? New member on very high starting dose of Vetsulin need watching

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OK, so it doesn't sound like the 5U was based on anything other than the vet-office curve (no DKA or other underlying condition). It sure does look like the 5U was waaaay too much, given how low it took him 7.5 hours in! I agree that the high numbers last night and today are likely due (at least in part) to bouncing, so it will take a little while to see what the 1U can do.

"Vet stress" can raise a cat's BG numbers, in some cases by hundreds of points (!). It's likely that his numbers were higher at the vet's office than they would have been at home-- it's a common cause of setting a too-high initial dose, though 5U is an outlier even then.
 
He was diagnosed with symptoms blood sugar of 539 on Tuesday for his annual clinical I noticed increased thirst and large volumes of urine
 
I am going to start low and see how he does it is hard I have another cat do I put him on wet food also got rid of dry my boyfriend does not get the seriousness of this he thinks him going for two hours past insulin time is okay no way I told him so this is going to affect my home life too
 
I see that you've had people here to help you. That's one of the many great things about FDMB - you're not alone.

It would be a lot easier for you if both of your kitties ate the same low carb wet food. It's good for all cats. Dry isn't - it's only convenient for people. You can let them free feed if that's what they like to do. Just make sure there's no food out for 2 hours before Clarance's pre shot BG test. Yes, you'll need to create a new routine at home and it'll feel strange at first. We've all gone through it and it becomes second nature after a while. Insulin works best when dosed at 12 hour intervals.
 
Yup, classic diabetes signs!

Carolee said:
he thinks him going for two hours past insulin time is okay no way I told him
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Not sure what this means, exactly? Do you mean it's going to be tough to keep on a regular schedule with the shots? You do want to keep them as close to 12hrs apart as possible, although Vetsulin is somewhat more "forgiving" of schedule changes than some other insulins. Or do you mean food? It is definitely very important that the cat has a full meal when you give Vetsulin-- it is a fast-acting insulin and can cause some dramatic drops, so there needs to be food on-board for it to work on. [Edited to add: as Kris says, you do want to keep the 2hrs before the shot free of food, so that the pre-shot test isn't food influenced]
 
Getting rid of dry food is definitely the best route for a diabetic kitty and is a better choice for a non-diabetic kitty as well. Trying to keep the shots as close to 12 hours apart right now is best so that you can see what sort of pattern develops.
 
Okay no dry at all ! I am waiting to check my cat at 1800 that will be 6 hours in between insulin coverage
 
Carolee said:
It has not been under 300 yet I think that is not good for his renal function
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That's correct. High numbers aren't good for renal function - if they stay high a long time. The problem is that too high a dose of insulin can cause a hypo episode that can kill very quickly. You have default to the evil that's less dangerous in the short term. Please consider setting up a spreadsheet like the one we use here and enter all the BG numbers you have in it. The dosing for today and tomorrow is aimed at setting a baseline from which a better dose can be approached.
 
Hi Carolee,

Do you have more data? Your +6 number of 317 last night was high but not terrible. You could speed it up and give 1.25 u today but we really need to see enough data on a spreadsheet to be able to advise. Until you get one set up please post your BG results for the day in a vertical column like this example:

AMPS __________
AM dose __________
+? BG __________
+? BG __________

It's almost impossible to give guidance when we have to search several posts to find single numbers. It's also much more useful to give time BG timing as the number of hours after as shot instead of a clock time because we're in many different time zones.
 
Good morning I have done my spreadsheet I am having trouble posting in the url. his sugar was 320 at 0930 + 9.
 
Yeah, I can't see the spreadsheet yet. Is the problem getting the link address itself or figuring out how to put it into the signature?

To answer your question, I think it's best to hold the 1U for at least 2-3 days to make sure the bounce has cleared after that 61 he got on the 5U at the vet's.

Have you done any ketone tests yet?
 
No not yet he has not been peeing as much and he seems to have slowed down on water consumption. I just rechecked his bs and it was 392 I am feeding him his 3 oz of wet food and then wait half hour and give him his insulin at 1220 pm.i am having trouble with the URL address.mist of his sugars have been around the 300+ mark
 
Hi Carolee,
Would it be possible for you to test his BG and post the results at say +2 hrs, +4 hrs, and +6 hrs after his shot? I see you have a +9 and +11, all data is valuable and helps you and us to see the bigger picture.

What I do with Smoky sometimes is a mini curve. I check his BG at maybe +3 hrs, +6 hrs, and +9 hrs after his shot. This gives me a pretty good idea of how the insulin is working on him. I work full time so can only do curves like this on my days off.
 
Carolee said:
Amps-_392___
Am dose___1 unit___
+ 9 BG _320___
+ 11 BS 392
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Thanks for listing this. Those readings are for the tail end of a cycle (cycle = the 12 hours between doses) and that might be why they're high-ish (I've seen much worse!). As Lisa suggested just above, getting BGs near the middle part of the cycle is key to know the full picture of a dose's action.

You'll get the SS sorted. For now, just list data as you have done.
 
That's not a bad number at all. How many hours was that after his last shot? What was his BG before that? I would agree that 1 unit is not a bad dose for that BG of 199.
 
@Carolee ....you still have a problem regarding the spreadsheet

If you'd like some help with it, please send me a private message by clicking on my name and choosing "Start Conversation"

I'd be happy to set it up for you and get you started but will need some information from you first
 
I just noticed a lump in my cats shoulder area where I gave insulin anyone else ever get a lump
 
Carolee said:
I just noticed a lump in my cats shoulder area where I gave insulin anyone else ever get a lump
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Smoky had one as well when I started giving him shots. The members on here asked me if I was giving shots in the same area all the time. I was doing that until someone suggested alternating the places where I give the shots. I hope that helps.:)
 
Carolee said:
I just noticed a lump in my cats shoulder area where I gave insulin anyone else ever get a lump
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Yes, there can be fluid build up in the injection site if you tend to use the same area. My guy was like that when I was using the scruff/shoulder area all the time. Now I use many places along his side and there's no fluid deposit happening.

That 199 after the previous shot 12 hours before is great! He was probably lower in the middle part of the cycle so if you can get tests in that time period when you're at home, it would really help to flesh out the picture. I'm so glad you went with my recommendation to drop to 1 u. It took a few days for the high bounce numbers to drop and now you're in some very nice pre shot BG territory. :D

I see that Chris has offered to get your spreadsheet set up so we can all see it. That's great! :)
 
Nan & Amber said:
I'll tag @Marje and Gracie , our spreadsheet guru, to help with this. It may take a little while before she's on again and sees the tag.

Glad he's showing some better clinical signs!
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I'm glad Carolee was able to get the SS going. Sorry I've been off the board this week....my kitten had two surgeries on Monday and I've been helicopter mom this week.

@Carolee please let me know if you have any issues with the SS. Just send me a PM.
 
Hello,
I finally have some free time! I have posted my spread sheet. I am pleased to say Clarence's BS have come down a lot. He has not had any insulin for a day. They have been low enough not to give. They have been below 100.He is not symptomatic of hypoglycemia.
 
According to the information I read cat's blood sugars should between 61-120. I am pleased with his progress.
 
WONDERFUL!!!!

I am SO SO glad you decided to take the advice on here and not shoot the dose your vet had suggested. That could have been deadly :eek: Maybe the switch to a low carb food was a big factor in getting the numbers back into normal ranges. After 14 days of no insulin Clarence will be officially OTJ (off the juide..insulin) and in remission.

Fingers crossed for many more good days!! :bighug::bighug:
 
Wow!!!!! Those are some amazing numbers! And like TuxedoMom, I am so glad you went with the lower dose!!!!

Clarence is looking fantastic! :cat:
 
Thank you alll for the help and support. I have been feeding 1.5 oz in the am after I check his sugar and then 3 oz at 1200 after I check his sugar and what is left over I put in the refrigerator and add warm water around 1700 my boyfriend feeds them and at midnight I check again and feed 1.5 oz.
 
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