Prescribed dose too high?

Silvia

Silvia

Member
Hi everyone! We were prescribed 3 units. Our initial BG numbers were in the 500s. No ketones in urine. I'm wondering now if 3 units is too high of a dose for my Phoenix. He is going very low for his PMPS. What do you think based off his numbers?
 
Hi there! Did you change food after Phoenix was diagnosed? Are you still feeding the glycobalance? Even the wet glycobalance is around 14% carbs -- too high for a sugar cat. And the dry is over 20% if I remember right. If you can give us a little info about what you're feeding right now, and if that's a recent change, and if it's a change, how Phoenix is doing with it.

Now onto the dose: the 3u is too much. However, it's a bit of a guess what the right dose would be right now. Can you get a before-bed test tonight to see what he does with the 1u? My guess right now would be to drop the AM dose down to 2u, and see how that does. You really want to be able to shoot two even doses/day, so we need to try to even out the cycles without losing the blue numbers (and hopefully finding some greens!). It's going to be a little trial and error for a while. :)
 
Thank you so much for your prompt reply. We are still eating glycobalance but plan on changing it to something more low carb friendly! I changed it as soon as I suspected he might be diabetic - about a few days before he was diagnosed. Will be going more low carb soon.
 
Some vets will take it back if you say it isn't working for your kitty. Especially if you still have a lot left. Food is one of the most important things you can do to take care of a diabetic cat, so if Phoenix transitions pretty easily to new foods, I would switch as soon as you can. There is a food list in my signature that you can click on and sort the foods by carbs, brand, protein, etc. The food list is a super helpful tool for getting Phoenix into healthier numbers.

If you do switch soon, definitely keep an eye on the numbers as cats will often get much lower BG numbers very quickly when switched to low carb foods.
 
I just saw your spreadsheet and it looks like you've entered a 25. I really really hope that's a typo. If that's an accurate number, please give your kitty some high carb food, or even a little honey. That number is much too low to be safe.
 
I'm going to sleep now, so if you see this, please read the info in the hypo sticky, and post out on Feline Health - The Main forum and folks out there can help you navigate this.
 
Djamila said:
I'm going to sleep now, so if you see this, please read the info in the hypo sticky, and post out on Feline Health - The Main forum and folks out there can help you navigate this.
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I gave him some dry food and his regular snack. He is acting himself. Will be watching him rest of the night. That was unfortunately not a typo.
 
We were told 2u to start when our sugarcat was diagnosed. We quickly found this was way too high, particularly with food change.

When you get a moment can you update us on Phoenix? 25 is so low, particularly on AT meter. Do you have any other strips from a different lot to test with? Or a different meter to try if that batch is defective? Human meters are relatively cheaper and work just fine, in our experience, so it may be worth having a backup on hand.
 
MamaMug said:
We were told 2u to start when our sugarcat was diagnosed. We quickly found this was way too high, particularly with food change.

When you get a moment can you update us on Phoenix? 25 is so low, particularly on AT meter. Do you have any other strips from a different lot to test with? Or a different meter to try if that batch is defective? Human meters are relatively cheaper and work just fine, in our experience, so it may be worth having a backup on hand.
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Thanks for your reply. We definitely have defective strips. Had to skip this mornings dose. I ordered strips online but will be going to various pet stores to see if I can find any.
 
Are you sure your AT2 meter is set to the correct code for the vial of strips you are using? Also try changing the battery in your meter. A low battery can sometimes cause some anomalous readings.

Unfortunately AT2 strips are not available in pet stores as they are a specialty medical product. A vet clinic may be able to sell you some but as MamaMug says, having a backup meter on hand is a good idea and a human meter works just fine although the readings will be a lower. We know what the normal range and too low BG warnings are for human meters so there is no issue using them. Walmart Relion meters are a popular choice amongst members here as the strips are considerably more budget friendly.
 
Djamila said:
Hi there! Did you change food after Phoenix was diagnosed? Are you still feeding the glycobalance? Even the wet glycobalance is around 14% carbs -- too high for a sugar cat. And the dry is over 20% if I remember right. If you can give us a little info about what you're feeding right now, and if that's a recent change, and if it's a change, how Phoenix is doing with it.

Now onto the dose: the 3u is too much. However, it's a bit of a guess what the right dose would be right now. Can you get a before-bed test tonight to see what he does with the 1u? My guess right now would be to drop the AM dose down to 2u, and see how that does. You really want to be able to shoot two even doses/day, so we need to try to even out the cycles without losing the blue numbers (and hopefully finding some greens!). It's going to be a little trial and error for a while. :)
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I changed his food to less carby Blue Wilderness! I have noticed - within 1 week on consistent insulin 2xs daily, his fur feels/looks gorgeous, just like it did when he was a young boy. I'm giving 2 units to see how he does since he's been getting a low reading before AM and PM shots. However, I haven't seen him hit any greens. What do we think?
 
There are some more experienced members here who can give better dosing advice, but I would personally be pretty wary shooting 2u at mid to low blues. I'm assuming you were able to pick up some more strips and that these are AT numbers. I would definitely try to get a +2 test to see where he's going with the dose tonight.
 
I agree with MamaMug....a +2 is definitely necessary. The 2u dose may be Ok or it may be a bit too high. You may need to test a little further into the night tonight to ensure Pheonix stays safe. Those low pre-shot numbers suggest that you are getting some overlap in dosing and while that is a good thing to an extent it can also be indicative of too high a dose. With the pre-shot tonight lower than the pre-shot this morning, I'm inclined to think 2u may be a bit too high a dose and more monitoring may be needed. You have no mid cycle test from today to see how low the 1.5u took Phoenix so while you may not have seen any green yet, it's possible Phoenix did get to a green reading some time today.
 
MamaMug said:
There are some more experienced members here who can give better dosing advice, but I would personally be pretty wary shooting 2u at mid to low blues. I'm assuming you were able to pick up some more strips and that these are AT numbers. I would definitely try to get a +2 test to see where he's going with the dose tonight.
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Got a +2 reading at slightly lower 132. PMPS was 138. He will be having some food later at around +4/+5.
 
Hi Silvia - Given your PS tonight, my hunch is that even without the mid-cycle numbers today, we can guess that the 1.5u was probably plenty of insulin for Phoenix. If you can get that +4 or +5 test tonight, it would be great to see where he heads later in the cycle. If you need to sleep though, we totally understand - just make sure to leave some food out for him.

Tomorrow, I think I'd either go with 1u or 1.5u depending on what you get for the next reading tonight. As Linda said, it's quite likely he's been getting greens, just not at times you've been able to test.

And great job getting his food changed already! Blue Wilderness looks like a great food (except for the "mature chicken" flavor - I wonder why that one is so much higher?). Anyway...isn't it great to see them looking and acting healthier?! I'm so glad to hear that his coat is looking so good!
 
Djamila said:
Hi Silvia - Given your PS tonight, my hunch is that even without the mid-cycle numbers today, we can guess that the 1.5u was probably plenty of insulin for Phoenix. If you can get that +4 or +5 test tonight, it would be great to see where he heads later in the cycle. If you need to sleep though, we totally understand - just make sure to leave some food out for him.

Tomorrow, I think I'd either go with 1u or 1.5u depending on what you get for the next reading tonight. As Linda said, it's quite likely he's been getting greens, just not at times you've been able to test.

And great job getting his food changed already! Blue Wilderness looks like a great food (except for the "mature chicken" flavor - I wonder why that one is so much higher?). Anyway...isn't it great to see them looking and acting healthier?! I'm so glad to hear that his coat is looking so good!
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I usually get a little nervous shooting when he is in the blues since I'm at work from 7AM-5PM. However, my wife works from home and monitors him all day. She also gives him a small snack when he is around AMPS +5. However, she is out of town for the next 2 days. If I do get a reading in the blues tomorrow morning, do you think I should shoot 1u or feed him and wait longer than normal to shoot? I don't want to be stressed at work. :(
 
Phoenix hasn't been at this for very long, so I would definitely suggest lowering the dose if you can't be home to monitor. If it's a medium blue, maybe try 1.25, and if it's a low blue not more than 1u. If it's green you can stall if you've got time, and see if the number comes up. if you need to leave though, go ahead and skip the dose.

A couple of important things: doing a "sliding scale" like this is not the most helpful way to approach dosing - consistent doses seem to work best. However, when a kitty is new, safety is super important and you just don't have enough data yet to risk a full consistent dose on a low number. So for now, safety first, and when your wife gets back, we can get back to consistency.

Is she able to access your account here too in case she has questions when you're at work?
 
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