Newly Diagnosed from New Zealand

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JackBlack

Member Since 2014
My cat Jack was diagnosed with Feline Diabetes 5 days ago. He is home now and I am giving him insulin and BG tests trying to stabilise him.

He is on 4 units of Caninsulin twice-daily. Although my vet said last night because the BG readings are swinging from high to low (an added complication he is on antibiotics now) we can adjust to what his BG is testing at.

I am being advised on facebook that 4 units may be way too much and also to look for alternative insulin. I googled it and saw some info that Caninsulin is the only insulin available for cats in New Zealand. Is this true? I will be checking with my vet also.

Also the Blood/Glucose numbers as different here in NZ. My testing machine goes from 0 - 33.3 (then reads high) Just so I can understand what people are talking about on these boards is there a calculation so I can convert my readings.

Regards Merrin
 
Re: Anyone here from New Zealand?

Hi Merrin, and welcome to FDMB.

Yes, 4 units of any insulin is a very high starting dose. We generally recommend starting out at something like one unit and then working up from there if necessary.
Also, it sounds like your kitty has an infection (is on antibiotics?), and infection can raise the blood glucose level quite a bit. This will become lower again as the infection subsides (another reason why the current insulin dose may be too high).

It sounds like you are testing Jack's blood glucose at home? What results are you getting? And are you testing before each insulin shot? (We recommend NO shot at all initially if the blood glucose prior to the shot is below 11/200)

The US has different measurements for blood glucose levels. To convert 'rest of the the World' numbers to US numbers it's necessary to multiply by 18.

What are you feeding Jack at the moment? Have you changed the diet since starting insulin?

And yes, I'm sure there are some other NZ members here at the moment, but I can't think who is currently posting..... Others will know, I'm sure.

Best wishes,

Eliz
 
Re: Anyone here from New Zealand?

Before diagnosis he was on dry food + raw beef. I have stopped the dry food and now feeding raw meat plus trying to introduce a low carb/protein based wet food (Ziwipeak) He wasn't eating much but since antibiotics his appetite is a little better.

I am testing at home - before every 12 hourly insulin shot and every also 2nd day trying to do a curve. At the 12 hour mark he has been testing high Any where from 26(x18 =468) to off the scale = over 33.3 (599) Yesterday mid curve he was low for the first time (maybe due to starting the antibiotics) at 5 (90) Now the vet says to administer units based on the BS

<10 (180) - 0 units
10-15(180-270) - 2 units
15-20 (270-360) - 3 units
<20 (360) - 4 units

Merrin
 
Re: Anyone here from New Zealand?

It'll help us give you feedback, if you put a few details in your signature.

To edit your signature

Go to the top left of the screen.
Click on User Control Panel.
Click on Profile
Click on Edit Signature
A text box displays.
This is where you paste the link for your spreadsheet, once it is set up.
Add any other text, such as
your name, cat's name,
city, state,country
date of Dx (diagnosis)
insulin
meter
any other pertinent issues like if there are any food issues, history of DKA, hepatic lipidosis, pancreatitis, allergies, IBD, etc.
Then Click on Submit to save it.
 
Re: Anyone here from New Zealand?

Allie & Myrtle are long standing members in NZ - I will PM her and ask if she can look in.

Diana
 
Re: Anyone here from New Zealand?

Welcome Merrin and Jack. One of our members from a couple of years ago, Kath & Red, is from Auckland, and she had Red on Lantus. Also Charlene (Java) is also on Lantus, though I believe she started with Caninsulin. She's a current member - I'll PM her too.

I started Neko on Caninsulin - that's what the vet did. :roll: Then I got a locum vet at the same office who got us switched to Lantus. It's also quite common in Canada to start on Caninsulin. And the rest of the world, like you uses BG numbers as mmol/L. To get the US numbers, just multiply mmol/L number by 18.
 
Re: Anyone here from New Zealand?

Hey Merrin :)

Im in NZ as well (Charlene from facebook).

Our Java was DX back in July, whilst in severe DKA. He had been diabetic for awhile. Our vet put us straight onto Caninsulin, 2U twice a day. We ended up at 4U by the time we made the change to lantus.

I too thought that Caninsulin was the only insulin available in NZ - and to a certain extent, it is the only one the vets will prescribe first up (although there is no reason they can't go straight to Lantus).

Lantus is one of two insulins prescribed to humans in NZ. Lantus (or glargine as its otherwise known), and Levemir. Access to both of these is via prescription from your vet. Take it to the pharmacy and voila! You have the good juice for your Jack. It is expensive however. If you do switch to Lantus, please make sure you get the pack of 5 "pens". These are little vials that diabetics put in their pens to administer. We don't use the pen, but use the syringes to draw insulin out of the top of the little pen vial. You can use these vials right down to the last drop as long as the insulin stays clear and bright. You do not need to dispose of them after 28 days. We can get into that a little more when/if youve changed.

You will also need a new box of syringes when you switch to lantus. You will need U-100. Please don't use the U-40 syringes you have for caninsulin. There is a mathy type conversiony thing (as you can see, im a bit light on the detail of the conversion, as I decided bugger it, im just going to use the right syringes!). You can either clip the needle into a sharps container and put the syringe in the rubbish, or dispose of the whole thing. I use a fresh and fruit 1 ltr container with a hole in the top and just bung a recapped syringe in there when done. The vet takes the containers back when i need a new box of needles. They can give you a box of 100 (ten packs of ten).

At the end of the day - the choice of insulin should be a decision you and your vet can discuss together. Take the protocol in from these boards, talk to your vet, and if they are not supportive of a change then find a vet who is. That might come across as a little harsh, but, Caninsulin is such a harsh insulin for your kitty. You want something that facilitates a more gentle rise and fall of the blood sugar.

Re food. Ziwipeak is perfect for your cat to be on 100% of the time. It was recommended by Javas vet at diagnosis. We still give him Jimbos 100% beef as a snack before we go to bed. We however do not give him any dry food whatsoever. We feed him 5 times a day, spreading his meals out to avoid big food hits. We use this little puppy from amazon. Helps us have a bit of a life outside shooting and testing :)

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000GE ... UTF8&psc=1

Java's spreadsheet is on my signature if you want to have a quick squiz at our transition from caninsulin to lantus - we are still on a journey to regulation, but we are getting some good numbers that shows we are on the right track, all down to the lantus protocol and the wonderful people here who help me interpret. If you can pop together a spreadsheet, the members here can better help you with dosing - sometimes the protocol needs a little tweaking, and there is pretty much nothing diabeties related that stumps the wonderful community on here.

If I remember, you're about 6 days into the sugar dance (sometimes is a nice gentle waltz, and sometimes it going to be an all out mosh at the front of a rock concert, just go with it), so you're probably still a little overwhelmed by information and worries. Just take it one day at a time. Keep going with your monitoring, and pop back in here any time if you have questions.

Charlene
 
Re: Anyone here from New Zealand?

Thanks so much, I read your email but will re-read it - it's all sinking in but a little like learning a new language at the moment. Here is the spreadsheet I just filled out. My numbers ore NZ numbers but the headings are the ones that were on the original spreadsheet. I will figure out how to make these match. I will have more questions but for now ...

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... edit#gid=0
 
Re: Anyone here from New Zealand?

Good work on getting the SS up! Let's tweak it a little and get you using the world tab :). At the moment you have jacks numbers in the US version :). The good thing is you can plug in your numbers, and it will convert the numbers to US values :)
 
Re: Anyone here from New Zealand?

There should be a template with World numbers in it that uses formulas to convert the values onto a 2nd page in the Technical Support forum.

Or, if you're spreadsheet savvy, add 2nd page and put in a formula to multiply the value from the 1st page by 18.
 
Re: Anyone here from New Zealand?

Thanks, I have made a new spreadsheet using the "world" template The US page is a bit ugly but the numbers are correct!

I have reduced Jack's Caninsulin to 2 units without consulting my vet but he is not at work until tomorrow. I feel a bit naughty but I took his bloods all day today and he didn't get the huge dips down that he had been experiencing over the previous 2 days.

Merrin
 
Re: Anyone here from New Zealand?

What a rebel - and good for you! With home testing you'll be in the best position to make decisions in regards to jacks insulin needs. We work with our vets for sure, but day in day out you'll live this sugar dance and will see how he responds to insulin, food and other influencing factors. Example - Java has stress highs when people come to stay (seems he's a little precious about his space!)

One more thing.....you might like to change the privacy settings on the new sheet :). It appears to be private :)

C
 
Re: Anyone here from New Zealand?

Hi JackBlack!

I did have a diabetic cat some years back, but can't offer you any help compared to what you have already had - and from another Kiwi who is really up with the play! Back in my days with a diabetic cat (2006-2007) caninsulin was pretty much all there was, but fortunately my vet was never into large starting doses, and I was able to cut back to 1.5 units 2x a day. My cat did OK-ish on caninsulin. A friend of mine had a diabetic cat a couple of years later and I told her about Lantus/Glargine, which she was able to get easily through her vet, who actually recommended it as a first choice.
So, it seems to depend on how well informed a vet is about feline diabetes, but most vets here are generalists, I suspect.

Ziwipeak is a good food, but a bit pricey. It wasn't available when my cat was diabetic, so I fed her the low-carb. Fancy Feast varieties, and some raw meat as well (I got horse meat and rabbit meat from a pet food shop). Jimbos raw meat pottles in the chiller section (pet food) of the supermarket, or those other varieties of raw cat meat there are good, too, if your cat will eat raw.

All the help in the world is here on the FDMB! You clearly are on the ball with the home-testing, so well done and good luck!
 
Re: Anyone here from New Zealand?

Thanks for the support. True, I am a bit of a rebel but only after having done my research and knowing I am not endangering Jack. I am sticking with 2 units for now. All I can see so far is his highs aren't so high and his lows aren't so low. I will broach it with my vet in a couple of days when I can show him some numbers and discuss switching to another longer acting insulin.

Jack's eating is sporadic. He wouldn't eat anything today. Since he was diagnosed I have cut dry food out and am introducing Ziwipeak by mixing it into his raw meat. He is not too keen on the Ziwipeak, sometimes he is hungry enough to forget its there. Sometimes I just give him raw meat so he at least eats something. But the aim is to switch to Ziwipeak or perhaps make my own wet food once things settle down and we are in a routine with all this. Generally his appetite is way down.

Merrin
 
Re: Anyone here from New Zealand?

If you add a few details to your signature and profile, it will help us give you feedback.

To edit your signature

Go to the top left of the screen.
Click on User Control Panel.
Click on Profile
Click on Edit Signature
A text box displays.
This is where you paste the link for your spreadsheet, once it is set up.
Add any other text, such as
your name, cat's name,
date of Dx (diagnosis)
insulin
meter
any other pertinent issues like if there are any food issues, history of DKA, hepatic lipidosis, pancreatitis, allergies, IBD, etc.
Then Click on Submit to save it.

To edit your Profile
Click on Edit profile
Add location: city, state,country
Any other details you'd like to put in there
Then Click on Submit to save it.
 
Re: Anyone here from New Zealand?

Perfect. And my phone even sees your spreadsheet (my phone is tempermental!).
 
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