The numbers issue continues + weight loss now.

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Not a lot of difference between 16 and 15.8 lbs. One productive trip to the LB could account for it.

I rather suspect 1.5 units is too low. Are you doing a curve this weekend? You do enough testing that I don't see where you could have missed a low telling you this dose is too high. Getting him into better numbers will help him gain weight.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
Not a lot of difference between 16 and 15.8 lbs. One productive trip to the LB could account for it.

I rather suspect 1.5 units is too low. Are you doing a curve this weekend? You do enough testing that I don't see where you could have missed a low telling you this dose is too high. Getting him into better numbers will help him gain weight.
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I’m just worried since we saw lower numbers on the 1.25 more consistently than on 1.50.
 
But on 1.25 units, you didn't see overall numbers that you want. It helps to remember that insulin is a hormone, not a drug. It's not like medicine where you add a little more and get a little better. You just have to increase until you see the numbers you want. It's entirely possible to increase and see little change until you get closer to a fitting dose.
 
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I agree with Wendy about being in better numbers and weight gain. Losing weight was one of the reasons I went to vet when Bubba got diagnosed with FD.

Remember, what was a good dose last week might not be a good enough dose this week. It's not uncommon for them to go lower on one dose and then fizzle out. And after an increase not to see a lot of movement.

Just keep following the SLGS and increase as directed. Ninja will get there. Slow and steady. This is marathon, not a sprint.
You are doing just fine.
 
Wendy is correct. You are looking for longer term trends. And nadir (+6) testing is very important. If possible, please do nadir testing on the weekends.

Your kitteh will continue to have some weight issues until BG is regulated. The excess glucose is getting flushed out of Ninja, so that creates a cycle of eating a lot and not absorbing as much.
 
Full Disclosure: We're following Roomp & Rand's 2008 dosing protocol which is too aggressive for FDMB. However, out of the last 22 days, you have only seen 1 day with numbers close to "normal" (2 x 150's in a PM). Perhaps a consideration of 2U could be in the near future (with tight monitoring)?

My cat was experiencing diabetic neuropathy with red/pink BG nos., so we dosecreased faster (in accordance with the published protocol) to try to keep the damage to his back legs from becoming permanent.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
But on 1.25 units, you didn't see overall numbers that you want. It helps to remember that insulin is a hormone, not a drug. It's not like medicine where you add a little more and get a little better. You just have to increase until you see the numbers you want. It's entirely possible to increase and see little change until you get closer to a fitting dose.
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This is true.

Ugh, I know you’ve told me this before, but I get in panic mode (especially since our vet told me to go back to 1.25) and think “omg I’m hurting my cat”. So this reassurance helps tremendously. So keep on keeping on? When would you increase to 1.75?
 
@Catacular Victoria has selected the Start Low Go Slow method for dosing. Dose increases are by 0.25 units at a time, per that method. And by the way, Tight Regulation, even the aggressive one that is no longer used calls for all low carb wet or raw food.
 
Bobbie And Bubba said:
I agree with Wendy about being in better numbers and weight gain. Losing weight was one of the reasons I went to vet when Bubba got diagnosed with FD.

Remember, what was a good dose last week might not be a good enough dose this week. It's not uncommon for them to go lower on one dose and then fizzle out. And after an increase not to see a lot of movement.

Just keep following the SLGS and increase as directed. Ninja will get there. Slow and steady. This is marathon, not a sprint.
You are doing just fine.
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I wish I could explain how much hearing this helps. I go from “ok, I’ve got this” to “I’m not adequate enough to handle this, I’m failing my cat”. You feel like his numbers make sense then? Cause I also feel like I’ve looked at SO many SS where the cat is in green by now. And we aren’t even in yellows hardly at all. At what point would I wonder if there’s something else going on? Somogyi effect? Disease elsewhere in the body?
 
JeffJ said:
Wendy is correct. You are looking for longer term trends. And nadir (+6) testing is very important. If possible, please do nadir testing on the weekends.

Your kitteh will continue to have some weight issues until BG is regulated. The excess glucose is getting flushed out of Ninja, so that creates a cycle of eating a lot and not absorbing as much.
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Nadir testing is absolutely possible on the weekends, and that’s my plan for tomorrow and hopefully Sunday. I’m also hoping that if I can get my act together, I can wake up at night a few nights a week to get it as well.
 
Catacular said:
Full Disclosure: We're following Roomp & Rand's 2008 dosing protocol which is too aggressive for FDMB. However, out of the last 22 days, you have only seen 1 day with numbers close to "normal" (2 x 150's in a PM). Perhaps a consideration of 2U could be in the near future (with tight monitoring)?

My cat was experiencing diabetic neuropathy with red/pink BG nos., so we dosecreased faster (in accordance with the published protocol) to try to keep the damage to his back legs from becoming permanent.
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I am not home enough for tight monitoring that I’m comfortable with, unfortunately and even TR feels too aggressive at this point. Thank you though.
 
Your cat has been on insulin not quite a month. It took Neko at least four months to see green. Ninja's numbers are totally normal for this stage of the dance. Symogyi doesn't exist, been disproved, too early to say if there is something else. How are Ninja's teeth? That's a common issue for slowing regulation.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
Your cat has been on insulin not quite a month. It took Neko at least four months to see green. Ninja's numbers are totally normal for this stage of the dance. Symogyi doesn't exist, been disproved, too early to say if there is something else. How are Ninja's teeth? That's a common issue for slowing regulation.
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His gums are iffy and he’s had teeth extracted in the past, he’s scheduled for a cleaning in Oct. (that’s the soonest out vet could get him in and she wants him regulated before he goes under)
 
JeffJ said:
Wendy is right. Many new people get on the forum hoping for a quick fix. Patience is our friend even for people like me! Some cats take awhile to get regulated.
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My issue in addition to lack of patience (which, 100% is an issue here) is also complete terror at the idea of loosing Ninj due to something I do, or fail to do. I know most of you can relate to that, I’m hoping I can start to let go of that fear some. Currently it feels paralyzing at times.
 
By the way Viktoria - you are doing a great job. Setting up the spreadsheet, testing Ninja, keeping the spreadsheet updated. It is a lot of work at first, and all so new. We know how much work it is, but you are helping Ninja to become healthy for the rest of his life.

And when he is healthy again, we will probably hear about his most recent kung-fu fights with other ninja warriors!

I have 3 cats. One is Chinus - a siamese tortie girl. She is usually stuck to me like glue! She got adopted as a kitten the same week we adopted Leoberry (12 year diabetic).
Chinus - getting sun 02-14-2017b.jpg
 
Viktoria said:
His gums are iffy and he’s had teeth extracted in the past, he’s scheduled for a cleaning in Oct. (that’s the soonest out vet could get him in and she wants him regulated before he goes under
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That's a catch 22. Often a kitty needs a dental before they can get regulated. My Neko had her first dental when she was seeing a lot of reds and pinks. Is there a dental specialist near you that your vet can refer you to? They are much more used to doing dentals on kitties with issues.

I think most of us can relate to being terrified at the beginning. :bighug: Just keep doing what you are doing. You are doing great.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
@Catacular Victoria has selected the Start Low Go Slow method for dosing. Dose increases are by 0.25 units at a time, per that method. And by the way, Tight Regulation, even the aggressive one that is no longer used calls for all low carb wet or raw food.
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Yes, I understand SLGS and TR. Without the diabetic neuropathy, we would have dosecreased a bit slower. But, because we were able to test every few hours and because we believe in published controlled studies, we followed Roomp & Rand's published protocol which calls for an "Increase every 3 days by 0.5 IU . . . If nadir blood glucose concentration >300mg/dL (17 mmol/L)." :bookworm:

After 45 days of treatment, results are blues/greens and a happier kitty! :cat: Now on Day 51, we're decreasing the dose after 6 days of blues/greens/light greens.

We are trying to do what is best for our cat. YMMV and ECID.
 
JeffJ said:
By the way Viktoria - you are doing a great job. Setting up the spreadsheet, testing Ninja, keeping the spreadsheet updated. It is a lot of work at first, and all so new. We know how much work it is, but you are helping Ninja to become healthy for the rest of his life.

And when he is healthy again, we will probably hear about his most recent kung-fu fights with other ninja warriors!

I have 3 cats. One is Chinus - a siamese tortie girl. She is usually stuck to me like glue! She got adopted as a kitten the same week we adopted Leoberry (12 year diabetic).
View attachment 38244
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Thank you so much for your kind words ❤️ Chinus is gorgous! Siamese are so special.

Ninja’s +4.5 is blue! I’m slightly worried at this big of a drop. But it’s an improvement...
 
Wendy&Neko said:
That's a catch 22. Often a kitty needs a dental before they can get regulated. My Neko had her first dental when she was seeing a lot of reds and pinks. Is there a dental specialist near you that your vet can refer you to? They are much more used to doing dentals on kitties with issues.

I think most of us can relate to being terrified at the beginning. :bighug: Just keep doing what you are doing. You are doing great.
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Oh I haven’t asked for a specialist... that’s a great idea!

Thank you ❤️ We’re now seeing blue at +4.5... not sure what to think of that decrease. But it’s a decrease!
 
+4.5 = 154
That is perfectly fine. That is what we are looking for. You can go to sleep now. He will be just fine.

Thanks for the kudos on Chinus. Siamese kittehs are indeed very loyal.
 
Could he drop into a dangerous zone with that quick of a drop? I have an alarm set for an hour from now just in case..
 
Given his dose history and stability on the current value, it is very unlikely. This is sleepy time for you.:)
 
Viktoria said:
My issue in addition to lack of patience (which, 100% is an issue here) is also complete terror at the idea of loosing Ninj due to something I do, or fail to do. I know most of you can relate to that, I’m hoping I can start to let go of that fear some. Currently it feels paralyzing at times.
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Just wanted to add my unsolicited two cents. The very fact that you're here asking questions and that you care so much that you're afraid to make a wrong move says a whole lot about what a great cat mom you are. Ninja already has an advantage many cats don't because he has you on his side.
 
I agree about the dental. If there is inflammation ( gingivitis) and/ or an infected tooth (teeth), regulation will not happen because inflammation and infection causes higher numbers. It is a catch 22 and if it were me, I would get another opinion. A bad tooth has knocked Bubba out of remission 2 times all ready.
 
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Beck and Grandpa said:
Just wanted to add my unsolicited two cents. The very fact that you're here asking questions and that you care so much that you're afraid to make a wrong move says a whole lot about what a great cat mom you are. Ninja already has an advantage many cats don't because he has you on his side.
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That is so kind of you. Thank you. I’m just doing whatever I can to support my feline. Ninja has been with my through so much. He’s my bestie.
 
Bobbie And Bubba said:
I agree about the dental. If there is inflammation ( gingivitis) and/ or an infected tooth (tteh), regulation will not happen because inflammation and infection causes higher numbers. It is a catch 22 and if it were me, I would get another opinion. A bad tooth has knocked Bubba out of remission 2 times all ready.
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Oh that’s good to know. I may see if we can move him up. Have you had dental done before Bubba was regulated?
 
Viktoria said:
Oh that’s good to know. I may see if we can move him up. Have you had dental done before Bubba was regulated?
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Yes, his first one was when he was still in yellow and pink numbers. Without it, there was not a chance I could have gotten him in better numbers. That was in Sept of 2015. Then Oct 29th of the same year, his right eye was removed due to cancer. Then in August of 2016 he went into remission the first time. ( this is our 4th rodeo with insulin) Twice he was wiped out of remission due to a bad tooth . :rolleyes:
 
Bobbie And Bubba said:
Yes, his first one was when he was still in yellow and pink numbers. Without it, there was not a chance I could have gotten him in better numbers. That was in Sept of 2015. Then Oct 29th of the same year, his right eye was removed due to cancer. Then in August of 2016 he went into remission the first time. ( this is our 4th rodeo with insulin) Twice he was wiped out of remission due to a bad tooth . :rolleyes:
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Did you go through your regular vet? Or a specialist?
 
This condo is really interesting to me. Grandpa had the lens removed from his right eye in February. He also only has five teeth or so. I've always wanted to have a dental done on him, but vets didn't want to put him through it. Now the vets all say he has really bad teeth, but it isn't safe to sedate him. They will only do Convenia shots. I gotta wonder if better numbers are even possible.
 
Rufus was up to 6 units 2x a day (and still in super high numbers) and had dental and was off insulin 5 weeks later. Probably not the norm, but we can attest to what dental issues can do.
 
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