Slippery sloped into awful situation--not sure what to do

Status
Not open for further replies.

equine99

Member Since 2012
It's been a few months since I've been a regular on here, but maybe someone else has been in a similar situation at some point...

So we were on ProZinc, dosing 0.4u twice a day and doing really really well. I then went on vacation for a week, and the petsitter just totally messed up. I came home, and had to travel for a few days for work, and had to use the same petsitter again because of the timing. When I got back, Snowflake (my cat)'s numbers were high (300-400's) and weren't falling at all. She started to slip into DKA (lost weight, lost appetite completely, high numbers), so I took her into the vet. He ran some tests, told me to up her prozinc (we went up to 2.0u twice a day)--still, that did nothing. she had inverted curves. A few days later she was much worse so I practically demanded a prescription for humulin R (which is what they used when she was in the emergency room, to bring her back down, because I can't afford to have her hospitalized again when I know I can do the shots and I just needed the R). He saw that she was on death's doorstep and gave me the prescription. I got the R and got her numbers back in check right away. As soon as I stopped using the R and went back to just the prozinc, her numbers went right back up, so I continued to supplement with R. I went as high as 6u with just prozinc, with still nothing happening, so I slowly stopped using the prozinc and just used the R (bad, bad, I know, but it was the only thing that worked). Well, over time (that was back in early June) she has been building up a tolerance for the R and we are now at the point where it takes 20 units to make a dent. She's usually in the mid-300's.

Sometimes, I'll give her her dose at night and then when I get up she's in a nice healthy 150ish, so I skip her dose that morning but then when I get home she's 550+. I variably give the doses through IM or in the scruff, depending on how high she is and if I'll be around to give another dose in a few hours (if not, I give it in the scruff, if so, I'll give im). I don't like the idea of giving 20 units in one site for im, so I'll usually do ten on one side and ten on the other. But as time passes, she continues to become less responsive and I need to up the dose. I'm going through vials much more quickly than I would like to, and I know this is a LOT of insulin. I've tried to pull the dose back a few times, but each time I do it, she stays in the "hi" range and starts to get sluggish and weak again.

Aside from the fact that I'm giving her insane amount of insulin, she's doing great. Has put on the weight she lost, has plenty of appetite and energy and seems like a normal happy/content little kitty, but in the long run, I know this can't be maintained.

Have any of you seen or heard of a situation like this? any recommendations?
 
Re: Slippery sloped into awful situation--not sure what to d

I remember you too. I can't help you with ProZinc questions.
I have heard so many stories of people going on vacation and coming home to DKA or almost DKA kitties.

Would you think about switching to a longer acting insulin like Lantus or Levemir?
I use R rarely, but sometimes to bring my kitty down, but I shoot teeny tiny micro doses.

I'm just offering you (((hugs))) right now, and hoping you get the help you need for Snowflake.
 
Re: Slippery sloped into awful situation--not sure what to d

Hi Kathryn -

Not sure if you remember me... I was on ProZinc through May, but after I had the tests for Acro (IGF-1) and Insulin Resistance (IAA), and both came back positive, I did convert over to Levemir. The tests helped me realize that the ProZinc wasn't responding, even shooting 6-9u BID and TID. Grayson did, in fact, need a longer lasting insulin.

I was totally freaked out about starting low with Lev, as we'd had moderate ketones 3x, but we started at 3u and have since worked our way up. Knowing that he was Acro helped me feel better about the aggressive dosing. My SS is current, and you can take a look at both the ProZinc numbers and Lev. I'm still shooting INSANELY high doses, as the SRT (radiation treatment) that is used to treat Acro cats has not yet kicked in (although it's still pretty early since the treatment - tomorrow is 11 weeks). As you'll see, I have JUST started using R in the past 2 weeks. It was a huge step for me, as I've seen other high-dose kitties use it, but I was still scared. It has helped, but the max of R I've shot has been 1.5u. I've never shot IM either... so you're kind of doing something I'm not experienced at.

You may want to talk to your vet and see if they will get you a prescription for Levemir (which is really good for the high-dose kitties as it doesn't sting like Lantus does to some), or Lantus. If you have a chance, you may want to read some of the stickies in the Lev/Lantus forums. Although they are technically different, many of the ways they're handled are the same.

From my 3 months of "swimming in the sea of pinks" (ProZinc) to actually seeing some blue and even green surfs, there has been a huge transition. I just recently printed out two 3-week windows from right after SRT to more recently, and shared with my vet. It was interesting to see the trending going from reds, pinks & high yellows; to low yellows with some blues and a few greens. It helped both of us see the changes I've been seeing in Grayson.

If you'd like to join the Acro/IAA/High-dose kitties on facebook, just shoot me a PM and we can get you over there. I've only been there since June, but have learned a LOT from the others that shoot/have shot high doses, and have been there long enough to see one cat (Perry & Cathy's Sooty), go OTJ at 26 weeks after cyber knife SRT! And he was shooting the highest doses of anyone!

So there is hope for a high-dose kitty... and I'm glad to offer any wisdom I have, and share that invitation to others with more knowledge.

Lu-Ann
 
Re: Slippery sloped into awful situation--not sure what to d

Oh, dear! I've never heard anything like that but my cat Sneakers is a high dose cat- she has acromelegy- and guzzles around 22u of lev BID a day.

I second Lu on checking out the stickies for- not only for Lev and Lantus but also for acromelegy and IAA (insulin auto-antibodies) and see if something looks familiar.
 
Re: Slippery sloped into awful situation--not sure what to d

Because R seldom lasts more than 4 hours, I'm wondering if you've done a curve to see exactly how its working between shots.

If you haven't, I'd encourage doing that to see if there might be any rebounding occurring from going too low. Not saying there is, just saying it should be/should have been ruled out.

Even so, I think checking for the high dose conditions should be done asap, plus doing a trial with Levemir.
 
Re: Slippery sloped into awful situation--not sure what to d

Thanks for all of the advice--I think I'm going to schedule an appointment with the Vet and ask about those and getting her on Levemir!It's nice to hear that I'm not the only one with a high-dose kitty.
 
Re: Slippery sloped into awful situation--not sure what to d

BJM said:
Because R seldom lasts more than 4 hours, I'm wondering if you've done a curve to see exactly how its working between shots.

If you haven't, I'd encourage doing that to see if there might be any rebounding occurring from going too low. Not saying there is, just saying it should be/should have been ruled out.

Even so, I think checking for the high dose conditions should be done asap, plus doing a trial with Levemir.

I've tested her every hour, and usually at +3 hours, it's still quite high, so I don't think that's what's happening.
 
Re: Slippery sloped into awful situation--not sure what to d

That's helpful data to share with the vet to justify getting the tests needed for IAAA and Cushings.

Hang in there.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top