Romeo- help!

[kflei]

Hey, my name is Kristin, and I'm new here. My cat Romeo has had diabetes for almost five years now. We've used PZI, Vetsulin, and he's now on ProZinc, which we love.

Romeo was the only surviving kitten to a mom who was pretty much a kitten herself. He was sleeping on a combine engine when the farmer started it up, and it threw him and broke his nose. He was about a year old when I got him from a friend whose fiancee was "allergic" in 1997, and man, he was a holy terror.

Then in 2004, he threw a blood clot (saddle thrombus). He didn't walk for 2-3 months (it was so awful my brain has blocked a lot of the memories). BUT, he recovered, can walk now- not the greatest, but he get around, and is able to jump up on the sofa.

Then in 2007 he developed diabetes. If I could quantify the messes I've cleaned up in rolls of paper towels, let's just say we've taken out an entire forest. What an ordeal, getting his insulin regulated.

Earlier this year, he seemed to be honeymooning, so I cut his shot down to once instead of twice a day. What a HUGE mistake that turned out to be. He spent five days in intensive care at the vet because he went into ketoacidosis (sp?). The vet said he almost died. Ever since then we've have a really hard time getting him back on schedule. I took him in last week because he hurt his leg trying to jump over a cat box (nothing keeps this cat down...), and they ran blood work on him because of his age. Everything checked out fine. He's been peeing so much lately, and when I took him to the vet I took my two meters along, which the readings came out really wonky, so they still have them to test them out for me (and man do I feel naked without 'em).

So, what brought me here today is last night he vomited after I gave him his shot. I fed him again, and he seemed to keep it down. We close him in the office at night so we can at least regulate where he pees, and when I opened the door this morning he had vomited again- not the entire contents of his stomach, but some. I tried to feed him again this morning, and he wouldn't eat. I gave him a smorgasbord, and he wouldn't touch any of it, so I syringe-fed him chicken baby food. He kept that down quite a while (but he was sooooo mad at me), but just vomited again. I didn't give him his shot, which has me totally freaked out because of the ordeal we've been going through to get him regulated.

As a side note, he has two 'tumors' on him- the vet took slides and said they don't appear to be cancerous. Also, they gave him a shot of Metacam for his injured leg. This was about six days ago. I'm on my way to PetSmart to TRY and find something he wants to eat (and for more puppy pads)- he's gotten SO picky lately- he never used to be that way. I've wasted so much food trying to get him to eat. Does anyone have experience here? Thank you in advance.

 

[jt and trouble (GA)]

With all the issues your Romeo has, I dont have advice...I think you need to take him to the Vet that knows him best. Kitty not eating, not good.
Sending prayers for you and Romeo,
jeanne

 

[Blue]

Hey, my name is Kristin, and I'm new here. My cat Romeo has had diabetes for almost five years now. We've used PZI, Vetsulin, and he's now on ProZinc, which we love.

Romeo was the only surviving kitten to a mom who was pretty much a kitten herself. He was sleeping on a combine engine when the farmer started it up, and it threw him and broke his nose. He was about a year old when I got him from a friend whose fiancee was "allergic" in 1997, and man, he was a holy terror.

Then in 2004, he threw a blood clot (saddle thrombus). He didn't walk for 2-3 months (it was so awful my brain has blocked a lot of the memories). BUT, he recovered, can walk now- not the greatest, but he get around, and is able to jump up on the sofa.

Then in 2007 he developed diabetes. If I could quantify the messes I've cleaned up in rolls of paper towels, let's just say we've taken out an entire forest. What an ordeal, getting his insulin regulated.

Earlier this year, he seemed to be honeymooning, so I cut his shot down to once instead of twice a day. What a HUGE mistake that turned out to be. He spent five days in intensive care at the vet because he went into ketoacidosis (sp?). The vet said he almost died. Ever since then we've have a really hard time getting him back on schedule. I took him in last week because he hurt his leg trying to jump over a cat box (nothing keeps this cat down...), and they ran blood work on him because of his age. Everything checked out fine. He's been peeing so much lately, and when I took him to the vet I took my two meters along, which the readings came out really wonky, so they still have them to test them out for me (and man do I feel naked without 'em).

So, what brought me here today is last night he vomited after I gave him his shot. I fed him again, and he seemed to keep it down. We close him in the office at night so we can at least regulate where he pees, and when I opened the door this morning he had vomited again- not the entire contents of his stomach, but some. I tried to feed him again this morning, and he wouldn't eat. I gave him a smorgasbord, and he wouldn't touch any of it, so I syringe-fed him chicken baby food. He kept that down quite a while (but he was sooooo mad at me), but just vomited again. I didn't give him his shot, which has me totally freaked out because of the ordeal we've been going through to get him regulated.

As a side note, he has two 'tumors' on him- the vet took slides and said they don't appear to be cancerous. Also, they gave him a shot of Metacam for his injured leg. This was about six days ago. I'm on my way to PetSmart to TRY and find something he wants to eat (and for more puppy pads)- he's gotten SO picky lately- he never used to be that way. I've wasted so much food trying to get him to eat. Does anyone have experience here? Thank you in advance.

I am not quite sure where to start.
My first question is if you are home testing and what numbers you have because I wondered about this statement:

Earlier this year, he seemed to be honeymooning, so I cut his shot down to once instead of twice a day.

what insulin are you giving now, and what dose were you giving? I think by honeymooning, most people have tested their cats and the results were non-diabetic numbers ... I think they do the test for 2weeks on this board .... and then consider the cat OTJ and honeymooning.
Also, NO insulin lasts 24hrs. Cats need shots BID twice a day and many on Prozinc need shots TID three times a day.

Next, I cringed at the sight of metacam (meloxicam) as it's dangerous:
See http://www.metacamkills.com/ - many owners have their cats' files marked clearly NO METACAM and NO CONVENIA.
You may want to read about the damage it causes - renal failure and death. I know some are fine on it, and I think very small doses in older cats? but it's something that I avoid.

For the food, what sorts of foods have you tried so far? Normally, low carb wet foods are the way most people go - fancy feast and friskies pates are good, and also Special Kitty and 9Lives, but there are others that are more expensive and with better ingredients you can try. Several feed raw diets which are very good.
Here's a good site for you about lots of food: http://www.catinfo.org/

It's pretty rare for survival after the clots; your Romeo definitely used up a couple of his lives surviving the clot! And maybe another couple with the DKA, so if nothing else, you've got quite a fighter on your hands.
BUT, with his history, and the vomiting and not eating, I really think you need to make another trip to the vet to sort it out.... he may have survived the clot and DKA before but you don't want to invite any repeat issues.

I hope you can sort out the current issues. I am sure many others will have some constructive advice for you.

 

[kflei]

Romeo is on ProZinc, 1.5 units in the a.m., 1 unit at night (U-40 needle). We are still trying to sort out his proper level, and even though I've tested MY meter against my vet's meter, and the reading came out identical, we are now having problems with said meter, and it's making it hard to know where he is. But my two meters are at the vet's being diagnosed as we speak, so hopefully this will be cleared up soon. I did a curve on him last week, and according to my malfunctioning meter, he was holding steady at around 155-165. But I knew something wasn't right because he was peeing and drinking so much. So, we did a glucose check at the vet, and their meter read "HI", while mine read 285 (this is the same meter I checked against the vets previously and it came out identical). I have another meter which read as theirs did, but we want to double check it.

And I freely admit I was an absolute idiot for cutting out his shot, and as much research as I do I'm amazed that I could be so stupid. I house sat for another cat that had the same readings as Romeo, but was only on one shot a day, so I thought it would be okay. Now I know that different insulins have different rates of absorption.

Romeo NEVER throws up, which is why I'm so concerned. My other cats that are perfectly healthy puke like it's a game, but not Romeo. SO, I am concerned with this Metacam business (using much restraint to keep from swearing here). I told the vet I had concerns, but I've had other cats take it that did fine, and she said it was a one-time small dose to get the inflammation down in his joint. But I'm worried. Very.

As for food, he gets either Evo or Blue Evolution grain-free twice a day, and high-protein moist once a day. I asked the vet if I should switch to moist 2x/day, and she said not necessarily. He loves his dry food, and it's good for his teeth, so I hate to go all moist. PLUS, I'm feeding eight cats, many with special needs, and I need the dry feeding at least once a day for sanity's sake... But lately he's been turning his nose up at so much food that I've been giving him SD C/D because it's all he might eat at that particular moment.

 

[LynnLee + Mousie]

do you test for ketones at home? if not i would want that checked asap. and since he has a history of dka, i'd want him tested for those sooner than later so it might be faster to take him to the vet to have him tested for those rather than going and buying ketostix and waiting for him to pee

 

[Blue]

As for food, he gets either Evo or Blue Evolution grain-free twice a day, and high-protein moist once a day. I asked the vet if I should switch to moist 2x/day, and she said not necessarily. He loves his dry food, and it's good for his teeth, so I hate to go all moist. PLUS, I'm feeding eight cats, many with special needs, and I need the dry feeding at least once a day for sanity's sake... But lately he's been turning his nose up at so much food that I've been giving him SD C/D because it's all he might eat at that particular moment.

Nope, dry is NOT good for cats, and it is NOT good for the teeth.... both untrue

http://www.catinfo.org/#My_Cat_is_Doing ... n_Dry_Food

Dental Disease: Long-standing claims that cats have less dental disease when they are fed dry food versus canned food are grossly overrated, inaccurate, and are not supported by recent studies. This frequently stated (among veterinarians and lay people) myth continues to harm cats by perpetuating the idea that their food bowls need to be filled up with an unhealthy diet in order to keep their teeth clean.

The idea that dry food promotes dental health makes about as much sense as the idea that crunchy cookies would promote dental health in a human.

First, dry food is hard, but brittle, and merely shatters with little to no abrasive effect on the teeth. Second, a cat's jaws and teeth are designed for shearing and tearing meat - not biting down on dry kibble. Third, many cats swallow the majority of their dry food whole.

There are many factors – known and unknown - that contribute to dental disease in the cat such as genetics, viruses, diet, and the fact that cats do not brush their teeth like humans do. There remain many unanswered questions concerning the fact that cats often suffer from poor dental health but one very obvious answer lies in the fact that Man feeds the cat a diet that does not even come close to what they would eat in their natural state.

When cats consume their prey in the wild, they are tearing at flesh, hide, bones, tendons, and ligaments. This is a far cry from the consistency of dry or canned food.

Neither dry kibble nor canned food comes close to mimicking a cat’s normal diet of mice, birds, rabbits, etc. Given what a cat does eat in nature, it makes much more sense to be feeding part of the diet in the form of large chunks of meat (as large as you can get your cat to chew on) or gizzards (tough and fibrous) which a cat’s teeth are designed to chew. Raw meat is ‘tougher’ to chew than cooked meat so I prefer to use raw – or parboiled - meat to promote dental health. See Making Cat Food - Dental Health.


As for regulating him while he's eating dry food, it's going to be difficult. There are some cats who refuse to switch to wet, and hopefully their owners can give you some tips.

I had one non diabetic cat who refused to eat wet. For the health of my two diabetic cats, the dry food was not left out, but rather, it was put out only when I could monitor who was eating it because one of my diabetics was a carb addict and very sensitive where her BG could jump almost 200 points just from one mouthful of dry food.
The non diabetic learned that when I came home, I would bring out the dry food and she got into the habit of waiting at the feeding spot when I came home.

If your diabetic cat will eat wet food, it is for his health that you need to keep the dry food from him. Actually, it will be better for the others to switch to wet as well for their health. Many cats are DIET CONTROLLED and need no insulin once the food is changed... it's worth a try.

All that the dry is good for is the dental charges with your vet.

 

[kflei]

Wow- thanks for that- so good to know. I had no idea there was that kind of information out there, but that makes complete sense. What cat eats dry things in nature? Just like what cat eats corn and wheat in nature?

I tried the raw diet (the one you buy in the deep freeze), and only a couple of cats went for it. I know that's not what you are talking about here, but just sharing that I've run the gamut, short of feeding them whole animals...

I'm at my wits end. Eight cats, three with UT issues, one diabetic, one dying, one picky as all get out, and two that will wolf anything you set in front of them. The vet hadn't gotten to my meters yet- said, "We'll have them back to you before the ten days are up and you need to do a curve again." Really? I have a diabetic cat, and you think I'm not supposed to test him again for ten days? (As a side note, she is a new vet, young, new to the clinic I've been going to for 10+ years- couldn't get into my regular vet for our "emergency" visit). I'm not an over-tester, but when you are trying to figure out what the heck is wrong, you test, you know? So anyhoo, I picked up my meters, and I'll do a test on the cats here at home, in hopes I can get an idea which meter is testing off.