Need advice (quick if possible)

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Henry's human

Henry's human

Member Since 2016
Henry's insulin is due. I just took his levels and it is 6.5 - the lady at the vet surgery told that 6 is normal for him. Do I feed him and still give the insulin? So glad I was able to get blood tonight.
 
Without having more data on how Henry's numbers are it is hard to say about dosing. Since Henry is new to insulin and without other data to show how well he responds to any dose it is suggested to not shoot under 11 mmol (200 US). With using the AT2 meter you definitely want the numbers higher until you have more data. You could try waiting 20 minutes WITHOUT feeding and test again and seeing if the numbers come up to that level. If not my advice would be to skip this dose.
 
Tuxedo Mom said:
Without having more data on how Henry's numbers are it is hard to say about dosing. Since Henry is new to insulin and without other data to show how well he responds to any dose it is suggested to not shoot under 11 mmol (200 US). You could try waiting 20 minutes WITHOUT feeding and test again and seeing if the numbers come up to that level. If not my advice would be to skip this dose.
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I already started feeding him. He was about to take my arm off. :( I couldn't get blood yesterday but the day before it was 13.5 and the day before over 20..
I feel a bit worried as to what to do.
 
Since you have started home testing it would be VERY useful to set up a spreadsheet. Instructions are here:

http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/fdmb-spreadsheet-instructions.130337/


Since you use the mmol/L system you would use this spreadsheet:

https://drive.google.com/previewtemplate?id=1JQ136YHkxNhhku9AML_OKGHkrg3Ixe27BWAdWONlnP0&mode=public

and enter the numbers on the World tab. Your numbers will automatically be translated into US numbers on a separate tab. Since many of the members here use the US system it makes it easier to see what the data is. As well the protocols used on this site are mostly set up in US numbers.

The AT2 pet meter reads higher than the human meter that the protocols use, so you need to ask for advice especially at lower numbers...just as you did today :)
 
Henry's human said:
I already started feeding him. He was about to take my arm off. :( I couldn't get blood yesterday but the day before it was 13.5 and the day before over 20..
I feel a bit worried as to what to do.
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At this point with no data to see just how low this dose takes him and having fed, it would be better to skip the shot. It is only 5 days since you started the insulin and some kitties will respond well. If possible you could do some more testing today depending on your time schedule.


ETA If you have any trouble trying to set up a spreadsheet just ask (I had to when I started :) ) and someone can give you a hand. The spreadsheet gives a great visual of how well you Henry is responding to the insulin and how low it takes it. Lantus dosing is based on how low the dose takes a kitty and to make sure that the dose does not take him too low.
 
When in doubt, don't give insulin. 6.5 is a nice number but you don't want to go a lot lower if you're new to this and uncertain how the insulin is working. We don't know if he is going up or down - hence the need for more info so experienced eyes can advise you. At this stage I agree with Mary Ann - skip the dose. But test again when you can and see what the difference in BG is after food.

Good luck

Diana
 
If his levels go up in a few hours should I give the insulin then or just wait for the morning dose? (It's 8.24pm here)
 
Henry's human said:
If his levels go up in a few hours should I give the insulin then or just wait for the morning dose? (It's 8.24pm here)
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Good question! But again, hard to say. Ideally you don't want to vary your shooting schedule too much. If numbers have risen dramatically you could give a token dose, yes - maybe half - but that could mess with the next planned shot so it could start to become complicated. If I were you I would stick around and check again after a couple of hours and post here again then.

Diana
 
Henry's human said:
If his levels go up in a few hours should I give the insulin then or just wait for the morning dose? (It's 8.24pm here)
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With not much data and with it being evening there I would not give the shot. This also would complicate your schedule for shooting. If you gave the shot and he does start to drop you would need to monitor for possibly a number of hours.

You can do some more tests without the shot and see how his numbers go.


ETA I see Diana said basically the same thing I did :)
 
Tuxedo Mom said:
With not much data and with it being evening there I would not give the shot. This also would complicate your schedule for shooting. If you gave the shot and he does start to drop you would need to monitor for possibly a number of hours.

You can do some more tests without the shot and see how his numbers go.


ETA I see Diana said basically the same thing I did :)
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We agree! When in doubt - don't.
 
Diana&Tom said:
We agree! When in doubt - don't.
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EXACTLY. ALWAYS better to err on the safe side.


ETA You said "the day before it was 13.5 and the day before over 20.." Depending on the timing of those test it could be that Henry is responding very well to the insulin at this point. More data from tests will give a better picture.

You are doing a great job and how great that you are home testing!!
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Well, he had loads to eat (he kept going back for more) and at 9.34pm his BG level was 6.6 (it was actually 6.4 at 7.56pm. I reported it wrong, sorry).
 
Definitely the right decision not to dose, then - sounds as if there is still insulin in his system and/or he is responding very efficiently to the dose... Keep testing when you can (I know it's late there so don't worry about staying up all night) and make sure you keep a written record of test results and timings... For now that's the info you need to tell us here so we can see what's what.
Looking good though :)

Diana
 
Henry's human said:
Well, he had loads to eat (he kept going back for more) and at 9.34pm his BG level was 6.6 (it was actually 6.4 at 7.56pm. I reported it wrong, sorry).
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Wonderful numbers especially after eating!!!! I agree with Diana, if you can get another test to see if he is still staying in those good numbers.


Have you changed his diet since he was diagnosed?? If he was on dry food before and you removed it that can have a BIG impact on glucose numbers. In any case those are great numbers....right in the higher normal range with the pet meter you are using.
 
Tuxedo Mom said:
Wonderful numbers especially after eating!!!! I agree with Diana, if you can get another test to see if he is still staying in those good numbers.


Have you changed his diet since he was diagnosed?? If he was on dry food before and you removed it that can have a BIG impact on glucose numbers. In any case those are great numbers....right in the higher normal range with the pet meter you are using.
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I did change his diet. I was wanting to do it slowly but I realised today that it was the dry food making him vomit. He didn't want it yesterday, so he had wet food and some fish I cooked him. Then this morning I gave him the lower carb dry food because I didn't want to change him too fast. So he ate it and then about twenty minutes later he threw it all back up. :( So I just gave him wet food and his tummy has been good all day.

That probably has a lot to do with the numbers he has then.
I am going to test him again soon (he and his brother want more food now.)
 
Henry's human said:
I did change his diet. I was wanting to do it slowly but I realised today that it was the dry food making him vomit. He didn't want it yesterday, so he had wet food and some fish I cooked him. Then this morning I gave him the lower carb dry food because I didn't want to change him too fast. So he ate it and then about twenty minutes later he threw it all back up. :( So I just gave him wet food and his tummy has been good all day.

That probably has a lot to do with the numbers he has then.
I am going to test him again soon (he and his brother want more food now.)
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The change from dry food to a low carb wet food can make a BIG difference with some kitties. There have been a couple of people whose kitties went off insulin within less than 2 weeks by dropping dry food. This may not happen the same with Henry, but with that low number this morning it is possible. A couple more tests during the day will give a good picture how well Henry handles eating without insulin on board.
 
Henry's human said:
I did change his diet. I was wanting to do it slowly but I realised today that it was the dry food making him vomit. He didn't want it yesterday, so he had wet food and some fish I cooked him. Then this morning I gave him the lower carb dry food because I want to change him too fast. So he ate it and then about twenty minutes later he threw it all back up. :( So I just gave him wet food and his tummy has been good all day.

That probably has a lot to do with the numbers he has then.
I am going to test him again soon (he and his brother want more food now.)
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Yes, a switch to wet food can definitely contribute to lower numbers... This is good but please be very careful as the dose of insulin prescribed may be too high if the diet has changed in this way. Ideally you should transition over to wet food gradually, but as you have already done so you need to be particularly vigilant about BGs. If at your next test Henry is lower than at his last test, you may like to give him a small amount of dry food mixed in with the wet in an attempt to stop him dropping too low... This is a trial and error situation so you do need to stay on top of things. Please keep us informed and post again if you are concerned about anything.

Diana
 
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Yes, diet can make a huge difference! Some lucky cats even go into remission after the diet change and no longer need insulin, so it's great that you took that step. If he's handling the wet food (what kind are you feeding?) ok, you can just ditch the dry. Bandit always vomited up his dry food, too, way back when he was on the Hills Prescription food. He hasn't had dry food in about 8 years and is doing great. :-)

4 years is a little young for a cat to be diabetic--was Henry on any steroids before or when he was diagnosed with diabetes? Or did he have an infection of any kind?
 
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