Rundown and advice

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Stephanie Montgomery

Stephanie Montgomery

Member Since 2016
Hi, I am about to begin my cats insulin Monday. He just got diabetes because 6 weeks ago he was tested for something else and came clear on diabetes. He's over his other problem now (vestibular) and was on steroids which I gave him and weaned him off. Vet said they think he got diabetes because of his age (almost 12), he was slightly overweight (which I didn't ever think he was at 12 lbs), and that he was on the steroids (topical in the flap of ear). Plus he was mostly a dry food eater his whole life. Tobey my cat loves to eat canned or wet food but I just didn't know much before this happened. I always knew it was better for them but didn't know it can cause diabetes. Now I regret it. Well, I'm pretty stressed out now. I am a busy working single mom of 2 and have 3 other cats who still like wet food but it's so much easier with my busy life to scoop out the dry, ya know?? Now I am aware I have to make changes and get organized and plan ahead with this new daily routine. I have a feeling he could easily go into remission because of how soon he just got diabetes. Pretty sure I got the canned food picked out and sure it'll all work out fine. I am about to try and find a glucose tester and the strips. Anyone know of a good place to buy since I need by Monday? Also he's on the Prozinc insulin and I just bought that from costco with 100 count of 100U syringes 31 gauge for $146 total. Good deal there?
 
Hi Stephanie, many of us use the Relion Confirm or Micro from Walmart. It needs a tiny drop of blood, and the strips are reasonably priced. You'll need to get some lancets to prick the ear, get size 25-28gauge to start. You may want to pick up some ketone test strips too while you're there. ProZinc is a good insulin. @Sue and Oliver (GA) is a great guide to it's use. It is a u40 insulin and needs u40 syringes unless you are using a conversion table. So check the syringes to make sure what you have.
 
Sharon14 said:
Hi Stephanie, many of us use the Relion Confirm or Micro from Walmart. It needs a tiny drop of blood, and the strips are reasonably priced. You'll need to get some lancets to prick the ear, get size 25-28gauge to start. You may want to pick up some ketone test strips too while you're there. ProZinc is a good insulin. @Sue and Oliver (GA) is a great guide to it's use. It is a u40 insulin and needs u40 syringes unless you are using a conversion table. So check the syringes to make sure what you have.
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Ok thank you. I will go to Walmart and check out those. Can I get all of that at Wal-Mart? My insulin is u100 not u40.
 
Ok, I wasn't aware ProZinc came in u100 strength! You can get all the testing supplies at Walmart, and they also sell syringes if you need more in the future.
 
Welcome to FDMB, Stephanie.

Feeding dry food is definitely easier when you are busy working Mom but canned food would be much better for Tobey and your other cats as well. If you are located in the US, there are a few dry food selections that are low in carbs including EVO Cat & Kitten, Wysong Epigen 90 and Young Again which is only available online.

Many folks freeze canned food in an ice cube tray or such and leave out the frozen food for consumption as it thaws. Not sure if that would work for you with 4 furry kids.

Are you sure it's ProZinc insulin? ProZinc is a pet specific insulin and here in Canada, it would only be available through a vet or from a pet pharmacy and to my knowledge it's only available in u40 strength.
 
Stephanie Montgomery said:
He's over his other problem now (vestibular) and was on steroids which I gave him and weaned him off.
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There is a very good chance that this is steroid induced diabetes. Since he had a clean bill of health prior to the steroids that seems to be a strong possibility. Now that you are finished the steroids and using a wet low carb food it is VERY important that you are able to home test. The glucose levels he was at while taking the steroids can drop a fair amount once all the steroid is out of the system. His insulin requirements could change a lot and quickly.
 
PZI BCP comes in U100 strength but is compounded by only a few pharmacies. I hadn't heard that Costco carried it. Are you sure it is U100? Not a bad price for insulin and supplies, but am curious about the U40/U100 thing.

Agree to start low and go slow. When he is off steroids and onto wet food, his levels could change drastically. No shots under 200. Be sure to catch the nadir; you don't want it below 50.
 
Larry and Kitties said:
ProZinc comes only in U100 strength.
You can order BCP PZI in U100, U40 and maybe U50 strength. You maybe be able to order PZI insulin from other compounding pharmacies in U100.
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ProZinc is U40, not U100. At least that is the only kind I have seen.

Hope we haven't completely confused you, Stephanie. Maybe look on the bottle and see what it says and post it.
 
Sue and Oliver (GA) said:
ProZinc is U40, not U100. At least that is the only kind I have seen.

Hope we haven't completely confused you, Stephanie. Maybe look on the bottle and see what it says and post it.
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I will look on my bottle when I get home. I bought the u100 syringes so hopefully if wrong I'll get a exchange or refund. The pharmacy is the ones who gave them to me when I picked up my script.
 
Sue and Oliver (GA) said:
PZI BCP comes in U100 strength but is compounded by only a few pharmacies. I hadn't heard that Costco carried it. Are you sure it is U100? Not a bad price for insulin and supplies, but am curious about the U40/U100 thing.

Agree to start low and go slow. When he is off steroids and onto wet food, his levels could change drastically. No shots under 200. Be sure to catch the nadir; you don't want it below 50.
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What is nadir? Don't want to sound dumb. Sorry! Also, my first visit tonight at vet is to show me how to inject and explain everything I need to know. Vet told me not to adjust the amount or units until after 2 weeks and he will get a curve done. I am confused of what to do now. Do I wait those 2 weeks like vet said or do I check his BG and make my own adjustment? He's been more lethargic lately and has uos and downs of his energy level. He's strictly on wet high protein low carb food. Mind you, I have 3 other cats and feel pressured because now needing to change all 4 of their food the same as Tobey's. It's much more stressful and time consuming now. I am a mom and work full time... I just don't know where to begin. It all starts tonight. Nervous but anxious to get my boy Tobey feeling better.
 
MrWorfMen's Mom said:
Welcome to FDMB, Stephanie.

Feeding dry food is definitely easier when you are busy working Mom but canned food would be much better for Tobey and your other cats as well. If you are located in the US, there are a few dry food selections that are low in carbs including EVO Cat & Kitten, Wysong Epigen 90 and Young Again which is only available online.

Many folks freeze canned food in an ice cube tray or such and leave out the frozen food for consumption as it thaws. Not sure if that would work for you with 4 furry kids.

Are you sure it's ProZinc insulin? ProZinc is a pet specific insulin and here in Canada, it would only be available through a vet or from a pet pharmacy and to my knowledge it's only available in u40 strength.
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Thanks you for the reply, yes I am in US, Texas actually. Yes it's definitely Prozinc. My vet just found out its offered at Costco now.
 
Stephanie Montgomery said:
Thanks you for the reply, yes I am in US, Texas actually. Yes it's definitely Prozinc. My vet just found out its offered at Costco now.
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Do you add water to the food before freezing to make it thinner? Also needing to know tips on making it more efficient and neater to serve wet food. I use small paper plates instead of having to wash the bowls out but when the eat plates slide over my tile and also food get on baseboards and it's just another thing to do. Tips here on how to serve food? So many little details that make this so much easier to deal with. Lol!
 
You can add a little water to thin the food down although I have simply frozen it as is myself. As for the mess wet food creates, I really don't have any great suggestions. I have one very messy eater and can relate to food on the baseboards etc. Perhaps you could try putting a screen of some sort up against the wall (e.g Cardboard covered in sticky shelf paper for quick wipe downs) and feeding with the plates up against that on top of a non-slide pet food placemat of some sort to prevent both the mess and sliding.

Just to be clear, ProZinc is a u40 insulin and if you use U100 syringes with it, you have to use a conversion chart to ensure correct dosing.
 
welcome:bighug:
I am pretty sure I have some U40 needles if you would like them--send me a PM if your interested. I was on pro zinc before Lantus:cat:
 
I'm considering not taking him to the vet just yet. There's a lot of people saying to test his BG before starting him and taking to vet. Saving money and possibly his life. My vet is kind of stuborn and doesn't really believe in a lot of things from this forum. I have my gut instinct telling me to continue the newly adapted wet food diet, test him daily, and then decide to start insulin basedo on my findings and observations of course. I will monitor him closely but am not so anxious to give him insulin until I know for a fact he's diabetic. Testing him at home will give me a huge difference. See where I'm coming from versus my vet being so pushy and negatively acting on his diagnosis?
 
Stephanie, I am so glad to have found someone who is planning to do the same thing as me. I was prescribed Lantus, which is very expensive ($100 for 3ml or $300 for 10ml), so I have yet to take that plunge since I just dropped $500+ at the vet. I have eliminated dry food (I have 2 cats, figure the other better get started on wet food too) and am only giving them Fancy Feast Classic Beef & Poultry Variety, which is supposed to be the most low-carb option of theirs. Many people have vouched for it online. Treats are only freeze-dried chicken and a little serving of chicken breast in water. These were treats I found in my local Petco. Gotta look for a while before finding them.

My Serena tested in the 500's at the vet when I took her in Saturday (thought something else was wrong with her, turned out to be Diabetes). When I got home I dumped the dry food. I tested her last night and got a reading in the 300's. So, I'm going to give it another several days or so, and see what the levels are looking like. Then I'll make a decision about the insulin.

I'd love to hear your progress as well.
 
Sure and thank you for sharing that with me. Very helpful. I haven't tested Tobey yet. He was last tested at the vet glucose was 439 (see bloodwork attachments) this was right after he was negative for diabetes 6 weeks ago and just got off the steroids! Fancy feast is making them throw up but not sure who it how many of them. Plus it's really stinky and I can smell it upstairs! Lol! I got a couple cases of tiki cat on the way to see how they like it. It's very difficult for me to manage 4 cats with wet food on a busy working mom schedule. I'm going broke. Lol! Want to find a way to make this work. Hate using paper plateso because food come of the platest and all over the floor and baseboards. I'm just annoyed by this whole new thing. Already overwhelemed before the news broke he had high BG. Sigh.....it'll be ok. I'll figure it out soon. I got the relion tester, strips, and 33 gauge lancets. Going to try and figure out how to test him. I'm nervous just thinking about it.
 

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Testing them isn't so bad, but I was nervous too. My boyfriend's cat also was just diagnosed with diabetes, which she hadn't tested positive for before when she was diagnosed with asthma. As you can figure, her diabetes was most likely kicked off by the steroids. Anyway, he helped me test her since he'd already been testing his own for a little bit. Just a prick on the outer rim of the ear, touch the test strip to it, and ta-da! Results.

It's the insulin, which I feel pretty sure will end up being needed, that I'm nervous about administering. She's very skinny, unlike my boyfriend's cat that has plenty of plump on her!
 
The lancets for the AT2 meter are 28 gauge which may look very small but is considerably larger than 33 gauge. The 33 gauge may work fine once you have been testing for a bit because our kitties grow more capillaries in their ears but to get kitty accustomed to testing and avoid frustration for kitty and you, trying to get blood, I would recommend you see if you can find some alternate site lancets 26-28 gauge. :)
 
I should probably have said that I didn't use the lancets from the AlphaTrak either, they were from a Publix TrueTrack brand that I haven't started using, 'cause it didn't come with control solution and its not available in the pharmacy I got it from...'cause THAT makes sense...o_O
 
Stephanie Montgomery said:
Sure and thank you for sharing that with me. Very helpful. I haven't tested Tobey yet. He was last tested at the vet glucose was 439 (see bloodwork attachments) this was right after he was negative for diabetes 6 weeks ago and just got off the steroids! Fancy feast is making them throw up but not sure who it how many of them. Plus it's really stinky and I can smell it upstairs! Lol! I got a couple cases of tiki cat on the way to see how they like it. It's very difficult for me to manage 4 cats with wet food on a busy working mom schedule. I'm going broke. Lol! Want to find a way to make this work. Hate using paper plateso because food come of the platest and all over the floor and baseboards. I'm just annoyed by this whole new thing. Already overwhelemed before the news broke he had high BG. Sigh.....it'll be ok. I'll figure it out soon. I got the relion tester, strips, and 33 gauge lancets. Going to try and figure out how to test him. I'm nervous just thinking about it.
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RE: paper plates. I have 3 cats and got tired of washing real bowls. I buy a giant package of small styrofoam bowls from Costco. The only problem is that they are so light, they can end up across the room as the kitty licks the food if you don't stabilize them! I put them inside a heavier bowl, or on a towel up against the wall. It would be wonderful if you are able to manage Tobey's diabetes with food only. I was fortunate that my Sassy was on insulin for only 2 weeks before going into remission. She was started on insulin immediately because she had a couple of other things going on making her very sick, but she responded very quickly, especially for a 20 year old! Hope you have a great outcome as well!
 
Sassy's Mom said:
RE: paper plates. I have 3 cats and got tired of washing real bowls. I buy a giant package of small styrofoam bowls from Costco. The only problem is that they are so light, they can end up across the room as the kitty licks the food if you don't stabilize them! I put them inside a heavier bowl, or on a towel up against the wall. It would be wonderful if you are able to manage Tobey's diabetes with food only. I was fortunate that my Sassy was on insulin for only 2 weeks before going into remission. She was started on insulin immediately because she had a couple of other things going on making her very sick, but she responded very quickly, especially for a 20 year old! Hope you have a great outcome as well!
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Did you test each time you gave a shot, daily and how often? What size gauge for the lancet and type of tester brand did you use?
 
MrWorfMen's Mom said:
The lancets for the AT2 meter are 28 gauge which may look very small but is considerably larger than 33 gauge. The 33 gauge may work fine once you have been testing for a bit because our kitties grow more capillaries in their ears but to get kitty accustomed to testing and avoid frustration for kitty and you, trying to get blood, I would recommend you see if you can find some alternate site lancets 26-28 gauge. :)
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Where can I fiND 26? Walmart only had 28. I'll go get those of its enough.
 
Stephanie Montgomery said:
Did you test each time you gave a shot, daily and how often? What size gauge for the lancet and type of tester brand did you use?
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I didn't test her when I was giving shots because I didn't find this site until just before she went into remission. She went to the vet weekly for 3 glucose curves and has been back once for an ear prick after fasting. She goes back in 3 weeks for a followup with the vet. However, yesterday I bought the Relion Confirm so that I could test her periodically at home for my own peace of mind. I am new to this and was just about to post a question asking for someone to tell me what is considered "normal range" for a kitty NOT on insulin right now and using this particular model. Someone with more knowledge and experience than me, please correct me if I am wrong, but it seemed that many here recommended the Relion Confirm or Micro. I got the Confirm simply because that was the only one Walmart had yesterday that also had the test strips in stock. The lancets I got are the ultra thin 30 gauge because that was all they had. I will say that she was still getting shots over the long July 4th holiday, and the vet had already said that he felt she might go into remission. Since she was also on the DM food and seemed to be improving so rapidly, I was afraid of giving her too much insulin. Without benefit of testing, I cut back on the amount I gave her over the weekend just on my own gut feeling because he had told me that too little insulin was better than too much. It was during her next vet visit that she was determined to be in remission. All of this has been a learning curve for me and I have read everything I can about what to feed Sassy, since she also has reduced kidney function due to her age. I have an order on the way with an assortment of low carb, low phosphorous food. I have 2 other cats and they are all going to have to be on the same diet because keeping them out of each other's bowls is impossible! She had a UTI, which is why I took to the vet initially, so she has been on antibiotics. The vet suggested probiotics for the diarrhea she gets with antibiotics. I also started giving the probiotics to my Rusty because he has always had a sensitive stomach and prone to throwing up right after he eats. Knock on wood, he hasn't thrown up since I started him on the probiotics.
 
28 gauge should be just fine.
Fluffy Face said:
it didn't come with control solution and its not available in the pharmacy I got it from...'cause THAT makes sense...o_O
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Yes, that just blows the mind. When the manufacturers suggest using control solution to check each new batch of test strips, you'd think it would be easier to get! Often, if you call the maker of the meter, they will send you control solution free of charge.
 
That's what they told me at the pharmacy, but I purchased it so I would have it right then and there - convenience. Not so convenient now! My boyfriend found AlphaTrak on eBay for a decent price, so I'll be getting that...
 
Sassy's Mom said:
I didn't test her when I was giving shots because I didn't find this site until just before she went into remission. She went to the vet weekly for 3 glucose curves and has been back once for an ear prick after fasting. She goes back in 3 weeks for a followup with the vet. However, yesterday I bought the Relion Confirm so that I could test her periodically at home for my own peace of mind. I am new to this and was just about to post a question asking for someone to tell me what is considered "normal range" for a kitty NOT on insulin right now and using this particular model. Someone with more knowledge and experience than me, please correct me if I am wrong, but it seemed that many here recommended the Relion Confirm or Micro. I got the Confirm simply because that was the only one Walmart had yesterday that also had the test strips in stock. The lancets I got are the ultra thin 30 gauge because that was all they had. I will say that she was still getting shots over the long July 4th holiday, and the vet had already said that he felt she might go into remission. Since she was also on the DM food and seemed to be improving so rapidly, I was afraid of giving her too much insulin. Without benefit of testing, I cut back on the amount I gave her over the weekend just on my own gut feeling because he had told me that too little insulin was better than too much. It was during her next vet visit that she was determined to be in remission. All of this has been a learning curve for me and I have read everything I can about what to feed Sassy, since she also has reduced kidney function due to her age. I have an order on the way with an assortment of low carb, low phosphorous food. I have 2 other cats and they are all going to have to be on the same diet because keeping them out of each other's bowls is impossible! She had a UTI, which is why I took to the vet initially, so she has been on antibiotics. The vet suggested probiotics for the diarrhea she gets with antibiotics. I also started giving the probiotics to my Rusty because he has always had a sensitive stomach and prone to throwing up right after he eats. Knock on wood, he hasn't thrown up since I started him on the probiotics.
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I am feeding all mine same food too and they're throwing up right after they eat. It's a waste of food to me. It's not Tobey but my others who are throwing up. Waiting for my tiki cat to come in today. Going to find a better food to feed my others than fancy feast. I don't think it agrees with them at all!
 
Stephanie Montgomery said:
I am feeding all mine same food too and they're throwing up right after they eat. It's a waste of food to me. It's not Tobey but my others who are throwing up. Waiting for my tiki cat to come in today. Going to find a better food to feed my others than fancy feast. I don't think it agrees with them at all!
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I've also ordered some Tiki and some Weruva, although Weruva is about as expensive as the DM. I had Rusty on the prescription Purina EN for sensitive stomachs for a while but didn't notice enough difference to warrant the cost. I think part of his problem is that he eats too fast. He likes FF and tends to turn his nose up at EN, DM and other "healthy" foods I've tried. I have only used the FF Classic because I read years ago that it was healthier than the others. Rusty had a bad episode the other morning and thought I was going to have to take him to the vet. He threw up from one end of the house to the other, was crying and literally fell over on the floor wailing. It happened to be the day after Sassy was declared in remission and I was so happy - then I thought OMG, I get one well and the other one gets sick! I rushed to throw on some clothes to take him to the vet, but by the time I got back in the room, he had pooped and was fine. He has always been a drama queen! LOL. I think his system got upset switching to all canned and using different food. They have always gotten canned twice a day, but grazed on dry in between. I was using dry Blue Buffalo for sensitive stomachs. I've been sneaking him a small hand full of dry when I feel he hasn't eaten enough wet during the day until we all get accustomed to the changes in routine around here. Ii bought a few cans of FF just for him until the new shipment comes, and hoping that the probiotics are helping. I've also been giving them boiled chicken as treats and they love it. Since Sassy is currently taking 4 pills/day, I cube the chicken and use it to give her pills instead of Pill Pockets.
 
Stephanie Montgomery said:
What kind of pills does she take and why?
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She has been on 2 Felimazole tabs/day for several years for hyperthyroid. The symptoms for hyperthyroid are very similar to those of diabetes = eating, drinking, peeing a lot but losing weight. She is on 2 antibiotics/day for 2 more days for a UTI. The UTI was what I originally took her to the vet for because of blood in her urine, and further tests showed the diabetes. Could be that it was the UTI that caused the diabetes. She originally took the antibiotics for one week, was off a week and had a recurrence. I'm hoping this 2 weeks course will do the trick. She uses the Breeze litter box for pee (has the pellets on top and catch tray on the bottom). The other 2 don't use it, so I put a fresh paper towel over the pellets each time she pees so I can monitor frequency, and see if she has blood in her urine. Oddly, she won't poop in a litter box, but does her business on newspaper. Makes it very easy to monitor her and makes for easy disposal! LOL By the way, does Tobey have any signs of diabetic neuropathy in his hind legs and have you noticed a change in his coat? Sassy started having trouble jumping up on things, which I thought was just old age, but between the time she was diagnosed and started insulin 2 days later, she could hardly stand, let alone jump. However she has regained most of the strength in her legs and her coat is bright and shiny with no more "dandruff".
 
Don't notice any coat changes. He just dropped weight really fast and I could all the sudden feel bones where I didn't before. He hasnt fallen recently but he was diagnosed with vestibular disease about 7 weeks ago which is why he was put on steroids. It is like vertigo in humans.
 
Steroids can definitely cause transient diabetes - it's actually one of the things that is known to cause cats to become diabetic. It is true that steroid induced diabetes is often easier to get into remission; however, many cats still need insulin for a time to give them the support they need to heal their pancreas. As you are already aware that the issue could be the steroids - they do seem like the most likely culprit, although as I know from Rosa diabetes can occur quickly even without an obvious trigger like steroids, you will definitely need to test every time before giving insulin - that's something we recommend anyway, but as you're changing his diet, giving insulin and you've taken him off the steroids, there is always the chance that he could drop very quickly once all of those combine. As you could easily be looking at a reduction in BG of 100+ points from the food change, another 100-180 from possible vet stress and however much the steroid has been raising the BG by plus the effect of the insulin, not testing pre-shot and preferably mid-cycle as well could put him at risk of a hypo incident.
 
I agree with Manxcat. There is a very good chance the steroids even if not the sole culprit, have played a big role in the diabetes diagnosis. Changing food alone can cause a dramatic decrease in BG in some cats. Add in stopping the steroids if that is the cause and chances are good the need for insulin is going to decrease dramatically. Testing when giving insulin is important. Testing when giving insulin while making multiple changes that could lower the BG is even more vital to keep kitty safe.
 
Thank you all for the replies. I do agree with all of you. I haven't begun testing Tobey yet. We go to the vet Monday to get a glucose reading from mine as well as the vets equipment. I haven't been noticing Tobey having any problems. He seems fine and is drinking less water and urinating a lot less too. He is hungry a lot as he's always been since I've had him as a kitten. My cats are all eating the shredded chicken tiki cat but aren't doing into it like they do FF. I out down a little fancy feast and it was demolished. They will graze on the Tiki for the rest of the day while I'm at work and I'm sure it'll be gone. I have a lot of tiki so I wanna get thru it before I buy any more other food. Going to try Weruva next. Is it a pate style? Sticking to chicken since I've heard that is the best for cats. So as far as Tobey, I'm not really concerned until Monday since he's doing well and I'll be testing him then and although vet didn't think was important I'll be testing him at home before any shots. I need a lot of guidance because I'm totally lost and so busy since I'm a full time working mom. Thanks again for your help!
 
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