New Diabetic Cat Advice

Status
Not open for further replies.
Lisa & Nacho

Lisa & Nacho

Member Since 2016
Good Afternoon -

My Cat Nacho - almost 6 year old orange tabby mix - was recently diagnosed with what most likely is cat diabetes. They just have to confirm with a urine sample, but his BG level was around 500.

He did not show other signs of diabetes (such as peeing more/excessive drinking), he actually tips his water bowl when I fill it! silly cat. I initially brought him in because he looked like he lost a few lbs (he went from about 16 lbs to 13.3 lbs) and his fur was looking rough/dandruff filled. They took a blood panel and also gave him fluids in his neck since he was a little dehydrated.

My vet recommended that I bring him in for a 3-4 day stay so they can monitor him 24/7 and begin insulin and diet change at the same time being roughly almost $1,000 in expenses when you add in the food, supplies, etc... They also recommended vet prescription food, but I am sure this forum may have other suggestions that are more affordable.

My questions are:
- Is this something I could do at home?
- I read that I should change diet first, see how that goes and then add insulin is that true? The vet I brought him to wants to do both at the same time.
- Can a changed diet (high protein/low carb) wet food help lower level before having to add insulin?
- If so, what food recommendations do you have?

I am trying to be more well informed before I jump to such a large expense. I love my kitty and want to do what is best for him with also being able to afford and manage it as well.

Thank you for your help!!
Lisa
 
Hello Lisa and Nacho (love his name!) and welcome to FDMB. Kudos to you for wanting to learn about how best to look after Nacho. You have come to the right place for all the support, knowledge and cost saving tips you could ever want or need. This is a wonderful friendly community with an immense amount of hands on experience that everyone is ready and willing to share.

First of all NIX on the prescription diet. There are some canned Rx diets that are OK but they are expensive and no better than store bought food in their ingredients. The dry Rx foods are all too high in carbs. There are many varieties of regular cat food that would be far better for Nacho than the prescription foods the vets habitually try to get their clients to purchase from them.

It's quite true that switching Nacho over to an appropriate diet could have a lowering effect on his BG. In some cases the change can be substantial. It would not be unreasonable to try a week of a diet switch before starting insulin but with Nacho's BG at 500, I certainly wouldn't delay any longer than a week. Now that said, it's quite likely Nacho's BG was excessively elevated at the vet's as most cats get very stressed. Vet visits can raise BG levels by 100 points or more. Lots of good dietary info HERE. Popular brands of food include Fancy Feast Classics and some Friskies and 9 Lives but there are many more options out there.

Yes you can do all of this at home. We strongly advocate home testing to keep kitty safe and we can help you learn to do it. It's not difficult and many of our kitties come get us at testing time rather than us having to hunt them down! Home testing allows you to monitor kitty's BG in their normal stress free environment, make sure their BG is high enough that it's safe to give insulin, and it allows to see how low a specific dose of insulin takes kitty so that you can find the optimal dose. Doing curves at the vet under stressful conditions can lead to the vet prescribing too high a dose of insulin and that can be very dangerous when you get kitty home.

Most folks here use a human meter to test their cats. The most popular meters are the Relion Micro and Confirm, both of which require a small blood sample and have relatively inexpensive strips which accounts for a good portion of the treatment of feline diabetes.

We're here to help anyway we can Lisa, so ask any and all questions you have and let us know how we can help. :)
 
Hello Lisa (and Nacho-- what a cutie!!!!)--

To answer your main question: I don't think a three-day vet stay is 100% necessary unless there are other health issues. In particular, if Nacho's tests reveal ketones or diabetic ketoacidosis (DKA), he MUST be treated by a vet to resolve that-- it can be life-threatening, and is very difficult to treat at home. There may be other health complications that would indicate a vet stay for initial diabetes treatment, so if there's anything else going on, that may be why your vet is recommending this. Generally, though, I think they recommend this course because most pet parents (understandably) find the diabetes diagnosis very overwhelming, so this is a way for the vet to get the pet parents off on the right foot with treatment rather than just sending them home with some insulin and syringes. Also, they can get full treatment (food+insulin) going very quickly because they have the ability to monitor closely and keep the cat safe-- you really don't want to delay either the food change or starting insulin for very long with a BG level that high.

Assuming no other health issues and that you can get your vet on board with you starting treatment at home, here's how I would proceed:

1) learn to home-test Nacho's blood glucose, so that you can monitor his progress and keep him safe
2) change to a low-carb food before starting insulin
3) after a few days on the low-carb food, and after you have done enough home-testing that you are confident you know where Nacho's numbers are, then decide (with your vet and/or consulting folks here with lots of experience) on a proper starting dose of insulin.

Whoops, just saw Linda replied with a lot of the details I was about to set out (I am a very slow typist!), so I'll just sign off here, adding only: Welcome!!!!
 
LisaMarie said:
Is this something I could do at home?
Click to expand...
Yes, absolutely! Your vet only has to:
1. diagnose the diabetes;
2. prescribe an appropriate insulin (ProZinc or Lantus would be best for a kitty - Vetsulin can work but is better for dogs);
3. teach you how to inject the insulin;
4. teach you how to test blood glucose yourself.
Your kitty does NOT have to be there for 3-4 days. My vet did all the things in the list above. No hospital stay for my guy.
LisaMarie said:
I read that I should change diet first, see how that goes and then add insulin is that true
Click to expand...
Yes, it's best to change to a wet low carb, high protein canned food before starting insulin. If Nacho is a good eater and doesn't have a sensitive tummy this can be accomplished in about a week. Removing all dry food from his diet can have a significant impact on his BG level, causing it to drop. Any insulin dose prescribed before the change could well be far too high. You need to learn to test BG at home so you can track the effect of the diet change.
LisaMarie said:
what food recommendations do you have?
Click to expand...
There's no reason to buy expensive prescription food. Many people here feed grocery store brands like Friskies and Fancy Feast pates (no sauce or gravy types) to their kitties.
LisaMarie said:
such a large expense.
Click to expand...
There's also NO reason that you have to pay for a blood glucose curve to be done by your vet. You can learn to do home testing. We strongly recommend learning to do this yourself because it's the essential tool for keeping Nacho safe by knowing whether a planned dose is too high and how low a dose takes him. Then, you can put this skill to use in doing your own curve at home and discussing those results with your vet.

Re testing: there's no need to buy a pet meter. Many people use human meters from Walmart. The meter strips are the costly item in the long run (like printer cartidges!) and the pet meter strips are horribly expensive.

I hope this helps. :)
 
Nan & Amber said:
Hello Lisa (and Nacho-- what a cutie!!!!)--

To answer your main question: I don't think a three-day vet stay is 100% necessary unless there are other health issues. In particular, if Nacho's tests reveal ketones or diabetic ketoacidosis (DKA), he MUST be treated by a vet to resolve that-- it can be life-threatening, and is very difficult to treat at home. There may be other health complications that would indicate a vet stay for initial diabetes treatment, so if there's anything else going on, that may be why your vet is recommending this. Generally, though, I think they recommend this course because most pet parents (understandably) find the diabetes diagnosis very overwhelming, so this is a way for the vet to get the pet parents off on the right foot with treatment rather than just sending them home with some insulin and syringes. Also, they can get full treatment (food+insulin) going very quickly because they have the ability to monitor closely and keep the cat safe-- you really don't want to delay either the food change or starting insulin for very long with a BG level that high.

Assuming no other health issues and that you can get your vet on board with you starting treatment at home, here's how I would proceed:

1) learn to home-test Nacho's blood glucose, so that you can monitor his progress and keep him safe
2) change to a low-carb food before starting insulin
3) after a few days on the low-carb food, and after you have done enough home-testing that you are confident you know where Nacho's numbers are, then decide (with your vet and/or consulting folks here with lots of experience) on a proper starting dose of insulin.

Whoops, just saw Linda replied with a lot of the details I was about to set out (I am a very slow typist!), so I'll just sign off here, adding only: Welcome!!!!
Click to expand...
I'm an even slower typist, Nan. :)
 
Nan & Amber said:
Hello Lisa (and Nacho-- what a cutie!!!!)--

To answer your main question: I don't think a three-day vet stay is 100% necessary unless there are other health issues. In particular, if Nacho's tests reveal ketones or diabetic ketoacidosis (DKA), he MUST be treated by a vet to resolve that-- it can be life-threatening, and is very difficult to treat at home. There may be other health complications that would indicate a vet stay for initial diabetes treatment, so if there's anything else going on, that may be why your vet is recommending this. Generally, though, I think they recommend this course because most pet parents (understandably) find the diabetes diagnosis very overwhelming, so this is a way for the vet to get the pet parents off on the right foot with treatment rather than just sending them home with some insulin and syringes. Also, they can get full treatment (food+insulin) going very quickly because they have the ability to monitor closely and keep the cat safe-- you really don't want to delay either the food change or starting insulin for very long with a BG level that high.

Assuming no other health issues and that you can get your vet on board with you starting treatment at home, here's how I would proceed:

1) learn to home-test Nacho's blood glucose, so that you can monitor his progress and keep him safe
2) change to a low-carb food before starting insulin
3) after a few days on the low-carb food, and after you have done enough home-testing that you are confident you know where Nacho's numbers are, then decide (with your vet and/or consulting folks here with lots of experience) on a proper starting dose of insulin.

Whoops, just saw Linda replied with a lot of the details I was about to set out (I am a very slow typist!), so I'll just sign off here, adding only: Welcome!!!!
Click to expand...

Thank you! The vet did not mention any of his other levels being off besides the BG level at this time.
 
Nan & Amber said:
Hello Lisa (and Nacho-- what a cutie!!!!)--

To answer your main question: I don't think a three-day vet stay is 100% necessary unless there are other health issues. In particular, if Nacho's tests reveal ketones or diabetic ketoacidosis (DKA), he MUST be treated by a vet to resolve that-- it can be life-threatening, and is very difficult to treat at home. There may be other health complications that would indicate a vet stay for initial diabetes treatment, so if there's anything else going on, that may be why your vet is recommending this. Generally, though, I think they recommend this course because most pet parents (understandably) find the diabetes diagnosis very overwhelming, so this is a way for the vet to get the pet parents off on the right foot with treatment rather than just sending them home with some insulin and syringes. Also, they can get full treatment (food+insulin) going very quickly because they have the ability to monitor closely and keep the cat safe-- you really don't want to delay either the food change or starting insulin for very long with a BG level that high.

Assuming no other health issues and that you can get your vet on board with you starting treatment at home, here's how I would proceed:

1) learn to home-test Nacho's blood glucose, so that you can monitor his progress and keep him safe
2) change to a low-carb food before starting insulin
3) after a few days on the low-carb food, and after you have done enough home-testing that you are confident you know where Nacho's numbers are, then decide (with your vet and/or consulting folks here with lots of experience) on a proper starting dose of insulin.

Whoops, just saw Linda replied with a lot of the details I was about to set out (I am a very slow typist!), so I'll just sign off here, adding only: Welcome!!!!
Click to expand...

It was almost like from the vet is "that's what they do to regulate the levels all at once" to have them stay there for a curve - this advice is SO helpful though :) makes me feel more at ease!
 
Lisa, a little word of caution. Not sure why but some vets are very reluctant to suggest home testing and some even discourage it for all sorts of ridiculous reasons. It may be that they feel many of their pet parents won't do it anyway and give up on their cat or it may be that it helps their pocket book to have you bring kitty in for curves etc.:( Either way, it's far better to be as hands on as you can with Nacho. You are with him 24/7 and you hold the needle, so in the long run, you should be the one making decisions about how involved you want to be with his care. Home testing gives you the ability to accurately know what is going on with Nacho all the time rather than possibly being mislead by the vet's often inaccurate observations during visits.

So if the vet is not on board with home testing, I suggest you just nod your head and then head off to get an glucometer. What you do at home is up to you. We can help you learn how to test even if the vet is not on board. ;)
 
MrWorfMen's Mom said:
Hello Lisa and Nacho (love his name!) and welcome to FDMB. Kudos to you for wanting to learn about how best to look after Nacho. You have come to the right place for all the support, knowledge and cost saving tips you could ever want or need. This is a wonderful friendly community with an immense amount of hands on experience that everyone is ready and willing to share.

First of all NIX on the prescription diet. There are some canned Rx diets that are OK but they are expensive and no better than store bought food in their ingredients. The dry Rx foods are all too high in carbs. There are many varieties of regular cat food that would be far better for Nacho than the prescription foods the vets habitually try to get their clients to purchase from them.

It's quite true that switching Nacho over to an appropriate diet could have a lowering effect on his BG. In some cases the change can be substantial. It would not be unreasonable to try a week of a diet switch before starting insulin but with Nacho's BG at 500, I certainly wouldn't delay any longer than a week. Now that said, it's quite likely Nacho's BG was excessively elevated at the vet's as most cats get very stressed. Vet visits can raise BG levels by 100 points or more. Lots of good dietary info HERE. Popular brands of food include Fancy Feast Classics and some Friskies and 9 Lives but there are many more options out there.

Yes you can do all of this at home. We strongly advocate home testing to keep kitty safe and we can help you learn to do it. It's not difficult and many of our kitties come get us at testing time rather than us having to hunt them down! Home testing allows you to monitor kitty's BG in their normal stress free environment, make sure their BG is high enough that it's safe to give insulin, and it allows to see how low a specific dose of insulin takes kitty so that you can find the optimal dose. Doing curves at the vet under stressful conditions can lead to the vet prescribing too high a dose of insulin and that can be very dangerous when you get kitty home.

Most folks here use a human meter to test their cats. The most popular meters are the Relion Micro and Confirm, both of which require a small blood sample and have relatively inexpensive strips which accounts for a good portion of the treatment of feline diabetes.

We're here to help anyway we can Lisa, so ask any and all questions you have and let us know how we can help. :)
Click to expand...

Thank you so much for your help!
 
Beth 73 said:
Hi LisaMarie ! I am a somewhat newbie myself and best thing I can encourage you to do is listen to these sweet, knowledgeable kitty parents. Their advice has helped and saved Elmo many times. Their wisdom and experience are beyond compare:). So glad u have found this enriching message board;)
Click to expand...

Thank you - yes it is very encouraging - I went from tearing up every time my cat walks by to feeling some hope and strength :)
 
LisaMarie said:
Thank you - yes it is very encouraging - I went from tearing up every time my cat walks by to feeling some hope and strength :)
Click to expand...
We are less than 3 weeks in with Ozzy's diagnosis and he presented at the vet with severe DKA and had to be hospitalized for 4 days. I was a wreck and cried for days; and then joined this site and the folks here gave me hope and strength as well.

I'm newbie too, but I can say that my vet also said most people won't do home testing. He actually quoted that 80-90% of folks won't; but I really think this is from lack of training pet parents 'how' to home monitor. They say they don't want to overwhelm you with info when you are taking your cat home. But I feel the opposite. I feel like they would be empowering you with info so you know how to treat your pet effectively and to make sure you are dosing insulin property and not shooting blindly.

I can say, insulin is kind of a scary thing and it is frightening giving your cat insulin when you don't know how he is reacting or if it's too much or not enough. My vet initially prescribed my Ozzy 3U of vestulin which is a harsh and quick acting insulin and it was too much. He was actually too sick still when we brought him home from the hospital and was not eating well so we were never able to give him the full dose. I, like you, learned about this site right away and joining was the BEST THING I ever did for my kitty and my own personal sanity. I immediately learned that the 2-3U dose was too high and never gave it to him. I can honestly say that the knowledgeable and caring folks on his board probably saved me from overdosing my sweet kitty. He is still only on 1U right now and has never taken more than 1.5U and even that was too much.

I also want to address the home monitoring and insulin dosing because this is all new to you, and yes, it is going to be a bit overwhelming at first. The folks here would tell me...be patient...don't worry it gets easier over time...etc. etc. etc. And you know what, it REALLY DOES. YOU CAN DO THIS.

After only a few days I felt like I had mastered the ear pokes for home monitoring Ozzy's glucose and also in giving the insulin injections. I can't say that my kitty doesn't react to the pokes still sometimes, but it's not that bad and I know what I am doing is best for him. And just know...you are going to have a learning curve with all this. You are most likely going to have to poke your kitty ears over and over till you get the technique down right. You may pierce his ears a few times with the lancets on accident more than once. You may miss giving the insulin shot under the skin and squirt it in his fur mistakenly (called a 'fur shot'). Or like me...your husband might actually squirt the insulin in your eye when withdrawing it from the bottle and you will think you might have a hypo moment yourself (you are NOT) and start drinking sugar water. All of this is part of the learning curve but your cat will be forgiving and will thank you for helping to make him feel better by getting his sugars in safer better feeling numbers.

And you will have as much support as you could possibly need from the wonderful folks here. Every question you could ever ask will be answered here... I PROMISE!

Good luck to you and your little sweet Nacho! My kitty is a ginger tabby too! Hope the diet change is all that is needed to reverse his high blood sugars. But if not, you know where to come!

Welcome!:bighug:
 
Last edited:
Ozzy Pawzbourne said:
We are less than 3 weeks in with Ozzy's diagnosis and he presented at the vet with severe DKA and had to be hospitalized for 4 days. I was a wreck and cried for days and then joined this site and the folks here gave me hope and strength as well.

I'm newbie too, but I can say that my vet also said most people won't do home testing. He actually quoted that 80-90% of folks won't; but I really think this is from lack of training pet parents 'how' to home monitor. They say they don't want to overwhelm you with info when you are taking your cat home. But I feel the opposite. I feel like they would be empowering you with info so you know how to treat your pet effectively and to make sure you are dosing insulin property and not shooting blindly.

I can say, insulin is kind of a scary thing and it is frightening giving your cat insulin when you don't know how he is reacting or if it's too much or not enough. My vet initially prescribed my Ozzy 3U of vestulin which is a harsh and quick acting insulin and it was too much. He was actually too sick still when we brought him home from the hospital and was not eating well so we were never able to give him the full dose. I, like you, learned about this site right away and joining was the BEST THING I ever did for my kitty and my own personal sanity. I immediately learned that the 2-3U dose was too high and never gave it to him. I can honestly say that the knowledgeable and caring folks on his board probably saved me from overdosing my sweet kitty. He is still only on 1U right now and has never taken more than 1.5U and even that was too much.

I also want to address the home monitoring and insulin dosing because this is all new to you, and yes, it is going to be a bit overwhelming at first. The folks here would tell me...be patient...don't worry it gets easier over time...etc. etc. etc. And you know what, it REALLY DOES. YOU CAN DO THIS.

After only a few days I felt like I had mastered the ear pokes for home monitoring Ozzy's glucose and also in giving the insulin injections. I can't say that my kitty doesn't react to the pokes still sometimes, but it's not that bad and I know what I am doing is best for him. And just know...you are going to have a learning curve with all this. You are most likely going to have to poke your kitty ears over and over till you get the technique down right. You may pierce his ears a few times with the lancets on accident more than once. You may miss giving the insulin shot under the skin and squirt it in his fur mistakenly (called a 'fur shot'). Or like me...your husband might actually shoot the insulin in your eye when withdrawing it from the syringe and you will think you might have a hypo moment yourself (you are NOT) and start drinking sugar water. All of this is part of the learning curve but your cat will be forgiving and will thank you for helping to make him feel better by getting his sugars in safer better feeling numbers.

And you will have as much support as you could possibly need from the wonderful folks here. Every question you could ever ask will be answered here... I PROMISE!

Good luck to you and your little sweet Nacho! My kitty is a ginger tabby too! Hope the diet change is all that is needed to reverse his high blood sugars. But if not, you know where to come!

Welcome!:bighug:
Click to expand...
Well said!! :D
 
Critter Mom said:
Hi LisaMarie!

How are you and Nacho doing today?

(Cute kitty, cute name! :) )


Mogs
.
Click to expand...

Nacho is doing well!! I changed him to Fancy Feast Classics wet food and he LOVES it!! The prescription food that I got from the vet he literally smelled it and walked away... haha. He gobbles up the Fancy Feast! I took away all dry food - very easy switch. He took right to the chicken & beef flavors of FF.

I have been researching new vets in my area and plan to make another appointment for him this week to go back in.

Since switching the food I noticed: immediate boost in energy on a daily basis, he seems like he has his "personality" back, he also gained 0.5 lbs back so he is 13.8 lbs now. He also is peeing less as well and drinking some water but not a ton.

Hopefully those are all positive changes!!

Thank you for asking :)
 
Ozzy Pawzbourne said:
We are less than 3 weeks in with Ozzy's diagnosis and he presented at the vet with severe DKA and had to be hospitalized for 4 days. I was a wreck and cried for days; and then joined this site and the folks here gave me hope and strength as well.

I'm newbie too, but I can say that my vet also said most people won't do home testing. He actually quoted that 80-90% of folks won't; but I really think this is from lack of training pet parents 'how' to home monitor. They say they don't want to overwhelm you with info when you are taking your cat home. But I feel the opposite. I feel like they would be empowering you with info so you know how to treat your pet effectively and to make sure you are dosing insulin property and not shooting blindly.

I can say, insulin is kind of a scary thing and it is frightening giving your cat insulin when you don't know how he is reacting or if it's too much or not enough. My vet initially prescribed my Ozzy 3U of vestulin which is a harsh and quick acting insulin and it was too much. He was actually too sick still when we brought him home from the hospital and was not eating well so we were never able to give him the full dose. I, like you, learned about this site right away and joining was the BEST THING I ever did for my kitty and my own personal sanity. I immediately learned that the 2-3U dose was too high and never gave it to him. I can honestly say that the knowledgeable and caring folks on his board probably saved me from overdosing my sweet kitty. He is still only on 1U right now and has never taken more than 1.5U and even that was too much.

I also want to address the home monitoring and insulin dosing because this is all new to you, and yes, it is going to be a bit overwhelming at first. The folks here would tell me...be patient...don't worry it gets easier over time...etc. etc. etc. And you know what, it REALLY DOES. YOU CAN DO THIS.

After only a few days I felt like I had mastered the ear pokes for home monitoring Ozzy's glucose and also in giving the insulin injections. I can't say that my kitty doesn't react to the pokes still sometimes, but it's not that bad and I know what I am doing is best for him. And just know...you are going to have a learning curve with all this. You are most likely going to have to poke your kitty ears over and over till you get the technique down right. You may pierce his ears a few times with the lancets on accident more than once. You may miss giving the insulin shot under the skin and squirt it in his fur mistakenly (called a 'fur shot'). Or like me...your husband might actually squirt the insulin in your eye when withdrawing it from the bottle and you will think you might have a hypo moment yourself (you are NOT) and start drinking sugar water. All of this is part of the learning curve but your cat will be forgiving and will thank you for helping to make him feel better by getting his sugars in safer better feeling numbers.

And you will have as much support as you could possibly need from the wonderful folks here. Every question you could ever ask will be answered here... I PROMISE!

Good luck to you and your little sweet Nacho! My kitty is a ginger tabby too! Hope the diet change is all that is needed to reverse his high blood sugars. But if not, you know where to come!

Welcome!:bighug:
Click to expand...

THANK YOU!

First change complete - changed his food this past week! He took right to the FF Classics, he loves them practically knocks me over when I have a can in my hand.

Since switching the food I noticed: immediate boost in energy on a daily basis, he seems like he has his "personality" back, he also gained 0.5 lbs back so he is 13.8 lbs now. He also is peeing less as well and drinking some water but not a ton so I am excited!!

He will be going to a new vet this week!
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top