Squeaka Question 3/4/13 - BG going down unexpectantly??

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Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

At the 93 reading he ate but no syrup. Then when he dropped we gave him more syrup on his food and on his gums. He stopped eating for about 30 mins and I gave him a bit more syrup twice, just a finger tip on his gums. Then I tested and got the 94.

My vet doesn't. They just tell you to go to the ER. We contacted a friend's vet a bit ago, that's why it took me a bit long to come back with the test, but they're an hour away and they said to take him to the ER that's closer.
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

Please head the advice they are giving you.

If there are reasons that you absolutely can't take him to the ER, you might want to make coffee, you're going to be up for a while, maybe all night. Hang in there!



You are in my prayers and hope you and your sugar baby come out of this ok.
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

how is he acting now? And is he still interested in food when you offer it, or is he getting full?

Lots of syrup can give them a tummy ache or make them vomit. That's a big concern at this point because his numbers would drop and you probably won't be able to get more food into him then.

Understand that even though his numbers are ok right now, that is because you are keeping them propped up with the food and the syrup. If the food and syrup stop going in, then the numbers will drop.
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

whatever you can do to make this happen... even your friend's vet said to go to the ER.
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

He's resting now. He ate a little more after I tested him at 10:40. Then curled up to sleep some.
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

can you squeeze the "juice" out of a can of food and mix the "juice" with some syrup?

i'd like to get some carbs into him without filling him up.

retest in 30 minutes...
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

RECAP

+11 ~ LO (gave syrup, fed low carb). SEIZURE.
+12 ~ 124 (ate LC)
+12.5 ~ 93 (ate, was there syrup added?)
+13 ~ 84 (did he have food/syrup?)
+13.5 ~ 94
+14 ~ 85
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

+11 ~ LO (gave syrup, fed low carb). SEIZURE.
+12 ~ 124 (ate LC)
+12.5 ~ 93 (ate, was there syrup added?) No syrup added
+13 ~ 84 (did he have food/syrup?) ate but no syrup. added after this reading
+13.5 ~ 94 syrup and food
+14 ~ 85 a little syrup, no food.
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

do you have a good supply of test strips to last the night if necessary? you might have to test every half hour or more if you can't get him to an ER.

can you send DH out for some high carb wet food? look for varieties that say "with gravy" or "gravy lovers".
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

My husband can go out to Walmart and get more strips. I only got the 20 pack but he was asking if he needed to go get more. I still have half of them, but I'll send him soon most likely. He can get more food then too.

I'm still working on some way to be able to take him...
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

i'm really happy to hear you're still working on getting him to an ER.

we're trying to help, but neither libby or i feel comfortable with handling this at home. this isn't a simple low number event. this could turn very, very ugly at a moment's notice.

he really needs to be hospitalized...
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

Test time in five minutes...
Carl
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

I would send DH to the pharmacy soon (maybe call first). My Wal-Mart's pharmacy counter is not open 24 hours. Sometimes they have strips in the little boxes out on the shelves, but often they are out and you have to ask at the pharmacy counter.

Have him get Fancy Feast or Friskies with gravy while he's there.

That said, I hope you can get him to the vet. As Jill said, this is more than we are comfortable handling at home. We'll do the best we can to help, though, if this is what you have to do.
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

Is there anywhere else I can get blood from? I'm having trouble getting anymore from his ears.
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

some people use the paw pads. The big pad. I think you would need to use a deeper lancet setting (if you're using a lancet device) and squeeze to get the blood out.

Are you heating his ears? You can use a rice sock (uncooked rice in a sock, heated in the microwave for a few seconds to warm it up), or a warm washcloth, or just rub the ear for a little while to get the blood flowing. Lucy LOVED her rice sock, I would rub it all over her face and her ear so she would think she was getting a warm massage.
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

I'm using a warm washcoth wrapped in a bag. It's been working up til now. He's getting really irritated with me.
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

Are you warming his ears and making sure the bevel is up on the lancet?

You can test his back toe pads but you'll need to warm them. They don't bleed as easily as ears. You will also need to be sure you hold a cloth to the spot to make sure it stops bleeding and then put neosporin on it. Some cats tolerate it, some don't.

This is another reason to keep working on getting him to the ER. You have to be able to test.
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

if you can't get a number yet, give him some more food/syrup while you're working on it, just in case he is dropping.
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

Sending prayers your way.
Carl
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

good, I'm glad to hear it. I know it's stressful, but it's really the best place for him to be.

Please update us when you get home.

(((((hugs)))))
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

it'll be the best place for him right now.
take care and let us know how things are going...

(((((hugs)))))
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

how is squeaka today?

i hope you'll be able to rest up a little today. you must be exhausted after last night.
be sure to pat yourselves on the back. you did an awesome job keeping squeaka's numbers steady! he's lucky to have you in his corner.
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

I've been sleeping most of the day. I don't feel well with all of this. The got his blood sugar up to normal levels but this evening he had another seizure even though he was at 230. We'll know more when we go get him tonight but we can't keep him there. We have no way to. We can take him to a regular vet tomorrow to get his bloodwork done to see if it's kidney failure causing the seizures but we're at a precipice. We don't want him to suffer, but we don't know what's causing them. Even if we do, if he's going to continue having seizures.. that's not good for him. I don't want my baby to suffer. I wish I could do more. I'm scared, confused, helpless and really hopeless right now.

I really appreciate all of the help and advice everyone gave me trying to help him and us. I so wanted it to only be the insulin that caused it. That seemed logical, but not now unless there is residual effects because of the seizures.
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

I am far too new to offer any kind of advice, but just wanted to wish you and your cat well. I'm amazed at all the responses and advise and encouragement this forum provided you last night. I'm so grateful I've found this resource. Sending lots of good wishes.
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

I also don't have any advice. I just want you to know I'm keeping you and Squeaka in my thoughts.
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

There are many of us here watching to see if he's okay.
I hope you'll come back and tell us what the vet says.
Prayers for you and your furbaby!
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

Any chance he might have gotten an electrical shock somehow...chewing on a wire, etc.? Next, any chance of getting a good cardio check with EKG and echo? Also, full moon coming up.......chance for hypos, seizures,ketones, etc. full moon can affect a lot of things in humans and animals. I had an oldie that would throw a seizure about once a month......kept her on pheno low dose every day.
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

I know he hasn't gotten into any cords. He mostly just stays in the bedroom and everything in here is intact.

To get anything else done we'd have to wait until tomorrow if the other vet will see him. We just can't afford it ourselves and my dad offered to pay the other vet but not the ER.
I never heard about the full moon stuff before...
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

It could be any number of causes. They don't know. He never had seizures before now. Before he was diagnosed with diabetes he never had any problems. And he never had any problems since, until now. I can't really think of anything that's changed in the last bit either, other than age and how long he's been diabetic... I just don't know.
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

Seizures would scare me too. I hope your vet will be able to figure it out and that the solution is something fairly easy. I don't have experience with seizures to know what the causes might be. I would cling to what Hope posted, that her cat just needed a low dose of meds. At least that lets you know that a good outcome is possible, though I know some of the other possible outcomes are more scary.

I really do hope there is a reasonable solution. You have worked so hard and I want Squeaka to get better for you. You both deserve it.
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

Hi. I just wanted to say that I have been following your thread, but have been staying out of the way.
I am keeping your Squeaka in my prayers. Sending White Healing Light to your boy.
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

We just brought him home. We'll make an appointment for followup tomorrow at a regular vet. He did have another episode after the first one that was face twitching and tremors. We'll monitor for any of that tonight. He was at 240 the last the vet checked. They told us to get him to eat and if he does eat his usual 1/3 cup to give him 2 units of lantus. I'm a little scared to give him more lantus at this point but I'm trying to get him to eat all his food at least. He seems hungry.
 
Re: New to the forum - Winchester, VA, USA

I'd be scared too.
Can you change your subject line to add "Dose ?" and put a question mark icon on? It has to be the 1st post.

Hoping a dosing expert will step in.
 
Re: Back From the ER after Hypo - ??DOSE??

I can't answer your dose question, but I'm hoping you maybe didn't give any tonight?

I was able to update your "Subject" and add the question.

Carl
 
Re: Back From the ER after Hypo - ??DOSE??

Cats who we suspect may have had a hypo are often very sensitive to insulin. I certainly would not give him 2u. I'm assuming you didn't shoot tonight. Since you are supposed to see your vet tomorrow, I'd discuss it with him and check back in here so we can see how he's doing.

I'm glad he's home with you and hope the seizures will stop.
 
Re: Back From the ER after Hypo - ??DOSE??

There's medication to control seizures, so you may want to discuss it with your vet. I know of another diabetic cat who had meds for seizures.
 
Re: Back From the ER after Hypo - ??DOSE??

You might check for urine ketones/glucose with ketodiastix until you can see the vet today.
Ketones suggest some insulin is needed; glucose in the urine indicates that blood glucose is over 240, the renal threshold.
 
Re: Back From the ER after Hypo - ??DOSE??

I gave him just 1.5, a little less, because I was scared to give him any, but as he was at 240 I thought I should follow what they said. He did well in the night. He did drink a lot of water and urinate a lot. I didn't get to check for ketones. Checked his level this morning and he's at 145. He goes in to the office at 2:15 today. I'll feed him again around 11am, as he got his food a little before 11:30pm last night. And I want to check him again after eating before giving him any dose.

He's moving all around today. Walking around seeing if he can sneak food and purring, rubbing on us. Haven't seen anymore seizures or twitching.

This whole experience has actually made me sick.
 
Re: Back From the ER after Hypo - ??DOSE??

If you plan on giving him a shot before the vet, you should test his BG before feeding rather than after, so the number isn't confused by food.
Carl
 
Re: Squeaka Dose Question for tonight. 2/25/13

Squeaka had his follow up today. His panels were all normal except for a very low red blood cell count and a bit of a high white blood cell count. The doctor said to get him to eat as much as possible. He's eatten a bit but I would've liked to see him eat more. I'm not sure if I should give him any lantus at all. He hasn't had any since last midnight and that was 1.5 units. The doctor's were telling me to give him 2 units. I just checked him, he ate about 20 minutes ago and his reading is 137. Should I give him any lantus at all?
 
Re: Squeaka Dose Question for tonight. 2/25/13

I wanted to jump in and say, "welcome!" :YMHUG: I've been lurking about, watching everything you've been going through. Great job you're doing so far with Squeaka! :thumbup You must have nerves of steel! Or a very calming husband. I would have been a frantic wreck! :lol:

Did the vet say whether or not he thinks Squeaka might have an infection? How are his teeth? Any information as to why the WBC might be elevated? Any relation to the seizures?

I'm not nearly knowledgeable enough to give dosing advice, but at the very least, I'd hold off on giving any insulin until someone more seasoned comes along to comment. (I've personally never shot anything under 140, yet.)
 
Re: Squeaka Dose Question for tonight. 2/25/13

The vet seemed a bit mystified. He gave me antibiotics in case there is infection because of the white blood cell count. I gave him that. He ate a little bit more after. I'm really hesitant to give him any lantus at all with it only being 137. I do know at the vet's office around 4pm they checked and it was 120, so it's going up. But this morning at 9am it was 145 and it went down on it's own.
His teeth were okay, gums were pale because of the anemia. No one seems to know why he had the seizures. Whether it was triggered by the hypo and then the anemia triggered by that seems the most likely scenario just from reading on the internet. The vet's don't know though, but there is a test coming back on Wednesday to check if his bone marrow is still producing red blood cells. I feel a little scared that they seem so lost on this.

Any advice on the lantus is appreciated. It's past his usual dosing time but I don't think I'll give him any at all unless I'm advised otherwise.
 
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