New to FDMB - questions on diet and insulin

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MiaMom

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Hello,
My Mia, a 10 year old spayed femaie Saimese,(indoor only) had a wellness exam this week and BG was at 326 on a complete blood panel. A fructosamine test came back in the fair range and then a indiviula BG test was at 300. Also, has high triglycerides/high cholesterol. She was previuosly diagnosed with diabetes and treated at end of 2009/early 2010. After changing diet and trying different foods, we found Wellness canned or Evo products agreed with he. Her recovery from what her Drs. thought was a difficult bout with gastritis or panceatitis and also a bladder infection in early 2010 was fairly quick. Two rounds of treatment with Lanutus insulin shots (1 unit twice a day) got her back to normal BGs. Dr took her off insulin and for over a year, she was energetic and back to her old self. Now, the diabetes is back. Thought diet alone could control it, but that is not the case with Mia. Best insulin to use?
I was not doing home testing and am serioudly thinking I'll have to begin that routine if my DH and I can get a handle on the anxiety we have. We teamed up before on giving the shots. Really can't afford the repeated blood panels work at the vet's on a monthly basis. Fees have gone up as her favorite Dr changed offices and has to charge more for tests.(Los Angeles area). Also, stress in getting her to their office so often.
Has anyone else had this type of situation happen? I am concerned about changing her diet again. Do I take her off Evo canned food? I am trying to limit and take her off Evo dry food completely. Do I go back to Wellness. Her digestion is good right now and weight is stable. She does not like eating form the feeders that pop open, but when we are both gone long hours - we have no choice. Can't afford a daily pet sitter to check on her a lunch time. I'll have to try the frosen canned food idea and see how she handles it.
Well, am open to suggestions on how to better manage this time around. Thanks - Mia's Mom
 
Raja went into remission after 6 weeks on lantus and we were fine for 3 yrs and now we are back.

The best thing to do is get her off dry food but if you do that be prepared for her BG level to drop so you need to test her. I use friskies and I put out two cans every morning at 7am and I don't throw it away until 7 the next morning. I've never had a problem doing it that way but I do know people freeze food and set it out so that it thaws throughout the day.

I think lantus is a great choice and I personally use lantus and I know a lot of people here recommend lantus as well

It is very overwhelming in the beginning when learning to hometest but it gets easier and easier as the days go by. Raja was a fesity cat in the beginning and I could never get blood from her ear so I use her back paw and that works wonderfully for us. I will say though the first few weeks I had to have someone help me hold her down but now she comes to me I lay her in my lap and test her blood without any problems (see my signature for youtube links of me testing her paw)

I'd recommend getting a carb friendly treat like bonito flakes (dried tuna flakes) and give those when you test. Raja now comes running when I call her name because she knows she gets a treat...heck she's meowing now because she wants a treat and it makes it all that much easier.
 
Also wanted to add with Raja I think the reason she is diabetic again is because she got into carbs. She was on friskies wet food but I switched cat litters to WBCL (world's best cat litter) and it's corn based and Raja ate that up. I wasn't thinking and let that go on for months and I am pretty sure that's what our problem is. I've switched cat litters and she is on a strict no cat litter or carbs diet.

If you get Mia off the dry food you might be surprised with her BG and she might not need insulin for very long
 
Hi Heather and Raja,
Thanks for the information. Trying to manage this new situation for me when working full time can be difficult. I really need to plan a day or two off in the next couple of weeks. I am trying at the beginning of this week to start to limit her dry cat food during the day when we are not home to monitor her. Mia gets two regular canned food meals - early breakfast and then dinner. I do not plan to change that routine or brand of food yet, but still have concern about the high triglyceride/cholesterol readings. That has to be related to her diet and since she's only been eating Evo canned and dry- maybe she's getting too many calories?
Our plan is to bring Mia back to her Dr for another visit,check the BG again and then start her on Lantus insulin later this week. One of the Techs at the Dr's will go over using the meter with me and if I just make a Tech appt, I do not get charged the reg. office visit. We'll get all the supplies and get her back on the shots routine by this Friday or Saturday.
Will post how things are going for her.
If anyone else uses Evo products and has any input, pet me know. Also, Mia liked some Wellness brand canned food. Will never use Hills Science Prescription diets for diabetics - that may have caused her stomach upset back in 2010
Thanks,
Mia's Mom
 
It is hard working full time, I work 10 hour days and sometimes even more than that, plus it's a 30-45 min drive to and from work so I really do understand how hard it is

I just have a routine, I wake up check her blood go to the kitchen and give them food, go get ready, give her insulin and go on about my day. When I get home I check her blood, give her tuna then give her insulin.

If you feel more comfortable start on the weekend or when you have your days off, and like I said you're going to want help the first few times.
 
Hi Mia's mom

I can tell you are pretty stressed about this but you really don't have to be. You've already had some familiarity with fd and you are on good footing

a couple of points I see..

1. how are her teeth? Infection can temporarily raise Blood glucose levels
2. dry food, even the stuff you are feeding, can raise bgs in some cats quite dramatically so definitely change her food if you can
3. hometesting. I freaked out when people here insisted I test, I even left the board for awhile. But Squeak needed me to test him and I finally smartened up and did it and it was wayyy easier than I expected. You CAN do it.
4. working and doing this is not impossible. Some people here test a lot, others don't and you do what you can for your cat with your particular realities. Lantus is a great insulin and you WILL do fine.

Jen
 
If she doesn't like the pop up feeders, would she go for the ones that turn? They are a little noisy but my cats got used to it easily and come running when it turns. I use the PetSafe 5. I also heard about one that uses your voice to tell them the food is there.....Not sure if this is it -
http://www.smarthome.com/6103CB/Contech ... der/p.aspx


If you can get her used to an automatic feeder, then you could freeze the wet and let her graze during the day?
 
I have this auto feeder and it records your voice: http://www.amazon.com/Automatic-Fee...DTJA/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1316445664&sr=8-2. It's a little noisy when it turns, and I had one cat not like it at first (the other cat would take food next to a jackhammer if need be). After a week or so she realized that the whirring meant food, and got over her shyness with it.

Some cats can go out of remission because of various things--Bandit had a really traumatic dental that knocked him out of remission at the end of June. He need insulin for about a month and then went back into remission again.

The canned food you're feeding is great--there's no need to switch that. The dry food should go, though. Some cats are very carb sensitive and can't have any dry food at all, even the lower carb stuff. Bandit is one of those cats. His blood sugar will shoot way up if he eats any dry, but not so much even if he has a canned food that's higher in carbs--it's very strange. For example, I can't feed him EVO dry, which is 8% carbs or his blood sugar will go up, but I can feed him Merrick's Grammy's Pot Pie canned food, which is 8% carbs and his blood sugar is fine. I think it has something to do with the starch they use in dry food.

I work two jobs and go to grad school, so I understand how tight schedules can be. Getting a routine down is really important. And once you start home testing, things will be so much easier for you. No more paying for vet testing, and it allows you to have tight control over your cat's blood sugar levels, making a second remission more likely. It also decreases the chances of a hypoglycemic incident, because you're not guessing how the insulin is affecting her. With Lantus, you need to test at least three times a day, so what I did was test before Bandit's AM shot at 7am, left for work with the autofeeder set to release frozen food 6 hours after his shot just in case he dropped a little low, tested before the PM shot when I got home at 7pm, and then I would set an alarm to get a test in 6 hours after the PM shot and go right back to bed. I know that sounds like a pain, but it only takes a minute, and the payoff is that you're more likely to get your cat off insulin again. I would do a curve on the weekends when I was home during the day.

Some possibilities you want to eliminate from the start, though, are tooth problems or a secondary infection like a UTI. Siamese cats are genetically prone to dental problems, and inflammation/infection in the gums knock a cat out of remission. Bandit has had to have most of his teeth pulled because he has chronic tooth resorption problems. If these are possible issues, you need to have them taken care of before you'll be able to get Mia regulated again.
 
Just wanted to give a welcome and put in my two cents!

Hometesting will dramatically cut down your costs and more importantly, will empower you to make good decisions regarding your Mia's care. Many of us use the Relion Confirm or Micro meter from Walmart. It is a reliable meter with very affordable strips that can be found even cheaper online at American Diabetes Wholesale.

As for food, the others are right... for a diabetic, adding back in dry food after being on all wet can definitely raise numbers into diabetic range. Another option to an autofeeder is what I call kitty cubes... we water Willie's food down and freeze it in ice cube trays. I'm doing this on my own and work full time, so we schedule our shots so that I can get a sense of where his cycle is going in the morning before heading to work, then I give his shot literally the minute I walk in the door first. With the last meal I give him when I leave, I also leave a "kitty cube," which melts in time for him to eat by mid-cycle.

As for insulin, you have a number of good options... Lantus, Levemir and Prozinc are all quality insulins. We have been on Lantus for 8 months and I've found that it has been effective in keeping Willie in healthy numbers. There is also a very active Lantus (Levemir users post there as well as the insulins work similarly) form on here that would afford you a virtually round-the-clock support network, which is also a bonus.

Good luck getting Mia back on the path to good health!
 
Hi All,
Thanks for all the replies. Yes, I am still very stressed and sad about Mia's current situation. Maybe I was being too optimistic when we saw her go back to normal BG readings for a good part of a year. I guess I did not expect the diabetes to return. I maybe am dealing with some denial here - she seems ok and does not appear sick like the first time she was diagnosed.
She is OK with eating from the pop up feeders and she's eaten the defrosted canned food , so will go back to that for the work week. I am just confused about how much canned food to feed her per day. She's a little ove 13 lbs. and could definitely afford to slim down a lb or two. Is a 5 ounce size can of Evo (200 calories) enough? I think that was the guideline the vet gave me last year when she was eating the combination of wet and dry. If she is no longer going to eat dry food, is 200 calories enough.Do I split that into about 4 meals? When I was home alot this weekend, it seemed she wanted to eat every 3 or 4 hours.
I got a glucose meter (bought a One Touch Ultra Mini and supplies at Target), but have not started the home testing yet. I read the instructions and tried using it on myself, but maybe did not have the lancet device adjusted deep enough because I hardly got any blood from my finger. It is an ultra fine needle - maybe need a different kind of lancet for the cat, but wanted to use the type that comes with the kit. Then, I got anxious about the whole idea and decided to wait on trying to use the lancet on Mia's ear by myself today for the first time. My DH came back from an overseas business trip on Thurs. night, had to go to urgent care and is fighting an infection this weekend and had to start on antibiotics, so he was not up to helping me this weekend because of his own health issues. I was very over tired and did not want to stress Mia out. I need to be relaxed and alert when starting this routine.
I can bring in my meter to the vet office later this week or next Saturday and work with one of the techs for instructions and to see that I am doing it ok. Thanks- Mia's Mom Jane
 
Welcome back Jane,
You might be able to get lancets that will work with that device but are larger gauge. I use a Relion Meter, and it came with 33g lancets. When I first tried, it took several tries before I could get blood from Bob's ear. I went to walmart and found they sell 3 or 4 sizes of lancets. 33g were the smallest, they also had 26, 28 and 30g. I went with 28's and did much better. I can use the 33's now, but at first, the bigger ones helped tremendously. I "free-handed" rather than use the device, so I can't give you any tips on depth settings. But if you can set it to get blood out of your finger, that setting should be plenty to get it out of Mia's ear.
Sorry to hear about DH's ills, and hope he gets better soon.
Taking the meter and device to the vet is a great idea. That's how I learned.
Food and calories - a good basic rule of thumb is 20 cal per lb of ideal body weight for a "normal" cat. So if you think she should be around 11 pounds, she'd need at least 220 per day. That's if she were 100% healthy. Being diabetic, she may require more than that for a while. Lots of people find feeding 4 times a day works better than just twice, (smaller meals more often). If she's screaming for food in between meals, maybe just adjust portion sizes during the day and let her eat more often. She could probably stand a can and a half a day for now. Once she's doing better, her appetite will most likely decrease.
Since Bob went OTJ in July, I've been able to play with the amount of calories per day and bring his weight up or down to try to keep him around 13.5-14 lbs. You just have to be aware of the amount of calories per can. Sounds like you already know the EVO is 200. If you end up giving her other choices, you can write the calories count on the label with a marker, so you'll know which can to open based on how many calories you want to feed her. People also do that with the carbs values when feeding several different flavors. My cans have lots of numbers on them!

Carl in SC
 
You could also start a new thread with your city and state and ask for hometesting help. Maybe we have a member who could come help. It is always great to have someone nearby who has made their way through this sugar dance.
 
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