Tell me about your litter and litter box

[MindyC]

Let me start by saying Max is 17.5 years old. He's old, we know this. But we've been having a variety of litter box issues with him since well before the diabetes diagnosis. There is nothing that sends my husband's normally great temperament through the roof faster than when Max decides to do his business somewhere outside the litter box.

We have enclosed boxes. Always have, always will--we have dogs, the boxes have to be covered. We used to keep them both (we have 2 cats) in the basement where the dogs can't go, but due to Max's age and movement limitations, we moved one upstairs to the main floor. He pretty much lives in the living room and dining room these days, though that is by his own choice. Until now, we never had to scoop boxes, and just changed the litter out every week.

We use non-clumping litter. Max has not been particular before about his boxes or the litter, he'd use whatever was there without a fuss. Our other cat refuses to use a box with anything but non-clumping clay litter (the red Tidy Cats, to be specific). We tried the clumping, and we tried pine pellets, and in both instances he decided to start peeing anywhere but the box. He's been on prozac for 7 years because of this.

As Max has had infections or illness, he's used the bathtub in the main bathroom to pee. Easy to clean up, but it's still not the litter box. In the last 2 months since his diabetes re-diagnosis, he's stopped hopping into the bathtub and is now peeing on the floor between the toilet and tub. A litter box won't fit there, or anywhere in that bathroom. We've started putting puppy training pads on the floor in that spot--this at least makes cleanup easier and the whole situation stinks a lot less.

At this point, we've figured out that for the most part, the peeing the bathroom is happening when his box is too wet. This week his box was changed on Sunday (normal day), and then I changed it on Thursday because he seems to be peeing in the bathroom on Thursdays or Fridays. Well, he waited until today to pee in the bathroom. He also pooped on the floor outside the bathroom (when he's had an infection he's done this before, but I don't think that is the case today). His box was wet, but not excessively so.

So...ideas on how to keep a cleaner/drier box for him that don't include clumping litter?

 

[Jasper Blue and Jay]

Let me start by saying Max is 17.5 years old. He's old, we know this. But we've been having a variety of litter box issues with him since well before the diabetes diagnosis. There is nothing that sends my husband's normally great temperament through the roof faster than when Max decides to do his business somewhere outside the litter box.

We have enclosed boxes. Always have, always will--we have dogs, the boxes have to be covered. We used to keep them both (we have 2 cats) in the basement where the dogs can't go, but due to Max's age and movement limitations, we moved one upstairs to the main floor. He pretty much lives in the living room and dining room these days, though that is by his own choice. Until now, we never had to scoop boxes, and just changed the litter out every week.

We use non-clumping litter. Max has not been particular before about his boxes or the litter, he'd use whatever was there without a fuss. Our other cat refuses to use a box with anything but non-clumping clay litter (the red Tidy Cats, to be specific). We tried the clumping, and we tried pine pellets, and in both instances he decided to start peeing anywhere but the box. He's been on prozac for 7 years because of this.

As Max has had infections or illness, he's used the bathtub in the main bathroom to pee. Easy to clean up, but it's still not the litter box. In the last 2 months since his diabetes re-diagnosis, he's stopped hopping into the bathtub and is now peeing on the floor between the toilet and tub. A litter box won't fit there, or anywhere in that bathroom. We've started putting puppy training pads on the floor in that spot--this at least makes cleanup easier and the whole situation stinks a lot less.

At this point, we've figured out that for the most part, the peeing the bathroom is happening when his box is too wet. This week his box was changed on Sunday (normal day), and then I changed it on Thursday because he seems to be peeing in the bathroom on Thursdays or Fridays. Well, he waited until today to pee in the bathroom. He also pooped on the floor outside the bathroom (when he's had an infection he's done this before, but I don't think that is the case today). His box was wet, but not excessively so.

So...ideas on how to keep a cleaner/drier box for him that don't include clumping litter?

I honestly don't know, we use Yesterday's News just because we started using that cause the vet told us to use it for a little while after their surgery when they were neutered and we just got used to it...

My wife sprinkles baking soda in the bottom of the box every time she changes it just out of habit, we're not sure it does anything to reduce moisture or odors but it seems like it would so we keep doing it lol.

If the biggest problem is that it's too wet... and scooping it more frequently isn't an option... what about a bigger box or a second box right next to it?

 

[CandyH & Catcat]

mostly my litter box solution won't help you, but ... the litter box my cat likes best is an Igloo type with a built in ramp and the litter area itself beside that; had to go to that because even with conventional covered litter boxes, the dog would still get his head in or paw the cover partly off and ..... ; if Max is ignoring the litter box he may not want to climb into a conventional covered box, so a ramp might help, who knows? we switched to equine stall bedding during a period when we had to keep a litter box open in the upstairs bathroom, did a terrific job of decreasing smell to nearly nothing, plus the solids dried out and sat on top, the pellet material that stuck to those is flushable even with our septic tank, and it was always easy to shake the "sawdust" to the bottom of the box, skim off the unused pellets on top to save for the next go round, then I used that sawdust to mulch landscape plants and it also seemed to deter rodents from getting too close to the house; you mentioned pine pellets, were these the ones sold specifically for cats? may be a difference between that and what we use, which is primarily fir rather than pine, and comes from the farm supply store intended for horses (way cheaper than the cat-specific stuff)

 

[MindyC]

I honestly don't know, we use Yesterday's News just because we started using that cause the vet told us to use it for a little while after their surgery when they were neutered and we just got used to it...

My wife sprinkles baking soda in the bottom of the box every time she changes it just out of habit, we're not sure it does anything to reduce moisture or odors but it seems like it would so we keep doing it lol.

If the biggest problem is that it's too wet... and scooping it more frequently isn't an option... what about a bigger box or a second box right next to it?

The boys already have "jumbo" sized boxes. And since Max's box is now in my living room, and right between the stairs to the basement, and a bedroom door, I can't fit another box in there.

 

[MindyC]

mostly my litter box solution won't help you, but ... the litter box my cat likes best is an Igloo type with a built in ramp and the litter area itself beside that; had to go to that because even with conventional covered litter boxes, the dog would still get his head in or paw the cover partly off and ..... ; if Max is ignoring the litter box he may not want to climb into a conventional covered box, so a ramp might help, who knows? we switched to equine stall bedding during a period when we had to keep a litter box open in the upstairs bathroom, did a terrific job of decreasing smell to nearly nothing, plus the solids dried out and sat on top, the pellet material that stuck to those is flushable even with our septic tank, and it was always easy to shake the "sawdust" to the bottom of the box, skim off the unused pellets on top to save for the next go round, then I used that sawdust to mulch landscape plants and it also seemed to deter rodents from getting too close to the house; you mentioned pine pellets, were these the ones sold specifically for cats? may be a difference between that and what we use, which is primarily fir rather than pine, and comes from the farm supply store intended for horses (way cheaper than the cat-specific stuff)

I might have to look into that. I'm not entirely sure if we can switch the litter in Max's box without having an issue with the other cat, but I have wondered if they could each handle having their own type of litter now that their boxes are not in the same location.

Good point too about the igloo type box and the dogs. I looked at one of those the other day simply because it had a ramp and Max is getting old. We bought a litter box cabinet when we moved his box upstairs several months ago, and it's deep enough that it allows for Max to go into the cabinet before going into the actual litter box. It keeps the golden retriever out of it, but the collie's head is so narrow that she can get into the box when she really wants to.

 

[CandyH & Catcat]

one more thing, what are you using to clean the litter box, and are you cleaning the cover too? am sure you know not to use pine oil products -- since I have a couple extra litter boxes, I clean with detergent and bleach, rinse well, then leave them out on the deck for a day for the wind and the sun's UV to assist the deodorizing/disinfecting (since cats detect smells something like 600% better than we can) -- I know others use vinegar rather than bleach -- I know a number of my cat owning friends never thought about cleaning the cover too ...

 

[Jasper Blue and Jay]

The boys already have "jumbo" sized boxes. And since Max's box is now in my living room, and right between the stairs to the basement, and a bedroom door, I can't fit another box in there.

I might have to look into that. I'm not entirely sure if we can switch the litter in Max's box without having an issue with the other cat, but I have wondered if they could each handle having their own type of litter now that their boxes are not in the same location.

Good point too about the igloo type box and the dogs. I looked at one of those the other day simply because it had a ramp and Max is getting old. We bought a litter box cabinet when we moved his box upstairs several months ago, and it's deep enough that it allows for Max to go into the cabinet before going into the actual litter box. It keeps the golden retriever out of it, but the collie's head is so narrow that she can get into the box when she really wants to.

That's what we have and I like the ramp too because some of the litter comes off their paws as they're coming out but I'm wondering if it ends up being a box that takes up even more space, cause they're huge, but then the ramp makes less actual litter space for them so might get wetter faster? I'm not sure, been a long time since I paid attention how much space it has compared to a regular one...

 

[MindyC]

one more thing, what are you using to clean the litter box, and are you cleaning the cover too? am sure you know not to use pine oil products -- since I have a couple extra litter boxes, I clean with detergent and bleach, rinse well, then leave them out on the deck for a day for the wind and the sun's UV to assist the deodorizing/disinfecting (since cats detect smells something like 600% better than we can) -- I know others use vinegar rather than bleach -- I know a number of my cat owning friends never thought about cleaning the cover too ...

Actually, we use the plastic litter liners (I know, they're bad for the environment, but we started using them when I was pregnant and couldn't change the boxes, it was the only way my husband would do it), so the box itself doesn't get cleaned except every once in a blue moon. If we end up with a hole in the liner, they get cleaned out with something like a clorox wipe after any residue has been removed, allowed to dry, and then new liner/litter are put in. Good point about the covers, I do need to clean his.

 

[CandyH & Catcat]

the ramp makes less actual litter space for them so might get wetter faster?

one good thing about the stall bedding we use, don't have to use nearly so much of it because cat doesn't have to dig through inches of it , oh he still tries, but I keep less than 2 inches of litter in it, and the fir soaks up the moisture so even the sawdust feels dry to him, he doesn't do much covering up either; with the lighter weight and less volume of litter, it's no trouble at all to change the litter every day, or every other day, can go a week or more if the cat isn't flooding it (he's not doing that any more, two days on the wet food and even with the water I am adding to the wet food to make slurry, he's leaving 3 inch diameter wet spots that I can just scoop out and change the whole box only when it's all gone to sawdust -- which is a good time to give it a thorough rinsing so spatters, evaporation, etc don't make it smell like a porta-pottie to him -- he must have been drinking even more water than I realized before diagnosis, he did always seem to be hanging out beside the dog's water dish (capacity over a gallon, dog is a husky/lab mix who runs a lot (chases birds and bunnies off the property), drinks a lot, barks a lot, I have to refill dog's water dish several times a day) and was refilling cat's water bowl too -- now the level barely goes down over a day, I'm adding about 1/8 cup of water to the dish with each can of wet food, not measuring, just adding enough that the lump of food turns into lumpy gravy

 

[Amina&M'row]

Maybe more litter boxes in more places? I am enjoying seeing your compassion, and everyone's great ideas.

 

[Yvonne Street]

Hi Mindy,
It seems like this may be redundant by now...
My cat is 16 and I had problems with him peeing over the side of the litter box. He’d climb in, but then he’d hang his behind over the side-kinda defeats the purpose. It took me awhile, but I realized he didn’t like the clumping litter because it stuck to his paws. I switched to a newspaper pellet litter, like Yesterday’s News just the Petco brand, and haven’t had a problem since.
I also bought a “senior” cat box off of Amazon, which is much larger and lower to the ground and that seems to have helped him as well, as he doesn’t really squat anymore, just stands‍.
I hope you find a solution to your problem!
Best,
Yvonne

 

[FurBabiesMama]

I cannot imagine having a litter box that does not get scooped at least once every day. Some cats are very picky about having a clean box, and if their 'stuff' stays in it for a week, or even half a week, it could turn them off. I saw that you said you cannot use a clumping litter, but have you tried all of the non-clay options? I love Okocat natural wood clumping litter. Or, if all clumping options are out, is there any way you could clean the box out more often?

You also mentioned that you have to use closed boxes. Some cats don't like those either. I guess you don't have any spot in your home that is off limits to the dogs but where the cats could go (with a cat door maybe)?

Is is possible he does have an infection that could be making the behavior worse right now?

 

[MindyC]

I cannot imagine having a litter box that does not get scooped at least once every day. Some cats are very picky about having a clean box, and if their 'stuff' stays in it for a week, or even half a week, it could turn them off. I saw that you said you cannot use a clumping litter, but have you tried all of the non-clay options? I love Okocat natural wood clumping litter. Or, if all clumping options are out, is there any way you could clean the box out more often?

You also mentioned that you have to use closed boxes. Some cats don't like those either. I guess you don't have any spot in your home that is off limits to the dogs but where the cats could go (with a cat door maybe)?

Is is possible he does have an infection that could be making the behavior worse right now?

It is entirely possible he has an infection, and I’m debating what to do with my work schedule tomorrow so i can take him in and get him checked again.

As for the scooping/clumping, I’m hesitant to use any clumping litter because of the other cat. He’s already on prozac for inappropriate urination. My husband will lose his mind if we have two cats peeing where they shouldn’t.

We’ve tried changing the box more often, in fact this week it was changed on Sunday as usual, then i changed it Thursday AM before work just for good measure. He peed in the bathroom sometime Friday night or early Saturday and again Saturday evening (I changed the box again last night before going to bed), and yet he still peed in the bathroom again last night. That’s what is making me think he’s got another infection, except his glucose numbers aren’t skyrocketing, so who knows?

 

[CandyH & Catcat]

I had another thought -- Catcat peed on the bedroom carpet several times before it became so blatantly obvious he had a problem that we were off to the vet for a diagnosis -- and I discovered that he really does not like the smell of Nature's Miracle enzyme treatment (one bottle had Just For Cats, the second bottle had a picture of a cat on it .. and the dog formula has a dog) -- I wonder if you sprayed this stuff in the bathroom where you don't want him to pee, and left it to dry by itself instead of mopping it up, if that might tell him "uh oh, not here" -- we put bath towels down on top of the wet spray and Catcat now tends to walk quickly away from that area

oh, as far as "scooping" -- the equine pellets don't clump (you can get some of the for-cats variety that does), am sure horse owners don't scoop nor want to deal with clumps, but it's really obvious where the pee lands (it turns into fluffy sawdust) and it's really easy to remove that bit (doesn't smell like anything but sawdust) -- or you can just shake the box, the unused pellets come to the top, the sawdust sinks down -- none of the cats that used boxes with that, ever seemed to mind a few bits of sawdust, and this is not just Catcat, but also the five feral barncats I had in quarantine for a month (using litter boxes) before releasing them to the barn where they use the adjoining forest corridor .. insert advertisement for Barncats R Us .. they alter, immunize, microchip, and earclip the healthy shelter cats who aren't suitable as house pets .. some are true wild ferals, some are abuse survivors who no longer trust humans, and some will tame themselves later on; and as a result we no longer have rats, mice, voles, gophers, or moles on the property ...

 

[MindyC]

I had another thought -- Catcat peed on the bedroom carpet several times before it became so blatantly obvious he had a problem that we were off to the vet for a diagnosis -- and I discovered that he really does not like the smell of Nature's Miracle enzyme treatment (one bottle had Just For Cats, the second bottle had a picture of a cat on it .. and the dog formula has a dog) -- I wonder if you sprayed this stuff in the bathroom where you don't want him to pee, and left it to dry by itself instead of mopping it up, if that might tell him "uh oh, not here" -- we put bath towels down on top of the wet spray and Catcat now tends to walk quickly away from that area

oh, as far as "scooping" -- the equine pellets don't clump (you can get some of the for-cats variety that does), am sure horse owners don't scoop nor want to deal with clumps, but it's really obvious where the pee lands (it turns into fluffy sawdust) and it's really easy to remove that bit (doesn't smell like anything but sawdust) -- or you can just shake the box, the unused pellets come to the top, the sawdust sinks down -- none of the cats that used boxes with that, ever seemed to mind a few bits of sawdust, and this is not just Catcat, but also the five feral barncats I had in quarantine for a month (using litter boxes) before releasing them to the barn where they use the adjoining forest corridor .. insert advertisement for Barncats R Us .. they alter, immunize, microchip, and earclip the healthy shelter cats who aren't suitable as house pets .. some are true wild ferals, some are abuse survivors who no longer trust humans, and some will tame themselves later on; and as a result we no longer have rats, mice, voles, gophers, or moles on the property ...

Thank you. I might try switching his box back to the pine pellets. He didn’t seem to have an issue when we tried them before, it was just the other cat that did. If we leave Truman’s box with the clay, we might be okay.

 

[MindyC]

Oh, and Nature’s Miracle has been our stink remover for years...doesn’t seem to matter to him regardless of strength or scent. I bought a different brand the other day, which also doesn’t seem to matter. He seems consistent in looking for a hard surface in the bathroom—he’s always been that way. If he doesn’t use the box he goes somewhere else in a bathroom.