New to the board, need support

Status
Not open for further replies.
TheresaJ860

TheresaJ860

Member
Hi, I have a wonderful long haired orange cat, age is aprox 9 to 11. He was abondoned, living under the porch for 2 years when my now husband and I met him. We adopted him, and he has been very appreciative.
From the first we had him at the Vets for what turned out to be a cyst/polyp deep in his ear, requiring surgery. That has affected his sinus.
He has been hospitalized at least 4 times for Urinary blockage/crystals/infections. He has been doing much better in this department. He was put on a Urinary tract diet, Royal Canin wet food, and Science Diet kibble.
In December he was attacked by a wild animal, and quite injured, and hospitalized for a week.

There have been some serious stressors in his home life, am not sure if these things played a part in him becoming diabetic.

Took him in this past week after noticing a ravenous appetite, and rapid weight loss, excessive thirst and urination. Sure enough, his blood sugar was over 450! He actually enjoys the vets, they all know and love him, and he takes advantage of that LOL, so I don't think there was an increase in his numbers due to transportation/vet visit stress.

He was also x-rayed and found to have bronchial asthma, something that has been suspected for years, but previous x-rays did not confirm, so that tells me the asthma has gotten worse. The Vet said she could not prescribe steroids due to his diabetes.

I'm so grateful to have found Feline Diabetes by Lisa, and being directed to this board.

The Vet discouraged at home testing, suggested dip stick testing if I was worried, (They know I'm rather neurotic and take both my cat and dog in at the slightest concern,) they were also going to order Royal Canin Diabetic diet.

I am sure there are wonderful posts here to go through, and I will do so as time permits, I just wanted to introduce myself and tell of my poor Cat Christian's new difficulties. I do not want to cause him any additional harm, and welcome the support that more experienced individuals can offer.

Thank you so much for this opportunity!
 
Hello and welcome


A few questions though

1. Does he eat dry food?

2. Did the vet tell you to start home test his blood glucos levels at home?


Ann
 
Hi Ann,

yes he eats dry cat food, and wet cat food. Science Diet Indoor dry, Royal Canin and friskies wet.

I was told it was not necessary to test at home, further reading, and a diabetic husband have given me concern over that advice. He was started on 1 unit of insulin, this is day 3.

Thank you!
Theresa and Christian, and his Shihtzu sister Libby :smile:
 
Ann,
I should add that one of the signs of his ravenous appetite was when he started moving the dog out of her bowl, and started eating her dog food, after eating his cat food.

I have started baking chicken, plain, no skin and supplimenting his diet with small amounts (1/4 cup at the most) of chicken, the vet thought this was a good idea as it is all protein and good quality.
 
Your vet saying don't test at home would be like your husbands doc telling him not to. Testing at home is the first and best thing you can do for Christian. Best thing? You may even be able to use the same meter.

Carl in SC
 
Thank you Carl, yes we were thinking the same thing. I just need to find out what his meter requires for a blood sample. cat_pet_icon
 
Actually, worse than telling your husband not to worry about it... Imagine if your husband had no way to communicate with you concerning how he was feeling during the day, and the only way to evaluate when or how much to dose him was for you to sit there and observe him during the day. That's what a cat with diabetes would be like.
Especially at the beginning of feline diabetes treatment, home testing is critical. Testing your sugarcat before each dose is crucial, so that you can have an idea of how the insulin is working and how his diet is affecting his BG levels. Pretty much, for the next days or weeks, think of Christian's life as coming in 12 hour segments. Test/feed/dose at breakfast and dinner times. Then you will learn to test him in between doses so that you can see how the insulin is working during that 12 hour period. When you home test, it is easy to see that his insulin and diet is working well, not-so-well, or "too good", because you'll see the swing of BG from highest to lowest.
If your reading time is limited, the best place to start is with the Feline Diabetes FAQ thread which is "stickied" in the top portion of every index page. That will answer many of your questions.

If you have questions, or need clarification, advice, or just need to vent, this is the best forum to do so at the beginning of this dance. Eventually, you will want to post on other pages, depending on the subject matter and which insulin (each type has its own forum for issues related to that specific insulin).

Best advice I can give - breath. Take this a tiny bit at a time, don't try to cram a million bits of information into your head at the same time. And always keep in mind that there are hundreds of people who visit here regularly who have been exactly where you are, and will freely offer support to you, your family, and your sugarcat whenever you need it.

Welcome to the dance,
Carl in SC

EDIT: I might have missed it, but you said 1 unit. That's twice a day, right? What type of insulin? And you also mentioned "dipsticks". Would those be ketone test strips to test his urine?
 
Hi Theresa.....Welcome to the Board, actually, I'm sorry you have to be here, BUT you couldn't have found a better place for help, support and INFORMATION! :-D

Glad you are thinking about hometesting.....a very important thing to do for your diabetic kitty. as far as meters go, any human one will do. A lot of people buy the Relion brand from Walmart.....meter is relatively inexpensive, and it was rated well by Consumer Reports. The strips are also relatively inexpensive....$20 for 50. I have an Accu-chek Aviva that I got for free and I buy my strips from ebay.

There are videos on youtube that show how to hoemtest your kitty as well as information on this site.

Keep asking questions.....and good for you for being proactive!

Sherry
 
Theresa and Christian,
Welcome aboard! Best place you will ever find that is forr sureee!
When my sugar Bean was dx.. 4/11, the vet did not encourage home testing either. One week after the dx, we went back and did the curve at the vets and she went from the 300's at the original dx to in the 500s that day! He doubled her insulin from 1u to 2u - 2x a day. Meanwhile, I found this site, and had my testing kit ready. I tried several times and did not succeed! I never increase to 2U, but I did increase to 1.25 and once I shot 1.50....Because of the posts I was reading here, I was very afraid of doubling without testing...

Anyway, I guess I wanted to share my story, I did increase Bean to 1.25 on the dreadful nite that I was finally able to test and she was ONLY 27!! EEEKS!

I guess that is why I find this place to be the best...everyone stayed with me, posting and responding as I was trying to keep Bean from hypo....Ms. Lori stayed with me for 4+ hours, while I searched the cabinets, frig...anything that would bring up her numbers! She finally reached the low 40's and a crazied mommy went to bed!

I did make a promise to my wonderful sugar Bean, NEVER EVER to shoot again without testing first..... since that promise, some diet changes, and calmness, she is now in Remission!!!! GO BEAN GO!!!

So, I do think my vet was way way off by telling me it was not important to test!!

It sounds like your baby is a trooper and can just about survive anything thrown his way! Good luck with OTJ (off the juice)! And again, welcome to the dance!
 
Home testing of BG is the way to go--with an ordinary BG meter that people use.

Dip sticks for glucose in the urine only tell you if he has passed the renal
threshold and spilled glucose into his urine sometime since the bladder
was last emptied.

Urine dip-stick testing does not tell you how LOW the BG is at a particular moment
and if it is safe to give insulin. Your vet is wrong. You should home test if
you are willing to step up to it and many cats here purr through the whole thing...
because there is usually a treat coming !

It is very useful to have some KetoStix in your kit, for testing urine for Keytones.
Ahhh yes...we can go over the mechanics of testing Christian's urine !!!

You certainly have your plate full with his medical problems.

I do want to mention we have Asthma cats here, too, that are diabetic. Some use
an inhaler and a special box for administering the mist. This form of asthma
treatment does not have the severe affect that injected steroids or pills do.

So when you have digested some of this info here...you might want to pose
a question on a separate thread about treating the asthma.

Also, I might mention that my cat Smokey, was a steroid-induced diabetic, being
on prednisolone for his IBD (Inflammatory Bowel Disease). He needed to have the pred.
You just work the insulin around whatever happens with the BG because of the steroids.

Something else I want to mention. You have started at 1u insulin (WHAT KIND ?)...is that
once per day or twice per day. There are no really once per day insulins for cats (they
metabolize insulin at twice the rate that humans do).

DO not fall into the trap of increasing the dose too quickly. Don't increase the dose
based upon one high pre-shot number. You can DECREASE the dose based upon a LOW
pre-shot number. We will help you with dosing, just come here with your numbers.

Good insulins for cats are Lantus, Levimir (both human insulins) and ProZinc, which is
a veterinary insulin for cats. Not so good insulins are NPH "N", Caninsulin. Both
hit hard and fast and have too steep a drop with little duration.

Both Lantus and Levimir require a steady dose at 12-hour intervals. And increases
should be very small (.25 to .5 unit). IF you are using one of those insulins,
you should go over to the Insulin Support group and learn more about dosing with
and handling Lantus or Levimir.

Also be aware that veterinary insulins are U-40 (40 units of insulin per ml of liquid) and ALL
human insulins in the
USA are U-100 (100 units of insulin per ml of liquid). So you shoot U-40 insulin
using U-40 syringes to start out with (we have a way to use U-100 syringes with U-40 insulin)

With U-100 insulin you MUST use U-100 syringes, which is what you get at any human pharmacy.

Bye the way, what insulin is your husband using ? You may even be able to use the same insulin !!!
 
Thank you Everyone!
I've spent the entire day reading at catinfo.org, and can totally understand why she repeatedly suggests joining this discussion/support board!

To answer a few questions, he is on Prozinc 40-U, I have a small supply of 40-U syringes, he is prescribed 1 unit 2x's a day.

His urine test @ the Vets showed an extremely high level of BG in his urine. The blood test came back the next day with what I consider an extremely high reading of over 450!

He eats wet food, prefers human cooked meats, but loves his kibble, as he is quite insistant when I let it go empty. I think it will be a battle to get him to give up the kibble, however, my reading today indicates I should be taking it up right now and throwing it all away!

If you don't mind, may I tell you part of his story, and why I am really driving my husband crazy over this. (Honestly I should have been cleaning the house today, and I haven't done a thing!)

When we moved into the house/three apartments in winter of 05 I had my incredible beloved male cat with me, he was 13 yrs old, orange tabby, (Hummer). He started hanging out with the abondoned cat, who really didn't want anything to do with humans, not that I could blame him. Over the year he came closer to us, and we enjoyed watching the two cats become best friends. (Odd since they were both dominant males.)
I had taken a kingsized lambswool mattress protector and placed it in a cacoon shape under the porch, hoping the poor thing would realize we wanted to help him. Of course we fed him from day one, so he did come to eat and become just a tiny bit more trusting.
One awful, blizzard conditions night, my Hummer literally came dashing up to the porch jabbering away in urgency, I'd never seen him like that. It was obvious he wanted me to follow him, which I did. Christian was covered in ice frozen snot, and was in serious resperitory distress. My husband and I wrapped him in a towel, brought him inside, and helped the best we could. It was that week he was taken to the vet, and surgery was performed... and he was ours.
He and Hummer were constant companions. We always say Hummer convinced him his mommy would help, and she did.
Hummer had saved my life, he was everything to me, everything. He went to the vet, and was given a new flea/tick something or other, I don't remember, but it was made by pfizer. Within a week he had drastically changed, and was obviously dying. It was awful, really heart breaking, he could not be saved, from a Thursday night to Saturday afternoon we tried everything, but the vet said that there was nothing left to try.

I always wonder, was it the new flea stuff? Could I have done something different? Did I miss something? His entire body was shutting done, so there was no way to actually say what caused his sudden illness and death.

Christian has settled in as the King Cat quite well, he knows he is loved, spoiled and that I worry excessively at times about him. He is quite the talker cat.

My husband is on metformin, not insulin, I need to get a new glucometer that does not require as much blood as my husbands, so I can test Christian.

I am a hypoglycemic pt. I've been in a coma from low blood sugar, and I know how I feel, so reading about spontaneous remissions, diet changes requiring a dose change etc. I'm now quite concerned. I immediately went out and bought corn syrup, as the vet suggested if he showed signs of low blood sugar to put some on my finger and let him lick it.

Since his first dose, I have stayed awake to make sure he is alright, and watch him closely all day. I do have a few questions though, he is suppose to have the insulin every 12 hours, and I apparently screwed myself with timing, as I gave him his first dose at 11AM, and now feel like that was a huge mistake. Is there a way to reschedule his dosing?

If I can't get his BGL, I mean, if I don't have the right meter tonight, and if it takes a while to get a sample, what do I have to look for?
He is still so hungry, thirsty, and he is sleeping a great deal, though I don't think it is more than usual.

Thank you all for understanding, and for encouraging me. I will keep reading, learning and definetly asking questions.
Theresa and Christian

I am very grateful for all the wonderful replies, and it really helps not to feel alone!
Edited for a typo!
 
You can use U-100 syringes instead of the U-40 syringes, once you run out of those.
U-100 syringes are available at most pharmacies and MOST states do not require an Rx.
You MUST use a conversion chart to draw U-40 insulin into U-100 syringes...we can cover
that later. And U-100 syringes are cheaper, readily available, and come in smaller gauges...
therefore more comfortable for your cat.

To get on a 12hr schedule that works for you, decide when you want to give shots, like 8am 8pm...
or whatever works for you. Then just adjust each shot by 30 minutes until you get to
the desired schedule. If his shot was 11am this morning, give tonight's shot at 10:30pm...
tomorrow morning at 10am...etc.

He should be OK with the 1u 2x/day, as long as he is still showing symptoms and still getting
a bit of dry food.

Get a meter as soon as you can, and read up on transitioning from dry food, on Dr. Lisa's
site, here:

http://catinfo.org/ (in the green column on the right)

I'm so sorry for your loss of Hummer. May your wonderful memories of him comfort you...
...'til you meet again.
 
Hi Theresa and Christian!
The others have pretty much covered the bases for you. I agree that home testing is critical. One morning(12 hours since his last insulin shot) my Charlie's bg was 33 :shock: I could have killed him if I shot his dose (he gets a very high dose because he has acromegaly, so he's a little different than a typical diabetic). Good thing I was testing or I never would have known! It is easy once you get the hang of it and his ears learn to bleed for you. I use the Relion Micro (from Walmart) because it's CHEAP and it requires a very small blood sample.

A wet diet is best for diabetic kitties...high protein, low carb just like human diabetics. Here is a link to janet & binky's site that lists carb contents of foods. You will want to keep it below 10% http://binkyspage.tripod.com/CanFoodNew.html http://binkyspage.tripod.com/CanFoodOld.html I'm honestly not sure how this diet is for kitties with urinary tract issues. I hope someone will come along with that info for you.

It's helpful that you and your hubby are so experienced in the area of blood glucose. You have a good reference point.

Poor Christian has had a rough go of it so far, but this will likely be one of the easier issues you've dealt with with him. Once you get in the groove, it's really pretty easy to treat a diabetic cat. Every Cat Is Different (ECID) though, so this group is always here to answer any questions you have, talk you down when it gets overwhelming, and help you figure out the dance that is feline diabetes dancing_cat dancing_cat dancing_cat dancing_cat dancing_cat
 
Welcome! I will chime in that we use the Relion Micro from Walmart. mOM WORKS FOR mCkESSION and could have gotten me a meter, but this was inexpensive, although Walmart isn't as convienet as Target. I get my lancets from there, as they have caps for them. I get the 28 gague tho I still have problems getting blood from his ear (we are diet controlled but still test).

I get what happened to Hummer. My friend 7 former next door neightbor had a similar experience when her cat got his annual shots one year. She's a nurse and gave him Benadrill, but he didn't last but a few hours. Probably something bad in what he got - he was only about 5 or 6 (and he was Midora's boyfirend :-D )

You are doing great - hubby will understand!

PS: did I see you are in CT? My uncle used to live in Gramby.
 
Thank you Charliemeow, Karen, and doombuggy, and all the other wonderful posters!

I got the Relion Micro today, tested Christian, (Which was awful, he cried and hated it, but it worked on the first try!) I was shocked and overcome with emotion when his reading was 464!!!

I measured his dry food this morning, he hasn't eaten much of it, and he had EVO ancestreal this morning, and his chicken treats. We were away all day, and he did drink a great deal of water, and as I'm sure you've all experienced, I am now even more of a wreck!

He is on to me with giving him his insulin shots, and is very unhappy with me. When I tested him, I was glad it worked with such a small amount of blood, but that cry! :cry:

Is it really possible that his BG has gone up? Or is it more likely that the Vet just said his original reading was over 450?

Doombuggy I see you feed your cat EVO, does your cat like the taste? He liked it this morning, but was not thrilled this evening with it being cold and microwaved to warm, (12 seconds in micro).

Can anyone tell me what the danger is with him being so high? I don't want to test him to often when he is this high if it is going to cause him such distress.

:cry: I'm miserable right now, really upset, my poor baby doesn't understand why Mommy is doing this. He isn't laying with me anymore, doesn't want to cuddle, and actually growled at me tonight, though bribing him with chicken made that stop. AGGGHHHH!!!!

Thanks for letting me vent! I really appreciate all of you.
Signing off as just Theresa (because Christian is totally mad at me!)
 
Hi Theresa (and you too grumpy Christian!)

Okay, first off take a few deep breaths...
His reaction is perfectly normal. He doesn't understand why all of a sudden, mom is poking him with sharp things! You'll have to trust me on this - within a week, maybe two, he will actually come to you for his tests and shots, and probably purr all the way though the routine. The secret is treats. Pick a nice low-carb treat that is just for those times when you have tested or shot him. Give him one or two right after the "trauma". What is going to happen is that he will eventually associate the treatments with treats, and more importantly with feeling better. He will decide, on his schedule of course, when that time will come. But it will.
PZI may take a few days before you begin to see the results. Not only will his numbers come down, but he'll stop eating as much, and stop peeing and drinking so much, and will become more active. You will see a general improvement on all counts. There's a concept we refer to as the "5 P's" (peeing, pooping, purring, preening and playing). Once you see him doing all five of those things the way he did before he got sick, you'll know he's on his way to recovery.

Testing - you need to test him before each shot. We usually do it in order: test, feed, and shoot. You will also want to test him between shots. Some people do a BG curve where you are testing him every 2 hours. You don't need to do that every day. Save it for when you have an entire day off. But in order to see exactly what the insulin is doing, you should try to test him around 6 hours post-shot, (refered to as +6) which is when his insulin should be at the point where it has dropped his sugar to his nadir. You can also check him sometime after his shot but before nadir, like at +3 or +4, then again at +9 or +10 to see how fast/slow the insulin works going down, and going back up. By his next shot, the PZI will pretty much have done what it going to do that cycle, and then you start all over again.
Think of his life as being lived in 12 hours segments for the next few weeks. Narrow your focus to just that much time, and this dance is a lot less complicated and stressful.
You will want to try to keep his major feedings 12 hours apart too. He can be given food at other times during the day, but you should try to not feed him for a two hour period before his next shot, so that food isn't inflating his test numbers when you pre-shot test him. So, no food after +10.
The danger of him being so high? The condition could cause him additional problems. Damage to his kidneys, nervous system, eyesight, etc. My Bob was in what the vet called "out-of-control diabetic condition and DKA" when I brought him in. That was the first week of May. I don't want (and I am positive that you don't want) Christian to get anywhere close to that point. Two months later, Bob went OTJ, hasn't needed insulin since July 19th. I used PZI, starting at 1u BID also. ECID (Every Cat Is Different), but if you adhere to the protocals used by people on this board, I am sure that Christian's life and health are about to take a drastic turn in the right direction.
Testing may, at the start, cause him to be stressed for a brief time period. That's temporary. In a few days it won't stress him nearly as much as it did today. What you need to try to do is remain calm yourself. They pick up on your stress, they stress. Talk calmly, pet him, and if you "fail" trying to get a blood sample, give him a treat anyway. You want him to associate the tests with a "positive" experience.

Keep us posted on Christian's BG test results and his day-to-day details!

Carl in SC
 
Hi Theresa and Christian (if he has stopped growling...)
We've nearly all been there. At first, many cats are not so thrilled about testing and some about shots. Most of us feed while the cat is eating. Tent, poke, inject - I recently started vibrating the skin when I tent it up - almost like I am shivering. It seems to distract Tony - and he is on a large dose b/c he has acromegaly.

Good for you for getting blood the first time! Yes, its a high number, but aren't you glad that you know? Now you have data to compare to your next test and will soon have a picture of how the insulin works for your kitty. You do not have to take him to the vet for any more blood tests - the results that you get at home are the most accurate.

Not sure if others have mentioned ketone stix - you are probably familiar with these. If not, ask and others can help.

The real trick is to find treats that he just LOVES - even Temptations (one or two for now) - that you only give him after a bg test. He will soon come running for his tests - give it a week and you'll be posting to another new member providing support.
 
I agree, with numbers that high the main concern is DKA (diabetic ketoacidosis). that's where the body starts burning fat instead of glucose for energy. http://www.felinediabetes.com/ketones.htm That is very dangerous, and it occurs from a combination of too little insulin and not enough food and water to flush the ketones out of the system. A kitty on this board, with numbers in the 200s, is currently being treated for a case of DKA. It is an emergency situation that requires a vet stay. Some cats are much more prone to the condition than others. My Charlie lived for weeks with numbers in the 400-500 range and never even a trace of ketones. Some kitties build up ketones at much much lower glucose levels (200s). ECID. You can buy ketostix from most pharmacies. You just wave them in the stream of urine when your cat is going, or collect the urine and use them like dip-sticks. I always tape one to the end of a long stick (ruler, barbeque skewer, dowel rod...) and stand back so he doesn't get nervous, :oops: and just wave it through the pee when he goes.

Is there any way you can cut out the dry food? Kibble really tends to drive up the blood sugar numbers. Plus, from what I'm reading here http://catinfo.org/?link=urinarytracthealth, a wet food is BEST for a kitty with urinary crystals. Proper hydration is the key for those kitties, so wet food will definitely help keep them hydrated. The natural diet of a cat includes very little in the way of liquid water. Most of their hydration comes from their foods. So if we mimic this in a domesticated cat it is more likely to keep them healthier. Plus, many people have seen their kitty's blood glucose level drop by 100 points when they got rid of the kibbles!
 
Kitty will feel the shots less when you run out of those U-40 syringes and switch to U-100 syringes.

The U-40 syringes are 28 or 29 gauge, which we refer to here as "harpoons".

You can get 30 or 31 gauge (very tiny) needles in U-100 syringes at human pharmacies.

Ask for 3/10cc capacity (maximum capacity 30 units), 31 gauge, 5/16-inch "short" needles,
WITH 1/2 UNIT MARKS ! for U-100 insulin.

Some pharmacists will insist that no such thing exists as 1/2-unit marks, and will try
to sell you 1/2cc capacity syringes instead.

INSIST on seeing the words 1/2-unit marks on the box of syringes.

IMPORTANT : You MUST use a conversion chart to properly fill the U-100 syringe with U-40
insulin. I can't find the link to the chart right now, but ask for it when you are ready
to switch to U-100 syringes.

Oh, and the poster above said "we feed when the cat is eating". She meant we SHOOT when the
cat is eating !!!
 
Good a.m. to Theresa... and Christian (w/ his undies in a wad)!
Congrats to you on your FIRST test and got BLOOD!! :thumbup

With Bean, I switched to the smalles gauge needle and the shortest..HATE needles. She did not like the first couple of times, but then after that, she would be eating and 3 seconds later, shot done...I would pet a small bit while eating then walk away for a few then back with the shot, a quick pet and she was ok....It did take a couple of days tho...I remember the first 2, she actually growled at me! I thought oh no! this is never going to work, but it did and she acted like she did not even know I was giving a shot!
Pokey poke became better honestly the better I got, because I was not so tense - was a bit calmer, and she was too!
Doing good, Keep up the good work!
 
Hi and thank you all so much,

I couldn't get a test this morning, sigh, but am going to try half way, (jargon check, nadir?) ;-)

I just looked at the prescription for the needles, (yeah our state requires scripts!) and it is written for the u-40 syringes. I don't know if my vet will be willing to switch to the u-100 syringes. It makes so much sense to do so though!

He didn't eat much of the kibble through the night, like he usually does, maybe he realizes himself he shouldn't eat it, I took it up this morning, and he hasn't been asking for it.

I was told by the vet, and have read on these great board and websites that consistency is crucial, how does finding the wet food that is appropriate for him? confused_cat

Feed when he is eating, lol I'm very fluent in typonese. Christian gets his shot when he is eating as well.

One of my concerns, and I will be getting the ketone sticks today, (they were out at walmart yesterday) is that he lost so much weight, and though the vet said he did not have any ketones, I worry about that the most. ( I have Lupus, and can't go out in the hot sun, so will have to go after dusk. Hate my own limitations.)

Surprisingly, since he is a diabetic, I am apparently upsetting my DH with my need to learn as much as possible, and wanting to stock up on everything I can. Thank you Carl in SC, I used your example of Christian not being able to communicate in explaining to him that it is better for our cat, and our wallet to be proactive!

Christian has already cost us nearly 6K in vet/hospitalizations. It's not like we don't take incredible care of him, and his drooler sister :lol: So I hope that explaination made more of an impact.

Doombuggy, yes I am in CT, I haven't been to Granby yet, I moved here in Winter of 05, we got married in 08, and bought our house in Groton. Which EVO do you feed Cedric?

The 5 P's, Christian is 4 of the 5, peeing, poopling, preening, occassional purring, no playing, though he has always been rather limited in this area. He was an outside cat when we adopted him, and continued to be, until the attack in December, I kept him in until June, and he just enjoyed going out in our yard and hanging out there, he could always be found. However, since his dx, I have not allowed him outside, and fear this is depressing him.

Thank you all so much, I found the page of the DKA kitty in the ER, my heart goes out to Violet, and I am so amazed at the awesome support on this board!
 
Well, take an Rx for U-40 syringes to most pharmacies and they will
look at you like you have two heads.

PEOPLE pharmacies do not carry U-40 syringes, only U-100 syringes.

You can get them(U-40) on line like at Hocks.com, KV Vet, I believe,
and other places.

You need an Rx from your vet for U-100 sryinges. You may have trouble getting this
from your vet because they will assume you will make a dosing mistake.

You can probably get a pack of 10 to try from a pharmacy. In most
states you can get 10 insulin syringes (but not a full box of 100) in
an emergency (my husband is diabetic and we ran out of insulin syringes).

If you manage to get some, COME HERE before using them so we can
instruct you in the use of U-100 syringes with U-40 insulin.

Then when you've got it working, you can show your vet.
 
I wonder if Lori & Tom have some u-100s in the newbie kit stash? http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=19541 It wouldn't hurt to ask! If you need a script for syringes in a particular state, is it legal to send them there through newbie kits? Hmmmm... :twisted:

Your jargon is very close :cool: .... Nadir is the lowest glucose reading of the day. For a lot of kitties that is at (or around) +6 (halfway between the 2 shots).

I agree- consistency is good! It makes for a more predictable kitty. Consistent dosing (same times every day, raising dose in small increments after allowing the dose to settle in-- about 5 doses with prozinc), consistent feeding (same times every day, similar carb content in all the varieties you feed), consistent playing (exercise really helps a diabetic kitty keep the numbers lower). For food, I feed Charlie 4 or 5 different flavors of 9-lives pates so he doesn't get bored. He'd eat a cardboard box,though, so I'm really doing it for me, not him ;-) They are all similar carb content...I believe under 7%. If you wean off the kibbles, please keep in mind that his numbers may go down by as much as 100 points, so be very careful when dosing! Once you start getting the hang of the testing, if you ever get a bg that is under 150- 200 PLEASE DON'T SHOOT! Maybe someone already told you that, but it bears repeating. Until you have more information about what his numbers are doing, you need to do everything you can to keep him safe. So, under 150-200 = no insulin. You may want to hop on the board in that case and get some opinions about what your options are at that point (shooting less, shooting late, skipping the shot altogether). But we will cross that bridge when we come to it. And we will come to it :-D Soon enough this will all be second nature and Christian will be doing great and will willingly sit for you to poke him :lol: Once they learn that treats are involved, most kitties will do just fine with the testing!
 
Hi Karen, and Charliemeow,

Well, wish I had read this before going to the pharmacy, they totally had no idea about u-40 syringes, they did offer me the u-100's but the gauge was 28, and it was in 1/2 cc markings. I will go back to the vets tomorrow, as I only have enough syringes to last till the morning dose. I will ask them to write the script.

I don't remember the thread I read that said what to ask for in the u-100 syringes as far as markings go, if someone can clarify that would be great.

I did get a reading this evening, it is amazing how small an amount of blood that relion micro can read with. He was 449 tonight. I also got the ketones strips, and he let me test his urine easily. Thank goodness it looked either completely negative, or between negative and trace. *whew!*

I bought tons of food this evening, from wellness 3oz grain free, to EVO 95%, which he seems to really like, his Friskies pate's, and his favorite greenies treats for testing, as well as a EVO brand, grain free treat which apparently he really really likes.

Today he was more of the 5 P's, although my drooler keeps stealing his mouse! He enjoyed some of his catnip, which made me smile, he is like a kitten with cat nip!

Thank you Charlie for suggesting the newbie kits, but for the time being, I still have funds in my pet account, (my husband has been layed off, and I am disabled, so God forbid, thank you for letting me know about it.) I will cover the cost, and if I'm not able to get the script, we will stick with the -40 syringes from the vet office. My husband is more comfortable after doing some reading with this aspect.
Thank you all again!
Theresa and Christian (who has a better but not great attitude this evening.)
Edited to correct a sentence my DH disagreed with. :lol:
 
Great job!!! I'm glad he is feeling better about the situation!! The u-100s I use are from Walmart....Relion Insulin Syringes. Capacity 3/10 ml (doses up to 30 units). Gauge 29. Length 12.7 mm (1/2"). Those have the half-unit marks on them. They may have other lengths and gauges, but I cannot verify whether they have the 1/2 unit markings. Did we already link the conversion chart for you? Here it is again just in case http://www.felinediabetes.com/insulin-conversions.htm My only advice is check each dose twice while you're getting the hang of it, and be careful!! Tell Christian he's doing a great job and give him some scritches from us! cat_pet_icon
 
Thank you Claudia!
I will print this out and bring with me to the vet, just a question, if he is on 1 unit, that is the 1.0 in the U 40 section right?

Thank you again, so much!
 
Correct, if he is on ProZinc, and you were given U40 syringes, the 1 unit dose would be specific that syringe. You would have to use the conversion chart to be able to pull up the correct amount into a u100 syringe. According to the chart, to administer 1u of insulin that is u40, you would draw up to the 2.5 mark on the U100 syringe.

***NOTE*** Would someone who uses prozinc with u100 syringes please verify that? Thanks!

Carl in SC
 
Absolutely correct! If you are currently giving 1 unit of prozinc in a U-40 syringe, that is equal to 2.5 units drawn up in a u-100 syringe! :-D
 
We just got back from the vet, Christian has lost more weight, could that be from less carbs? (I can only loose weight on a low carb diet.)

We bought the u-40 syringes, and will search the web for a less expensive price. I brought the conversion chart with me for the u-100 syringes, however in the end, with the needle gauge being the same it just seems the best for us at this point in the game.

I did give the office the website catinfo.org, and the vet was pleased I had joined this group. (we actually took him to the vet because DH suspected I was doing the shot wrong, :roll: however they affirmed that I'm doing it correct, :lol: )

Thank you all so much! This is an awesome community!
 
TheresaJ860 said:
We just got back from the vet, Christian has lost more weight, could that be from less carbs? (I can only loose weight on a low carb diet.)

We bought the u-40 syringes, and will search the web for a less expensive price. I brought the conversion chart with me for the u-100 syringes, however in the end, with the needle gauge being the same it just seems the best for us at this point in the game.

I did give the office the website catinfo.org, and the vet was pleased I had joined this group. (we actually took him to the vet because DH suspected I was doing the shot wrong, :roll: however they affirmed that I'm doing it correct, :lol: )

Thank you all so much! This is an awesome community!
Click to expand...

Some cats do lose weight on a low carb diet if they are overweight. However, an uncontrolled diabetic cat will also drop weight because of the diabetes. Make sure that Christian is eating plenty enough so that he's not dropping weight quickly--a cat shouldn't lose any more than 1-2% of their body weight a week. From Dr. Lisa: http://www.catinfo.org/?link=felineobesity#Safe_Rate_of_Weight_Loss

You can also get the U-100 3/10 syringes in a 31g with a shorter needle--these are the ones I use. I used to use the 29g but the 31g are so much better--the needle is so short it's nearly impossible to get a fur shot, and the cat can't feel a thing.
 
Re: New to the board, Progress and update

Hi Everyone,

Well here it is a week, and I have to tell you, I was initially doubtful that Christian would do some of the things your cats have. confused_cat

However, he adores his EVO grainfree meat treats, and now comes running when I bring them in. I usually set up everything before I go get them, and then put the strip into the meter. Test and he just sits there staring at the treats! As soon as I have the blood sipped, I give him his treat, one by one while I hold his ear.

This morning was a fantastic reading, he's dropped 100 points from his highest at home reading from 492 to 392! Yeah Christian!
:RAHCAT flip_cat dancing_cat :RAHCAT

Thank you for all of your help and support! This board is awesome!

Theresa and a non grumpy Christian!
 
Re: New to the board, Progress and update

Yes they sure do Karen!

I'm even attempting to do a curve today, have tested AMPS, just now at +3, got a 302 reading, he is eating his afternoon snack now, and will try for +6, +9 and PMPS so I can track what his BG is through the day. (Fingers crossed!)

Thank you!
 
Good Boy Christian!

Cats are amazing creatures, it doesn't take them long to figure out that a small poke equals yummy treats. And you have the avantage over me, Christian already knows and loves you, when I started with first Maxwell and now Musette, they didn't know me from Adam, yet both come running now the moment they see the test kit. Although Maxwell is a little confused since he doesn't always get poked now that he is in remission....but he still gets his share of the treats...lol.

Mel, Maxwell, Musette & The Fur Gang
 
Super - glad you found treats that he adores. Hard to believe that a week ago he growled at you for this! And now you are doing your own curve - looking forward to seeing the rest of your readings.
 
Re: New to the board, Progress and update

Thank you Mel and just as Appy,

Yes it is an exciting day for me today, I'm seeing lower Bg levels, and he's even more of himself today!

(Everytime I see your name, I think of a now closed bar nearby, called Appy's. It was a big deal for the Navy in it's day. :lol: )
 
Don't worry too much about the 399 at +6 it could be a couple of things...1) he has an early nadir, some kitties do, they will peak around +5, 2) it could be a food spike depending on when he last ate is afternoon meal opposed to when you tested him. or 3) his body got a little scared of the 302 and released some stored sugars.

What you are looking for is a pattern not so much the actual numbers just yet, that comes once you have lots of data, and you know how he will respond to both the insulin and food.

Musette the last few days has been a great example, she went blazing along in the blues, then yesterday hit a double digit for the first time in a long time, her body freaked out, since it doesn't yet recognize that a normal BG is just that normal, it is so useto running in the 200 & 300s that when it dropped into the double digits it thought she was going into hypo and tried to save itself and she shot way up into the 400s. Now today on the same dose she is surfing the yellows and was still dropping at her +9. It takes them awhile to settle into a dose, which is why we hold a dose for several days, and try not to react to just one reading or one series of reading, to give their bodies time to adjust.

We call it the sugarcat dance for a reason, because not only do we as their beans need to learn the steps, so do they. You and Christian are doing great, just baby steps, your over the first hurdle, he is coming willingly to be tested, there is plenty of time to work on the numbers. :-D He didn't become a diabetic over night, and he isn't going to be 'cured' overnight either...its a marathon not a sprint.

Mel, Maxwell, Musette & The Fur Gang
 
Well I don't use Prozinc, so I'm not sure what the testing protocol is for that insulin, but I always look at it is any tests I can squeeze in within reason its that much more data I have to work with. Both Maxwell and Musette were/are on Lantus. Maxwell is in remission so he gets tested about twice a month, Musette on the other hand because she is still pretty new to me and has decided to be problematic about her dosing I try to get several tests a cycle. Usually with her one day I will get her amps, then the odd hours, the next day I will get the even hours. So one day it is amps +3, +5, +7, +9, pmps, the next day I try for her amps, +2, +4, +6, +8, +10 pmps, but I'm also home all day so I have the luxury of testing her when I want. And then there are some days when I think we both need a break and I'll only test at her pre-shots and maybe one or two spot checks,

Mel, Maxwell, Musette & The Fur Gang.
 
Re: New to the board, Progress and update

Thank you very much Mel. Like you I'm home almost everyday, at least in the summer. I really appreciate your suggestions!
 
Nice +9. Down a bit. You guys are doing such a great job. I love seeing the data - it is such a good feeling knowing what's happening with your cat and his treatment.
 
Thank you Just as Appy, PMPS was 414.

I also noticed his poor ear seems bruised tonight, :sad: I can't test his left ear because that is the ear that had surgery in 06, and it isn't, well, let's just say it's not looking like it would work, lol. Je has 3 lil notches in it from before we adopted him as well.

Thank you!
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top