Sams spread sheet up

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sueandsamwise

sueandsamwise

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I got Sam's spread sheet up with a lot of help from Sue and Oliver. Could some of you other Pzi users tell me what you think. I know it's kind of sparse, especially for pre shots but we suck at getting blood. Sam is on .5 u morning and 1u in the evening. His numbers are not all that great. Thanks. :smile:
 
dearest dear robin....why so conservative? do you SEE those numbers? 1U at least. slow and go. but i am not in favor of the no test shot...even if kitty did eat. very important.
ya never know when kitty will throw you a low # for absolutly no reason at all.
right gang?
this is your most important and valuable tool, the pre shot test.
 
actually looking at this ss, you have so few pre shot #'s and that one +2 in the 200's is not any good becuase we just dont know if what kind of movement that was. you learn absolutley nothing at +shot #'s if you don't know what you started with.
does this make sense?
so i take back my comment to robin cause actually don't know what's going on yet.
 
Hey, I'm trying okay! Don't make this any harder on me than it is already. We did a PMPS and you can see the damn #'s is higher than hell. Why he is having some much trouble getting regulated I don't know, maybe he needs a higher dose. He goes to the vet Tuesday for a totally useless frigging test and God knows how much it will cost. We are on a limited income and I am feeling a little brow beaten. We'll do another test +2. cat(2)_steam
 
I'm so sorry, please don't feel brow beaten. It takes time to get regulated, take a look at my Harley's ss it took us 3 months to make any progress.

What test are you getting at the vet? Frutosamine? You don't really need that, you already know he is high, so don't pay for it, save the money for food and insulin.

We are on a limited income too. We are here to help not hurt.
 
Sorry I flew off the handle. I was really feeling like **** yesterday because of Sam and his crappy numbers. He is taking forever on this insulin. Yeah, it's the fructomine test. I told my husband to take him in and give them a copy of his spread sheet so maybe they wouldn't do the test. I don't know. His numbers were even worse today. 422 and 500.
 
It's ok. We all have felt the frustration. This is the best place to vent because we can all relate

The learning curve with this is steep and overwhelming, in the beginning I wanted Harley better and I wanted it NOW.

But here we are. We are all here in the same boat so you're among family.
 
You can't take this stuff personally. It is not in the best interest of your kitty. Diabetes management for kitties is a marathon not a sprint.

Just keep plugging away - the folk in here are beyond wonderful and will help you along.
 
sue it's ok, sometimes it seems like we're just poking you to death with questions, thoughts, theory's. i think it's really becuase we want sam to come down as much as you do.believe it or not we care so very much.
i'm glad gator is on board, he's an old-timer with mucho experience but he can be a little pushy and mathamatically brainey at times :lol: (luvs ya gator ;-) )
let's just keep plugging along and we will not leave you ever until kitty's doing better. sometimes it takes longer than others.
lori and tom
 
I know, it's great here because you can answer questions and not be so holier than thou about it like my vet. She is a cousin of a friend of mine and knows I know her cousin who now won't ever let her near her horses again. She botched a gelding, left him bleeding like crazy in a stall so Suzie sort of hates her. She will look at you like you are a piece of dog crap on her shoe and never smiles. Ever. The only good thing she ever did was take in two kittens we found in our yard with horrible URI's and rehome them. One is a clinic cat with one eye and the other was adopted out very quickly. She likes cats but not owners, thinks every one is a SPO. So, she has me frustrated and I won't go back. I am actively looking for a new vet that understands home testing is the way to go and not berate you in the lobby of her clinic over food.

Sorry for the rant but we will test Sam in another half hour to see how this shot is going. Thanks for listening and like Rob I want Sam well and I want it now too. :!:
 
Some here limit the info they tell their vet for some of the reasons you have encountered. As long as you can get a script for insulin then everything else diabetes wise is in your hands and not the vets. Just keep in mind what is best for your kitty - telling the vet everything is sometimes counterproductive.
 
good call on that gator. the vet's can actually be counter productive!
 
I think the key is to find a Vet with an open mind.

I had the same sort of experience with my Vet. I naively thought she would want to learn about this site and all of the information but she didn't.

I changed to a Vet that encourages home testing and loves to get copies of his ss.

Hang in there.
 
I've got a line on one to call Monday. Hopefully, he'll be a bit more open minded. There are 3 other vets at the clinic Sam goes to but without talking to all three I don't know how they'll react either. Do what the boss says or not. Sam's AMPS was Hi this morning. He's scarfing down lots of food now.
 
I'm late to the party but just wanted to say ((((hugs)))) hang in there. We all get the frustration, unfortuately most here have been through similar stuff, otherwise we probably wouldn't still be here, lol!

On any insulin, it typically takes weeks to months to get regulated. Some cats are "easy" and pop into good #s in their first or second week on insulin, and make all the rest of us totally jealous :lol: but they are really the exception. I would say there are few cats that I have seen who are regulated in less than a month, and many that are not regulated by then.

So I would definitely try to shift your expectations to something closer to a month. If he's not regulated by then, you can go cat(2)_steam , but before the month mark it's more of a confused_cat .

I am glad you evened out the doses - I think that will really help make it easier to make sense of the data and figure out what his insulin needs really are.

I'm actually still a fan of trying .75/.75 for a dose. That 1u back at the beginning of the SS looked potentially too high a dose, and you've gotten some yellows on only 0.5, and now on 1u you've got some pretty high #s cropping up. That's why I would want to try 0.75 for 2 or 3 days (barring low #s of course), and then get some curve data. If you are sure 0.75 is too low, then I'd go up to 1u, but right now I'm not convinced he needs as much as 1u, and you have some better #s on less insulin.

If you don't want to lower the dose though, then I would try to get some curve data on this dose. It could be you are hitting good #s and seeing higher PS as a reaction, or it could be a short-duration issue that is giving you the higher PSs. Hard to say for sure right now, but I'm sure you will get it figured out!!! :-D
 
Since the DH had charge of Sam this morning, he didn't test, did give shot and took him to the vet. He forgot the meter, I wanted him to see how it stacked up against theirs, didn't ask any questions I wanted him to (and told him to ask) did take Sam's log book and they just said it's a good idea to keep it up. Then she told him to feed then shoot him right away. Others said wait for half and hour, others wait until 8am. He gets fed when i get up at 6am but I'd like him to have his food on the belly for a bit before he get his shot. So, even though I don't feel very warm and fuzzy towards this vet I guess I'll have to go the next time. Sometimes husbands are pretty useless.
 
I guess you will have to go and have the difficult conversations yourself. Print out the Convert a Vet stickey and take that with you next time maybe.
 
Hi Sue,

Then she told him to feed then shoot him right away. Others said wait for half and hour, others wait until 8am. He gets fed when i get up at 6am but I'd like him to have his food on the belly for a bit before he get his shot.
Click to expand...

I always like to know "WHY" about what i'm told to do by anyone, including folks here and my vet, so I hope this helps you. :-D

The typical "onset" of Prozinc begins at +2, in other words it takes 2 hours before a shot begins working noticeably in their body. The typical curve pattern is (or used to be) explained in the PZI stickies, so it might help you decipher what you are seeing with his numbers.

The pattern I used to see on Prozinc all the time was this:
preshot- -test, feed, shoot (right after each other)
+1 and +2 -rising numbers from the food and the previous shot wearing off
+3 -beginning of downward movement
+4 through +7 or 8 -a fairly even, low point of the curve, maximum effect of the insulin
+8 through +12 - rising numbers

It's obviously scary/dangerous to shoot and then find out your cat won't eat, so always test, then feed, then shoot.
Food hits the blood stream within minutes, but the insulin takes a couple hours, so IMO its desirable to shoot immediately after food. As soon as you know he has food in his stomach, get that insulin started. ;-)
 
Sam tends to eat a bit at 6 am then again about 7:30. We gave his shot early about 7:45. We are trying to stay on an 8am/8pm schedule. I'll print out what you wrote down about the action of the PZI. It will be handy to have. We are going to do a curve on Sunday so we'll know what he's doing. The vet did say that the test showed his highest number was 366. Which means our meter is way off. I did so want it tested against theirs to see.
 
vets probably test with a animal meter, which does vary from human meters. I think Joanna and bix use one and could tell you which one reads higher- I NEVER can remember which way it goes

and fructosamine test numbers do not equally correspond to human glucometer numbers either, for a conversion do a google or fdmb search.
 
Thanks, I'll do that. The pet meters are way more expensive aren't they? Sam is doing a lot better, bugging us for food again, sitting on his begging stool, not peeing as much, etc. He seems to be back to his normal self. We are both really relieved. I still hope to get him off the juice again.
 
yes from what I've heard, the pet meters and there strips are MUCH more expensive. And in my mind, more frequent readings (that I know are slightly off in one direction), are perfect for showing what I need to know- trends and dangerous extremes. So keep using your Relion (if thats what you use), it's a good meter.

the WCR, whole cat report, is VERY important, so thats fantastic that he's doing better.

I know you had trouble with the testing before, has that gotten easier? Have you heard of or tried the warm rice sock in the MW trick? I never did it, but it supposedly really helps. And I prefer the clear top lancets, so I can see the spot.

My technique:
I rub ears vigorously. fold his ear over my finger, hold the lancet on for a good 3-5 sec waiting for the spot to turn pink, then pop it CONTINUING to hold it on the spot until enough blood oozes out, carefully lift it off, test, then immediately press firmly on the bleed and hold for 3-5 sec to stop future bruising. then he eats- YAY! reward!

If you look at our ss you will see I test a lot and Cody's ears are fine.
Also lancets come in different needle sizes, the ones that are 26 or 28 gauge will make a bigger hole and bleed better. avoid the 31 gauge lancets. Lancets are cheap, and I change mine every couple days and daily if I am concerned about a questionable test result.
 
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