Need advice Low numbers

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TheresaJ860

TheresaJ860

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Hi Everyone,

I've been away from the boards, had a death in the family and went out of state. Left Christian in the hands of my DH, who does not test. :roll: Managed to come home a few evenings and tested, numbers were in 300's. He has been doing well, acting normal, even more back to himself.

Hurricane stress did not seem to phase him, or his numbers yesterday. ............. However, there are some concerns today.
confused_cat

1. He is not eating as much as he has been, though he is in love with his dehydrated chicken treats and doesn't shut up when he wants them, which of course means he will be tested.

2. Todays numbers are freaking me out!
Last night PMPS=400
Today AMPS=319
+4= 75, retested =69
Fed him, ate a small amount, waited 50 minutes
+5=69
Fed him some new (not cold) food, (tested myself, meter is working fine)
+5.5= 97

3. Prior to today, his lowest number in a day has been 189, once, he usualy is in the between 274 and 346 at lowest numbers.
I think (this is actually a question) he is doing well on the insulin, and may just be adjusting.
**** However, I've read and read so much from all of you wonderful cat lovers, and I know that hypo is a huge deal.
Do his numbers cause any of you concern? (I'm trying not to be an alarmist.)

I will be testing him even more than usual today because of the low numbers, my DH has been working on excell keeping track of his numbers, and when he has a few moments, I will ask him to figure out how to post them to my signature so you can reference the entire testing spectrum.

Thank you all for your help, I missed you while I was away!
Theresa and Christian
 
Theresa,
Welcome back! Sorry to hear about the loss in your family.
I can understand your concern today, anytime kitty drops into the double digits (which is exactly what we hope for) it is alarming, especially when used to 200s and 300s. Christian is still on 1u BID, right?
You did well today, seeing that low number at +4, and you averted anything lower be feeding a couple times. Nice job! The steeper drop might have been caused by not eating enough this morning if he didn't eat well. Or it could be that his body didn't freak out when his BG dropped that far (which is a good thing). Sometimes their liver will react to a drop and dump glucose into the system. It's an internal "life preserver" thing sometimes referred to as "liver panic".

If possible, try to test him around +10 or +11 this evening so that you can be sure his number is rising towards PMPS. Pretty sure it will be. Depending on what he gives you at PMPS, perhaps a small decrease in dosage might be indicated. No, you aren't being an alarmist. Like a good bean, you are concerned for his health and safety, that's all. Kudos to DH for managing while you were away. Now all you need to do is convince him that he can hometest too!

What time will Christians PMPS be tonight?

Carl in SC
 
You did a great job catching the lowish numbers and feeding them. The numbers were not alarmingly low and are actually what you would see in a non-diabetic cat or one that is diet controlled. So, in this case there are a couple of possibilities. Do you think that he is eating less because he is becoming better controlled or because he isn't well for some reason? If he has been ravenously hungry b/c he wasn't well controlled and has now decreased to more like what he ate b4 diabetes, then this is good. If he has an upset tummy and is not eating, its a bit more of a worry. The lower numbers could mean that his pancreas is feeling better b/c of the help it has had with injected insulin and is starting to produce again. Or they could be from less food taken in. If he is eating several small portions a day and seems otherwise ok, then I would suggest testing b4 his next shot and posting for advice about dose (giving type of insulin and previous dose). If he is getting ready to drop his needs for insulin, then you will want to get some guidance with that process.
 
Thank you Carl and Just as Appy!
He recv'd his dose late this am, *sigh* I overslept from no sleep Sat. night. So I tested, fed and shot at 1020 this am. He had been moved back in 15 min increments to 0930.
I will be getting + numbers every hour today, I really want to see what he is doing, I'm about to do the +6. I'll post it.

Thank you both for the encouragement. He used to eat when he felt like it, here and there, but that was dry food out all day. Before his dx, I saw that ravenous hunger increasing. First I thought it was his "get back" to the dog who was always trying to eat his food, when he started eating her food, and I mean gobble it up. It was when I changed his location to eat so she couldn't get his food I realized he would gobble/inhale his wet food, move her and eat her food, and was always asking for more more more!!!!!

So maybe he is just back to his pre-dx feeding schedule, he really seems annoyed that I make him come in from outside to eat, he'll take a few bites, and want to go back out. (He is now inside sleeping, in his, I'm the King Cat, I own the coffee table position,) So I don't think he has a tummy ache.

I have noticed that when he was ravenous, he could care less if the food was refrigerated, (he use to complain loudly!) So maybe he is back to his, listen slave, I said no cold food catitude, LOL.

Yes he is still on 1u bid Prozinc, I have read not to shoot if he is 200 or less.

Thank you so much, will post his +6 soon.

((((hugs)))) Thank you so much!
 
OK, no more food till PMPS time. I wanna see that number before saying anything about a dose. Tey to quantify how much and when he ate since that 79 early today.
I know he got treats around +8 I think. What kind of treats were those?
Carl
 
Theresa,
Do your syringes have 1/2 unit markings?
Carl
 
Lori,
Decrease. 1u seems to be dropping too much too soon. But not a lot of data to go on until DH gets that SS up and running. I was thinking .75 if she can eyeball it.

Carl
 
Just so everyone is on the same page and can see clearly....

pmps 400 1u
amps 319 1u
+4 75, 69
+5 69
+5.5 97
+6 202
+8 399

Did you treat this alleged 'low' number with H/C treats?
I really think it was a nice number...not too low...a little sudden and certainly worthy of a snack.
 
+4= 75, retested =69
Fed him, ate a small amount, waited 50 minutes
+5=69
Fed him some new (not cold) food, (tested myself, meter is working fine)
+5.5= 97
Click to expand...

She fed the low, but don't know quantity. Also treats at +8
Fairly early nadir, not sure what "normal" is as far as timing.
Carl
 
a 250 point drop in 4 hours is not what we aim for of course...and I agree Carl, .75 or even a skinny u would be ok.
alot depends of if she carbed him up.
 
Alternative scenerio...
1u isn't enough, and the nadir is +4 and she's not getting 12 hours out of the dose.
Caarl
 
Or the "treats" were HC...or for him this is a bounce cuz I think she said this is the first time he got this low...
In any case...not ready for an upper yet unless she is home to monitor him I don't think.
And if there were no HC treats and this is indeed a bounce...then he may be a bit insulin sensitive (of course for no rational reason) so I think .75 or skinny is a good idea.
No Increase tho'
Right Carl....I mean she could do 1u if she is home to monitor but no increase.
 
Hi, thanks for the posts, not sure why the notiification just arrived?

PMPS=460

He was outside so don't think he ate anything besides the treats, which is 100% dehydrated Chicken. He did have 4 wellness wild craving treats when he was 69.

He didn't even eat when I brought him in, well, I coached him inside at almost 8PM, with the chicken treats. He doesn't get to many.

I did his PMPS, fed him a small amount and shot his 1u dose @ 10:28 PM.

I don't have the 1/2 marks on my syringes, since I bought the 40 unit syringes. But I do have medical training, and can gauge a 1/2 mark if need be.

I watered down his evening wet food, to be left all night, but the fact is, he hasn't really been eating much during the night. As previously posted, he seems to be back to his, I'll eat when I feel like it old self.

I'm just surprised by the way his numbers are all over the place.

Lori you said that you liked his numbers earlier, and I read in another thread that going to double digits is scary, trust me, I'm not one to give him a chance to go hypo, if I have to stay awake to test him tonight, I will. I'm looking at him right now, all comfy sleeping, and here I am worried he is adorable. Even went back to being his old self this evening, sleeping with the drooler on my lap.

Is it more likely he is just getting better? He sure does seem to be more like himself.

Thank you so much, sorry my internet is so slow, I would have recv'd the notifications earlier, but I'm in a hurricane affected area, and am sure that things are still slow.
 
I am home to monitor! Just saw the other posts Lori and Carl, I'm willing to do whatever he needs.
Should I not have given him the 1u?
Thank you so much!
 
I think the 1u is ok...really.
and don't let double digits scare you ok...they are not the enemy!
try to get a +2 or so to see if he is dropping fast. maybe a +4?
where in the country are you?
 
Theresa,
We were just going to maybe suggest a slightly lower dose, as you probably just read the discussion. No worries. You are there to monitor, so that is a good thing, just in case. I'm not expecting problems, and like Lori said above, the 79 wasn't critically low. What you can do is test him in 2 or 3 hours and see what you get. Don't panic, and if you see anything that is alarming to you, just post here and someone is going to be here to help if need be.
Just as a precaution, do you have a "hypo kit"? The best thing to have on hand for low BG is some sort of "junk food" canned food. Something now low carb, like with gravy or something. That is better than karo or honey because it stays in the system longer. You still want syrup in an emergency too. But gravy style food is good to have on hand.
Carl
 
Hi Carl,

Well I thought I was prepared with a hypo kit, I saved some of his HC dry food, and have the karo syrup, but no, I don't have any gravy food, except the dogs, and I do know the Christian LOVES her occassional gravy food. We have worked hard to keep their foods seperate since finding this board, she eats with supervision usually when he is out doors, or out of sight so he won't eat her food.
Tomorrow I will go get some junk food, OH, I do have greenies treats for cats left, the dog likes them, do they count? Christian likes them a lot, but have kept them from him since dx.

What is the double digit number we hope for?
I was afraid that the stress of me not being here for a while, was causing his higher numbers, I wasn't anticipating sudden drops in numbers. Besides, I'm home again, and he doesn't seem to have been phased by my absense!
Thank you so much!


carlinsc said:
Theresa,
We were just going to maybe suggest a slightly lower dose, as you probably just read the discussion. No worries. You are there to monitor, so that is a good thing, just in case. I'm not expecting problems, and like Lori said above, the 79 wasn't critically low. What you can do is test him in 2 or 3 hours and see what you get. Don't panic, and if you see anything that is alarming to you, just post here and someone is going to be here to help if need be.
Just as a precaution, do you have a "hypo kit"? The best thing to have on hand for low BG is some sort of "junk food" canned food. Something now low carb, like with gravy or something. That is better than karo or honey because it stays in the system longer. You still want syrup in an emergency too. But gravy style food is good to have on hand.
Carl
Click to expand...
 
The HC dry will work ok, especially if he still loves it. You can also pour some gravy over that to make it doubley junky!
As far as numbers.... ECID of course, but a lot of people draw the line at 50. Below that is not good usually. 70s and 80s? They make people nervous certainly, especially when 200 is the norm they see. I would have gotten nervous if I were in your shoes.
And yes, he certainly was fazed by your not being around. However, he's a cat. There's no way he's going to let a mere human know that. :smile:

Carl
 
Thank you Carl!

LOL, he is indeed quite the cat, I think he missed the treats with testing! I am still amazed that he tests so easily, I would never have thought he would stand for it!

Thank you so much, 25 minutes to +2
 
Ya know...I don't think it's so much the number as it is where in the cycle the number appears.
So, if your +10 is a 60, well, not the most desirable circumstance but he is likely over the hump with pzi and on his way back up.
I would'nt treat that with anything more than low carb.

Now if it was +3 and he was 60....now you got yourself a possible hypo on the make. low carb, just a little and test. about every 20 minutes. you may have to step up the carbs. if the number goes to 50 or lower before +6...you may want to break out the high carb.
I don't like using the sugary stuff unless you are in trouble. Cause it just throws off the whole cycle.

So where you are is more important than what you are :lol:
 
Don't get me wrong Teresa, it's a fast drop....but I've seen much much faster.
 
+3=276

I have to go to sleep, it's been a while since I had consecutive nights of good sleep. I hope he is ok in the night, and I can't thank you enough to be here to help Christian and I!
 
Theresa, this is a perfect example of drop like a rock hypo alert! It's going on this morning. It's good to be prepared for this.
And THIS is the kind of thing you don't want to see....a mere visit to the 60's....very doable.

viewtopic.php?f=28&t=51157
 
Thank you Lori,

Yes, just read the thread, scary! I think I gave Christian a fur shot this morning, *sighs* he lunged forward, fur was all wet. His +11=445, AMPS=411, +2.5=422.

This is quite the roller coaster for the mommy!

Thank you for all your help!
 
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