Question regarding Kitty's numbers

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kse

kse

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Just checked Kitty and her PMPS was 511. I gave 2.5 units this morning on a 377 reading. Just shot 3 units on this reading.

Being new at this and very little experience, can anyone give any explinations on why I am getting such a big swings in her preshot numbers. Her spreadsheet is attached--but I haven't updated the 511 pmps.

Please Help!
 
Tell us more about exactly what's happening. She is testing negative for ketones, right? Is she eating and drinking well? Are you feeding completely wet lo carb including treats? No infections?

You are missing mid cycle numbers. Get some numbers 4-6 hours after you shoot. It may be that she is dropping low and bouncing back up. It may be too much insulin. Mid cycle numbers will tell you what the insulin is doing. Then you can decide what to do.
 
She gets 1.5 cans of low car FF after testing both am and pm. She only eats wet low carb FF. I was giving her another half of can at "lunch" and midnight due to hunger---but have discontinued. Her hunger has reduced some---but tonight she was starved! She eats readily always.

She drinks more than the other cats--but not as excessive as at one time. Her urine output appears in line with her water in take. At one point, I couldn't keep enough litter in the house due to cleaning the box so much.

I am giving no treats. I have cut back on the food from the intitial dx. She was eating 4 to 5 cans a day. And though she was not getting insulin twice a day earlier--I never saw big swings like this in the mornings before I shot. I have never seen numbers at the 498 and 511 range like I got Tuesday and tonight.

She tested negative for Ketones yesterday at the vet and her UTI was clear. She finished zeniquin/antibiotic today.

I am at a loss. I want so badly to regulate her and had hoped the twice a day dosing was going to be the answer.

Thanks for the help.

I get nervous every time I am going to test--scared of what the monitor will show.
 
I do think the twice daily dosing will improve her numbers. Your DKA adventure has just set you back some.

I would start feeding several small meals a day - it helps support her pancreas. You can freeze the wet food and leave it out to thaw if you aren't home. Our 9 pound kitty gets 2 cans of FF daily. When Oliver was first diabetic, we gave him 3 cans daily. Their bodies aren't processing food well so you can feed more.

Do you give her a treat or food each time you poke her? You want to get her used to the idea that poking is a good experience.

If I were you, I would get some numbers tonight - every couple of hours until you go to bed. It may help us see what is going on.
 
When she was getting once a day dosing a did feed her some all day. I would come home from work and feed her at lunch and during the night I would get up and give her a snack. She has always been an eater,even before the diabetes.

She was actually eating almost 5 cans a day before the twice a day dosing started. But, the vet told me to cut out all the food and try to control/regulate what I fed. I actually had thought the increased food was helping---it sure doesn't appear that it was hurting!

When she was weighed yesterday she had gained 3 onces since her last weigh in--prior DKA. I was scared she might have lost weight during the crash--but it appears she held her own and then some.

Do you normally see cats that react like Kitty (numbers hi and low) get regulated. Is this uncommon?

What about liver training--could something like that be happening?
 
I do give her a spoonful of food after each poke! She tolerates the poking really well.
 
Yes, sometimes it takes them a while to even out. Look at Angela and Henry's posts and spreadsheet. They have had this pattern for several weeks.
 
If these wild swings continue, am I better to use a sliding scale or should I stick with one dose. My vet wanted me to dose 3 units twice a day, but I thought it was A LOT on mid 300 numbers. So, she agreed on 2.5. Unfortunately, I haven't settled into that dose yet--due to the swings.

Should I stay with a consistent dose--would that help regulate her, or will the sliding scale get me through this?

Sue, I can't tell you how much I appreciate your responses.
 
Your numbers will help us figure that out. Usually with a new diabetic, we suggest holding the dose for 3 days or so before switching. Once you get used to how Kitty might react, you can start varying it more often.

Have you checked out other people's spreadsheets? It'll give some insights on how PZI has acted in their cats.

Those mid cycle numbers should show you whether she has high flat numbers or is swinging from highs to lows.
 
I would let her eat as much LC as she wants assuming she is not overweight and on a diet for that. Reasons: 1) eating can stimulate the pancreas to produce its own insulin, 2) when they are unregulated they need more food to sustain the same bodyweight (something about metabolism being off?), and 3) if there is some chance she is getting too much insulin, she will naturally try to balance that by eating more. So IMO food provides a safety mechanism, and also can help their pancreas along (several small meals or free feeding are the ideal).

I can see the reasoning in keeping the amount of food in check if you are feeding higher carb food, as it will lead to higher #s and then needing more insulin to balance that, making regulation harder. I don't think that applies much though to LC food, and besides I think the pluses of extra food outweigh that potential minus in the case of LC.

If you aren't comfortable just disregarding what the vet said, you could always give it a 2-day trial or something. If you feed her more and things seem more out of control, you can always go back to the vet's scheme.

Try not to get to frantic over the #s, I know it is hard. It can take some time - typically weeks and sometimes months to get regulated. It is rare that it happens in a few days or within a couple weeks. If you can keep yourself breathing and taking a slightly longer-term view of the #s (i.e. don't let each # freak you out), you may find it easier to cope with. I know, easier said than done. :) I'm sure it is extra-scary with the ketone threat. :YMHUG:
 
If you look at Samwise's SS you will see that it took us months! to get a break through on his numbers. He was so skinny at the start of this bout (Sept of 2010) 5 lbs that I fed him whenever he wanted. It was about every two hours until his weight started going up. He now weighs around 7 lbs which is a great weight for him. I'd like to see more weight on him but so far, so good.

So, don't worry about the numbers. Sam is on the roller coaster and I never know what to do with his insulin. Sliding scale or shoot the 2.75U the vet wants me too. Sometimes the numbers are good after the 12 hours, sometimes not. Sam's +6 (which you should try to get one on Kitty) were always in the normal range after the break through. He was still eating a lot of food and I still feed him when he wants which is usually before shot morning, after shot, DH feeds twice or three times in the morning, lunch, then he eats again when I get home at five. So he eats lots of small meals through the day. When he gets regulated I think his appetite will drop accordingly. So, keep after it and good luck with Kitty! You are doing a great job! Do try to get the mid cycle tests to see where she is. :smile:
 
I'm thinking those pinks look good. Try a mid-cycle test. I was doing +6 for Sam every day and he's gotten so hissy at having his ears poked 3 times a day I decided to give him a break and just to pre-shot pokes. I bet Kitty's +6 will be normal or close to it.
 
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