need help-not sure what's going on?

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nicholeandwolfgang

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I updated a little while ago about my cat wolfgang. We just gave him fluids and he ate a few treats after that and he began scratching on both sides of his head, and wouldn't stop. I checked his ears and rubbed the sides of his face, and he has calmed a little bit but what could this be??? I cleaned his outer ears with q-tips to make sure his ears were clean (and I do this quite frequently) Ugh this cat has got me worried sick :cry:
 
I think you might want to add your location to your subject line, to see if anyone is near you that may be available to help you with the hometesting issue you mentioned in your first thread.

(just hit edit in your first message, and add your location. Im going to cross post your first thread in the community forum for now)
 
hi there- he gets a few Temptations indoor cat treats, not many, maybe four? We had just given him his subq fluids and to reward him for being good, we give him a few. He has never done this before and especially on both sides? He has calmed now, but is looking really miserable. I feel so helpless that I can't soothe him and I'm just in tears because I feel this way. As I said in my previous post, I've got a baby on board so this is all so upsetting, especially when he isn't showing improvement. I have to call his vet tomorrow and report back to her about how is doing since our visit on Wednesday... I wish I had great news for her, because she may want to hospitalize him and I don't think this would be beneficial. I think it will stress him out even more and he won't make progress there....
 
I cant help with subQ's, hoping others can step in to help with that.

did u give insulin today?
and you're not home testing yet right?

is he eating?
 
yes, he got his 1 unit of Lantus this morning at 6 am pacific time, so it is also almost time for his 2nd shot of the day. Personally, I think the vet wanted to start him on a low dose of insulin, but I just don't think it's enough. We do not know how to hometest, and we don't have a kit for him. I have a kit for myself for my diabetes, but it's a click pen... even in an emergency with him I probably can't use this right? It has to be lancets?
Oh- and he is eating very little, we are force feeding him per the vet. He actually vomited a while ago, and has a few times since last night. Could he be reacting like this because that insulin is not a high enough dose?
 
Nichole right?

the unfortunate thing is, we have no idea what Wolfgang's numbers are, if it's ok to give insulin.

do u have a human meter with your kit? which one?
It does take a bit of practice and lots of patience to learn, but it is feasible, and most get the hang of it within a week.

u mention food issues in your other thread,,,has he been eating, besides the treats?
 
We do not have a meter or kit for him at all. I do have mine for my use and it's an Aviva Acu-check (sp?) with the clickpen lancet. He is not eating as much as we would like him to on his own, he may take a few bites, or lick the gravy/gel off the food and then walk away. It's hard for us to tell what he needs also as he just got put back on the juice and the vet was not ever supportive of home testing, so we just brought him in for curves every month. So when we brought him in this time, she said that he has the ketoacidosis and hepatic lipidosis again. I remember it taking him a while to bounce back from the ketoacidosis, but I'm worried sick this time.
 
so we just brought him in for curves every month. So when we brought him in this time, she said that he has the ketoacidosis and hepatic lipidosis again. I remember it taking him a while to bounce back from the ketoacidosis, but I'm worried sick this time.
Click to expand...


Do you have a ketones box to check for ketones right now?

when was the last time ketones was checked at the vets?

how is Wolfgang behaving right now?
 
HI Nicole,
First off, take a huge breath, OK? Wolfgang's going to be all right. Has the scratching stopped? Not sure how it could be related to the fluids. Was he being restrained? Is he shaking his head or acting unusual otherwise? Behavior such as staring or walking in a circle? That might indicate hypoglycemia, but it's been about 12 hours since his morning shot, right, so that's probably not likely.

You can use the click pen as well as your meter on Wolfgang! It will mess up your tracking your own numbers on the meter, if that is acceptable to you, then use it. You may have to experiment a few times to get the setting on the click pen right, do you have the clear shield they send with them so you can see where the needle is going in?

This is completely doable - you have the equipment. I use an AccuCheck Aviva for Gandalf! It's a good meter and takes a very small amount of blood, even if it doesn't fill up the strip completely it will read accurately.

Also, you can get a 60ml syringe from the vet and blend food for Wolfgang and administer it to him that way, it's called syringe feeding. It's very important for a cat prone to ketones to eat, as well as receive insulin.

Keep posting questions and we'll see if we can talk you through this to get Wolfgang his shot. And empower you to know what's going on with him.
 
we do not have a a box of the ketones strips at the moment- can these be purchased at the drug store and used on animals? His ketones were checked on Wednesday at the vet, she said he had some, but they were not as severe because we caught it in time.

Wolfgang is actually sleeping peacefully on the bed next to me right now, and he has since stopped scratching his ears. It's also time for his shot, and I am going to syringe feed him in an hour or two so he has some calories in him. Unfortunately, I don't think there is anything more I can do for him until I call his vet tomorrow and let her know what's going on. We will be taking him in for an all day curve probably within the next few days and I have a feeling she may change his dose of insulin.
 
Hi Vicki-thanks for reminding me to breathe! I worry sick about my boy, and most ppl say because I'm pregnant that I shouldn't- a little easier said than done. I don't mind sharing my meter with him until he gets his own. We are just unfamiliar with the process of it all. My clickpen does have the guard on it, but it has a little hole where the needle comes out- is that what you mean? It's bad enough I have to test my blood sugar 4x's a day, and give insulin to myself 2x's a day. I know I need to be patient and he will get better- he did before.

Also, we are actually syringe feeding him already- the science diet a/d and I crush his appetite stimulant up in there to make sure he gets it. He is not really acting strange, he just looks really sad and sick :sad: He has been purring, and he has not been despondant to us like before we took him to the vet. He is also not hiding from us, but he still looks like he doesn't feel well. He is being very hard to "read" the last few days. He will come in the kitchen when I crack the cat food can, stick around and take a few bites but that's all I can get from him. last night he was purring really loud and he came and layed on my tummy. Now he is sleeping peacefully so I guess he is ok for now, we will syringe feed him again in a little bit...
 
yes they can be purchased at any pharmacy, and used for cats too.

if your cat had ketones at the vet just last wednesday - this is really something you should be monitoring, and not just at the vets once a week.
You may also want to learn how to home test, most vets unfortunately discourage home testing, but you dont need their permission to home test.
You're one step ahead of it - you test yourself yes? Do u test yourself before giving yourself insulin? Do you test yourself thru the day, a spot check or two?

Home testing is the next best thing you can do for your cat,..there's an alert in community for members in your area, so hopefully someone will see this and be in contact with you thru the board.

There's no way to know how much insulin your cat needs without testing it - and trust me a few curves a month at the vets is not the way to monitor insulin on cats.

If your kitty right now is doing ok, and you are ok, you may remove the 911 icon, but only if you guys are ok, allright?

Keep posting here in this forum when ever you want, update when u can, eventually, you may want to post in the Lantus forum where you will receive a lot of help with it.
 
You're welcome! You're giving him insulin tonight, right? Since he's had ketones he needs his insulin. The 1U should be fine. Your vet actually did really good by only starting him on that much.

Yes, stress isn't good for either of you!! I hope reaching out, even if it's to unknown "friends" online, is helping ease some stress for you.

The needle comes out the hole, yes, and there should have been a clear plastic shield included with the same hole in it (mine is a larger hole actually) so you take off the blue one and put the clear one on. I think it's for people who want to see where they're pricking! Most probably don't. But to do a cat's ear it's helpful to see where you're poking.

Hope that helps. Maybe check your meter case for the shield.
 
Thanks for your help Ronnie,
I will get the ketone strips tomorrow and start using them. Unfortunately, I'm confused as to where you draw the line about involving the vet and home testing, obviously if I home test, I still cannot or would not feel comfortable setting the insulin dosing, esp if my vet is not supportive of home testing. But I am hopeful if someone in my area gets back to me, I can ask which vet they use so I can maybe switch to a vet that would encourage home testing?

Kitty is doing fine and he is resting for the time being. He had a rough patch after his subq fluids and the itchy ears, so I feel ok taking off the 911 icon.

Thanks again for all your help and advice!!!
 
nicholeandwolfgang said:
So when we brought him in this time, she said that he has the ketoacidosis and hepatic lipidosis again. I remember it taking him a while to bounce back from the ketoacidosis, but I'm worried sick this time.
Click to expand...

It really concerns me that the vet mentioned these two conditions and still sent you home without treating him. Both of those conditions need monitoring and treatment and may explain why he is not feeling good. Like Ronnie mentioned, I would purchase some ketostix as soon as you can from a drugstore. If the strip says anything over "trace" you need to get him to an emergency vet. I apologize if I misunderstood this and he did get treated for ketones. May I ask what you are giving the sub-q fluids for?
 
Please read this thread for some input...this discussion comes up a lot here

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=6665


the bottom line is, you're paying the vet, it's your pet, you want to do the best and safest thing for your pet, just as if it were you're child.

Also, yes, you do want to keep a working relationship with your vet.
However, if you're uncomfortable with the ongoing issues that your vet doesn't want you to take safe measures, discouraging you, then it may be time to move on.

by the way, these issues with vets also involve the prescription dry food too.

take care of yourself, and keep us posted ok?
 
Thanks again Vicky- I probably do have the clear shield you are talking about, it's probably still in the box! I was so overwhelmed when I became sick with the gestational diabetes and then learning I had to give myself shots put me over the edge. It's just ironic how Wolfgang became sick two weeks after his bean did! argh!
It is helping alot reaching out to people that understand -believe me, there aren't many people in my daily life that do!!! I love Wolfgang so much and I would do just about anything to make him feel better. It makes my husband and I so sad to see him so sick. He seems to be pretty ok right now and resting comfortably. Thanks so much for all the kind words and support :smile:
 
Hi,

I don't want to get in the way here, since I am a relative newbie myself, but there are a LOT of people here who WILL HELP you. It's amazing. I know it may feel odd relying on people here, but really--there is a lot of wisdom and knowledge here. Lean on people while you need to!

Incidentally, I use a clicky pen every time I test my Basil. I use the deepest setting, and I use a sock filled with rice, heated up in the microwave, to warm up his ear and get the blood flowing.

Come on into the Lantus group. There are lots of people there!
 
I just use the regular click-pen cover that came with mine - I saw that clear thing, but didn't know what it was LOL so it's still in the box. I think the testing is 100% the same as with people, only you test on their ear. But all the equipment and stuff is just the same as far as I know. (I hope so, because that's what I'm using!!!!). When people talk about lancets they just mean the one you are putting in the pen. Some people poke freehand, but I never got the hang of that.
 
i am hoping your husband can help with the ketone testing. should you be handling litter when you are pregnant?
it's pretty easy. i usually clean the box to tempt him to use it, then collect urine before he has a chance to cover it up with the litter. either that or you can wait til he starts to pee, then stick a ladle under him to collect some of the pee, then dip the test strip in it. they'll have ketone test strips at any pharmacy. i know CVS has them right on the shelves and not behind the pharmacy counter. if you think it will be too hard to collect pee as he's peeing, you can mix some of his clean litter with water and dip a strip into it to see if you get a positive reading for ketones. if you get a positive reading with the clean litter, you will not be able to do the following, but if you get a negative reading you will be able to collect some of his litter right after he pees into it, and then test that (easier to collect the pee sample that way).

you can make your own mind up as to whether you want to follow your vet's dosing advice or follow tilly, which is the protocol many of us lantus users use (there's a link to it in my signature). it's gotten over 100 cats into remission in the past year alone.

dka is very serious so i'd be careful about any advice you get from a layperson about it. check their profile carefully to make sure they have DKA experience or are a vet tech or vet. basically understand that DKA comes from some combination of high blood glucose numbers, infection, inappetance, insufficient insulin, so it's very important not to give insufficient insulin to a cat bordering on DKA. if your cat does have DKA, make sure he goes to a 24-hr pet ER so he can be monitored continuously. it's not something easily treated at home.

beyond understanding how your cat's diabetes is going at any time, testing his blood glucose will help you show your vet when things are going wrong and numbers are high or if dose should be adjusted because he's going too low. you can use your regular diabetes testing equipment with him. lots of us really like the accuchek monitor (makes it cheaper coz you're getting strips anyway). you already know how to do this for yourself, so you have a huge advantage over total newbies. you just use your pen to get a blood drop from his ear. around the outer edge of the ear, about 1/4 inch in, a vein runs. you nick near that vein to get the blood drop then sip it into the test strip as normal. eventually you'll probably want a separate meter for wolfgang but right now it's a bit of an emergency so i'd get a reading using your own monitor asap.

you can do this! you know you can. just tell yourself you're the best person in the world to help your cat, take a deep breath, and totally fake that you're confident and go do it. he'll pick up if you're nervous so it absolutely helps to fake confidence and get the job done asap. they usually fuss more if it takes too long. afterward, apply slight pressure to the area you've poked, to avoid bruising. i usually poke into a cotton ball so i don't prick my own finger but if i do manage to prick my own finger i test my own blood glucose. :)
 
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