New Lantus User With BG Numbers Dropping For Today

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carolyn16

Member Since 2013
Hi! My cat Red started on Lantus on Feb. 2nd. I started him on 1 unit. He only eats Fancy Feast Classic & occasionally FF Flaked Fish. Since Feb. 2nd he has always been in the 300's no matter what time of the day. On Feb. 25th & 27th he hit the upper 200's but that was the only time he hit the 200's. He is now on 3 units. Today my husband gave his shot at 10:40 a.m. (EST)-he's done it before but now wonder if he messed up. Now at 7:45 PM he was at 183. At 10:07 he was at 84. I am not giving him his shot tonight though he is due for it at 10:40. He is still acting like he's starving to death too. Any words of wisdom would be most appreciated!
 
How long has Red been on 3u? Is this a fairly recent dose increase?

Mel, Maxwell, Autumn & The Fur Gang
 
carolyn16 said:
Hi! My cat Red started on Lantus on Feb. 2nd. I started him on 1 unit. He only eats Fancy Feast Classic & occasionally FF Flaked Fish. Since Feb. 2nd he has always been in the 300's no matter what time of the day. On Feb. 25th & 27th he hit the upper 200's but that was the only time he hit the 200's. He is now on 3 units. Today my husband gave his shot at 10:40 a.m. (EST)-he's done it before but now wonder if he messed up. Now at 7:45 PM he was at 183. At 10:07 he was at 84. I am not giving him his shot tonight though he is due for it at 10:40. He is still acting like he's starving to death too. Any words of wisdom would be most appreciated!
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I saw your post over on facebook, so I thought I'd come on over and welcome you.

I suppose I'll ask the first questions that others will ask here....

Food: Fancy Feast is great, the pates, but I am not sure about the flaked stuff. You can check in Dr. Lisa's food list and be sure you are feeding foods under the 10% carbs as it will help to keep Red in good numbers.
http://catinfo.org/docs/FoodChartPublic9-22-12.pdf

Home testing is pretty important, and you will find that the protocol many follow here works well because there are not big jumps in dose, rather increases are slower so that you don't jump past Red's good dose.
If the 2u dose was not enough, maybe a 2.5u dose would have been just right.... it's looking like maybe going all the way to 3u was a bit too much.

Diabetic cats do need to be fed more because their bodies are not capable of processing the food eaten well enough to extract the nutrients needed to run the show, so let Red eat a bit more, and you can try a few things like spreading out the daily total amount of foods into smaller and more frequent feedings. You can help to trick the stomach in feeling full by adding water to the wet food. The water's great for the body and helps to cut the edge off the eating.

Take a look around.... read posts here and in other forums, and make yourself at home.
You were right to skip this shot; tomorrow, you will likely see a high number at preshot time, but I would give a lesser dose, OK?

Just post before you shoot to say what the test number is and what you are thinking of doing.
 
Ok-Red went from 2 1/2 units to 3 units. I did not up him a complete unit. This morning at 8 AM he is now at 149. This is the first time in 15 months of him having diabetes that I have come across this. Always in the past if he missed a shot the night before he would always be way up in the morning! Plus, my husband fed him already too. I have to leave for work around 10:15 so will test him around 10 & will be home around 3:15. I have my fingers crossed! Any advice is most wanted & appreciated! Thanks!
 
What a beautiful number to start the day. When you test at 10 a.m., be sure to post his BG in your subject line. We post a daily subject line like this (if 149 was Red's pre-shot number): 3/8 Red AMPS 149. Then when you get the +2 reading, update the subject line in your first post (the beginning post you made) like this: 3/8 Red AMPS 149 +2 (put whatever BG is here). For example: Gobbles AMPS was 104 and 2 hours (+2) he was 135, so my subject line reads: 3/8 Gobbles AMPS 104 +2 135. Also, if you have a question, click on the ? when you edit the subject line and maybe a short phrase after the BG's relating to your question. Example: "3/8 Gobbles AMPS 104 +2 135 ? dose"

A 10 a.m. test is a good idea. In case you don't know, here is a typical Lantus curve (though ECID "Every Cat Is Different"):

Example of a typical curve:
+0 - PreShot number.
+1 – Usually higher than PreShot number because of the last shot wearing off. May see a food spike in this number.
+2 - Often similar to the PreShot number.
+3 - Lower than the PreShot number, onset has started.
+4 - Lower.
+5 - Lower.
+6 – Nadir/Peak (the lowest number of cycle).
+7 - Surf (hang around the nadir number).
+8 - Slight rise.
+9 - Slight rise.
+10 - Rising.
+11 - Rising (may dip around +10 or +11).
+12 - PreShot number.

Also, are you keeping track of the daily readings (BG's) you get for Red? I don't know your history, but thought I would ask :mrgreen: It is a really good idea to keep track of his numbers on a spreadsheet.
 
Red has NEVER had a low number the next morning after not having a shot the night before. He has been diabetic now for 15 months too. He just started on Lantus on Feb. 2nd. Before that, he was on Pro-Zinc. Wow-what a big difference in numbers! On Pro-Zinc he was always jumping up & down & on Lantus he has had no big high's or low's until yesterday.

Thanks for your help! I work part time so a spreadsheet might be kinda difficult for me to do.
 
We post those as AMBG (morning blood glucose reading)

It would also help us greatly if you could get a spreadsheet set up so we can see the numbers that you are seeing to better guide you on what is going on with Red.

Until you have that you can alway post the numbers as

amps/ambg
+1
+2
+3
pmps/pmbg

The + numbers would be the numbers after his injection or after when his shot normally would be if you aren't shooting for the day
We use that way of denoting time since we are international and have a folks in all different time zones so your 10:30 am may or may not be the as my or someone else's 10:30am it just helps keep us all on the same page.

Mel, Maxwell, Autumn & The Fur Gang
 
carolyn16 said:
How do I post a AMPS number if Red hasn't had a shot since last morning?
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Oh, he didn't get a shot this a.m.? Ok, I thought he did...sorry. You could just put: 3/8 Red AMBG 149 +2 (add #). AMBG = morning blood glucose reading. So his last shot was yesterday morning--how much? Edit: 3 units. Are you giving Red shots once or twice per day? Sorry I don't know your history on FDMB; if you posted it elsewhere, I didn't see it.
 
Okay thanks for your info. Since I work I usually only test Red twice a day. Is that enough info for a spreadsheet? Today I will test him more though!
 
Sorry just saw other message now. Yes, Red gets insulin twice a day. Always has now for the 15 months of his diabetes.
 
carolyn16 said:
Thanks for your help! I work part time so a spreadsheet might be kinda difficult for me to do.
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We can help you with that. A fellow Lantus Mom here is good with that. I can hook you up with her if you want to try to put one together in the future; just let me know. Once you get it done, all you have to do is update it daily with Red's numbers (and any notes you may want to make...)
 
Well with Lantus we really like to see tests 3 to 4 times a day but we also realize that life happens and that isn't always possible.

Lantus dose changes are based off the Nadir or the Lowest point in the cycle which is usually around +6 so we like to see as many of those you can catch. What a lot of folks do that work is try to either catch that +6 on the pm cycle or just grab random spot checks during the week and then on a day off or on the weekends run a curve testing every 2 hour between shots on one cycle (either am or pm)

With my girl since I'm home with her all day I test amps, +6, pmps and then right before I go to bed at night which is usually right around her +3

Those midcycle tests are kind of critical to tell you how low the dose is taking Red, because the higher preshot that you have been seeing may have been from him dropping low and then bouncing back up when his body tries to compensate for the lows by sending out stored sugars and counterreglatory hormones.

Mel, Maxwell, Autumn & The Fur Gang
 
carolyn16 said:
Yes, I would LOVE help with a spreadsheet! Thanks so much!
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I sent a PM re: you setting up a SS for Red, to the Lantus Mom that's great with SS :-D I am sure she will reply either here or by PM....just keep writing down those numbers....
 
Carolyn

I'm the other member Kat (TheBowHuntress) was referencing that can help you with the Spreadsheet. I'll send you a PM (private message). I just need to get some info from you that doesn't need to take up space here. To get your PMs, go to top left of the forum page and click on "(X new messages) where X is the number of messages waiting for you to look at. Then you'll see my message.
 
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