/litter box okay?

You did have a better run from 5/14 - 17.

I don't know. A curve would be nice to see if there is an early nadir or something. Any chance?
 
To be honest, I don't think that the hour later shot is causing this. That could cause a slightly higher preshot, but I don't think it would have such a long effect.

It is hard to work out what's going on. I agree, that a curve would be nice. That might help us to see if he ever goes lower or not. If we can see what he does throughout a day, I think it might help some.
 
Whoa, I wasn't notified about all of these posts! Sorry guys! I just updated his numbers but haven't done a curve yet. I suppose I can do a 'mini' curve today and get some more check in tomorrow as well. I've noticed his numbers are fine in the morning but that increases during the day. I haven't changed his food or the amount he's getting for I would say almost a month now since I've switched vets. I need to call the vet today to and see what he thinks. It's odd that for about two weeks his numbers were fine but now increasing again. =P
 
I've updated his SS and here is a picture of his insulin vial.
13263800_1301070929907928_8962585856365224577_n.jpg
 
If there are no floaters/clumps, you've stored it refrigerated, and always rolled it gently before drawing up the insulin, it should be good.
 
I agree with BJ - how old is the vial? Does Jasper have any thing going on pancreatitis wise? When Murphy gets a flare up of pancreatitis or IBD, I see numbers like you are seeing - then when it subsides, the numbers go down
 
Ok! That is what I thought but someone from the FB group recommended I share the photo here with you guys. The vial is about two months old. Nothing else is going on with him although I had noticed that when he gets fed (half of the 5.5 oz cans) he's not eating all of it in one sitting. He used to but now he isn't, maybe he realized that him eating and the raising of his BG made him feel cruddy? I was doing some research and wondered about air bubbles? I read that having those in the syringe can alter his actual dose. Feeling a bit dumb now...but I've never really tried to get them out. Hearing that the insulin dropping can ruin it and the only vet that had showed me anything about that was in Japan and with a different kind of insulin and had my flick the air bubble out. I thought maybe flicking it could ruin it? I'm sure that sounds dumb. But I did watch a video a few minutes ago where the guy pulls extra insulin into the syringe quickly and pushes out the extra and I guess pushes the air bubble out as well. But it is still odd that even though I hadn't been watching for them that he still had a good couple weeks before his numbers went up again. :banghead:
 
As the insulin dose approaches what he needs physiologically, his hunger and thirst, and urination and defecation, should become normalized.
 
When was the last time the vet checked him out for an infection? How are his teeth? Anything else different - litter box? Playing and grooming?

There are so many variables in this sugar dance that deciding which might have what effect is difficult. I'd fix the things you can - work on your technique for the air bubbles. (I don't think flicking would hurt anything - nurses do it all the time.). And maybe schedule a vet appointment just to check things out?
 
It's been about two weeks since he saw the new vet but didn't test for anything. Then his numbers were good for a couple weeks. On Friday when I talked to the vet he gave the go ahead on increasing to two units (from 1.75). With the higher numbers he hasn't played that much but he is still up and about as normal. Nothing out of the ordinary. I will give this new dose another day or so-wasn't it about 3-4 days about for his body to adjust to the new dose ? and go from there. The vet said to call him at the end of the week so if I need to call before than I will.
 
We usually say 3 cycles and then an increase - usually 0.25. If, after increasing, you continue to get higher ranges - especially midcycle higher than preshot, you might consider going down in dose for a couple cycles and see if the numbers get any better.
 
Sarah,
I noticed that you seemed to have been giving a lower dose of insulin when your preshot number is still sky high with numbers such as 290. When you do that, you can end up with funky numbers for a few days afterward. You are better off not doing that. Remember that yellow numbers are still very high. We want to see all the numbers in the blue and green range.

As you get up into the purple, red and black numbers, you will see things that just don't make sense. The cat's metabolism doesn't run efficiently and reliably with these high numbers.
Try not to let that get too frustrated. Let's concentrate on getting the numbers into at least the yellow range and lower. And it would be good if we didn't back off on insulin at the very top of the yellow range.
Jenny
 
I continue to see higher numbers at midcycle than at preshot. What do you think about reducing the dose for a few cycles - when you can test (especially around nadir) and see if that pattern changes? Maybe go back to 1.5 or even 1.25. If you decide to try this, be sure to get ketone tests in and make sure he is eating well. Only try it for a few cycles and if you don't see any improvement, go right back up.

My thinking. Sometimes with ProZinc, if the nadir is consistently higher than the preshot, it can mean the dose is too high. Not always but it might be worth doing this little experiment.

If this doesn't help, and you are sure there are no infections, then I see two choices. Start moving up the scale, increasing every 3 cycles or change insulin. The best insulin is the one that works best for your cat and it could be that his body is just not using the ProZinc effectively.

For some reason, he is not reacting to it in a normal pattern. If it isn't because it is too much insulin, then his reaction to ProZinc is very different than usual and different than it has been in the past.

There is definitely no high carb food around he could be getting into? He is not an outdoor cat and could have someone else feeding him?
 
JenzyandtheFurkids said:
Sarah,
I noticed that you seemed to have been giving a lower dose of insulin when your preshot number is still sky high with numbers such as 290. When you do that, you can end up with funky numbers for a few days afterward. You are better off not doing that. Remember that yellow numbers are still very high. We want to see all the numbers in the blue and green range.

As you get up into the purple, red and black numbers, you will see things that just don't make sense. The cat's metabolism doesn't run efficiently and reliably with these high numbers.
Try not to let that get too frustrated. Let's concentrate on getting the numbers into at least the yellow range and lower. And it would be good if we didn't back off on insulin at the very top of the yellow range.
Jenny
Click to expand...

Oh ok! The vet was telling me to lower the dose if he is under 300. At what number should I start backing off the dose a little? Granted he's not to that point yet...
Which I did update his SS! =) I'm a little surprised that my last check was in the yellow but not getting my hopes up yet.
 
Sue and Oliver (GA) said:
I continue to see higher numbers at midcycle than at preshot. What do you think about reducing the dose for a few cycles - when you can test (especially around nadir) and see if that pattern changes? Maybe go back to 1.5 or even 1.25. If you decide to try this, be sure to get ketone tests in and make sure he is eating well. Only try it for a few cycles and if you don't see any improvement, go right back up.

My thinking. Sometimes with ProZinc, if the nadir is consistently higher than the preshot, it can mean the dose is too high. Not always but it might be worth doing this little experiment.

If this doesn't help, and you are sure there are no infections, then I see two choices. Start moving up the scale, increasing every 3 cycles or change insulin. The best insulin is the one that works best for your cat and it could be that his body is just not using the ProZinc effectively.

For some reason, he is not reacting to it in a normal pattern. If it isn't because it is too much insulin, then his reaction to ProZinc is very different than usual and different than it has been in the past.

There is definitely no high carb food around he could be getting into? He is not an outdoor cat and could have someone else feeding him?
Click to expand...

I went ahead and backed down to 1.75 and he didn't seem to get any better. If I was to go back down to 1.5 or 1.25 would I need to go down a quarter unit each time as the same as when we increase?

I have been letting him outside for about a month or two now and actually thought of that. The only person I could think that may have put out cat food I asked my son about it since he goes over there to play he said he's never seen any cat food sitting out. I've kept him inside a couple days to see if his numbers would be any different and they weren't. Although he hasn't been outside today and I found him in the yellow at plus 8. Although that doesn't account for other neighbors that could be placing out food and I not know it. I suppose I should keep him in the house for a couple extra days to see if anything does change.

If I got switch him insulin does it matter which one I choose? Let the vet decide? Would you have a recommendation?
 
If you'd decrease, just go down to the dose and hold it for maybe 3 cycles, getting ketone tests daily.

I think I'd explore the outside possibilities. Bobbi got her Bubba lower by keeping him indoors. He was a real mouser and although they are supposed to be low carb, eating them raised his levels. Or maybe a neighbor feels sorry for him and leaves out some dry?

I would definitely go with one of the depot insulins. Lantus or Levemir. Both have good success rates. Changing will be a big mind shift - they are dosed very differently than ProZinc.
 
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