New to group- Remission? Food???

[Pico]

1/31 Pico 146
Hi, I am new to this group. I just found it earlier this week. Pico has been diabetic for 1 1/2 years. He went into diabetic shock on 1/5. Thank goodness I was home and could give him food and Karo syrup. He stayed at the vet a few days and he is fine now. Since then he has been up and down in his BG's. The vet thought he might be going into remission. He went up this week. Today his was low and I didn't give any insulin. The vet said not to give under 200 because he has gone low if I do.

Does anyone have food suggestions? I have been feeding him Wellness grain free which I just realized still had carbs with the potatoes and peas and carrots. I can't believe I just assumed grain free was low carb. The vet wanted me to switch to Purina DM. Does anyone have experience with this? I should get him on something else. Wellness is good, but it does have carbs.

Also what is the exprerience with giving shots below 200? I was all set to say ok no remission back to shots when he went up to mid 200's and today it is 146...So confused on what to do....I don't want to hurt him by giving or not giving. Really really unsure what to do with food and shots and his numbers. Oh his is on Lantis and has been since day 1.

Thanks!!!

 

[PeterDevonMocha]

Hi guys and welcome to lantus land! I'm so sorry to hear about Pico going into diabetic shock, and yes, so thankful you were there to get him back up .. Remission is considered when cats can stay, I believe, below 120, and spend majority of the time in double digits .. I don't think anyone here feeds purina DM, most of us feed a low carb wet cat food diet, us in particular feed our diabetic (who is in remission) wal mart brand special kitty turkey and giblets at 4% carbs .. there is a list floating around here somewhere that has all the carb values for cat food out there ..

There is a ton of helpful information on this site and everyone on here is always eager to help you get your kitty going in the right direction so please, stick around, read up on the forums and ask questions as many times as you need to!

 

[Linda and Scooter & Jack]

We follow Dr. Lisa's Food guide. There is a sticky note about it on the health forum at the top.

She explains what your food is doing to him.

Linda

 

[Tara & Buster]

Welcome! The food list has lots of great options. If you want to stay with the Wellness brand, we feed the turkey and chicken flavors which are 4% carbs. I think there's another one that's beef, too, but we just do the poultry. As far as dosing goes, you want to find a dose where you can give it twice a day, as Lantus works best that way. Say for instance you give 1u in the morning, but he's too low to shoot at night. You would then try shooting .5u morning and night. I'm sure a more experienced dose advisor will come along to help you with your specific situation.

I, too, almost lost my sweet Buster to a hypo event. He recovered without harm (after 24 hrs at the ER) and then I started listening to the people on this board. I am so very thankful they helped us get on the right track!

 

[Sandy and Black Kitty]

Hi there and Welcome!
Glad you found us!

Regarding food, Here is Dr. Lisas information

I fed my kitty Wellness however I selected the varieties that were under 10% carbs. Keeping under 10% is key, whichever food you choose.

I'm so glad you were home when Pico experienced low BGs. What was his BG at that time?
Please keep in mind that following a hypo event, a kitty may become very sensitive to insulin.

From the data on your spreadsheet the numbers look pretty good. Any chance you can grab some mid--cycle tests on a daily basis?
We follow the Tight Regulation Protocol here in Lantus Land and dosing is based primarily on Nadir, with some consideration to pre-shot numbers. For your kittys safety and your peace of mind it's important to know what is going on between shots during both the AM and PM cycles. Putting that piece of the puzzle in place will give you the full picture and help us help you find the right dose for Pico.

Have a look at the starred posts at the top of this forum (which we refer to as 'stickies - they are always there). There you will find a wealth of info.
Ask questions - plenty of experienced folks here happy to offer experience and guidance.

 

[Sienne and Gabby (GA)]

Welcome to Lantus Land!

Congrats on getting your spreadsheet going. I'd encourage you to read the starred, sticky notes that are at the top of the Board, They will give you a great deal (read that as an overwhelming amount) of information about Lantus and it's use.

Most of us here follow the Tight Regulation Protocol. With that approach to dosing, you will have guidelines for when to increase or decrease Pico's dose. However, you will need to collect more data. Lantus dosing is based on the lowest point in the cycle -- the nadir. If you are able to always get a test before you give a shot (AMPS and PMPS) as well as at least one spot check during the AM and PM cycles, that will help you to know whether doses need to be changed and even more importantly, it will insure that you can keep Pico safe.

As for food, there are very few foods that are 0% carb. Most foods contain some amount of carbs. If you look at the food list that Sandy linked, you'll see Wellness, in general, is low carb. The fruits and veggies actually contribute very little to the overall carb content. I actually feed both of my kitties (one who's diabetic and one who's not) Wellness Chicken or Turkey. FWIW, while Purina DM is 7% carb, take a look at the ingredients. It's made primarily from animal by-products vs. muscle meat. It is not a high quality food despite you're having to pay a premium price.

 

[Pico]

Re: New to group- Remission? Food??? 1/31 146 AMPS

Thanks for the info from everyone. I printed out the food charts and will go over them. I would rather feed higher quality food then the DM which is mostly biproducts. I am not home during the day so I can't get a reading midcyle. I will try to over the weekend. I do have my spreasheet attached. I have been updating him. From the posts here and the regular board he def isn't in remission. Do you test several times everyday?? I actually never did that before now. I would spot check and due curves but not daily. How are their ears? It takes me a few pokes to get blood and I am afraid that testing 2-4 times a day will cause his ears to really get sore and hurt. He is very good but is getting a little annoyed now.

Thanks again everyone!!

 

[Chris & China (GA)]

Hi and welcome to Lantus Land!!

Here's your Post from Health so people can catch up on your story. We like to have the link to the prior post included so it's easy to go back and see what happened the day before.

It was suggested on your Health post that you add some information to your signature line. This would be VERY helpful, especially since you're using the AlphaTrak meter. The same way you added the link to your spreadsheet...just add your name and Pico, date of diagnosis, type of insulin, type of meter, food you're feeding and any other health issues Pico has had. This way we don't have to keep asking you the same questions over and over again!

On the meter, if you choose to continue using the AlphaTrak, please make sure in your signature that it's in BIG letters, and it wouldn't hurt to change the font color. The vast majority of us here use human meters because the cost of the strips for the Alpha is too high for a lot of us to afford, especially considering the amount of testing we do. The Alpha's strips are about $1-2 each...the strips for the meters most of us use range from $9 for 50 to $18 for 50. Testing 4 times a day with the Alpha could run $120-240/month just for strips...using one of the Relion meters from WalMart will cost $22-$44/month...big savings!

The Alpha isn't any more precise than human meters, but if you're going to keep using it, we do need to know...it runs about 30 points higher than the human meters, so if you get a test result under 80, that's an automatic reduction in dose. Since we're "used to" human meters, if we don't realize you're using the Alpha and you say you have a result of 60, we're going to say "YEAH!!"....when we should be advising you to feed Pico because that's hypo territory on the Alpha.

We can help keep Pico safe, as well as get better regulation. If you can't test mid-cycle during the day, please try to get an "in the door" test if you can, and a "before bed" test, plus the pre-shot tests. On weekends, you can get more testing in so we can really see how Pico reacts to both Lantus and food.

Do you test several times everyday??

Yes...we ask that you test before EACH shot, and once during the AM cycle, and before bed on the PM cycle...If you look at others spreadsheets, you'll see we usually test a lot more, but those 4 are the most important. (if you can't get the mid-cycle on the AM, maybe you can get a test as soon as you walk in the door?)

How are their ears?

The ears "learn to bleed". The more they're poked, the more new little capillaries grow in and in a few weeks, it's usually much easier to get blood. You might want to get some "alternate site test" lancets. They're 26 or 28 gauge which make a bigger hole than 30 or 31 gauge lancets. Once Pico's ears "learn to bleed", you can go back to the smaller gauge lancets. (in needles/lancets, the smaller the gauge, the bigger they are...seems backwards but that's the way it is)

The edge of their ears have few pain receptors, so what most cats object to is having someone fooling with their ears, not the actual poking. If you decide on a "testing spot" in your home and as often as possible, you take Pico there, give the ears a little rub and give a yummy treat. Soon, they associate the "testing spot" with the yummy treat, and don't care that you're fooling with their ears.

Keep asking questions! We're here to help!

 

[Pico]

I am so not tech person. I have no idea how I got the signature line. I did it yesterday and threw out the instructions. I can pretty much just turn on the computer. I know that somewhere there are directions but I can't find it. My current needles don't are in 1/2 units. Is there a brand that goes to .25? I do give Pico treats after I test him. He is good, I feel like I am just so bad at it. I didn't know you could use a human meter. That is def less expensive. I was getting the test strips from the diabetic Warehouse at about $80 for 100 strips. My vet sold them for $85 for 50 strips! Now that hurts.

Thanks for the great advice. As soon as I figure it out I will get Pico's info out there.

 

[Chris & China (GA)]

At the top left side of the page, look for "User Control Panel" and click there

A new page shows up...click on "Profile" and then "Edit Signature"


Fill in the info in the box and click "Submit" and it's done

(if you click on the pictures, they will open up bigger)

You can get syringes with half unit markings, but they don't make them with .25 unit markings. WalMart carries them too, but make sure you check. Lots of times the pharmacy doesn't know that they DO have some with half unit markings.

While you're there, you can get a Relion meter. The Confirm and Micro models take the tiniest blood sample but the strips are a little higher ($36 for 100) The Relion Prime takes a little bigger sample (but still not bad) and the strips are $9 for 50. What I did was start with the Confirm and then when China's ears "learned to bleed", I switched to the Prime to save the money on strips. My Confirm is now my "backup" meter in case my Prime dies on me when I need it most (which is when they tend to die)

Keep asking questions!