new to the forum - symptoms of diabetes?

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healla

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Hello everyone! I've been reading this forum as a "guest" for a couple of days now and am looking for some advice about my kitty. This is mostly for preventative measures, so I hope that is allowed and ok!

I have a 10 year old, 16 pound, male kitty (he's a very big cat) who is currently on steroids (prednisolone) to treat IBD. I'm worried about the potential for him to develop diabetes and am hoping that if he does, I can catch it early. The GI vet who is treating him told me to watch out for excessive thirst, increased urination, and an increase in appetite along with weight loss. Are there any other symptoms that I should be looking out for that might indicate he is developing diabetes and should get to the vet for testing?

This is his first bout with IBD and his first time on a steroid treatment (we tried budesonide first but it didn't help at all, so we had to go for the prednisolone). He's been on the prednisolone for about 2 weeks now so I'm not sure if that's long enough to really develop diabetes or not, but it's still a concern for me. Any advice that could help me help him would be very much appreciated! Thank you!
 
Well, good for you! I have been on the site for 6 years and I don't think I have never seen a preventative post like yours.

The best thing you can do is to feed a wet lo carb diet. We try to stay under 10% carbs. Here is our food chart: Janet and Binky’s chart This site by a vet explains why it is best for every kitty: www.catinfo.org

You could also buy a cheap meter and strips. (The ReliOn from Walmart fits this category.) Learn to test his blood sugar: Video for hometesting Get a baseline for where he usually is (40 -120 is normal without insulin with the majority of the time spent in double digits.) Then, if you see him creeping up, you can get him to the vet early.

You can also watch for increase peeping, dry hair, eating more, drinking more - but those symptoms are usually after the blood glucose levels are headed up.

Read alot and ask questions. We would love to help you keep your kitty healthy.
 
Great JOB!
What a lovely mommy bean. Hopefully, you wont have to worry about nailbite_smile
 
If you test him weekly, give low carb appropriate foods, keep all high carb crunchies away...I bet you can beat the odds of a steroid induced diabetic. And god forbid if he shows increased bg's you would be on top of it so quickly that he would likely go off the insulin as quickly as he began.
Good for you staying on top of things.
Lori
and tomtom
 
healla said:
I have a 10 year old, 16 pound, male kitty (he's a very big cat) who is currently on steroids (prednisolone) to treat IBD. I'm worried about the potential for him to develop diabetes and am hoping that if he does, I can catch it early. The GI vet who is treating him told me to watch out for excessive thirst, increased urination, and an increase in appetite along with weight loss. Are there any other symptoms that I should be looking out for that might indicate he is developing diabetes and should get to the vet for testing?

This is his first bout with IBD and his first time on a steroid treatment (we tried budesonide first but it didn't help at all, so we had to go for the prednisolone). He's been on the prednisolone for about 2 weeks now so I'm not sure if that's long enough to really develop diabetes or not, but it's still a concern for me. Any advice that could help me help him would be very much appreciated! Thank you!
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Hello,

This is so good that you are taking preventative action now. I have two kitties with IBD symptoms (with inconclusive results but the vets put them in the IBD category). One has both IBD (suspected) and diabetes. My kitty’s IBD was diagnosed after he became diabetic, and he was never on prednisolone.

May I ask how your kitty’s IBD was diagnosed and what are his IBD symptoms? The reason I am asking is because too often when the vets can’t find a conclusive dx when kitties have prolong GI issues, they would give us an IBD diagnose. I just wanted to make sure that your kitty is properly diagnosed, and he indeed has IBD. I would hate to see him being put on prednisolone for a pre-mature IBD dx or worse for allergic reactions to his current diet. There are other ways which you can try to treat IBD before trying prednisolone. Maybe you have tried them all but in case you haven't, I just wanted to let you know that a change of diet could help treat your kitty's IBD.

1. Eliminate ALL grains - try grain free canned food.
2. Try raw diet - you can make your own or buy pre-made.
3. Try novel protein - many cats with IBD are in fact allergic or have intolerance to chicken, beef and turkey. Unfortunately, the most common ingredients for cat food are chicken and turkey. My kitties can only eat raw rabbit, canned rabbit and canned pork.

Also, Cobalamin B12 injection will help with nutrient absorption for kitties with IBD.
http://www.ibdkitties.net/B12.html
This is the B12 dosing protocol recommended by Texas A&M University Veterinary GI department:
http://vetmed.tamu.edu/gilab/research/cobalamin-information#dosing

I was given the option to put one of my kitties on steroids but opted to try diet change, injectable B12 treatment and NAET (allergy elimination treatment to make sure the problem is not just caused by food allergy). The combination of the above is working for us. Both my ‘suspected IBD kitties’ still have an extremely sensitive GI system (knock-me-out stinky diarrhoea and vomiting when they have flare ups) but in general I can keep their IBD symptoms under control.
Below is a link for kitties with IBD. It has a lot of good info.
http://www.ibdkitties.net/
 
Thank you for the advice, everyone! And for the warm welcome! He means the whole world to me and I want to keep him healthy and happy as long as possible. I'm glad it was ok to ask for preventative help! :smile:

I will review the home testing video and get myself a meter to check him at home...what a great idea for tracking any potential progression to diabetes!

In terms of diet, he is a very, very, very (did I mention very?) picky eater who refused to eat anything but dry food all of his life, but I have now managed to switch him onto a grain-free wet food (after TONS of trial and error, it seems the only wet food he will eat is Blue Buffalo Wilderness in the Salmon formula). I'm still experimenting to find out if there are other wet foods he will eat, but so far he has flat out refused to eat anything else at all, and since he's still recovering from IBD and a mild case of hepatic lipidosis, I get worried about a relapse when he refuses to eat. I'm a bit uncomfortable with keeping him on the Salmon formula long-term because a blood test last year had indicated a "red flag" for potential early stages of kidney disease (a rising level of something - I would have to ask for the results again to remember...my head is a bit fuzzy after all we've been through so far, but more on that below), and I know that he would need a food low in phosphorus for kidney disease. He had been on a kidney diet and every test since that first "red flag" has indicated absolutely no sign of any kidney issue, so hopefully we're ok for the moment.

KSAkitties, thanks for the info! To answer your question about the IBD, it's been quite a process to get his diagnosis. In July, he grew increasingly lethargic/depressed and was refusing to eat and after many vet and ER trips, three hospital admissions, plenty of blood tests, a few x-rays, two ultrasounds, a feeding tube placement, an endoscopy, and a surgical biopsy of his stomach and intestines (and liver, to check for for hepatic lipidosis), the surgical biopsy finally confirmed the IBD (and a mild case of fatty liver from the anorexia from the IBD) in September. We may have been able to get a diagnosis earlier but I was hesitant to try the more invasive measures until absolutely necessary. He still was refusing to eat on his own so I didn't have much of a choice but to try a steroid until he started to eat again (we used a novel protein [rabbit] for making the formula for the feeding tube with no luck). I had wanted to start out on the milder steroid so we tried budesonide and he improved just slightly for a couple of days but then had a major relapse and ended up in the ER for 4 nights so we had to bump him up to the stronger steroid about three weeks ago. He felt better almost immediately and was eating full meals on his own two days after starting the prednisolone, and I'm pleased to say we're now feeding tube free (as of one week ago) and back to playing and making trouble! We're working on tapering off the steroid (now down to about 1/3 of the original dose) because my goal and hope is to control the IBD (and any diabetes he may develop from the steroid or just from being a bit overweight and big in general) with his diet.
 
definitely do NOT change the food if you've found something that works with his IBD, especially if it is already grain free, etc.

Have you tried metrondiazole at all for the IBD? I know little about it except that my Squeak has been diagnosed with liver issues, is on it and apparently it is also used for IBD

Jen
 
healla said:
KSAkitties, thanks for the info! To answer your question about the IBD, it's been quite a process to get his diagnosis. In July, he grew increasingly lethargic/depressed and was refusing to eat and after many vet and ER trips, three hospital admissions, plenty of blood tests, a few x-rays, two ultrasounds, a feeding tube placement, an endoscopy, and a surgical biopsy of his stomach and intestines (and liver, to check for for hepatic lipidosis), the surgical biopsy finally confirmed the IBD (and a mild case of fatty liver from the anorexia from the IBD) in September.
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You are welcome. Just wanted to be sure your kitty's IBD was properly dx. I went through a very similar experience with my boy Major. After lots of tests and ultrasounds, my vet still couldn’t give us a firm dx but decided that Major had IBD. I didn’t want to have a surgical biopsy because Major was too weak at that time, and I was afraid the procedure would be too invasive.

healla said:
I have now managed to switch him onto a grain-free wet food (after TONS of trial and error, it seems the only wet food he will eat is Blue Buffalo Wilderness in the Salmon formula). I'm still experimenting to find out if there are other wet foods he will eat, but so far he has flat out refused to eat anything else at all, and since he's still recovering from IBD and a mild case of hepatic lipidosis, I get worried about a relapse when he refuses to eat. I'm a bit uncomfortable with keeping him on the Salmon formula long-term because a blood test last year had indicated a "red flag" for potential early stages of kidney disease (a rising level of something - I would have to ask for the results again to remember...my head is a bit fuzzy after all we've been through so far, but more on that below), ….
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Good, you are feeding him grain free wet food but you are right that the salmon formula is not the best diet for any kitty on a long term basis.
Perhaps, you can slowly and slowly transition him on to a different type of grain free wet food while use the salmon formula as a ' toping' to entice him to eat. I had to use this method to convert my kibble addict girl to eat wet food. But in your case, the key is to make sure your kitty continues to eat on his own so I would DELAY any diet change at this time. Wait till he is more stable and is used to eating on his own again.

healla said:
…..I know that he would need a food low in phosphorus for kidney disease. He had been on a kidney diet and every test since that first "red flag" has indicated absolutely no sign of any kidney issue, so hopefully we're ok for the moment.
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Regarding finding a low phosphorus food for kitties with kidney problems, there are ways to reduce the phosphorous content by using phosphorous binders (see the link below). I know many kitties with kidney problems do very well on high protein diet with proper supplements.
http://www.felinecrf.org/phosphorus.htm#aluminium_hydroxide

By the way, injectable B12 helps with appetite and nutrient absorption, especially for kitties with IBD and with poor appetite. I have been giving it to my two IBD kitties for the past three years.
 
Jen - Nope, he hasn't been given that. So far we've been through budesonide and prednisolone as the steroids, metoclopramide to help his stomach movements, and Cerenia through a bout of vomiting. He was given mirtazapine as an appetite stimulant and had a HORRIBLE reaction to it (I really thought he was dying) and that reaction was what spurred my efforts to try to learn everything I could about his symptoms, condition(s), treatments, and any medications they were prescribing for him instead of just blindly going along with what was suggested. He also had a course of Clavomox after his second feeding tube placement and didn't do very well on it.

KSAkitties - Thanks for the phosphorus and B12 info! His sister (my mom has her) is on B12 shots for triaditis and they seem to help her a ton! Also, unrelated, but I had read Major's story on ibdkitties a while back and just put two and two together! I hope he's doing well!

One more quick question regarding the home testing to try to get a baseline for him. When would you all recommend testing him for this? Morning before breakfast, morning after breakfast, afternoon, evening before dinner, evening after dinner, etc.?
 
healla said:
KSAkitties - Thanks for the phosphorus and B12 info! His sister (my mom has her) is on B12 shots for triaditis and they seem to help her a ton! Also, unrelated, but I had read Major's story on ibdkitties a while back and just put two and two together! I hope he's doing well!
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Thank you for asking. Yes, that's my sweet boy Major's story (an abreviated version of his IBD journey) on ibdkitties. His IBD is currently under control (touch wood) but sadly his diabetes came back a few months ago (he was in remission for over three years) after he wast attacked, bitten and injured (physically and emotionally) by one of my Saudi rescue kitties. I am still feeling very sad, guilty and angry with myself for not being more careful or providing Major with more protection when I moved Major and his sister Sudbina to Saudi earlier this year. He is the most affactionate kitty. He is my love and my kitty soul mate.
 
There are plenty of cats who need to be treated with steroids who never develop diabetes. My Abbey was treated with pred as part of her lymphoma treatment for over 4 years and never had any elevations in her glucose. (despite her Whiskas Temptations addiction!)

I do think you're better off sticking with a low dose of pred instead of the stronger stuff like DepoMedrol.
 
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