Returning cat after 2.5 years

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Mikaila31

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A few weeks back Oliver relapsed into diabetes he has been testing about 400. He is a family cat but lives with my parents and they do 100% of his care. It took a couple weeks to get him into the vet as there has been debate on doing insulin again. My parents simply did not want to do it and it had nothing to do with cost, simply the time and his age. Its caused me A LOT of stress lately. I just turned 23 and Oliver is 16-17. I have mostly convinced them to start up insulin. I'm going to need your amazing help again. I would like to try to get him off insulin again if its possible, though I'm not holding my breath on this.

I would like to try changing his food again. Originally we went to fancy feast but we switched to sprout brand (fisherman's catch flavor) which I can not find much info on. I did check ingredients and actually suggested switching to it as it did not seem all that bad compared to the fancy feast but the cost was much less. He has been doing fine on it the last 2 years. His levels were always nice and low, always below 100 and usually below 60. I would still like to check and make sure there isn't something better out there. I also want to work on putting some weight back on him as he has lost considerable weight the last couple months. He had full blood work and urinalysis done and everything was okay apart from sugar levels and some minor ketones, which isn't surprising after a few weeks of untreated diabetes. So as far as weight loss I'm not sure what exactly the reason is for it unless it is just the diabetes. The weight loss isn't a new thing, but it has increased significantly. So what is the best way to put weight back on a cat? He weighed 9.8lbs at the vet yesterday 2.5 years ago he was ~12lbs. Right now his is definitely underweight and you can feel most his spine. He eats a little over 8oz of the wet food a day in 3 feedings, if I remember right but I will double check.

I am debating if it is best to bring him to my apartment short term until I can figure things out. Anyone have any suggestions on this? He would get a lot more testing here but it really comes down to his behavior. He has been indoor/outdoor his whole life and I don't want to take that away from him permanently. He has the potential to be very loud if he doesn't get his way or doesn't like something :?

Thanks again for the help.
 
Though all of my cats are indoors, most of they started outdoors as strays. They all adjusted pretty well and only occasionally make a dash for the odor. I live near a busy street, and there are raccoons and possums in the neighborhood, so I keep them inside.

You might start with weekend visits to the apartment if it is close enough to your folks. First, spend a good 20 minutes in active play to tire him out a bit. Then travel. Confine to just 1 room 'til he gets his bearings, then let him explore from his base of operations. And see how it goes. It could work out. You might see if he'd cooperate with a harness and leash, too, though the cat walks you, not the other way around!
 
An idea for putting back on some weight would be to try feeding some of the higher protein foods like the kitten foods. Dr. Lisa Pierson, DVM had a great update Food chart that lists almost all the commercial foods available in the US.

See here:http://catinfo.org/docs/FoodChartPublic9-22-12.pdf Look fo high protein (column 1 of the numbers) and low carb < 10% (third column of numbers).
 
Welcome back! You're awesome!

It's possible to get a 2nd remission, my Pudge maybe undergoing it right now. My main question: did I understand you correctly that Oliver has been exclusively on fish flavors of wet food? We generally recommend fish be given only once or twice a week (just like people) as it can have a lot of mercury which, I believe, can cause weight loss. Have you compared the cost of Friskies classic pates to what Oliver gets now? My cats were rescued as feral kittens, then, were indoor/outdoor cats for the next 3-4 years. For the past 9 years they have been indoors only. They go 'crazy loud' when they see a strange cat in their garden. I do bring in grass for them to eat, it helps.

Best wishes, Sophie
 
Yes he has been almost exclusively fed a fish based wet food but I forget if all the ingredients were fish or not. I don't have a can I can look at ATM but I will get get the info on what he has been eating. Its a brand that come exclusively from Fleet Farm I believe and they don't list any real information online. Thank you for the updated food list it will certainly help. The food we use isn't on there but that does not surprise me.
http://www.fleetfarm.com/detail/sprout- ... 0000044307

I don't think he would mind the apartment short term I'm still hesitant to do long term. He always prefers to be outdoors rather then indoor as long as it is not too cold outside. He does work with a harness and leash as we usually travel that way unless he isn't feeling well then we use a carrier. My parents are not big on using the glucose meter so I would rather work with him here and try to get him off the insulin or at least make sure he is being regular at each dose. What is the proper way to start insulin? the vet said 2 units twice a day(using lantus), should I start with this?

Are there any special ways to encourage a remission apart from diet?
 
Its better to start with the lower of his ideal weight or his current weight, in kilograms. This is his lean weight.

Which is less - his current weightor how much the vet says he should weigh?

The lean weight in kg * 0.25, rounded down is the suggested starting dose of Lantus.
 
Thanks. Going by that it would be 1 unit.

I did get some info from the food. Basic main ingredient breakdown is: ocean fish, water for processing, poultry by products, meat by products, animal liver, rice flour, guar gum, shrimp, and salt before it gets into the additives and preservatives.

Guaranteed Analysis is protein 11% min, fat 3% max, fiber 1.5% max, moisture 78% max, and ash 3.5% max.

I'm not sure how this relates to the numbers in the chat so if anyone could help explain that would be great. Also any suggestions on any better alternative foods would be very helpful.
 
To start I think you would be safer going back to the fancy feast classic pâtés. Also you will need to be a bit more aggressive this time to stay in top of things. Update his SS, start testing and restart the insulin.

When can you start moving him in with you?

Wendy
 
I bought some pro plan kitten food chicken and liver since it had some of the lower carbs on the list. He has enough for at least 4 days. If he does well with that I may continue it or switch to the fancy feast. I dropped the food off tonight but wasn't able to test his blood sugar as he was no where to be found. He probably knew what I was up to as he showed up shortly after I left :roll: . I will see if my parents can get one at some point tomorrow.

Moving him in with me is still questionable and will take some time. There is also the option of me staying at my folks for a bit and trying to do it there.

I will try to get access to the SS it been a long long time.
 
Yes he is an outdoor/indoor cat that free roams. I doubt he is getting any dry food as he his blood sugar seems pretty darn stable throughout the day. He's also very cautious off of our property, Someone shot him lot with a BB gun when he was much younger :evil: .

He had his first shot of insulin tonight. 1 unit. For the spread sheet that was made with google right? I am going to have to make a new one as I lost/was unable to access that gmail account. I can add the information from the one in my sig into the new one.

* edit nevermind about the spreadsheet I found it.
 
Cant wait to see how the insulin helps, he is pretty high.

If he doesnt come down into good levels with the insulin and food change I would try keeping him in a few days. I heard this story once about a woman whose cat was getting fat so she put a note on his collar saying "if you feed my cat please call me".. and got like 10 calls...
 
I thought I made another post but IDK where it went. But yes I got the SS updated. The testing over the last few years did get pretty random and rare after his remission. But I dumped all the data on his blood glucose meter into the spreadsheet. Its a relion confirm meter. The test strips are expired(like a year) but they seem to be reading right. We have our non-diabetic cat and she tests fine(~60). There are less then a dozen strips left anyway. And I will try to keep him inside or at least be with him outside to make sure he is only eating what we feed him.

Also a question do people use the lantus pens? We've got the 10mL vial since the pharmacy would not sell a single pen but is there a place you can buy a single pen? Also after talking with the pharmacy they said we could likely get buy for 3 months on the lantus vial before replacing it since it is for a cat. What do you guys think?
 
Don't know about buying individual pens, maybe someone else can speak to that. However if you keep the lantus in the fridge (not the door) you can get 4-6months out of a vial. Just watch for cloudiness or flakes or lack of action around the 4month stage. Oh and don't shake or roll the vial..
 
I've used expired test strips that were 12-15 months past expiration date and they were fine. They were unopened and in the foil packet still. Not sure about a vial of test strips that had been opened. How long would they last and still test accurately. Don't know.

Yes, people do use the Lantus Solostar pens. There is even a savings card program from the manufacturer. Sign up here: http://www.lantus.com/considering/save-on-lantus/default.aspx Most of us sign up as if we were the one being covered, after all, we are the guardians for our cats.

You need to use an insulin syringe with the pen because the dial a dose feature is not accurate with the tiny doses our cats get.

You need to do some legwork to find a pharmacy that will sell a single pen. Or shell out the discounted with your savings card $125 for the 5 pens in a box and put some up for sale in the Supply Closet forum.

I believe, the prescription from your vet may need to specify the Solostar pen. Not sure on this.
 
It seemed to take a while for the insulin to bring him down. He tested 96 this morning when he was suppose to have his shot, so it was skipped. He is now back up to 286, so should I give him a small shot?
 
I would wait till tonite. The issue with shooting now is that your next shot has to be 12 hours from now and it will put you way off schedule.
 
Also because he fell out of remission you will need to be a bit more aggressive if you want to get him there again. So I would strongly recommend you move over to the Tight Regulation board. There are very experienced members there that can help you know when and how much to change dose so that you stay on top of things. I didnt do that when Tiggy fell out of remission a year ago and now it looks like he will never get back in!

Also its a great sense of community: http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewforum.php?f=9

Heres how to post
Every day ( or as often as you can) you open a new thread/post. We call them "condos"
- The subject has the date/cats name and BG readings ie 06/07 Oliver PMPS 462 +2 396 +3 310 etc. You add a ? icon if you have a question. You can update your subject as you get a reading, or whenever

- The contents of your post have a quick update on how Oliver is feeling as regards the 5Ps ( peeing. pooing, preening, playing and purring) and any questions and a link to your previous post ie : Today Oliver was in a good mood, playing and eating well. But he is peeing a lot and his BG is really high. Should I increase the dose?

For your first post put "newbie" also in your subject so everyone can welcome you!

Wendy
 
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