Should I drop her dose now?

Status
Not open for further replies.
Cat girl

Cat girl

Member Since 2015
I went shopping today and went to petsmart and almost every food I was looking for they were out of and some I wasn't sure of the whole brand being ok.wellness core is suppose to be low carb but they had wellness core indoor and not sure that was the correct one.finally I gave up and went for natures variety instinct chicken.a lot better than what she has been eating carb wise.might have to order a food online or have petsmart get the food in or something.all the people who work there don't know anything to help.ok now that I have a lower carb food should I drop her dose some?i have been struggling trying to get it to go down with that other food but should be able to with new food.bought more ff and 9 lives for them too.
 
No, don't drop her dose, but you will want to test enough so that as you're lowering the carbs in her diet, you're watching to keep her safe. Transition slowly...no more than about 25% "new" with old and then gradually add more until you're feeding 100% low carb

It's also important for you to get at least a "before bed" test in on the PM cycle. Most cats go lower at night, so it's possible she's going low at night when you're not testing and then "bouncing" high again by morning

Also with SLGS, you don't change the dose as often as you have been. Even on TR we don't increase more often than every 6 cycles (3 days) unless there are ketones or a history of ketones. You may want to go over the Start Low,Go Slow method because we don't increase the insulin more often than every 7 days on SLGS

When you're using Lantus, think of it like you're steering a barge...you turn the wheel, but it takes awhile for the barge to move completely in the direction you're pointing. There are other insulins that are more like steering a speedboat..you turn the wheel and they react almost immediately, but Lantus doesn't work that way
 
Chris & China said:
No, don't drop her dose, but you will want to test enough so that as you're lowering the carbs in her diet, you're watching to keep her safe. Transition slowly...no more than about 25% "new" with old and then gradually add more until you're feeding 100% low carb

It's also important for you to get at least a "before bed" test in on the PM cycle. Most cats go lower at night, so it's possible she's going low at night when you're not testing and then "bouncing" high again by morning

Also with SLGS, you don't change the dose as often as you have been. Even on TR we don't increase more often than every 6 cycles (3 days) unless there are ketones or a history of ketones. You may want to go over the Start Low,Go Slow method because we don't increase the insulin more often than every 7 days on SLGS

When you're using Lantus, think of it like you're steering a barge...you turn the wheel, but it takes awhile for the barge to move completely in the direction you're pointing. There are other insulins that are more like steering a speedboat..you turn the wheel and they react almost immediately, but Lantus doesn't work that way
Click to expand...
I was getting very frustrated about not getting much control over her sugar.the food I switched to helped a lot but was still too high in carbs.had potatoes peas etc in it.read somewhere that lantus can be raised about every 3 days.so was going by that mostly.i didn't buy enough bg strips so had to lower the amount of my checking to a minimum til I got paid.i usually go shopping once a month.i grabbed 200 bg strips for the month this time.i didn't realize how many strips I would need especially when raising her dose.
 
Cat girl said:
I was getting very frustrated about not getting much control over her sugar.the food I switched to helped a lot but was still too high in carbs.had potatoes peas etc in it.read somewhere that lantus can be raised about every 3 days.so was going by that mostly.i didn't buy enough bg strips so had to lower the amount of my checking to a minimum til I got paid.i usually go shopping once a month.i grabbed 200 bg strips for the month this time.i didn't realize how many strips I would need especially when raising her dose.
Click to expand...
They are eating the natures variety but don't like it as much as their other food.i hope they take to it a little more.sable tried it right off but miss kitty walked up sniffed it and Buried it.i was like oh no I hope that is a save for later bury and not a yuck ewww bury.lol
 
My guys eat the Nature's Variety Raw chicken and they all love it. It's funny, because I never thought I'd get Squallie to eat raw, but he dives right into it and chows down, lol.
 
If they like Fancy Feast classics or Friskies pate's (or 9 Lives pates) those are also low carb foods...and most cats will eat them (especially the Fancy Feast)

You really don't have to spend a lot of money on food...as long as it's below 10% carbs, that's the important part!!

Yes, there's a protocol where you can increase every 3 days, but that's the Tight Regulation Protocol....Your signature says you're using Start Low, Go Slow (SLGS) which means you hold the dose for 7 days before increasing (unless they drop below 90 which is an automatic reduction)

With TR, it's even more important to get those tests in on both cycles because we allow them to go lower (down to below 50) before we reduce the dose. TR is a much more aggressive protocol than the SLGS method and we just want to make sure your kitty stays safe...as well as getting under the best control possible

You'll hear us say it again, but it's good to remember....This is a marathon, not a sprint! There's no quick cures for the vast majority of cats....darn it!!;)
 
Squalliesmom said:
My guys eat the Nature's Variety Raw chicken and they all love it. It's funny, because I never thought I'd get Squallie to eat raw, but he dives right into it and chows down, lol.
Click to expand...
I hope they start liking natures variety more.worried about how much miss kitty is eating today.maybe it is cause she is upset about the meds I put in her ears.i got the chicken kind.i never have been able to get mine to eat meat so figure anything with raw food in it wouldn't go over well.
 
Cat girl said:
I hope they start liking natures variety more.worried about how much miss kitty is eating today.maybe it is cause she is upset about the meds I put in her ears.i got the chicken kind.i never have been able to get mine to eat meat so figure anything with raw food in it wouldn't go over well.
Click to expand...
Mine were the same way, especially Squallie; he would never eat any kind of people food, raw or cooked. But he really likes the Nature's Variety Raw, go figure!
 
Chris & China said:
If they like Fancy Feast classics or Friskies pate's (or 9 Lives pates) those are also low carb foods...and most cats will eat them (especially the Fancy Feast)

You really don't have to spend a lot of money on food...as long as it's below 10% carbs, that's the important part!!

Yes, there's a protocol where you can increase every 3 days, but that's the Tight Regulation Protocol....Your signature says you're using Start Low, Go Slow (SLGS) which means you hold the dose for 7 days before increasing (unless they drop below 90 which is an automatic reduction)

With TR, it's even more important to get those tests in on both cycles because we allow them to go lower (down to below 50) before we reduce the dose. TR is a much more aggressive protocol than the SLGS method and we just want to make sure your kitty stays safe...as well as getting under the best control possible

You'll hear us say it again, but it's good to remember....This is a marathon, not a sprint! There's no quick cures for the vast majority of cats....darn it!!;)
Click to expand...
It just worries me that her sugar isn't going any lower than 200s and only for like a hr.rest of time it is higher.im afraid of damage to organs etc.and I guess my aspergers plays a role in this too.i have to feel like I have control over my life and things and when something like this happens I fall apart.so I think that is why I'm trying harder to get control over her sugar.i feel like the dose is getting so high but it isn't hardly doing anything.
 
Has your vet seen her spreadsheet? I think what I would do is show him her SS and see what he has to say about dose/BG levels. Is she eating all canned food now?
 
Squalliesmom said:
Mine were the same way, especially Squallie; he would never eat any kind of people food, raw or cooked. But he really likes the Nature's Variety Raw, go figure!
Click to expand...
Mine love fruits yogurt veggies candy but would never touch meat for some reason.im just glad they are at least eating it period.so they might start more eventually.i have to keep an eye on miss kitty.she use to go in my purse and steal my lollipops and eat them lol
 
Squalliesmom said:
Has your vet seen her spreadsheet? I think what I would do is show him her SS and see what he has to say about dose/BG levels. Is she eating all canned food now?
Click to expand...
No she still hasn't given up the dry so I bought some natures variety chicken to give them with canned food too.just switched her 2 days ago to the new dry.im getting a new vet.the one I went to was awful.diluting the lantus etc on me.i don't trust her at all.
 
Cat girl said:
No she still hasn't given up the dry so I bought some natures variety chicken to give them with canned food too.just switched her 2 days ago to the new dry.im getting a new vet.the one I went to was awful.diluting the lantus etc on me.i don't trust her at all.
Click to expand...
I doubt you'll see Miss Kitty's BG come down much more until you get her off the dry stuff. As someone told me, when Squallie was still eating dry food, you are just shooting her, and yourself, in the foot as long as she continues to eat the dry food. The Nature's Variety has tapioca as an ingredient and it is second only to cane sugar in carbohydrate content. Here is a link to an article about it: http://www.wysong.net/pet-health-and-nutrition/tapioca-in-pet-food.php
 
Well since there's still dry, you have to stay with SLGS since TR requires low carb canned or raw only

I think it's possible that you've gone up too fast too...with SLGS, we would have started her at probably 1U and she would have only gone up .25 per week...so at this point, she'd only be at 2U and you're approaching 4U....At MOST we would have increased .5 per week but only if you were getting those PM tests in and an occasional curve

It's REALLY important for you to start getting some tests on that PM cycle....it's possible Miss Kitty is going lower at night and then "bouncing" high again by morning. Grabbing a "before bed" test at night may be the key to finding out what's going on

You must stop responding to those higher Pre-shot numbers by increasing too. Lantus dosing is based on how LOW it takes them so as hard as it is, you need to hold each dose for at least a week and then do a curve (every 2 hours for 12 hours or every 3 hours for 18 hours) and see how she's doing.
 
The Natures Variety Instinct dry, is 12% carbs. You should try to wean her off it. Is your insulin still diluted, or did you straighten that out? image.jpg
 
Squalliesmom said:
I doubt you'll see Miss Kitty's BG come down much more until you get her off the dry stuff. As someone told me, when Squallie was still eating dry food, you are just shooting her, and yourself, in the foot as long as she continues to eat the dry food. The Nature's Variety has tapioca as an ingredient and it is second only to cane sugar in carbohydrate content. Here is a link to an article about it: http://www.wysong.net/pet-health-and-nutrition/tapioca-in-pet-food.php
Click to expand...
I know I'm trying to get her off it.this food is a lot better than what I had her on.had peas cranberries potatoes etc in it.she gets so upset without the dry and refuses to let me sleep if I don't give her any.my civie will go with anything.wish miss kitty was that easy.i think the switch is finally helping though just took her bg test.i got 3 200s today!so crossing my fingers that it gets better.im going to do some night tests too.i wasn't able to do many before cause was low on bg strips.this month I made sure to buy 200 instead of 100.i only go shopping once a month usually.
 
Cat girl said:
I know I'm trying to get her off it.this food is a lot better than what I had her on.had peas cranberries potatoes etc in it.she gets so upset without the dry and refuses to let me sleep if I don't give her any.my civie will go with anything.wish miss kitty was that easy.i think the switch is finally helping though just took her bg test.i got 3 200s today!so crossing my fingers that it gets better.im going to do some night tests too.i wasn't able to do many before cause was low on bg strips.this month I made sure to buy 200 instead of 100.i only go shopping once a month usually.
Click to expand...
I tried getting miss kitty something better in food but petsmart was out of all that I wanted and wasn't sure which one to pick on the wellness core so went with last resort natures variety.
 
I would really try hard to wean her off the dry as soon as possible. If you absolutely must keep feeding her dry, then get some Young Again Zero Carb or Evo Turkey & Chicken and try mixing it for a week or so until she is completely weaned off dry food! I know it's hard to not feed her what she wants, but you are the one responsible for seeing that she eats appropriately for her diabetes, not her! The longer she stays on the higher carb dry, the more damage continues to happen to her system from high blood glucose, jeopardizing her chances at remission.
 
Squalliesmom said:
I would really try hard to wean her off the dry as soon as possible. If you absolutely must keep feeding her dry, then get some Young Again Zero Carb or Evo Turkey & Chicken and try mixing it for a week or so until she is completely weaned off dry food! I know it's hard to not feed her what she wants, but you are the one responsible for seeing that she eats appropriately for her diabetes, not her! The longer she stays on the higher carb dry, the more damage continues to happen to her system from high blood glucose, jeopardizing her chances at remission.
Click to expand...
she just gets so upset if I take it away so going very slowly.she cries and cries and and paces back and forth then hurts herself trying to get up where I use to keep the food.i thought putting it in frig.would help but she thinks it is where I use to keep it.then at night besides the crying and jumping around she comes up on bed and refuses to let me sleep.she will lay there and meow or blip until I open my eyes then she stares and if I try to close my eyes she meows or blips and taps me on arm.this will go on all night.no dry no sleep.
 
Cat girl said:
she just gets so upset if I take it away so going very slowly.she cries and cries and and paces back and forth then hurts herself trying to get up where I use to keep the food.i thought putting it in frig.would help but she thinks it is where I use to keep it.then at night besides the crying and jumping around she comes up on bed and refuses to let me sleep.she will lay there and meow or blip until I open my eyes then she stares and if I try to close my eyes she meows or blips and taps me on arm.this will go on all night.no dry no sleep.
Click to expand...
I wrote down dry foods that were on the list if foods and the main ones I wanted weren't there.wellness core was but I wasn't sure which wellness core I was to get.i wanted hills or purina w/d or royal canin diabetic.i thought or ordering online but a lot of those foods are expensive and I was wondering how they are delivered?ups?this food was $26 for a 5.5 lbs of food and that is high priced for me but as long as it stays around $25 that I can handle somewhat.what is the cheapest diabetic food online and size of bag if you know?im on disability and have a lot of health problems myself.i used all my dental money I had saved up on miss kitty when she had her surgery.i rather have her than get my teeth fixed.i don't want to put her to sleep.im not giving up the fight.
 
Cat girl said:
I wrote down dry foods that were on the list if foods and the main ones I wanted weren't there.wellness core was but I wasn't sure which wellness core I was to get.i wanted hills or purina w/d or royal canin diabetic.i thought or ordering online but a lot of those foods are expensive and I was wondering how they are delivered?ups?this food was $26 for a 5.5 lbs of food and that is high priced for me but as long as it stays around $25 that I can handle somewhat.what is the cheapest diabetic food online and size of bag if you know?im on disability and have a lot of health problems myself.i used all my dental money I had saved up on miss kitty when she had her surgery.i rather have her than get my teeth fixed.i don't want to put her to sleep.im not giving up the fight.
Click to expand...
All of those dry foods are going to be too high in carbs for Miss Kitty. Evo (in the purple bag) and Young Again Zero Carb are the only low/no carb dry cat foods on the market. Evo is about $45 for a 15.4 lb bag at Chewy.com (they use FedEx to deliver). YAZC is $30 for a four lb bag and can only be purchased at their website: https://www.youngagainpetfood.com/zero-formula.html

I have used both brands and the Evo made Squallie's BG rise, but a lot of people here have had luck with it; I ended up giving my almost-full bag to a local shelter, that sure hurt my budget (I'm on disability, too)! He was okay with the YAZC but I transitioned him, and all my cats, to canned mixed with frozen raw, so much better for them than dry! If you get the YAZC they recommend it be the only food you feed you cat but it seems like a lot of people here who use it still feed canned, too.

Hope this helps you some. I know how hard it can be on the wallet, believe me. I have four cats and two of them eat special diets, meaning I have to have something that all of them can eat or I risk having my special diet guys sneaking the wrong foods from their housemates. I am always looking for a less expensive, safe diet to give them. Right now I spend well over $200 a month on cat food - my kids joke that I spend more on cat food than I do food for the family; they may be right, lol!
 
I should have mentioned that the YAZC lasts longer than an average 4lb bag of cat food because it is very dense and you feed so much less. Also, Evo is available from many retailers, both online and in stores; Chewy.com is the cheapest one I have found so far.
 
Squalliesmom said:
All of those dry foods are going to be too high in carbs for Miss Kitty. Evo (in the purple bag) and Young Again Zero Carb are the only low/no carb dry cat foods on the market. Evo is about $45 for a 15.4 lb bag at Chewy.com (they use FedEx to deliver). YAZC is $30 for a four lb bag and can only be purchased at their website: https://www.youngagainpetfood.com/zero-formula.html

I have used both brands and the Evo made Squallie's BG rise, but a lot of people here have had luck with it; I ended up giving my almost-full bag to a local shelter, that sure hurt my budget (I'm on disability, too)! He was okay with the YAZC but I transitioned him, and all my cats, to canned mixed with frozen raw, so much better for them than dry! If you get the YAZC they recommend it be the only food you feed you cat but it seems like a lot of people here who use it still feed canned, too.

Hope this helps you some. I know how hard it can be on the wallet, believe me. I have four cats and two of them eat special diets, meaning I have to have something that all of them can eat or I risk having my special diet guys sneaking the wrong foods from their housemates. I am always looking for a less expensive, safe diet to give them. Right now I spend well over $200 a month on cat food - my kids joke that I spend more on cat food than I do food for the family; they may be right, lol![/QUOTE
EVO don't sound too bad in price.i thought it was $45 for a 3.5lb bag of food!im probably going to order some of that if I can't get her off the dry.$200 a month!! wow that is expensive.i also need a food that both my cats can eat like you cause it is hard to separate them.i would have to be door opener to cat cages or something.so hill's prescription w/d and m/d diabetic cat foods and royal canin diabetic cat food are too high in carbs too?that is the foods I was mainly looking for at petsmart.natures variety instinct was my last resort food if I could find the others since it was all over internet saying it was good for diabetic cats.this is so confusing.i have enough money to order her some EVO this month and if they don't finish it my mom will feed her cats with it or I will give it to the stray cats outside that I feed regular dry food to that I have.i at least have this food to give her til I get the Evo.it is so much better for her than the simply nourish as carbs go.i wish the cat food bags had the carb amount written on the bags.i don't know how to figure how much is in them.
Click to expand...
 
Squalliesmom said:
I should have mentioned that the YAZC lasts longer than an average 4lb bag of cat food because it is very dense and you feed so much less. Also, Evo is available from many retailers, both online and in stores; Chewy.com is the cheapest one I have found so far.
Click to expand...
Evo and yazc don't sound bad at all.thanks!i was thinking it was $45 for a 3.5lb bag of food!i also need a food that both cats can eat.i would have to feed them in cat cages or something to separate them.$200 a month WOW.how do you do it?lol
 
Cat girl said:
Evo and yazc don't sound bad at all.thanks!i was thinking it was $45 for a 3.5lb bag of food!i also need a food that both cats can eat.i would have to feed them in cat cages or something to separate them.$200 a month WOW.how do you do it?lol
Click to expand...
I wrote something earlier but it ended up I a strange place.
 
Cat girl said:
I wrote something earlier but it ended up I a strange place.
Click to expand...
So hill's prescription diet m/d and w/d diabetic and royal canin diabetic cat foods are too high in carbs too?so confusing.how do you figure the carb content out?wish they wrote it on the bags.
 
Cat girl said:
So hill's prescription diet m/d and w/d diabetic and royal canin diabetic cat foods are too high in carbs too?so confusing.how do you figure the carb content out?wish they wrote it on the bags.
Click to expand...
I'm probably going to get some EVO and if they don't finish it the strays I feed can have it or my moms 20 cats can.at least I have this natures variety for her until I get the EVO.she was on simply nourish source.
 
Cat girl said:
Evo and yazc don't sound bad at all.thanks!i was thinking it was $45 for a 3.5lb bag of food!i also need a food that both cats can eat.i would have to feed them in cat cages or something to separate them.$200 a month WOW.how do you do it?lol
Click to expand...
You're very welcome, hope one of them works out for you! For future reference should you need it, this site has a list of some of the other dry foods you mentioned. You will see, the carb contents are through the roof!!! Evo and YACZ aren't listed there but Evo is about 8% carbs, I believe, and obviously the YAZC speaks for itself.Good luck, and keep us posted, I hope this will help you bring down Miss Kitty's BG, but PLEASE also work on weaning her off the dry altogether (it's healthier for Sable, too)! It might mean a few sleepless nights but she'll get the hang of it, I went through the same thing with my kitties. :):):)
 
Cat girl said:
So hill's prescription diet m/d and w/d diabetic and royal canin diabetic cat foods are too high in carbs too?so confusing.how do you figure the carb content out?wish they wrote it on the bags.
Click to expand...
These foods are WAY too high in carbs for a diabetic cat, no matter what they claim. Hill's m/d is 14% and their w/d is 25%. Royal Canin dry foods run any where from 14% to 38% carbs, except for their Recovery formula which is 7%.

Believe me, we all wish they'd put this info on the bags/cans of all cat foods! Here are links to two well-respected sites that list some of the more popular cat foods and the nutritional breakdown, including carb content:

http://www.catinfo.org/docs/FoodChartPublic9-22-12.pdf

http://binkyspage.tripod.com/CanFoodNew.html
 
Squalliesmom said:
These foods are WAY too high in carbs for a diabetic cat, no matter what they claim. Hill's m/d is 14% and their w/d is 25%. Royal Canin dry foods run any where from 14% to 38% carbs, except for their Recovery formula which is 7%.

Believe me, we all wish they'd put this info on the bags/cans of all cat foods! Here are links to two well-respected sites that list some of the more popular cat foods and the nutritional breakdown, including carb content:

http://www.catinfo.org/docs/FoodChartPublic9-22-12.pdf

http://binkyspage.tripod.com/CanFoodNew.html
Click to expand...
Wow they shouldn't claim to be diabetic food and stuff if they aren't that isn't right!makes me mad.i believe I will go with EVO.they sell in stores too?which store sell it do you know?probably will have to order online.
 
Squalliesmom said:
I doubt you'll see Miss Kitty's BG come down much more until you get her off the dry stuff. As someone told me, when Squallie was still eating dry food, you are just shooting her, and yourself, in the foot as long as she continues to eat the dry food. The Nature's Variety has tapioca as an ingredient and it is second only to cane sugar in carbohydrate content. Here is a link to an article about it: http://www.wysong.net/pet-health-and-nutrition/tapioca-in-pet-food.php
Click to expand...
I was reading ingredients on EVO and it has tapioca in it too along with apples,cranberries and peas.is this a different kind of EVO?is there a diabetic EVO or are these ingredients not effecting the carb level?
 
This is the Evo I was referring to: http://www.chewy.com/cat/evo-turkey-chicken-cat-kitten/dp/32562

It does have tapioca in it but I'm guessing it's not in high enough quantity to cause too much problems for diabetic cats (honestly, in my opinion, it has too many other things that I think would raise BG, as well). Scroll down the page at the link I gave you and read the reviews; a lot of the people purchasing it have diabetic cats and it works for them, and several people here use it with good results. As I said, I did not have much luck with it, it made Squallie's BG rise. I have used the YAZC with good results.

Cat girl said:
Wow they shouldn't claim to be diabetic food and stuff if they aren't that isn't right!
Click to expand...
I know, so very frustrating!!! Those so-called "prescription" foods are no better for diabetic cats than most of the OTC foods, and in some case they are actually worse! I blame it on corporate greed.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top