My white fur ball Bello really needs help

Status
Not open for further replies.
M

MaryJaneSS

Member Since 2013
Hello everyone,

I've been browsing this forum for two days now and I hope that someone will be able to help me and my furry white ball Bello. First of all, I would like to tell you that I'm writing from Macedonia where I believe no one is fairly familiar with feline diabetes and its treatment, so I'm really hoping and I'm grateful for any advice from anyone.

Bello is a 5 year old male who's always been for the kibble food and not anything else in spite we offered all sorts of food. Because of that kind of diet, he always drank more water than his furry friends. But, for the past month or so, he started eating everything, triple the dose he used to and in spite it, started loosing weight. Along with it, he started heavily drinking water and using the litter box. We took him to the vet on the 16th of November and all the parameters in the initial blood test results were off the charts (he wasn't tested for BG level at the time). The vet immediately started him on antibiotics and vitamins and he was injected everyday until the Wednesday. On Wednesday the vet made additional blood test for BG level since his condition was worsening. He was diagnosed this Friday (on the 22nd of November) with extremely high BG level of 468. From this Saturday the vet put him on 0.25 milligrams of Amaryl (oral pills) once a day since she was afraid that starting him immediately on insulin would cause a shock to his body. Yesterday I bought a glucometer in order to home test him but couldn't get enough blood. After carefully reading other's posts and advice here, I learned to warm his ears and managed to get enough blood for the test. The results were the same in spite the fact that he is for three days on Amaryl. Additionally, as of the Wednesday he started refusing to eat but still ate a bit. As of yesterday he refuses to eat anything and we started force feeding him low-carb can food mixed with low-fat yogurt. He doesn't like it, but I know he has to eat because of the pills. He continues to drink water and use the litter box, but not as much as before and sleeps all the time.

We are going off to the vet again now and see what will the future steps be.

Please if anyone can give me any advice, me and Bello will be more than grateful.

Thank you
 
Welcome to the forum. I hope we can help. It is wonderful that you are testing at home and it gives you options to help Bello immediately.

No, pills don't work. They tend to tax the pancreas rather than help it heal. What insulin choices are available to you? It would be good to get a mild, long lasting insulin. Humulin, Canninsulin, N are not great choices. Lantus and Levemir should be available as they are human insulins. ProZinc is another good choice if available.

We can help with ideas to get him to eat wet food, which will bring down his blood glucose levels. Do you have any American brands available like Fancy Feast or Friskies? If not, what brands of wet? Would you be able to order catfood over the internet?
 
Sue and Oliver (GA) said:
Welcome to the forum. I hope we can help. It is wonderful that you are testing at home and it gives you options to help Bello immediately.

No, pills don't work. They tend to tax the pancreas rather than help it heal. What insulin choices are available to you? It would be good to get a mild, long lasting insulin. Humulin, Canninsulin, N are not great choices. Lantus and Levemir should be available as they are human insulins. ProZinc is another good choice if available.

We can help with ideas to get him to eat wet food, which will bring down his blood glucose levels. Do you have any American brands available like Fancy Feast or Friskies? If not, what brands of wet? Would you be able to order catfood over the internet?
Click to expand...

Well, back from the vet and they increased Bello's dose from once a day to two times a day until tomorrow evening and see how it works. Out of all the insulin choices you mentioned, at the pharmacies I could only find Lantus human insulin, but I don't know why the vet is afraid to administer it to him. The other problem with insulin in our country is that it is only given to diabetic persons and it only goes on prescription. The other thing I believe the vet has a problem with is the proper dosage i.e. they have never previously treated a diabetic cat and are going on the safe side with the pills.

As for the American brands of cat food, we don't have Fancy Feast (which as I read from the other, cats especially prefer) but we do have Friskies, Royal Canine, Whiskers and some other brands. We will start searching the options for ordering over the internet immediately.

By the way, after the visit to the vet (they gave him some vitamins and NaCl fluids), when we got home he was asking to eat by himself and ate a whole pack (85 gr.) of Royal Canine 'wet food :RAHCAT

Being able to share experiences and have valuable advice regarding Bello's condition is undoubtedly the highlight of my day :smile:

Thank you from the bottom of my heart
 
I hope I can make it even better: on this page, read the starred topics at the topic. They will give you and your vet lots of info about how to use Lantus in cats.

http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewforum.php?f=9

Here is vet study on using Lantus with cats that you can give your vet:

http://www.felinediabetes.com/Roomp_Rand_2008 dosing_testing protocol.pdf

Friskies pates are great for diabetics. Don't get the gravy ones - just the pates.

If I were you, I'd start feeding the Friskies pates and check his numbers carefully - before each shot and midcycle. You might see a big reduction in the numbers. Send the documents to your vet (maybe start with the vet study first?)

To get him to eat wet, try sprinkling Parmesan cheese or tuna pieces or tiny pieces of dry on top. You might warm it up until it is nice and stinky. Add a little warm water to it and make a gravy. This vet has great ideas for transitioning cats from wet to dry.

www.catinfo.org

Keep asking questions. We'd love to help you help Bello.
 
Hello.

Here is a list of friskies varieties that are good for diabetics. The first number is the carb %. The second number is a phosphorus value ... you don't need to worry about that right now.
8% - Friskies flaked with tuna and egg 415
9% - Friskies Poultry platter – 438
5% - Friskies Special diet Beef and Liver entree 241
5% - Friskies Special diet Turkey and Giblets dinner pate 189
5% - Friskies Special diet Beef and Chicken Entree pate 242
4% - Friskies Special Diet Whitefish dinner 351
7% - Friskies Special Diet with Salmon 228
7% - Friskies Salmon dinner classic pate 499
8% - Friskies Turkey and Giblets dinner 338
8% - Friskies Supreme Supper 416
6% - Friskies Mariner's Catch 393
Click to expand...

You might want to ask your vet if he would give you the prescription for Lantus.
We can help you here with dosing and answer all your questions. Your vet can learn with you if he's willing.
You would start the dose low and work your way up.
There are many receiving help here who have vets that don't know lantus very well. ( And some think they do when they don't)
Please join us. We love to help others, paying it forward for getting help when we were first learning. :-D
 
Thank you all for making this "dance" as you call it a lot easier for us :smile:
Regarding the prescription, the problem here is that the health care system only provides Lantus (and maybe other insulin types) for humans and there is no other way you can get it but from a diabetic person that already receives it (which is no long term solution). The vets can't write prescriptions for insulin and for other medications for that matter for animals. There is only one pharmacy that sells it without prescription for about 17 dollars for a vile of 3 milligrams, but I will have to go through the links Sue and Oliver posted first to look for the right dosage, even if my vet doesn't want to.

As for the friskies varieties that are good for diabetics, thank you so much, I will look for them and start feeding Bello immediately.

Thank you all once again for the time and effort to help us.
 
Welcome Mary Jane and Bello

I am so glad you are here because all the experienced people can help you. I can offer advice on transitioning to wet food from dry. It is a slow process but what I found worked best is appealing to your cat's thirst. If given a choice, a cat will usually choose very watered down (like soup or applesauce) pate food over a water bowl (I found anyway). Mix the water in well and put it next to the water bowl. If Bello starts drinking the food, that consumption will also curb his hunger. I was able to completely remove the dry food when I found my sugarcat cleaning the bowl of the very wet canned food. That's my experience. I have worked this trick successfully on six cats and three kittens. It is only a suggestion but I wish you the same success. Getting your Bello off the dry food will make him healthier.

We are here for you an Bello.
 
The starting dose for Lantus is based on lean weight, which is the lower of either current weight or ideal weight, in kilograms.
Multiply the lower number by 0.25.
Round down to the nearest quarter unit. (Syringes only measure down to 0.5 units, so you have to eyeball quarter units)

Ex:
11 lb cat at ideal weight
5 kg * 0.25 = 1.25 starting dose
 
My cat simply can't resist wet food if it has a little cooked shredded chicken, or freeze dried chicken crumbled on top. So even when he thinks he doesn't want his wet food, I can add that chicken, and he will lick the bowl clean. And like RobinCot, I add enough water to make it the consistency of applesauce. Eventually my cat didn't want any dry food anymore. I hope you find something that works!
 
MaryJaneSS said:
The other problem with insulin in our country is that it is only given to diabetic persons and it only goes on prescription. The other thing I believe the vet has a problem with is the proper dosage i.e. they have never previously treated a diabetic cat and are going on the safe side with the pills.
Click to expand...

In the US, vets can write prescriptions for insulins that need to be purchased through a pharmacy. Check with the pharmacy and see if they accept prescriptions from vets. If they do, ask your vet for a script for the Lantus Solostar pens instead of a vial. Ther are 5 pens in a package. The initial cost is more than a vial, but since it is packaged in smaller containers, you will have enough insulin to last almost a year. With the vial, the insulin becomes ineffective long before you can use it all up. So you end up throwing a lot of it away. Since each pen is a smaller container, you probably will be able to use almost every drop

Starting dose should be 1 unit. Also, consider learning how to hometest. This means using a glucose meter to test your cats blood glucose levels before every shot. We can help you learn how to do it. By testing before every shot, you will know if it is safe to give the insulin dose. You will also learn how to determine if you need to modify the dose. All you need is a human glucose meter, test strips and lancets. You can use almost any brand meter, however, since I do not know which brands are available to you, you may want to let us know what brands you can buy. We can then recommend a good one for you.
 
Hi everyone,

Since last night and during the night Bello started eating on his own, it is wet food and he doesn't seem to mind :smile: He is very hungry and thirsty after last night's visit to the vet, he continues to drink a lot of water and use the litter box a lot. Nonetheless, I'm happy at least he's eating and I don't have to cat burrito him to syringe feed him. I will have to visit the pharmacy that sells the Lantus and ask if they have pens instead of a vial and discuss the dosage with my vet.

As for the home testing, I bought a glucometer two days ago and with the help of other people's experience and advice from this forum, I learned and I am home testing him to determine his BG levels.

There is another thing I would like to ask you. For the past 5 years Bello lived with his brother (I found them both wrapped in a plastic bag and dumped in a dumpster five years ago, they were just born with their umbilical cords still attached to them :cry: ) and another female I adopted 3 years ago. Two months ago I found a brother and sister kittens and I brought them home in order to give them for an adoption (no luck in that yet). I don't know if this was a good idea since my 3 cats started acting weird and seemed to hate the little guys. They still are having trouble adjusting to them but we're doing our best. Now the vet thinks that this change (two more family members) is what triggered high BG levels with Bello, because the excessive drinking and eating started after that point. I don't know if this is true, but Bello has always been more of a quiet guy that kept to him self, and now he's always sleeping somewhere on a higher level or in the bathroom where the little guys can't reach him and disturb him.

Anyway, if anyone had similar experience I would like to exchange opinions because otherwise I'm really thinking of giving them up just to establish the previous peace for Bello's sake if this is true.

Thank you all, it means a great deal to me.
 
True, adding a new cat or two to the family will raise stress for a while.

But - what were you feeding then?

How you did the introductions may affect how well they integrate, too.
 
Stress does contribute but it's generally more diet related as to what causes diabetes. It would take a lot of stress , like being caged kind of stress.
Teeth issues, steroid medications, infections, are more likely to bring it on.
And sometimes it's just genetics.

The kidneys are the weakest in cats.

Good luck finding a way to get Lantus.
 
At the time they were eating as they usually did: at morning I gave them canned food and the dry food was always there in a dispenser so everyone could eat whenever they wanted. And they never ate much at a time, but more often small amounts. Bello was always for the dry food and his brother and female friend were eating more canned food (occasionally dry food). As for the introduction, at first the kittens were isolated, I didn't want my 3 fellas to catch anything from them. After we made the regular check ups and everything was fine, the introduction was gradual, I would take the kittens out of their room to the living area, they would smell the kittens passing by, hissing and running away, after which I would take the kittens to their room and so on, increasing the time they spent together for about 3-4 weeks when I started letting the kittens run free around the apartment. But because they are young and playful (about 4 months old now) they are always bothering the big guys which they still really hate.

Up until now, Bello never had any health problems and was never under any kind of medication; they are home cats, they never go out. Today his BG level dropped to 360 which I'm really happy for (although I know it's still high but it's not 468) and as for the Lantus, it only comes in vials and I'll have to buy it that way, there's no other way. But could it be that the pills are really working? The vet keeps telling me that and she's satisfied that the BG is dropping slowly, not rapidly.

Hope everything turns out OK. We're taking baby steps and learning to live with it. You've been tremendous help and support for me and Bello.
 
Food changes can take a few days to see a difference in blood glucose but it could already be kicking in, I am glad you are home testing!

Vials of lantus are fine. They keep up to six months in the fridge so one vial should last you a while. Sooner the better because the pills stress the pancreas to make more insulin, which just makes the problem worse..

Wendy
 
How big are the vials you are talking about? Cause the ones that I can get are 3 milliliters each and I don't know how long will they last.

Thanks Wendy
 
Lantus is a U-100 insulin.
This means there are 100 units in 1 mL.
So, a 3 mL cartridge has 300 units in it.
At a dose of 1 unit twice a day, you have 150 days of doses.
At a dose of 2 units twice a day, you have 75 days of doses.

A 10 mL vial has 1,000 units in it.
If stored on a stationary shelf in the refrigerator, it lasts about 6 months.
After roughly 6 months, it becomes less effective and you may need to increase the dose from that vial to get good control. (If you do that, you have to drop the dose when you get a new vial or risk a hypoglycemic episode!)
 
BJM thank you so much for clearing things out for me with the metrics and the dosage (I had a bit trouble with the US metrics, I was using converters but wasn't sure I was right). This means a great deal for me and especially for my Bello :) Now the only thing left for us to do is to find a pen to administer that kind of small dosages (believe it or not the pharmacies don't sell them). Today Bello's BG level went through the roof - 530!!! and got me scared to death. After the pill it dropped to 500 but I'm still going nuts about it. Later we're doing another check up and see how things are going. The vet still ensures me that everything will get better (from today he's on 3 times a day pill therapy) but if nothing changes tomorrow, should I administer my self if I find the pen?

I'm also looking for other medical opinions tomorrow. This really is an awful emotional roller coaster. I hope everything turns out fine. :cry:
 
I don't have any advice-I will leave it to the more experienced. This board is great and I am welcome you!
You and Bello are in good hands here!
Take a deep breath and heres a hug.... :YMHUG:
 
Yes we stopped the dry food since Saturday, he now eats only wet food and home cooked poultry and fish. After yesterday's episode with the BG level and again today with over 560, and all your advice that we should start as soon as possible with insulin, as any good mother today I went for a second opinion to another vet. Not only did he have Levemir in a pen and he immediately administered it to Bello, but he also said that the therapy prescribed by the other vet eventually would have killed him (as all of you here pointed out that pills don't work)!!!!! Can you imagine what went through my mind?

Anyway, we're happy that from today Bello is in good hands, the new vet started him off with 2 units to slowly decrease the BG level and he will continue to provide us with Levemir in the future :) Almost an hour after the Levemir shot I tested him again and his BG was over 600 (the glucometer doesn't measure any higher values only showed HI?) but I think it's from all the stress of going to the vet??? I'll continue to monitor him to make sure everything is fine.

If it wasn't for all your advice here and opening my eyes about the appropriate way of treating diabetes, I would have continued listening the other vet and in the end kill my baby.

I don't know how to thank you all for your generous support...Here's a giant hug to you all :YMHUG:
 
In addition to the link to the protocol that one of the others provided, you may want to share this journal article with your vet. It describes the research behind the dosing protocol that's used with Lantus (glargine).


The information in the article applies to both Lantus and Levemir. The same protocol is used for both types of insulin since they are both long-acting, depot types of insulin. If you've not already purchased syringes, you will need U100 insulin syringes that are in half unit markings.

There is a great deal of information about Lantus/Lev in the starred, sticky notes on the Lantus board.
  • Tight Regulation Protocol: This sticky contains the dosing protocol that we use here. There are also links to the more formal version -- the “Tilly” Protocol developed by the counterpart of this group in Germany, which was also published by Kirsten Roomp & Jacqui Rand, DVM in one of the top vet journals.
  • New to the Group: Everything you wanted to know about this forum and more. Info on our slang, FAQs, links to sites on feline nutrition and to food charts containing carb counts, how to do a curve and the components to look for, important aspects of diabetes such as ketones, DKA, and neuropathy, and most important, info on hypoglycemia.
  • Handling Lantus: how to get the maximum use from your insulin and what to not do with it!
  • Lantus depot: This is an important concept for understanding how Lantus works.
  • Lantus & Levemir: Shooting & Handling Low Numbers: What data you need in order to be able to work toward remission or tight regulation as well as information if you have a low pre-shot number or a drop into low numbers during the cycle.
Now that you've started giving Bello insulin, you may want to set up a spreadsheet (SS) so you can track his progress. In the link to the spreadsheet template, you'll notice there's a "World" template. The world version will convert units from mmol/L into the format used in the US (mg/dL).
 

Attachments

Thats great news. Sienne provided a lot of useful links for you to read. That will help a lot.

I usually recommend 3-4 tests a day

- always before the shot - this is mandatory as you don't want to shoot when too low. As a newbie this too low number is 200 but is reduced over time once you have the data to know if its safe.
- mid cycle - 5-8 hours after morning shot depending on your schedule. This is to see how low he is going. The low point "nadir" is what you base dose changes on since you don't want him dropping too low (under 50).
- before bed (2-3hours after Pm shot) to get an idea of what his overnight plans are. If this number is less than the pre shot test number you may want to set the alarm for a test a few hours later as this implies an active cycle.
 
Well, yesterday we had a near hypoglycemia episode. He took his shot at 12:30 pm (he's taking one 2 units shot per day, this was his second) and when I tested him 5 hours later his BG was 115 (pre-shot was 500). It took me by surprise because it got drastically low so in half an hour I tested him again and it was 95. I started getting worried and in 15 minutes when I saw BG of 90 I started panicking (since from all I've read so far he was dropping to fast to low). And what most worried me he didn't show the typical signs of hypoglycemia, he was sleeping as he usually does and when I started testing him I noticed he wasn't very responsive. I called the vet and as he suggested I gave him water and sugar (1 syringe - 6 ml) and dry food. In 15 minutes he was 110, but after 15 more minutes he stayed at 110 so I gave him another dose of water and sugar and dry food. After half an hour he was 135, and after an hour 280. After 2 hours he was 580 and through the night went over 600!!! I went crazy during this night, but this morning he's 370 and I'm starting to calm down. I don't know what this drastic changes did to him, but he seems fine now. He's eating and drinking water as usual, but he hasn't been in the litter box for a poop in 2 days (this is day 3), probably from the change in diet?

I know this can happen when starting with the insulin until we find the right dose but what if I wasn't home? I'm between jobs this period and I'm with him all the time, not leaving the apartment for more than 2 hours. I hope soon we'll have the BG under control and predictable cause I don't know what I'm gonna do when I start a new job.

Anyway, you've been of tremendous help for me and Bello, I'm glad I have you to understand the rough roads we're going through.
 
For the future I would not have give any sugar with a BG of 90 after 5 or 6 hours. That is really the desired low point. As you later saw, the BG went sky high later. However, we all here just learn by what we do so do not feel bad at all.
Just keep monitoring the BG before and in between shots. Based on the large drop y go one Levemir, you may have to reduce the dose as the levemir builds up in her system
 
Don't feel bad... there is a lot to learn ... it's a steep learning curve in the beginning.
The 90 was actually a fantastic number to get. His bg going high afterwards was partially due to you giving sugar but even more likely a bounce.
His body reacts to a lower bg than he is currently used to with counterregulatory hormones.
Each cat is different, but generally it's a number below 40 that you start approaching hypo numbers/responses.

It would be helpful for us and for you if you could start a spreadsheet for him how to get a spreadsheet
Now that you have started, you are learning his individual pattern and how he responds to the insulin.

Eventually you will be trying to get lower than that 90. It depends on what your goal is..... regulation numbers ( under 200 all the time) or
if you hope for remission. (numbers stay between 50-120) There is a start low, go slow method or a tight regulation option and we will teach you more about that as we proceed.
 
I understand why you got worried. Given he only started levemir on Thursday you should watch closely. He gets a dose reduction if he goes under 50. Remember to not shoot for now if he is under 200.

In future if you do need to bring him up you don't want to give dry food - it takes too long to bring them up and lasts too long in their systems once they do come up. Mix a drop of syrup or honey with a teaspoon of low carb wet food and test in 30 minutes.

Print this off, read it and stick it to your fridge http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=15887

Wendy
 
Since you're home testing, here are some glucose reference ranges used for decision making using glucometers. Human glucometer numbers are given first. Numbers in parentheses are for non-US meters. Numbers in curly braces are estimates for an AlphaTrak.

< 40 mg/dL (2.2 mmol/L) {< 70 mg/dL for an AlphaTrak}
- Treat as if HYPO if on insulin
- At nadir (lowest point between shots) in a long term diabetic (more than a year), may earn a reduction.

< 50 mg/dL (2.8 mmol/L) {< 80 mg/dL for an AlphaTrak}
- If before nadir, steer with food, ie, give modest amounts of medium carb food to keep from going below 50 (2.8).
- At nadir, often indicates dose reduction is earned.

50 - 130 mg/dL (2.8 - 7.2 mmol/L) {80 - 160 mg/dL for an AlphaTrak}
- On insulin - great control when following a tight regulation protocol.
- Off insulin - normal numbers. (May even go as low as the upper 30s (1.7 mmol/L){60s for an AlphaTrak}; if not on insulin, this can be safe.

= 150 mg/dL (8.3 mmol/L) {> 180 mg/dL for an AlphaTrak}
- no shot limit for ProZinc, PZI, or other non-depot insulins

> 150 mg/dL (8.3 mmol/L) {> 180 mg/dL for an AlphaTrak}
- At nadir, indicates a dose increase may be needed when following a tight regulation protocol.

200 mg/dL (11.1 mmol/L) {230 mg/dL for an AlphaTrak}
- no shot level for beginners; may slowly reduce to 150 mg/dL (8.3 mmol/L) {180 mg/dL} for long-acting insulins (Lantus, Levemir, and ProZinc) as data collection shows it is safe

180 - 280 mg/dL (10 - 15.6 mmol/L) {may be 210 - 310 mg/dL for an AlphaTrak}- Any time - The renal threshold (depending on data source and cat's renal function) where glucose spills into the urine.
- Test for ketones, glucose is too high.

>= 280 mg/dL (15.6 mmol/L) {may be >=310 mg/dL for an AlphaTrak}, if for most of the cycle between shots
- Uncontrolled diabetes and thus at risk for diabetic ketoacidosis and hepatic lipidosis
- Follow your insulin protocol for dose adjustments
- Test for ketones; if more than a trace level of ketones, go to vet ASAP.
 
We seem to be doing fine now. His BG is getting stabilized except for yesterday when at one point it went 530 cause we didn't gave him his morning shot in order to establish a regular 12 hour cycle (till Saturday he was receiving one 2U dose per day, and we didn't give him yesterday morning one to start giving it in regular intervals - 8 am and 8 pm). I attached his SS (since I can't seem to get it in my signature, and some of the numbers don't convert, contacted the tech support about it) and would appreciate any opinions.

Now, is it normal for him to eat every 3-4 hours? Should I also get his food on regular cycle i.e. eating pre-shot at morning once and again in the evening or he should eat whenever he chooses?

He's coming back to normal, playing with rubber bands and hanging out with his friends :)

Thanks
 

Attachments

Looks like a good start.
I will send someone a pm to see if they can't come help with ss. We prefer you to have the same one.... it's like a language every one understands best here.
:-D

Yes. Frequent meals are good for them. Much better than twice a day....
You will want to time the meals with the shots . The one time you need to take food away is at least the 2 hours before shot time.
Food can influence the bg and you want to know what their bg is at shot time without that food influence.
If you can space it even more, the better.
I always gave food at shot time.... and at +3 or +4 and then again at +7 or +8 and then no food until next shot time.


Good that Bello is playing....
I hope they aren't small rubber bands. Those can be dangerous.
Because of cat tongues, small items like that can get caught on the barbs on their tongue and they might swallow it. Once something get's caught like that
they might not have a choice but to swallow it.
Dental floss is equally dangerous.
We had one here who swallowed dental floss and it was a costly surgery for removal as well as dangerous for the cat.
I no longer allow rubber bands in my house. And I'm trying to train my husband to not put dental floss in the trash.
 
If I am looking at your sheet right, I am thinking we might need to keep a close eye on this dose. Given you skipped yesterday morning and he still dropped to 104 at night and again today his dose may be a little high.

Can you get a +2 or +3? I am wondering if he is dropping lower earlier in the cycle. Those 104s may not be the lowest he is going.

Wendy
 
Well, I couldn't get +2 or +3, but here's +5 and it's 94. After the shot he ate a small amount of chicken, maybe that's why he's dropping so low. Is this good or bad? I also didn't give him yesterday's pm shot - BG was 155 I was afraid it was too low.
 
I am wondering about a dose reduction so you can shoot twice a day at least for now. Dyana - what do you think about 0.75?

Wendy
 
I can't give him smaller dose cause I'm using FlexPen and it doesn't have smaller doses than 1 unit. Yesterday, again I didn't give him pm shot although BG was 234, I thought the shot would drop the BG too low. Am I doing the right thing with once a day 1 unit shot? He seems to be doing great, when he's sleeping he's sleeping but otherwise he's playful like he hasn't been in a long time. I wonder how long did he have this problem?
 
As a finagle, if you can't lower the dose because you're using the pen, you can tweak the carb level a smidge higher to keep him from going too low. You would do this primarily because waiting for him to go low and intervening with very high carb food or syrup requires being there to monitor him.
 
I know with the lantus pens that everyone gets syringes and use the pen like a vial for those smaller doses that aren't whole units.
I don't know the levemir pen and wonder if its the same way.
Eventually you will need to have lower doses.
 
I'm wondering if you are still giving pills as well? Or did you stop when you changed vets? A starting dose or 2 units would normally be considered too much. When the calculations were given earlier, the appropriate dose would have been 1.25 units which would have been rounded down. If you can get some insulin syringes from somewhere it would halp you to fine tune your dosage. The pen is ok for even units as you have seen, but it is likely that you will need to give half units at some point. Maybe ask around to find a diabetic person who will sell you some needles.
 
Would you edit the very first post here and take off the 911 icon?

It's been up a while now.... and if you were having a dire need for attention....it might not get noticed since it's been up so long.

just pick none instead.
 
The insulin syringes you want to get are the 3/10 cc, with 1/2 unit markings on the syringe barrel. Wal-Mart Relion brand is one. Our shopping partner, ADW also carries insulin syringes with the 1/2 unit markings. With those 1/2U marks, it's easier to not only measure 1/2U increments, but also to eyeball 1/4U increments between the whole and half unit marks on the syringe barrel.
 
911 icon taken off ;-) Regarding the pills, no, ever since we changed vets we stopped the pills immediately. As for the syringes, I will definitely look up for them, cause the latest numbers show that we will need dose reduction for sure. If I can't find any to buy, I will look for a diabetic person to get them.

Is it possible for him with the change of diet to start regulating his BG so soon? I will continue to keep a close eye on him.

You've all been the greatest support anyone in this kind of situation can hope for.

Thank you so much.
 
Regulation numbers are all under 200. (human glucometer)

Hope you can find syringes. Most of us buy from the American diabetes wholesale.... there's a link up at the top of this page.

or try this.... Terumos
 
MaryJaneSS said:
...Is it possible for him with the change of diet to start regulating his BG so soon? I will continue to keep a close eye on him....
Click to expand...

Within about 3 days, the glucose may nearly normalize in some cats. This is also the period over which the Lantus dose settles in with a change, so monitor closely between +5 to +7 hours after any shot. I suspect that dosing with 0.5 units may work right now.
 
We are OTJ for 4 days now. Since I still can't find the syringes, I'm not giving him the shots cause his BG is too low for 1 unit. And today his BG is nearly normal :) He eats normally, mostly chicken and chicken pate, he's playful and happy and I think I will continue to keep him OTJ. Tomorrow I'm going to his vet and discuss in details what our future steps should be.
 
Regulations numbers don't mean remission. And cats that are in remission are still diabetic, just diet controlled diabetics.
Please continue monitoring Bello because he may rise again down the road and you will be back to giving shots....
You will need to watch him. The earlier you catch his numbers going back up, the better your chances of getting them back down.

It would be better for him ( and for you) if you would find the syringes and go to the smaller doses and continue giving him insulin support.
He has a very good chance of going into remission since his numbers are in the regulation range. But he needs those microdoses.
We can continue helping you with that.

Just take a look at my own spreadsheet. We were giving 0.75u, then 0.50u, then 0.25u, then 0.1u.... worked our way down the dosing scale
until I just gave one drop.
 
Bello's numbers are still a bit high. We'd really like to be seeing most of the BG (blood glucose) numbers below 100.

I think Bello still needs some insulin, but less than the 1U that the insulin pens allow you to give. You really do need to find insulin syringes.

I know you have said you have had difficulty finding insulin syringes over there in Macedonia. What is the closest city to where you live?

Have you checked with hospital pharmacies to see if they have insulin syringes? If your vet wrote a prescription for insulin syringes for you, would the hospital pharmacy be willing to fill the prescription?
 
The vet also said that he may go up again but the around 100 numbers seem fine and the 1 unit will make him go hypo so we should continue with no insulin (since he also doesn't know where we could get syringes). Today he's 90 and he seems to be doing great. We are sticking to the diet with low carbs (or none at all) and will have to continue monitoring the BG levels, hopefully everything turns out fine.

I live in the capitol city - Skopje but it doesn't matter cause the insulin administration is strictly controlled and it was hell of a tough job to find the insulin in the first place. We'll have to do only with the diet.
 
Are there any government officials you can contact about this? Or is that something that would cause a problem for you?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top