Relatively new diagnosis. Maybe odd case. Hypothyroidism as well.

Guenhwyvar

Guenhwyvar

New Member
My cat was diagnosed in June. We've steadily been increasing the Vetsulin. We are now up to 5 units 2x a day. In addition, he takes a twice daily pill for hyperthyroidism (edited).

We do not have a home monitoring system, and our vet discourages it. We have to bring him in every few weeks to see how he is doing. He's clearly not doing well. He drinks a lot of water and pee's all over the floor. We use dog training pads.

I'm rethinking monitoring, because it looks like there can be spikes and dips that might be useful to know about.

Vet has suggested there may be another form of insulin for him, but I'd hate to switch and have to go through months of trying to find the right dose.

Anyway, I'm looking for whatever advice there might be. I'd really like the peeing all over the floor to stop.
 
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Learning to test at home is a great way to see what your cat's BG (blood glucose) numbers are doing. You don't need permission from the vet to test at home. I still don't understand why so many vets are not supportive of home testing, when the AAHA Diabetes Managements Guidelines strongly recommend owners test their cats at home.

What country are you located in? So we can give better info on what meters are available that members here have used.

Testing tips here for home testing your cat. It takes some time to learn, but we'll help you.

Meter ratings and info are here. If you are in the USA, many of us use the Relion brand of meters, due to the low cost of test strips.

p.s. I think you meant to say in your signature that your cat is hypothyroid (thyroid too low). That's unusual. Most cats are hyperthyroid (thyroid too high). Hypoglycemia is low blood sugar.
 
Whooos. Yes, he has hyperthyroidism not hypothyroidism. He’s not an old cat either, maybe 8. I’m in the US.
 
So look over those documents I linked for you about home testing tips and meters.

Let us know if you have and questions and we will try to answer them.

Catch you in the morning off to sleep now.
 
I’ve started testing him with Contour Next EZ meter. As expected, his readings are high, but I’m not certain how they compare with a meter actually calibrated for cats. I upped his dose to 7 units 2x a day, so I’ll wait to see where that lands him. He did get his lowest reading of 268 just now, about 4 hours after dosing. He was at 317 before feeding and dosing. I think his numbers are headed down.

How do these numbers compare with an actual vet meter?

Yesterday
7:30 AM, 352, Feed + 7 units
10:30 AM 339
4:00 PM 308
7:24 PM 344, Feed + 7 units

today
7:30 AM 316, Feed + 7 units
11:40 AM 268

at the vet his readings have been around 500, but we’ve increased the dose by 2 units since then.
 
We don't compare vet meters to human meters. We have no idea which meter your vet uses. So we just go by whatever type of meter you are using. Would you add the meter you are using to your signature please?

Have you seen our Beginner's Guide to Caninsulin (Vetsulin)? Please read through that if you would. There is lots of helpful information there.

Here is a link on What is Regulation?

What food you are feeding can make a big difference. What do you feed?
Would you please give us more background information. Don't worry about making the post too long. We'll read it.

7 units of Vetsulin is a really big dose, so knowing when the dose increases were, approximate dates of increases, how many units each increase was will help us to understand better, if your vet suggested testing for high dose conditions would be helpful for us.

Your vet is right, there may be another insulin that would work better for your cat. Vetsulin is better for dogs. Cats do better on Lantus, Levimir, or Prozinc.




http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/beginners-guide-to-novolin-humulin-nph.186097/
 
He’s been at 6 units for a week. I decided to go up to 7 units yesterday. We’re really sick of the extraneous peeing, so I’d like to control this ASAP.

we use Hills prescription GlucoSupport, and its pretty strict.
 
Did you print out and read the Guide to using Vetsulin I told you about?

Is that the canned or the dry version of the Hill's Glycobalance? Still too high in carbs for a diabetic cat. AAHA Diabetes Management Guidelines from 2018 say <12% carbs >40% protein. Here on the message board, we say 10% carbs or under.

Giving insulin and stopping any peeing outside the litter box are not a simple matter of upping the dose. Your cat could also have a UTI or something else going on to cause him to pee outside the litter box.

Do you have enough litter boxes to place one either near or in the area he is peeing? Recommendation is one litter box per cat, at least 1 box on each level of your home.

Was it your vet that increased the dose, or did you decide to do that on your own?
 
Yes, we have enough litter boxes. He was an outdoor cat, and never really took to peeing in the litter box. We really resisted bringing him, because we knew the mess it would be. It’s less that he pees outside the box and more the incredible volume he pees. He drinks a lot. Really, a lot.

The vet cleared the increase. I won’t increase the dose on my own. I can tell that with each increase, he’s a little better. I’ll wait and see where his insulin stabilizes before I take him in again.

I’m fairly happy with these numbers. 3 weeks ago he was at 500.
 
Do you have a HYPO kit ready, in case Toesy goes really low?

How to treat HYPOS - THEY CAN KILL! Print this Out!!

The volume of urine is because Toesy is not regulated yet. Above renal threshold and excess blood glucose gets dumped in the urine. Boy, is it sticky! Peeing lakes still? Not normal small fist sized clumps or smaller?

Is that the canned or the dry version of the Hill's Glycobalance? Still too high in carbs for a diabetic cat. AAHA Diabetes Management Guidelines from 2018 say <12% carbs >40% protein. Here on the message board, we say 10% carbs or under.

Changing the food to a lower carb food can help immensely to bring those BG levels down and then you won't see so much urine production. Since you are home testing to monitor, you can see what the food change can do to help.
 
Dry Hill's M/d Glycosupport dry is 15% carbs. Even the canned Hill's M/d is 13% carbs so still a bit high for Toesy. All those grain ingredients and things like potatoes and sweet potatoes raise the BG levels.

Veterinary food diets are expensive, and there are lots of other more species appropriate options for a diabetic cat. Many people here use the Fancy Feast pate style or Friskies pate style canned food. That is due to their being widely available, lower cost, lower carb content than vet prescription foods. More choices in flavors too.

There are lots of canned food options. Not so many dry foods that are low enough in carbs for a diabetic. This chart includes protein/fat/carb and other values for many wet cat foods. You are looking in column 3, the carb % for values that are 10% or less.

What are your other cats eating?
Is Toesy overweight and needs to lose a bit? Being overweight contributes to inefficient use of the insulin and keeps the BG high, which means his BG (blood glucose) stays high and more urine.
What would you say is Toesy's 'ideal' weight.

Is Toesy a dry food addict? Will he eat wet/canned food?

Pee pads around the litter box or in his new peeing spot not helping? Enzymatic cleaner to get the smell out helps too, so he doesn't keep smelling the pee and think that is an ok place to squat and go.
 
Yeah, we figured out the enzymatic cleaner thing. He’s peeing lakes, as you said.

This cat was an acquired stray. As such, he is food insecure, and will eat anything. We “hired” him as a ratter back when we had chickens, and the guy could catch anything.

He’s not overweight at all, and frankly, I’m glad to see he’s putting on a few pounds since moving inside. This could partly be the hyperthyroidism.

I’ll definitely look in to those lower carb foods. Fixing diet is preferable to adding drugs. He lives in our bedroom, mostly isolated from the other cats.
 
Yes, the hyper-T together with the diabetes surely contributed to Toesy's weight loss. He's still probably telling you he is 'starving' and constantly begging for food. That's because he can't process the food he is eating properly, due to the diabetes.

When you switch to another cat food, watch for digestive upsets. Some people go 'cold turkey' to the wet food. Some folks take it slower, gradually replacing a bit of the dry food each day. Choose whichever way works the best for you.

You'll want to test a bit more, because the food change to lower carb can make a big difference in the BG (blood glucose) levels. Something for you to be aware of.
 
Please remove the location information from your signature. I mistakenly asked you to add that information and that is incorrect. No location information of any type (no state, no country, no time zone) should be in your signature. My apologies for the extra work.
 
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