Need food and insulin advice

[Alicia & Chester]

Hi everyone,

I'm new here so I'll give some background info. I adopted Chester on 1 May 2018 as an FIV positive kitty. It turns out he is also diabetic and the shelter didn't know it. He was started on insulin on 5-21 at 1 unit of Lantus. Since then he's gradually worked his way up to 5 units. At 4 units his levels were still high and don't seem to be budging much, but he hasn't yet had his 5 unit levels checked. He is also gaining weight. He came to me at about 12 pounds and the vet wants him down to 11, but since being on higher levels of insulin he's up to 14 pounds and change despite being on a fixed diet recommended by the vet. I've been reading the boards and doing google searches and wondering if he might have acromegaly. Do you think I should bring this up at his next vet visit or just see what the vet thinks? Also, how much does the IGF-1 test tend to cost in the US?

I would also like some food advice. Chester is currently eating Purina DM wet food and Hill's MD dry (only 1/8 cup a day broken into 2 meals) and the cost is killing me when you factor in the insulin and having to go to the vet every month for BG and fructosamine checks. I see a lot of info saying that you can feed some types of commercial wet food instead of buying the expensive prescription food. I'm not sure how my vet will react if I bring this up. I brought it up in passing before and she said that cats on the prescription diet have greater rates of remission. Is this true? I want him to have the best chances of remission, but I'm going broke and if I can save money on food with little to no effect of his BG levels I'd like to do so. Thanks for any help.

 

[JanetNJ]

Hi everyone,

I'm new here so I'll give some background info. I adopted Chester on 1 May 2018 as an FIV positive kitty. It turns out he is also diabetic and the shelter didn't know it. He was started on insulin on 5-21 at 1 unit of Lantus. Since then he's gradually worked his way up to 5 units. At 4 units his levels were still high and don't seem to be budging much, but he hasn't yet had his 5 unit levels checked. He is also gaining weight. He came to me at about 12 pounds and the vet wants him down to 11, but since being on higher levels of insulin he's up to 14 pounds and change despite being on a fixed diet recommended by the vet. I've been reading the boards and doing google searches and wondering if he might have acromegaly. Do you think I should bring this up at his next vet visit or just see what the vet thinks? Also, how much does the IGF-1 test tend to cost in the US?

I would also like some food advice. Chester is currently eating Purina DM wet food and Hill's MD dry (only 1/8 cup a day broken into 2 meals) and the cost is killing me when you factor in the insulin and having to go to the vet every month for BG and fructosamine checks. I see a lot of info saying that you can feed some types of commercial wet food instead of buying the expensive prescription food. I'm not sure how my vet will react if I bring this up. I brought it up in passing before and she said that cats on the prescription diet have greater rates of remission. Is this true? I want him to have the best chances of remission, but I'm going broke and if I can save money on food with little to no effect of his BG levels I'd like to do so. Thanks for any help.

I'll let someone else comment more on the lantus, but I will say that your vet is probably raising the dose in whole units which is not the way to go. Here the protocols have folks raise in 0.25-0.5 increments so the ideal dose is not skipped. Too much insulin can look like not enough

Also if you really want to keep your cat safe and save money the best way is by home testing. It's more accurate and can tell you in that moment of your cat is too high or low. I have a video in my signature showing how I test my cat CC at home. It literally can save his life. It saved my cats life last night. If I hadn't tested her, she most likely would be dead this morning. No joke.

Perscription food is not necessary. That food is crap, esp the dry. The dry is around 14-15% carb. If you tell the vet she's won't eat it and you're going to try fancy feast classic, what could be really say?

I have a link to the food list in my signature. Choose foods under 10 percent carb (under 7 is even better).

 

[Veronica & Babu-chiri]

Welcome!!

Is hard to give an opinion on the dose without knowing his blood sugar test results, but it is a high dose, and I think is very dangerous to be giving it with out testing him before each shoot because if for any circumstance his blood sugar level gets too low it can actually kill him and the way to prevent this is by home testing,

Home testing can also help you get him regulated since you will know if he needs a higher or lower dose, is more precise since blood sugar levels can get higher at the vet because of stress and much more cheaper than what the vet charges for testing him, the fructosamine test is also not very helpful for establishing a dose and regulating him because it basically gives you an average of how he's been for a period of time but not how he is now.

It is true that giving the right kind of food ( 10% of carbohydrates or less ) will give him better chances of going into remission ( is important to consider not all cats can go into remission ) but the food he's eating as Janet mentioned is not helping him besides being very expensive, do take a look at the list Janet has in her signature and choose one that suits you and that he likes, because is important that he eats specially with a high dose like the one you have but I do suggest you start testing before changing his diet since the low carb (carbohydrates) food will probably lower his blood glucose numbers

 

[Alicia & Chester]

Welcome!!

Is hard to give an opinion on the dose without knowing his blood sugar test results, but it is a high dose, and I think is very dangerous to be giving it with out testing him before each shoot because if for any circumstance his blood sugar level gets too low it can actually kill him and the way to prevent this is by home testing,

Home testing can also help you get him regulated since you will know if he needs a higher or lower dose, is more precise since blood sugar levels can get higher at the vet because of stress and much more cheaper than what the vet charges for testing him, the fructosamine test is also not very helpful for establishing a dose and regulating him because it basically gives you an average of how he's been for a period of time but not how he is now.

It is true that giving the right kind of food ( 10% of carbohydrates or less ) will give him better chances of going into remission ( is important to consider not all cats can go into remission ) but the food he's eating as Janet mentioned is not helping him besides being very expensive, do take a look at the list Janet has in her signature and choose one that suits you and that he likes, because is important that he eats specially with a high dose like the one you have but I do suggest you start testing before changing his diet since the low carb (carbohydrates) food will probably lower his blood glucose numbers

Can I use a human blood glucose monitor on him? I looked up ones for pets and holy cow, they aren't cheap. Is ReliOn a good brand for cats? The one I'm looking at is the Confirm model and it got good reviews for humans and it's within my budget, plus it uses minimal blood. How many times a day should he be tested, just before meals/insulin or more than that? Are most cats cooperative with the testing? He's good with his shots, but sometimes he's not too cooperative with the tech for his BG checks at the vet.

Yes, the food definitely doesn't seem to be helping lower his numbers as he was on Friskies wet pate originally (as well as Hill's Ideal Balance dry) and his numbers aren't much lower. I think I'm going to ask the vet if we can try cutting out his dry food (though Chester will hate me for it) and switching him back to Friskies pate which is lower in carbs than his current Purina DM wet food.

 

[Evie Corso]

My vet started my cat on Rx cat food for diabetes, the same ones you are using. They are not low carb diets. When I switched to canned food, non-prescription, with carbs under 10% and for my cat with kidney disease, low phosphorus, I have been able to go from 7 units insulin twice a day to 1.25 units twice a day. I am not using Lantus, so you can’t go by my numbers, but you are asking the right question - what food! Most cat food does not show the amount of carbohydrates in it. Thanks to some wonderful people, they created a list of cat food with the carbs, proteins, phosphorus and it even lets you use filters to help you find a good food for your situation. The list is only for canned cat food because it is what is recommended and what is cheaper in the long run. There is a nice “sticky” post for the reasons we use canned food. It has been a challenge finding the right canned foods and then getting my diabetic kitty to eat canned food after eating dry for most of her life, but it is worth the battle. You will be surprised to find many cost effective options. I have even been able to find some less expensive options for my diabetic kitty with kidney disease. She was getting dehydrated on dry food, despite increased water consumption and I had to give her subQ fluids. Now all the cats are getting canned food. They are drinking less water, BUT the litter boxes have more than twice as much urine. Their urine is more diluted and I am betting I end up with less kitties having urinary tract and kidney problems later in life. Their coats are looking nicer too and we only just started a few weeks ago! Here’s a link to the list:
http://catinfo.org/chart/index.php?...n=">;45"&fat="<;50"&carbs="<;10"&phos="<;300"
It is a godsend!

 

[Mel & Dominic]

My vet started my cat on Rx cat food for diabetes, the same ones you are using. They are not low carb diets. When I switched to canned food, non-prescription, with carbs under 10% and for my cat with kidney disease, low phosphorus, I have been able to go from 7 units insulin twice a day to 1.25 units twice a day. I am not using Lantus, so you can’t go by my numbers, but you are asking the right question - what food! Most cat food does not show the amount of carbohydrates in it. Thanks to some wonderful people, they created a list of cat food with the carbs, proteins, phosphorus and it even lets you use filters to help you find a good food for your situation. The list is only for canned cat food because it is what is recommended and what is cheaper in the long run. There is a nice “sticky” post for the reasons we use canned food. It has been a challenge finding the right canned foods and then getting my diabetic kitty to eat canned food after eating dry for most of her life, but it is worth the battle. You will be surprised to find many cost effective options. I have even been able to find some less expensive options for my diabetic kitty with kidney disease. She was getting dehydrated on dry food, despite increased water consumption and I had to give her subQ fluids. Now all the cats are getting canned food. They are drinking less water, BUT the litter boxes have more than twice as much urine. Their urine is more diluted and I am betting I end up with less kitties having urinary tract and kidney problems later in life. Their coats are looking nicer too and we only just started a few weeks ago! Here’s a link to the list:
http://catinfo.org/chart/index.php?sort=company ASC&protein=">;45"&fat="<;50"&carbs="<;10"&phos="<;300"
It is a godsend!

Hi Evie! Thank you for this chart. Dominic's recent blood work has revealed the onset of kidney disease. The vet wants to put him on Hill's KD, but the carbs are so high that I'm scared to do it. He's been in remission since February, but I really don't want the diabetes to come back. May I ask what the most cost effective food option you've found is? I'm having a really hard time. I figured IAMS grain free would be affordable, but all I'm not sure what I've found is the same as what's on the chart. Thank you!

Alicia, there's a great video in the general info section here on how to home test. Don't worry, you can do it! I bought the Relion Prime at Wal-Mart and it wasn't expensive. Home testing is so helpful to get diabetes under control. I was able to get Dominic into remission in just a few months after I started home testing and adjusting his Lantus dosage myself. You and Chester will get through this

 

[Evie Corso]

Hi Evie! Thank you for this chart. Dominic's recent blood work has revealed the onset of kidney disease. The vet wants to put him on Hill's KD, but the carbs are so high that I'm scared to do it. He's been in remission since February, but I really don't want the diabetes to come back. May I ask what the most cost effective food option you've found is? I'm having a really hard time. I figured IAMS grain free would be affordable, but all I'm not sure what I've found is the same as what's on the chart. Thank you!

Alicia, there's a great video in the general info section here on how to home test. Don't worry, you can do it! I bought the Relion Prime at Wal-Mart and it wasn't expensive. Home testing is so helpful to get diabetes under control. I was able to get Dominic into remission in just a few months after I started home testing and adjusting his Lantus dosage myself. You and Chester will get through this

I haven’t forgotten your question. As soon as I get a chance to look up the price per ounce of the foods I use, I can tell you what is most cost effective.

 

[Mel & Dominic]

I haven’t forgotten your question. As soon as I get a chance to look up the price per ounce of the foods I use, I can tell you what is most cost effective.

Oh, don't go through too much trouble! I ended up ordering Weruva Cats in the Kitchen Chicken Frick A Zee in 10 ounce cans. Thank you for replying

 

[Evie Corso]

10 ounce cans - awesome! With 11 indoor only kitties and a few trap-neuter-vaccinate feral barn kitties I need large sizes of everything! I have gone through a lot of NULO because they gave me buy 4 get 2 free cans coupons and they are the large 13 ounce cans! They are a higher in fat, but that was not my first concern.