P - AMPS 344, +10 = 266, dose advice (daily condo near end)

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Re: P - AMPS 344, +10 = 266, dose advice (daily condo near e

I'd feed if you were planning to do so. I don't think you're going to see anything dramatic happen one way or the other by feeding versus withholding. The 511 is a bummer to see, but with 20% meter variance, a 500 reading could be anywhere between a 400 or a 600. P might be having a little bit of a bounce from the mid-200's he saw late in the AM cycle.
 
Re: P - AMPS 344, +10 = 266, dose advice (daily condo near e

If it is a bounce, could he still come down fairly quickly?
 
Re: P - AMPS 344, +10 = 266, dose advice (daily condo near e

Melissa and P said:
If it is a bounce, could he still come down fairly quickly?

Some cats can clear a bounce quickly, which you usually see as a high pre-shot that comes down right away, or it can last for a cycle or more where the insulin really seems to have no effect.
 
Re: P - AMPS 344, +10 = 266, dose advice (daily condo near e

Wow. I just...I don't even know. I hate this. I hate this so much.
 
Re: P - AMPS 344, +10 = 266, dose advice (daily condo near e

Any ideas on what I should do in the morning? Keep the 3.5 if he's high, or lower if he's lower? I don't know if anyone will be on then, so I was just wondering.
 
Re: P - AMPS 344, +10 = 266, dose advice (daily condo near e

Melissa and P said:
Wow. I just...I don't even know. I hate this. I hate this so much.

I do think those yellows you saw today are some headway. So the 3.5u did something. :smile: Will keep our fingers crossed that if P is bouncing a bit, he clears quickly.
 
Re: P - AMPS 344, +10 = 266, dose advice (daily condo near e

Melissa and P said:
Any ideas on what I should do in the morning? Keep the 3.5 if he's high, or lower if he's lower? I don't know if anyone will be on then, so I was just wondering.

If no one's on, my suggestion would be to keep the 3.5 for another cycle if he's above 300, and maybe just a hair lower if he's in the high 200's and if you can monitor.
 
Re: P - AMPS 344, +10 = 266, dose advice (daily condo near e

Thanks, Jen.

Sounds like a plan to me. I'll only be at school for 2 hours, but DH will be home to monitor.
 
Re: P - AMPS 344, +10 = 266, dose advice (daily condo near e

He cleared that bounce pretty fast, Melissa. (I think that the blacks last night were a bounce from the yellows you saw in the cycle before).

Looks like he is back in the pinks this am and your dose is good. Hope he decides to drop in the yellows again and maybe have an earlier nadir.

I know this is scary but you got great support and advice from Jen. Once he settles into a pattern and you start to see some movement, you'll start to figure this out on your own. The more you post and get advice, the more it will start to come clear for you. And the more nadirs you can get, the better the advice can be. :-D
 
Re: P - AMPS 344, +10 = 266, dose advice (daily condo near e

Good starting point for today. I can only echo what Sue said - it looks like P came off those icky blacks nicely by this morning. Since the yellow was late in the AM cycle yesterday, it looks like it pushed the bounce to the middle of the PM cycle. A yellow is pretty high to bounce from, but then again, it doesn't look like P had seen a yellow for about a week. Hopefully, you'll see some yellows again mid-cycle, and if so, that should give you some guidance on going forward.

I can't find the quote at the moment, but someone much smarter than me wrote that bouncing can be two different things: 1) a warranted bounce, where kitty went dangerously low into hypo territory, and the kitty's body did it's job in releasing glucose and counter-regulatory hormones to bring the cat back up into safe numbers, and 2) an unwarranted bounce, where kitty's body sees a lower more healthy number that it hasn't seen in a while and unnecessarily freaks out since it is used to high numbers. The unwarranted bounces are, I think, what most of us see pretty regularly. Bouncing is normal and it does get better over time.

I also think that an inverse curve can signal that a dose is too high; however, I think Carl wrote somewhere that you'd normally see a real low number somewhere early in the cycle and kitty bounced from for it to be a "true" inverse curve. For example, an inverse curve might be something like: AMPS = 200, +3 = 30, +6 = 300. That's an extreme example, but I think you get the idea.

How I personally look at bounces is that as long as the number that kitty bounced from is not an unsafe low, bouncing in and of itself is just part of kitty's body learning to adjust to better blood glucose levels.

I hope you're getting some rest today. If you get a chance, can you start a new condo with today's info, with a link to this conversation at the top?
 
Re: P - AMPS 344, +10 = 266, dose advice (daily condo near e

Woo! Glad he cleared quickly and the blacks were due to a bounce! +3 is looking good so far - 386.

Since I was up so late last night and worrying, I dipped into the think tank, and all around the site and read up on some good info. It's a lot to take in and still confusing, but like you said Sue, I'll start figuring it out on my own. But until then, I am so thankful to have you guys helping me. :-D

Jen, I saw you were on pretty late last night. I don't know if you were doing your own thing or checking up on P and I, but thank you so much.

That makes so much sense about bouncing. It was just really scary to see those 500s, but I can see now that it was his body responding and that's what we want.

I want to get a bunch of numbers around nadir, so I'm planning on a nap later in the day. :smile:

I'll post a new condo when I get some more numbers.
 
Re: P - AMPS 344, +10 = 266, dose advice (daily condo near e

Melissa and P said:
Since I was up so late last night and worrying, I dipped into the think tank, and all around the site and read up on some good info. It's a lot to take in and still confusing, but like you said Sue, I'll start figuring it out on my own. But until then, I am so thankful to have you guys helping me. :-D

I have definitely learned a ton from reading not only the stuff in the PZI forum, but in Lantus Land condos, in the Think Tank and all over the place. So long as you are aware, (which you are :smile: ) that the "rules" for LL are not applicable for us, I think a lot of really good info can be gleaned from all over the place.

Melissa and P said:
Jen, I saw you were on pretty late last night. I don't know if you were doing your own thing or checking up on P and I, but thank you so much.

I'm usually up fairly late with Eddie since he sometimes goes fairly low on me at night, and I tend to shoot more aggressively to get those greens at nadir. Other times, I just forget to close my laptop. :smile: I'm just glad I could be of some assistance.

Fingers and paws crossed for some movement in the right direction today which should help us with making dosing decisions going ahead.
 
Re: P - AMPS 344, +10 = 266, dose advice (daily condo near e

Im a real newbie on here and really don't know anything, but in any medicine, If one doesn't work why not try a different one? Just throwing that out there. If I went weeks and weeks with no progress I would try something else like Lantus or Vetsulin. My cat used Vetsulin with great success but most people here are not very fond of it.

Like I said im VERY new and don't have a clue what I am talking about compared to these members but just trying to get the brains working :)
 
Re: P - AMPS 344, +10 = 266, dose advice (daily condo near e

Well I'm not as new as you, but I'm still a newbie too!

ProZinc's a good insulin and I'm just trying to give it time to work, he's only been on insulin for two-ish months. There's a number of things that could be causing his high BGs. I haven't ruled out if it's an infection or something like that so we went to the vet today, to get a urinalysis and blood panel to check for infections. But if nothing turns up, it could be that ProZinc's not the insulin for him and I'll have to consider switching him to something else.

It's so cool that you guys are doing so great on Vetsulin. I think people aren't fond of it because I guess it usually doesn't work for most cats. But Wease obviously digs it and that's all that matters. :-D
 
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