Re: 12/17 Tawny PMPS 208 hooted full 3u

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DD & Tinkerbell

DD & Tinkerbell

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yesterday:http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=58804 SS is current

Stayed w/the 3u yesterday pmps b/c she went from those mid-cycle blues the day b4 to the high 500s yesterday.

I started to question the meter but her pmps last night was w/a different meter & it was 401 as opposed to the 414 on the regular meter an hr b4. Plus Tinkerbell's pmps seemed to be in line w/where she has been reading.

Got up every 2 hrs to do a BG on Tawny, she dropped all night. Tube fed her a couple times overnight, Recovery w/a little water. Today I will mix up a batch of Wellness & Clinicare for the tube feeds.

This morning (1/2 hr ago) she follows me downstairs as I stumble toward the coffee, acts fine, acts hungry. I'm thinkin' OK, 3hrs til shot time, this is a good time to tube feed her if she won't eat on her own. So i figure i'll pull a bg 1st.

Good bloody damn thing. 78 at +8.75, I got her to eat a little Friskies 8%, a little Wellness (I think it's less than 2%?) and lick a bunch of CliniCare (didn't s/one say that was 25%?) out of a bowl. BG'd again, +9, 78.

So I am thinking (1) maybe that .5 dose crease down to 2.5 is in order, (2) maybe better hold off on the tube feed in case I gotta get some HC into her (like how am i gonna do that? No worries, I'll figure out s/thg).

EYES & ADVICE PLEASE!!!!!!!!
 
Re: 12/17 Tawny +9 BG 78; fed, +9.5/201 I blew it! Dose ?

OK yeah I blew it. Too much Clinicare looks like, but that's all I could get her to eat. So this cycle and the accuracy of what she does during a cycle is shot to Hades in a Hand Basket. I blew it, should have just watch the cycle, but it scared me bad, she'd been dropping all nite, and this was the end of the cycle.

Guess it's safe to tube feed now.

I figure I'll go with the dose crease from 3u to 2.5u anyway like the vet wanted, any thoughts?
 
Re: 12/17 Tawny EYES PLEASE! +9 BG 78!!!!!

It looks like the infection is clearing perhaps? As a result the BGs are coming down.

Honestly, I have no experience with DKA/ketones so I'm not sure if a decrease by .5 unit is needed or a .25u decrease. 78 isn't too scary.... yet. But it sure is a huge difference from the 400's so I get why this is so significant.

I wish I could help, but at least this will keep you bumped up. I have to go to a funeral so I can't hang around, but I will be thinking of you and wish for the best for Tawny.

Hugs and more hugs!

Edit to add: ah, I see she came up for you. Glad she isn't dropping any more. That big drop must have been a shock. Hang in there!
 
Re: 12/17 Tawny EYES PLEASE! +9 BG 78!!!!!

Talk about a high before a break. Yeesh! Remember, a 78 is not dangerous ground and it's not like you just gave her insulin. You're in control of this.

The Wellness, depending on the flavor, is probably around 4% -- at least that's what the chicken and the turkey flavors are. On their nutritional profile, CliniCare is over 29% carb.

I would wait until closer to AMPS to decide on what to shoot. I'm really on the fence about a 0.5u decrease. On the one hand, this really looks like it was an infection that caused the high numbers. Now that the infection is clearing, numbers have dropped. That would potentially mean a reduction is in order. On the other hand, Tawny has been throwing ketones. Insulin is one way to keep them away. That would be a vote in favor of not reducing or reducing a smaller amount. It may be that you can drop the dose by 0.5u this morning to drain the shed a bit and bring it back up a little this evening or reduce by 0.25u. OTOH, Tawny's numbers haven't dropped below 50. Are you around today to monitor?

I think the big question, at least to me, is that if Tawny drops into lower numbers will you be able to get her numbers back up with food? Obviously, you can get the CliniCare down the tube so that shouldn't be a problem. You're in the room with Tawny. What are your thoughts?
 
Re: 12/17 Tawny +9 BG 78; fed, +9.5/201 I blew it! Dose ?

Sienne and Gabby said:
Talk about a high before a break. Yeesh! Remember, a 78 is not dangerous ground ...

I think the big question, at least to me, is that if Tawny drops into lower numbers will you be able to get her numbers back up with food? Obviously, you can get the CliniCare down the tube so that shouldn't be a problem. You're in the room with Tawny. What are your thoughts?
Click to expand...

Well, as you can see I already blew it, I grabbed the only thing she would lick out of the bowl on her own, the HC Clinicare. & like you say, 78 is not a dangerous # but it was such a HUGE drop in less than 24 hrs.

I will take her w/me to THS so I can monitor her all day. I am totally on the fence about the dose crease too--there's the ketone issue--guess i'll figure that out in a couple hrs, her +6 was 137, it's hard to tell when her actual nadir actually is w/all this weird stuff going on w/her.

I have to run into town for about 45 min's i'm gonna take her w/me -- bbl -- keep the dose crease thoughts coming please!
 
Re: 12/17 Tawny +9 BG 78; fed, +9.5/201 I blew it! Dose ?

Desi, I like to think of low BG as a good problem. :smile: You can do something about it by feeding. Tawny is healing and it's all because of your great care. That is really good news that the infection is clearing up.
Liz
 
Re: 12/17 Tawny +9 BG 78; fed, +9.5/201 I blew it! Dose ?

Hi guys .. I don't think you blew it .. I think you've both been through a lot lately and all you want to do is make sure your baby girl is getting all the help she needs .. You can recover from the high carb .. Take a long deep breath, give tawny an extra kiss and a hug and know you are the best momma in the world to that little baby!
 
Re: 12/17 Tawny +9 BG 78; fed, +9.5/201 I blew it! Dose ?

I would stay with the 3u and see if she'll flatten out on that dose. 78 is a good nadir and it looks like she is starting to heal. Most likely she will only stay on that dose for another cycle or two before needing a reduction. Yesterday could have been a bounce from the night before, or it could have been vet stress, or most likely a combination of both.

When you do reduce, I recommend reducing by 0.25 instead of 0.5. She is finally starting to bring her numbers down, and you don't want to lose momentum or let the ketones take hold again.

I love the blue and green on her!
 
Re: 12/17 Tawny amps in 15 min

amps is in a few minutes but she is eating now, LC, I try to let her eat on her own whenever she wants, she wasn't interested in much earlier xcept the Clinicare.

we have to leave for THS so i will post as soon as i get settled there. i have not done a bg yet b/c i don't want her to associate poking with eating on her own.

These dilemmas are driving me crazy & it's a really really really short trip.

i am once again leaning toward holding the 3u for now, local vet is only 1/8th mile from THS if i need her!

bbl
 
Re: 12/17 Tawny amps 381 Mommie blew it gonna hold the 3u

gonna hold the 3u and watch her all day...

i really blew it with that clinicare...
 
Re: 12/17 Tawny +9 BG 78; fed, +9.5/201 I blew it! Dose ?

Hi Desi,
Sienne and Libby always give great dosing advice.

I'm sure that Tawny will settle in now that the infection is under control. Wellness Turkey (Rusty's main food) is 4% carbs. When I want to give him a little boost, I feed Fancy Feast Turkey & Giblets (his favorite food!), which is supposedly only 2%, but I and many others here have found that it tends to raise bgs and therefore must be higher in carbs. I suspect it is about 7% and seems to be just enough to keep Rusty from going too low.

I hope you will have a good day today, get a little rest and relaxation in, and that Tawny will continue to feel better and better.

Hugs,

Ella & Rusty
 
Re: 12/17 Tawny amps in 15 min - eating - no bg yet

don't worry about the clinicare. If that is what raised her BG, then it is only temporary and will wear off. If the high doesn't wear off, that just means either she is bouncing, or just rising naturally at the end of the cycle. There is no such thing as blowing it (if there was, Jazzy would have NEVER been regulated because I "blew it" all the time when I was sick).
 
Re: 12/17 Tawny amps +5.25/210

so i get to THS, settle Tawny in the office, pull the laptop out of the bag, fire it up, battery almost dead. look in bag. no cord. wait on 2 customers, get back to computer, shut itself off. cord still at home. at least i didn't forget the cat.

She did well today. she is not eating as well on her own so I have tube fed her 3 times today, she doesn't act "sick", just "off". maybe those wild BGs of the last couple days kind of weirded up her system! also she is prescribed mirtazapine every 3 days for appetite stimulate, if she's eating on her own i don't give it to her, but today is day 3 from the last one and i will tonite. she usually starts eating real good again for 1.5-3 days after one, then goes off her food for some reason.

after this morning's fiasco here's our day so far:

amps 381 after Mommie went crazy w/the 12/16 PM + 9 of 78 and fed her high carb clinicare; shot 3u;
+2 - 265
+5.25 - 210

i was so afraid she was gonna high-5 it again after the CC...

so not so bad today after all.

Caught a pee at the store: NO KETONES!

i gotta go change her bandage wrap & feed everybody else, horses are done, bbl.

thanks for the support this morning all.
 
Re: 12/17 Tawny amps +5.25/210

Do not give a cat with a feeding tube an appetite stimulant. There is no need. It has a lot of side effects and is often called meowzapine. You have the tube. She will eat when she feels better. An appetite stimulant can actually cause long term food aversion and you will have the tube for a much longer time.

Sending hugs.
 
Re: 12/17 Tawny amps +5.25/210

Karrie and Maverick said:
Do not give a cat with a feeding tube an appetite stimulant. There is no need. It has a lot of side effects and is often called meowzapine. You have the tube. She will eat when she feels better. An appetite stimulant can actually cause long term food aversion and you will have the tube for a much longer time.

Sending hugs.
Click to expand...

That is very good advice, thank you. I did not give it tonight, and now i am glad, b/c:

we have just spent the last hour eating mostly off of Mommie's finger's 3/4 can of Wellness Chicken and are now napping. Mommie snuck in a BG cuz it's time to hoot: PMPS is 208, i have about a 5 minute window here til the 12 hr mark and I, even tho i know we don't hoot off preshot #s, given the last couple days' #s, am once again wondering about a dose crease down from the 3u to either 2.75 or the 2.5 the vet recommended.

There may be some selfishness in here, I am not sure I am capable of getting up every 2 hrs tonite to ck her even if 6 alarms are going off.

Ketones are NONE today, we don't want them back. Tube fed her twice today, 50mls and then 40mls, recovery, but tonite she ate on her own.

Dosing advice, anybody? would you stay with the 3u?
 
Re: 12/17 Tawny PMPS 208 NEED DOSING ADVICE time to hoot

my gut feeling is that you shouldn't decrease the dose unless she goes below 50. my sympathy about the waking up - i don't know the exact answer. i see tawny's numbers coming down nicely from this morning, but nothing that would say to reduce the dose. 208 looks more to me like she's clearing the bounce from last night's nice 78.

just my thoughts.
 
Re: 12/17 Tawny PMPS 208 NEED DOSING ADVICE time to hoot

I wouldn't decrease either. Get a test around bedtime. If you think Tawny's numbers are heading down, you can always give some HC. You need to sleep, too.
 
Re: 12/17 Tawny PMPS 208 NEED DOSING ADVICE time to hoot

Sienne and Gabby said:
I wouldn't decrease either. Get a test around bedtime. If you think Tawny's numbers are heading down, you can always give some HC. You need to sleep, too.
Click to expand...

LOL it is already waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay past bedtime! :lol:

So i felt really guilty about being so selfish and set the alarms for 2 hrs from bedtime, i mean now LOL and hooted the full 3u.

I am pretty sure that at this point i am just delirious.

but the cat's OK. Tinkie, too.
 
girl...you are one of the most GIVING people I know...

so buy into Binks and my philosophy...

Guilt is a non-productive effort!!
 
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